Crown

What is the point of the auto pilot on a sport car? It should be by definition a car you want to enjoy by driving it. I fully understand and see the benefits of  smartphones on four wheels for transportation purposes but  sport cars?

m4ever:

What is the point of the auto pilot on a sport car? It should be by definition a car you want to enjoy by driving it. I fully understand and see the benefits of  smartphones on four wheels for transportation purposes but  sport cars?

Same here, I don't get the auto pilot thing on a sports car but I understand why this is an important feature for other cars, especially when people are stuck in traffic jams for hours. I could also imagine an auto-pilot to make sense from LA to Las Vegas for example. Pretty boring drive, with the exception of a few curves. Only interesting thing on that route is the Tangier Outlet (according to my wife). 

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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

RC:

m4ever:

What is the point of the auto pilot on a sport car? It should be by definition a car you want to enjoy by driving it. I fully understand and see the benefits of  smartphones on four wheels for transportation purposes but  sport cars?

Same here, I don't get the auto pilot thing on a sports car but I understand why this is an important feature for other cars, especially when people are stuck in traffic jams for hours. I could also imagine an auto-pilot to make sense from LA to Las Vegas for example. Pretty boring drive, with the exception of a few curves. Only interesting thing on that route is the Tangier Outlet (according to my wife). 

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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

 

You sure it wasn't you being excited about updating your Tommy Hilfiger underwear collection? 

but totally agree about autopilot and sports cars. 

I actually wear Calvin Klein underwear.   I know, I know, too much detail...sorry about that.  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

RC:

I actually wear Calvin Klein underwear.   I know, I know, too much detail...sorry about that.  

wantone:

It seems that customers in the US require these features even on the 911. Autopilot is the next big thing in the auto industry and I doubt that the company would want to miss out here even if it takes away steering feel.

Porsche Won’t Make a Self-Driving Car Anytime Soon

apias:

wantone:

It seems that customers in the US require these features even on the 911. Autopilot is the next big thing in the auto industry and I doubt that the company would want to miss out here even if it takes away steering feel.

Porsche Won’t Make a Self-Driving Car Anytime Soon

I think they won't make a self-driving 911 anytime soon but a Cayenne or Panamera or maybe a Macan? I think they will.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

apias:

wantone:

It seems that customers in the US require these features even on the 911. Autopilot is the next big thing in the auto industry and I doubt that the company would want to miss out here even if it takes away steering feel.

Porsche Won’t Make a Self-Driving Car Anytime Soon

Ferdinand Porsche is reported to have said "The last car ever built will be a sports car".
That was in the days before the Porsche company made the reputation it has today as a sports car manufacturer. 
If he were alive today, he might be tempted to say "The last sports car ever built will be a Porsche".

fritz

tso:

The big question for me is the sound. You can somewhat make up for turbo influence on the track cars, but the street cars are going to sound horrible. Again I am not sure the 90% of the clients really care.

Because they will be upgrading from 3er and C-Class

fritz:

 

Ferdinand Porsche is reported to have said "The last car ever built will be a sports car".
That was in the days before the Porsche company made the reputation it has today as a sports car manufacturer. 
If he were alive today, he might be tempted to say "The last sports car ever built will be a Porsche".

Pre 2012 = Porsche, the new models are just too comfy and cosy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx2uBcgAXxc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-4MtZI6XGY

Which is why, again, many people want a GT3 with rear seats and no wing...

20 min long video with lot's of exhaust sound and detailed shots:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssG-yLJHsDE

Sound really seems to be amplified in the Video. In some shots it sounds like a muscle car and in others like a poky 4-cyl. Feeling a bit confused. Car looks good though!

This car really needs the LED head-lights. With the xenons it looks like a Mazda MX-5 from certain angles 

On paper, the 718 looks pretty good, if you can disregard the 4 which I'm also having a hard time doing. After running the configurator I hit $80k US with around 1/2 of the options I'd want, that is tough to take for a 4.

I bet there are big discounts on the way, at least here in the US. I'd guess the base Boxster will sell ok, but can't imagine much demand for the S. I bet a lot of dealers will order $90-100k cars that are going to sit in the showrooms all year. Doesn't help that some of the new cosmetic changes make me wonder if Porsche hired Chris Bangle as new Chief of Design.

Dreamcar, if there's any justice in the world your killer spec GTS just gained 20k in resale!

I'm still looking forward to reading some 718 test reviews, it should be a blast to drive. Hopefully, the PSE sound on the 4 wont get compared to a vacuum cleaner clogged with cat hair.

Thanks for the link Lukas, is that without PSE?

So far the 718, more than anything, makes me wish I'd kept my 981, but only 2 months to go until my '17 Macan arrives.

Where is that underwear outlet RC? I'll be driving from Vegas to SF this summer, might have to stop.

Just some 3 Paulaner Hefe-Weizen after work thoughts, sorry guys.

Don't know if it was posted before but found it pretty funny 

http://sniffpetrol.com/2016/01/27/porsche-presents-new-naming-policy/#.VrMg9v0o-5M

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

dr.j:

On paper, the 718 looks pretty good, if you can disregard the 4 which I'm also having a hard time doing. After running the configurator I hit $80k US with around 1/2 of the options I'd want, that is tough to take for a 4.

I bet there are big discounts on the way, at least here in the US. I'd guess the base Boxster will sell ok, but can't imagine much demand for the S. I bet a lot of dealers will order $90-100k cars that are going to sit in the showrooms all year. Doesn't help that some of the new cosmetic changes make me wonder if Porsche hired Chris Bangle as new Chief of Design.

Dreamcar, if there's any justice in the world your killer spec GTS just gained 20k in resale!

I'm still looking forward to reading some 718 test reviews, it should be a blast to drive. Hopefully, the PSE sound on the 4 wont get compared to a vacuum cleaner clogged with cat hair.

Thanks for the link Lukas, is that without PSE?

So far the 718, more than anything, makes me wish I'd kept my 981, but only 2 months to go until my '17 Macan arrives.

Where is that underwear outlet RC? I'll be driving from Vegas to SF this summer, might have to stop.

Just some 3 Paulaner Hefe-Weizen after work thoughts, sorry guys.

 

 

The Tanger Outlet is right on the I-15 in Barstow on the way from Los Angeles to Las Vegas (or the other way around). The deals there are not the best (you can get better deals around Las Vegas, just make sure you don't buy at the malls/stores around the Strip) but it is a nice stop when traveling from LA to Las Vegas and we always stop there to eat a bite and to go for some (fast) relaxed shopping. Nothing special but they have Calvin Klein, Michael Kors, Tommy Hilfiger and so on. Nothing really fancy but still worth it if you are looking for a relaxed short stop.

Caution: Someone told us that they might close at some point (not sure if for renovation or for good), so I cannot guarantee they are going to be there when you travel.

Oh, if you travel from Las Vegas to San Francisco, I think you are going to travel a different route and not on the I-15.

There are tons of outlets around Las Vegas though, so no worries.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

dr.j:

Dreamcar, if there's any justice in the world your killer spec GTS just gained 20k in resale!

 

Some hope..... Not that I have any plans to sell, what would I replace it with?  GT4 would be wasted as I'm not a track junkie; Spyder probably too hard core for SWMBO...even if both are held in much higher regard (certainly appear to be on RT ) GTS is just perfect for us, even if SWMBO is not 100% with the sports plus seats. 

Porsche Boxster GTS Carrara white / Skoda Octavia Mk.3 daily drive

dreamcar:

dr.j:

Dreamcar, if there's any justice in the world your killer spec GTS just gained 20k in resale!

 

Some hope..... Not that I have any plans to sell, what would I replace it with?  GT4 would be wasted as I'm not a track junkie; Spyder probably too hard core for SWMBO...even if both are held in much higher regard (certainly appear to be on RT ) GTS is just perfect for us, even if SWMBO is not 100% with the sports plus seats. 

991.1 GTS.  I'm afraid however that prices will stay pretty stable, there aren't many cars available on the market right now and it may get worse when people actually start to buy their leases after the lease ends. I plan to buy my car, I love it but I also have to see if my dealer wants to sell it to me after the lease ends.  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

My prediction is...as soon as the first reviews state that these 4 cyl. turbos are a hell of a ride, resale values of "old" 6 cyl. N/ A will go down again. It is quite remarkable that - on paper - a 718 S will be nearly 0,5 secs faster from naught to 100 km/h than my 981 GTS. Not that I really care about (still happy with my car), but that is a huuuuge improvement compared to the odd 0,1 sec from one facelift or whatever to the next seen in the past...

I think the 4-cyl is the best thing that could have happened for the Boxster/Cayman. Now Porsche can focus on performance without the risk of competing with the 911. If you want a 6 cyl, get a 911, very simple. 

2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2

RC:

dreamcar:

dr.j:

Dreamcar, if there's any justice in the world your killer spec GTS just gained 20k in resale!

 

Some hope..... Not that I have any plans to sell, what would I replace it with?  GT4 would be wasted as I'm not a track junkie; Spyder probably too hard core for SWMBO...even if both are held in much higher regard (certainly appear to be on RT ) GTS is just perfect for us, even if SWMBO is not 100% with the sports plus seats. 

991.1 GTS.  I'm afraid however that prices will stay pretty stable, there aren't many cars available on the market right now and it may get worse when people actually start to buy their leases after the lease ends. I plan to buy my car, I love it but I also have to see if my dealer wants to sell it to me after the lease ends.  

I'd agree but way above my price bracket unfortunately. There was a 991 GTS coupe in my ideal spec  - carmine red, exactly as I would have specced one if I'd ordered it, but even with 18,000 miles on it was still priced at  GBP 85,000  I try and convince myself that like my previous 997/2 it would be frustrating here in speed limited GB I would barely scratch the surface of the car's capabilities. With Boxster more of the performance is usable, and with the open top and that exhaust note high speed is not essential for thrills.

Out of interest on the Porsche UK used car website :-

Boxster GTS 10 for sale

Boxster Spyder (981) 1 for sale

Cayman GTS 15 for sale

Cayman GT4 7 for sale

991 Carrera GTS 25 for sale

991 Carrera 4 GTS 3 for sale

991 Targa 4 GTS 3 for sale

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Porsche Boxster GTS Carrara white / Skoda Octavia Mk.3 daily drive

993Targa:

I think the 4-cyl is the best thing that could have happened for the Boxster/Cayman. Now Porsche can focus on performance without the risk of competing with the 911. If you want a 6 cyl, get a 911, very simple. 

I'll agree to disagree on that one. The added performance and economy would never, for me anyway, compensate for the wonderful engine note. It's not that simple - it might be sacrilege to admit it but I'm happier with mid engine than rear engine. Had a 911 (997/2 Carrera S PDK), sold it for the Boxster GTS I have now.

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Porsche Boxster GTS Carrara white / Skoda Octavia Mk.3 daily drive

d997h:

My prediction is...as soon as the first reviews state that these 4 cyl. turbos are a hell of a ride, resale values of "old" 6 cyl. N/ A will go down again. It is quite remarkable that - on paper - a 718 S will be nearly 0,5 secs faster from naught to 100 km/h than my 981 GTS. Not that I really care about (still happy with my car), but that is a huuuuge improvement compared to the odd 0,1 sec from one facelift or whatever to the next seen in the past...

I doubt that the Boxster and Boxster S will keep their values but the Boxster GTS maybe and the Spyders for sure.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

dreamcar:

RC:

dreamcar:

dr.j:

Dreamcar, if there's any justice in the world your killer spec GTS just gained 20k in resale!

 

Some hope..... Not that I have any plans to sell, what would I replace it with?  GT4 would be wasted as I'm not a track junkie; Spyder probably too hard core for SWMBO...even if both are held in much higher regard (certainly appear to be on RT ) GTS is just perfect for us, even if SWMBO is not 100% with the sports plus seats. 

991.1 GTS.  I'm afraid however that prices will stay pretty stable, there aren't many cars available on the market right now and it may get worse when people actually start to buy their leases after the lease ends. I plan to buy my car, I love it but I also have to see if my dealer wants to sell it to me after the lease ends.  

I'd agree but way above my price bracket unfortunately. There was a 991 GTS coupe in my ideal spec  - carmine red, exactly as I would have specced one if I'd ordered it, but even with 18,000 miles on it was still priced at  GBP 85,000  I try and convince myself that like my previous 997/2 it would be frustrating here in speed limited GB I would barely scratch the surface of the car's capabilities. With Boxster more of the performance is usable, and with the open top and that exhaust note high speed is not essential for thrills.

Out of interest on the UK Porsche UK used car website :-

Boxster GTS 10 for sale

Boxster Spyder (981) 1 for sale

Cayman GTS 15 for sale

Cayman GT4 7 for sale

991 Carrera GTS 25 for sale

991 Carrera 4 GTS 3 for sale

991 Targa 4 GTS 3 for sale

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Porsche Boxster GTS Carrara white / Skoda Octavia Mk.3 daily drive

 

In Germany, there are 7 GTS and 9 C4 GTS available and this includes convertibles (total of 9 available). A total of 16 cars only. No Targa GTS anymore.

Cayman GT4 or Boxyter Spyder? 0.

Also interesting: There are 491 non-GTS 991 Carrera/Targa models available. Ouch.

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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

Can't help but thinking you guys are wrong on even GTS values holding medium term... They will dip significantly around the 2 to 4 year mark first. Then they might rebound and will end up higher than turbo equivalent in 7-15 years. But short-medium term? No... Heck even GT4 or Spider aren't really trading at premium right as magically some late allocation popped up and that in the end the potential GT4 buyers might still be lurking at a GT3. In the US (and Germany?) some people just lease new cars and replace them after 3-4 years and just keep doing it no even wanting to own a used car. Not sure enough people will appreciate the non turbo version qualities vs the appeal of a new car which in the end all the reviewers like. And if it doesn't happen with the 991.2 it will happen with the 992 as technology advances.

I guess most of the Cayman GT4 for sale are owners "flying a kite" trying to make a quick profit - judging by the GBP 100k asking prices.  Personally for that money I'd rather have a 991 GTS. Maybe because as I've said earlier I'm no track enthusiast.

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Porsche Boxster GTS Carrara white / Skoda Octavia Mk.3 daily drive

SciFrog:

Can't help but thinking you guys are wrong on even GTS values holding medium term... They will dip significantly around the 2 to 4 year mark first. Then they might rebound and will end up higher than turbo equivalent in 7-15 years. But short-medium term? No... Heck even GT4 or Spider aren't really trading at premium right as magically some late allocation popped up and that in the end the potential GT4 buyers might still be lurking at a GT3. In the US (and Germany?) some people just lease new cars and replace them after 3-4 years and just keep doing it no even wanting to own a used car. Not sure enough people will appreciate the non turbo version qualities vs the appeal of a new car which in the end all the reviewers like. And if it doesn't happen with the 991.2 it will happen with the 992 as technology advances.

It depends on how successful the new 991.2 will be. First GTS leases expire in around 1-2 years over here and this is where there will be more used cars available on the market in Germany. So prices could actually drop. Unless 991.2 demand will be slow and customer are looking for the "old" 991.1 (and of course the GTS model). I doubt however this is going to happen. I too think that the 991.1 GTS will gain in value after 4-5 years or so and of course it depends on how future 911 models evolve. I doubt the 991.1 GTS is going to become a collectible but it could keep it's value steady (compared to the regular 991.1 or even the 992.2). Difficult to predict though but since I want to keep the car, I don't care. Actually, I would prefer the value to drop, so my dealer is more inclined to sell it to me and not someone else. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

dreamcar:

I guess most of the Cayman GT4 for sale are owners "flying a kite" trying to make a quick profit - judging by the GBP 100k asking prices.  Personally for that money I'd rather have a 991 GTS. Maybe because as I've said earlier I'm no track enthusiast.

They are selling here above £100k though. A specialist close to me has sold at least three above £100k (they ranged in price from £104k to £109k) and I suspect would happily take at least a couple more if they can get hold of them. Spyders on the other hand seem to be struggling with around 8 examples on sale. The most recent one came on the market yesterday with a ludicrous premium of £16k and the spec isn't that special. There are around 5 examples that have been on sale since December with premiums of between £8-10k that haven't sold which suggests the market is nowhere near as strong on these as sellers would like/hope to think. It has much more niche appeal than the GT4.

ISUK:

dreamcar:

I guess most of the Cayman GT4 for sale are owners "flying a kite" trying to make a quick profit - judging by the GBP 100k asking prices.  Personally for that money I'd rather have a 991 GTS. Maybe because as I've said earlier I'm no track enthusiast.

They are selling here above £100k though. A specialist close to me has sold at least three above £100k (they ranged in price from £104k to £109k) and I suspect would happily take at least a couple more if they can get hold of them. Spyders on the other hand seem to be struggling with around 8 examples on sale. The most recent one came on the market yesterday with a ludicrous premium of £16k and the spec isn't that special. There are around 5 examples that have been on sale since December with premiums of between £8-10k that haven't sold which suggests the market is nowhere near as strong on these as sellers would like/hope to think. It has much more niche appeal than the GT4.

I agree the Spyder is much more for the cognoscenti . However, I wonder if some of the GT4 price is also driven by the amateur car investor hysteria that is sweeping the UK where the guy buying at £100K thinks he can sell for even more than that in a few years or even sooner.

If Porsche decides to put another (last) GT4 on the market, maybe even with the new exterior of the 718, many GT4 speculators will be screwed. Also, I don't remember anything about a GT4 limited production, so basically...

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

RC:

If Porsche decides to put another (last) GT4 on the market, maybe even with the new exterior of the 718, many GT4 speculators will be screwed. Also, I don't remember anything about a GT4 limited production, so basically...

Serve 'em right....

Porsche Boxster GTS Carrara white / Skoda Octavia Mk.3 daily drive