Apr 13, 2005 12:53:54 PM
- shin
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Carlos from Spain
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Apr 13, 2005 5:41:39 PM
- svtrader1
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Carlos from Spain
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
In order for it to hurt 30k/year Porsche 911 sales (which will be even more by 2009),
Nonsense. If you understand Porsche's business strategy, then you'll know they think the 911 market is fully saturated.
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
Ask Ferrari "owners" here if they like the idea.
The link came from F-chat and most the F-chatters seem to think it's a good idea. But, whether one thinks it's a good idea or not is irrelavant. It's whether they will buy it or not when available. And yes, they will buy it.
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
This cheaper Ferrari model would serieously hurt Ferrari's image and customer satisfaction. Ferrari is one of the most exclusive brands and this is one of the biggest assets. Maserati can sell this car but not Ferrari. Whats next a Ferrari SUV? I wouldn't like to see Ferrari do this.
Apparently, you haven't heard that the Maserati coupe isn't selling too well. But, slap a Ferrari badge on it and they will sell like hot cakes.
If they decide to build such a car, then there will be no need for an SUV. I don't think they will sell their soul like Porsche did by making an SUV for the sake of profit.
Apr 13, 2005 6:32:09 PM
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Carlos from Spain
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Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
svtrader1 said:
Nonsense. If you understand Porsche's business strategy, then you'll know they think the 911 market is fully saturated.
I'm not talking about market share, the car market gets bigger and bigger as time goes by, for all type of cars svtrader1, there are more cars on the roads as time go by and sales figures increase. And the inncrease will really take a jump in the case for high end cars with the hugely growing asian market in the coming years.
Quote:
The link came from F-chat and most the F-chatters seem to think it's a good idea. But, whether one thinks it's a good idea or not is irrelavant. It's whether they will buy it or not when available. And yes, they will buy it.
Don't think so, existing owners (Ferrari's base) won't be thrilled about Ferrari flooding the streets with a cheaper and front engined sportcar, many people are just exited at the novelty and prospective owners as well, but current customer base, those that own a F360SC, F430 or F612. Ask Patriek, Ben lj, Nick or zzboba here what they think.
Quote:
Apparently, you haven't heard that the Maserati coupe isn't selling too well. But, slap a Ferrari badge on it and they will sell like hot cakes.
If they decide to build such a car, then there will be no need for an SUV. I don't think they will sell their soul like Porsche did by making an SUV for the sake of profit.
Didn't say Maserati would be succesful with it, just that they can do it without damage to their image, but Ferrari can't.
As to this cheaper front engined entry level car eliminating the need for a SUV, thats what Porsche said with the Boxster
Apr 13, 2005 6:43:13 PM
- krown05
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Carlos from Spain
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
I agree, I do not think that Ferrari should do this. Ferrari has long been my favorite car company since I was a boy, but Porsche has fulfilled my needs and dreams for the current moment. Moreover, I believe that Porsche is an essential car for me (daily driver) and most importantly, I refer to it as the "ultimate all around sports car." But back to Ferrari, I do not see Montezemolo doing either. As much as it would be nice to see a Dino, perhaps now is not the right time.
Thanks,
Ray
P.S. does anyone have any other pictures of the "new Dino?"
Thanks,
Ray
P.S. does anyone have any other pictures of the "new Dino?"
Apr 13, 2005 10:09:08 PM
- ben, lj
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Carlos from Spain
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:Quote:
svtrader1 said: Ask Patriek, Ben lj, Nick or zzboba here what they think.
i sold my CS last week but if i hadn't i could really care less if they roll out the dino. afterall i paid almost $1/2 mil with taxes for the CGT which is made by a company with a $40k boxster that is as common as the day is long. btw, what most 360 owners don't realize is they are driving ferrari's boxster (the price entry level model which is also the only 8 cyl). ironically enough though, this model of which they made 20k examples!, happens to have carried one of the largest premiums to MSRP at ferrari. the 430 will be no different - though likely even more plentiful than the 360 was.
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
"what most 360 owners don't realize is they are driving ferrari's boxster"
Interesting point. IMO the Boxster and 911 and now Cayman are quite similar. I'm guessing that the choice between a Boxster and a 911 is made based upon the buyer's ability or willingness to pay the respective price - no? Those who can afford a Modena generally could afford a Maranello, but the cars are utterly different.
Interesting point. IMO the Boxster and 911 and now Cayman are quite similar. I'm guessing that the choice between a Boxster and a 911 is made based upon the buyer's ability or willingness to pay the respective price - no? Those who can afford a Modena generally could afford a Maranello, but the cars are utterly different.
Apr 14, 2005 12:55:40 AM
- svtrader1
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Carlos from Spain
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
Don't think so, existing owners (Ferrari's base) won't be thrilled about Ferrari flooding the streets with a cheaper and front engined sportcar, many people are just exited at the novelty and prospective owners as well, but current customer base, those that own a F360SC, F430 or F612. Ask Patriek, Ben lj, Nick or zzboba here what they think.
Carlos,
With all due respect, you've failed to see the big picture. More specifically, you need to look at this from a business perspective. It's no longer about image. It's about survival! Ferrari can't continue to bleed red ink much longer.
Jean Todt is Ferrari's new boss. He will green light this project as they need to find an alternative source of revenue to support their Formula 1 program.
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
FERRARI TO BUILD ASTON-KILLER
New baby Ferrari goes head-to-head with AMV8 Vantage
Ferrari plans to launch a new entry-level car -- the 21st century Dino, if you like -- according to this week's Autocar. The car will be powered by a Maserati-sourced 400bhp 4.2-litre engine, mid-front mounted and driving the rear wheels through a rear axle-mounted transmission.
The engine position is similar to that in Aston Martin's 911-killer, the V8 Vantage. And given the price, the new baby Ferrari looks like being an intriguing competitor.
It'll cost some Pounds85,000 as a coupé, and sources say that it could lift Ferrari sales by some 3,000 to around 8,000. This suggests that Ferrari is the last of the big premium car marques to indulge in brand extension -- something its rivals have been happy to indulge in but which Ferrari has so far eschewed.
The car is dubbed Project California and will be based on the now-canned replacements for Maserati's Spider and Coupé models. Maserati stopped developing the cars just before the company found itself under Alfa Romeo's wing in February.
New baby Ferrari goes head-to-head with AMV8 Vantage
Ferrari plans to launch a new entry-level car -- the 21st century Dino, if you like -- according to this week's Autocar. The car will be powered by a Maserati-sourced 400bhp 4.2-litre engine, mid-front mounted and driving the rear wheels through a rear axle-mounted transmission.
The engine position is similar to that in Aston Martin's 911-killer, the V8 Vantage. And given the price, the new baby Ferrari looks like being an intriguing competitor.
It'll cost some Pounds85,000 as a coupé, and sources say that it could lift Ferrari sales by some 3,000 to around 8,000. This suggests that Ferrari is the last of the big premium car marques to indulge in brand extension -- something its rivals have been happy to indulge in but which Ferrari has so far eschewed.
The car is dubbed Project California and will be based on the now-canned replacements for Maserati's Spider and Coupé models. Maserati stopped developing the cars just before the company found itself under Alfa Romeo's wing in February.
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
WCH said:
"what most 360 owners don't realize is they are driving ferrari's boxster"
Interesting point. IMO the Boxster and 911 and now Cayman are quite similar. I'm guessing that the choice between a Boxster and a 911 is made based upon the buyer's ability or willingness to pay the respective price - no? Those who can afford a Modena generally could afford a Maranello, but the cars are utterly different.
Certainly many 430 buyers can afford any car; prob already own several great cars, etc but enjoy having the "entry-level" F driving experience. But I suspect many 430/360 buyers...esp for Spiders...are poseurs who stretch to get a F with significant assumptions re: resale value/speculative flip value. Buyers of new 575/612 are prob a less speculative, more deep-money buyer set, as they've prob been warned to expect ?$50-75Kish depreciation once car's driven off the lot....and they still want the car....
Apr 14, 2005 6:14:32 AM
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Carlos from Spain
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Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
svtrader1 said:Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
Don't think so, existing owners (Ferrari's base) won't be thrilled about Ferrari flooding the streets with a cheaper and front engined sportcar, many people are just exited at the novelty and prospective owners as well, but current customer base, those that own a F360SC, F430 or F612. Ask Patriek, Ben lj, Nick or zzboba here what they think.
Carlos,
With all due respect, you've failed to see the big picture. More specifically, you need to look at this from a business perspective. It's no longer about image. It's about survival! Ferrari can't continue to bleed red ink much longer.
Jean Todt is Ferrari's new boss. He will green light this project as they need to find an alternative source of revenue to support their Formula 1 program.
That I agree with, its a business desition like Porsche's to build the Cayenne, but I'm talikng about their image which is one of their greatest assets. While business wise it may be profiable, flooding the streets with a cheaper entry-level fornt-engined rebadged Maserati may be dangerous in the long run, if they go this route they will have to change many other things that made Ferrari so exclusive and pure to the sportcar philosophy, and as a sportcar enthusiast its sad to see Ferrari do this.
Apr 14, 2005 6:20:49 AM
- shin
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Apr 14, 2005 2:35:58 PM
- Rich C (UK)
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Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Well - hopefully I'll be in the loop as things progress.
Just had an interesting chat with my 'local' Ferrari Centre. Looks like this is really going to happen, they were already talking about 'when' not 'if'. So have taken the plunge and placed a letter or interest and Pounds1000 fully refundable deposit with them, am #4 on their list.
I'm not too sure how a Pounds85k+ car can 'cheapen the brand' (my God my first house cost less than half that!) but if they get it right I'll be in the enviable position of having to decide between the AMV8, 911 and this. For the sake of the interest on Pounds1000 over a few years I think it'll be worth the risk
. And hey, be able to keep my friends at Rennteam in the 'offical' loop 
Just had an interesting chat with my 'local' Ferrari Centre. Looks like this is really going to happen, they were already talking about 'when' not 'if'. So have taken the plunge and placed a letter or interest and Pounds1000 fully refundable deposit with them, am #4 on their list.
I'm not too sure how a Pounds85k+ car can 'cheapen the brand' (my God my first house cost less than half that!) but if they get it right I'll be in the enviable position of having to decide between the AMV8, 911 and this. For the sake of the interest on Pounds1000 over a few years I think it'll be worth the risk
. And hey, be able to keep my friends at Rennteam in the 'offical' loop
Apr 14, 2005 3:27:03 PM
- Rich C (UK)
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Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Shin - will do . I poping down ther over the weekend to put a face to the voice on the phone. And hey, I can lust after the other cars in the showroom and it's a lovely village too - plus still trying to get through the break in period on the Boxster - doesn't take me much effort to think of an excuse!
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
i sort of like the idea... do you guys really think that 100k is cheap or like the boxster is to the 911???
In my opinion, i think not, if the new dino ferrari is 100k or so, thats pretty exclusive. If its a great performer its gonna be a cool car, hopefully.
I guess if i were a ferrari owner i would have different feelings - i just doubt that them making this car at maybe 5000 a year is really going to damage the ferrari image.
Heck, you see tons of 360's running around, i know california is full of them... stupid rappers and etc own them even that Bam Magera skater kid has one i think...
I dont the new dino will hurt ferrari's image all that bad - but who knows!
In my opinion, i think not, if the new dino ferrari is 100k or so, thats pretty exclusive. If its a great performer its gonna be a cool car, hopefully.
I guess if i were a ferrari owner i would have different feelings - i just doubt that them making this car at maybe 5000 a year is really going to damage the ferrari image.
Heck, you see tons of 360's running around, i know california is full of them... stupid rappers and etc own them even that Bam Magera skater kid has one i think...
I dont the new dino will hurt ferrari's image all that bad - but who knows!
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
svtrader1 said:Quote:
Patriek (jennyz) said:
ALL of that is just a RUMOR !!! I asked them yesterday, when we were at the factory and at Fiorano. they also read it, but nobody knows where this rumor comes from. But it was totally false !!!
They're pulling your leg.
NO WAY !!!
even for now, they can't make one more car extra on their lines.
They were even building 8cyl on the 12cyl line ...
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
Patriek (jennyz) said:
ALL of that is just a RUMOR !!! I asked them yesterday, when we were at the factory and at Fiorano. they also read it, but nobody knows where this rumor comes from. But it was totally false !!!
If the story's false, why are Ferrari dealerships accepting deposits on the car?
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
tonyhopkins said:Quote:
Patriek (jennyz) said:
ALL of that is just a RUMOR !!! I asked them yesterday, when we were at the factory and at Fiorano. they also read it, but nobody knows where this rumor comes from. But it was totally false !!!
If the story's false, why are Ferrari dealerships accepting deposits on the car?
free use of the dough. for each few deposits along with some leverage, they can inventory a non-owner and consigned resale car.
Apr 16, 2005 1:59:18 PM
- tony h
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Apr 16, 2005 2:14:41 PM
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Carlos from Spain
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Apr 16, 2005 3:29:35 PM
- Rich C (UK)
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Carlos from Spain
Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
Thats true. I just hope that those dealers are hosnest enough to tell them that there is no official confirmation nor mention that a project of that car even exists at Ferrari, after that its their problem if they still want to place a deposit.
Well we'll see - to be honest the interest on Pounds1k is hardly going to break the bank. And I'd be kicking myself if it did happen and I liked it (not the most patient type me!
)
Apr 16, 2005 4:16:58 PM
- MKW
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Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
A $100K front engine " Dino " or whatever it's called will always still be known among the tifosi as a bastard Maserati to be . ( Shades of the VW model that was taken over by Porsche and sold as the 924 - never had full cred with the long time Porsche people , though a decent sports car for the time ) .
I predict discounts and/ or poor or typical industry resale like the V12s and having to sell them like any other lux mrkt front engined sporty car but without the ready service and parts avail people used to driving German cars in that price range expect. There will never be a speculative mkt like on the mid engined V8s which makes the
backed up service experience tolerable for their owners.
I predict discounts and/ or poor or typical industry resale like the V12s and having to sell them like any other lux mrkt front engined sporty car but without the ready service and parts avail people used to driving German cars in that price range expect. There will never be a speculative mkt like on the mid engined V8s which makes the
backed up service experience tolerable for their owners.
Apr 18, 2005 2:55:14 AM
- Holminator
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Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
tonyhopkins said:
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?p=134862012#post134862012
cool, ferrari is making it's own boxster. wonder when they're gonna open another production facility and start cranking up volume.
Well, F is planning on putting an SUV into production, too, so why not.
Apr 20, 2005 9:41:12 AM
- tony h
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Re: Autocar-"new" Dino?===========
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