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Joost said:
Haha Nick! Long live the Dutchies!
Now don'tlet yourself be fooled. The car that ran the record was not a standard donkervoort, but had an additional huge rear wing, and som eother adaptations I don't exactly know... anyway, a good prestation.
For a moment, I feared the Enzo ran faster...
-Joost-
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nberry said:It only proves that focusing on performance only is a fools quest. There will always be someone doing it better and faster.
Dec 15, 2004 12:48:00 AM
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Grant said:Performance can be alot of fun, even if it doesn't come with ultimate bragging rights...
Dec 15, 2004 1:20:23 AM
Dec 15, 2004 8:53:41 AM
Dec 15, 2004 10:54:00 AM
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DrPhil said:
HAHAHA! I'm laughing my ass off here...How much is the Donkervoort in $$? One tenth of the Carrera GT? LOL! Now THAT's what I call kicking ass and taking names. OK, so the car isn't as beautiful as the CGT IMHO, and probably doesnt have the tech details, but the CGT is supposedly all about performance and being a driver's car. And the Donkervoort beat the CTG at its own game. With a 15 second margin! WOW! I know you don't like it guys..and that some of you try to defend the CTG by saying that the Donkervoort had a huge rear spoiler etc etc. Get over it. I know it sux if you just bought a $$$$$$ CGT, that a tiny car at the fraction of the cost can drive in circles around your car...but u gotta admit..it's funny
Dec 15, 2004 10:59:10 AM
Dec 15, 2004 3:39:19 PM
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carlos fromspain said:
DrPhil,
If you think for one moment any CGT onwner here is the least bit worried or bothered by cars of the type of "Donkervoort" or "Radical Turbo" (which FYI is even faster), etc. being faster around the ring, then I'd think they will tell you that you need a lot to learn about what sportcars such as the CGT, Zonda or Enzo are really about and why their owners buy them, and what exactly vehicles like the Donkervoort, Caterham R500, Ariel Atom or Radical SR4 really are.
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Grant said:Quote:
nberry said:It only proves that focusing on performance only is a fools quest. There will always be someone doing it better and faster.
Nick - Just because someone will always be faster doesn't make performance a fool's quest. Performance can be alot of fun, even if it doesn't come with ultimate bragging rights...
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nberry said:Quote:
Grant said:Quote:
nberry said:It only proves that focusing on performance only is a fools quest. There will always be someone doing it better and faster.
Nick - Just because someone will always be faster doesn't make performance a fool's quest. Performance can be alot of fun, even if it doesn't come with ultimate bragging rights...
Grant,my point is ALL of us (I include myself) tend to look at performance as the holy grail in judging cars. Porsche develops it cars with the ring in mind. In the article Porsche apparently practiced several months with the CGT before the timed run so as to come in with a great number.
This car blew it away by 15 sec! It will blow away the Enzo and others by similar margins. I have no idea what this car costs but you must admit it drives home the point that performance is not all what it is cracked up to be by experts like us.
What matters is the whole package that stimulate the senses. Certainly the CGT does as well as Ferrari.As for the the rest of Porsche's; well we know how I feel.
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Grant said:
I agree with the need to define performance. For me, it's not just the specs (0-60, lap times), but the way in which these numbers are achieved. I like a very involving ride that has quick reflexes and lots of feedback. I am willing to sacrifice quite alot of comfort for these ideals.
As has been said, "It's not how fast you go but how you go fast..."
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nberry said:
Porsche has sold a lot of cars by tuning them for fast Ring times. They just got beat at their own game. Do you realize what a 15 sec difference is? Over a quarter of a mile.
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nberry said:Quote:
Grant said:
I agree with the need to define performance. For me, it's not just the specs (0-60, lap times), but the way in which these numbers are achieved. I like a very involving ride that has quick reflexes and lots of feedback. I am willing to sacrifice quite alot of comfort for these ideals.
As has been said, "It's not how fast you go but how you go fast..."
Ben,Grant, on this board as well as others, the defining test in measuring performance has been Ring times.Just review past discussions regarding perf. and clearly the Ring times were the holy grail.I have tried to debunk this by claiming other factors should be part of the equation.
Porsche has sold a lot of cars by tuning them for fast Ring times. They just got beat at their own game. Do you realize what a 15 sec difference is? Over a quarter of a mile.
Dec 15, 2004 5:51:15 PM
Dec 15, 2004 6:31:06 PM
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carlos fromspain said:
Nick, let me add a small detail you seem to repeatedly miss before you start teaching the whole board the proper way to value sportcars
The ring is the benchmark, or of great value in terms of comparing performance for cars that offer a similar package Nick and the ring is very valuable in that aspect, its the ultimate "real world" performance benchmark, and its valuable for those of us who look for real world performance in the sportcar "class/package" we condider owning or driving, yet those who look for "other" things in sportcars couldn't care less about it as we can see.
So putting an M5, a 997S, a tunned Lotus Superseven, a CGT, and a Bentley Coupe on the same ring time list for comparison is... how should I put it... looking at sportcars too "simply" or from an innocent child's view please tell me you can tell the difference between a CGT and a Donkervoort and how to value their ring times accordingly nick
I know Ben and the other CGT owners do.
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ben, lj said:
Yep, a 15 sec differential over a 1/4 mile is indeed a major one. So I guess the Donkey car does it in negative 4 seconds (Carrera GT's 11 less 15 seconds)? That is definetely very impressive.
Dec 15, 2004 8:14:24 PM
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Joost said:Quote:
ben, lj said:
Yep, a 15 sec differential over a 1/4 mile is indeed a major one. So I guess the Donkey car does it in negative 4 seconds (Carrera GT's 11 less 15 seconds)? That is definetely very impressive.
I think Nick meant to say that 15 seconds difference is as much as 1/4 mile difference.
-Joost-
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ben, lj said:Quote:
Joost said:Quote:
ben, lj said:
Yep, a 15 sec differential over a 1/4 mile is indeed a major one. So I guess the Donkey car does it in negative 4 seconds (Carrera GT's 11 less 15 seconds)? That is definetely very impressive.
I think Nick meant to say that 15 seconds difference is as much as 1/4 mile difference.
-Joost-
We're all running our mouths about seconds and tenths of seconds when it all boils down to what makes your organ alert.
Dec 15, 2004 9:36:45 PM
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So if we buy a CGT we expect to get the ultimate ride, with the ultimate combination of style, design, technology, power, excitement, driveability...and speed
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It all aims at one thing, and one thing only: Being the fastest car on the track.