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    997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    German car magazine SPORT AUTO tested the Porsche 997 Carrera S on the track, Hockenheim Kleiner Kurs. This is no real highspeed track, it is actually a track which favors good suspension setups.
    Unfortunately the weather wasn't too good during the testing, outside temperature was 32*C and asphalt temperature 44*C(!), pretty bad conditions. But anyway, the 997 Carrera S with PASM and standard brake did a time of 1 min 15,6 sec. Sport Auto claims that with better weather conditions, a 1 min 14,x time is possible. Again, this was a 997 Carrera S with PASM and standard brake!

    Now the impressive results despite the high asphalt temperature (not very common for Germany):
    Kleiner Kurs Hockenheim 1 min. 15,6 sec.
    For a short comparison:
    Dodge Viper SRT-10 1 min. 16,3 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena 1 min. 15,1 sec.
    Porsche 996 Carrera 2 (320 HP) 1 min. 17,1 sec.
    Porsche 996 Turbo 1 min. 14,6 sec.
    Porsche 996 GT3 MkI 1 min. 14,9 sec.

    Under normal weather conditions, a track time similar to the 996 Turbo track time should be possible.

    Now the most impressive thing, braking performance.
    from 200 kph (125 mph) to 0, the 997 Carrera S with standard brake needed 138,3 meters to come to a full stop.

    Comparison data:
    Dodge Viper SRT-10: 143,6 m
    Mercedes SL 65 AMG: 148,8 m
    Mini Cooper S Works: 157,2 m
    Porsche 996 GT3 MkI: 144,2 m
    Ferrari Challenge Stradale: 139,8 m (semi-slicks)
    Ferrari 360 Modena: 144,6 m
    BMW M3 E46: 141,6 m
    Porsche 996 GT3 RS: 132,5 m (semi-slicks)
    Porsche 996 GT3 Mk2: 141,5 m
    Porsche 996 Turbo: 144,2 m
    Porsche Carrera GT: 133,9 m

    With the new improved PCCB, the braking performance is rumored to be in the 130 m range, similar to or even better than the Carrera GT braking performance.

    For those who are really curious about the 997 Carrera S' full track capability: Sport Auto will test a 997 Carrera S with 20 mm chassis/LSD and PCCB around Oct. this year on the Nuerburgring Nordschleife and in Hockenheim.
    Just can't wait to read the results, expectations are high.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    RC said:
    ...

    Just can't wait to read the results, expectations are high.



    Me neither. Thanks for the info!

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Very impressive results. Do you know if 996TT cited is w/ or w/o X-50 and/or X-73 and/or PCCB? Thanks.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    What about acceleration times?

    J.Seven

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    RC said:
    For those who are really curious about the 997 Carrera S' full track capability: Sport Auto will test a 997 Carrera S with 20 mm chassis/LSD and PCCB around Oct. this year on the Nuerburgring Nordschleife and in Hockenheim.
    Just can't wait to read the results, expectations are high.



    Can't wait! but I'm very confident the -20mm 997S will deliver the "goods". Anybody want to guess Von Saurma's lap times with it at Hockenheim and the ring (I take it Saurma will be driving)?
    I say 1 min. 14,1 sec and 8 min 1 sec respectively

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    ... Anybody want to guess Von Saurma's lap times with it at Hockenheim and the ring (I take it Saurma will be driving)?
    I say 1 min. 14,1 sec and 8 min 1 sec respectively



    1.14,2 and 7:59 min

    These are just guesses, in case anybody'd copy these numbers!

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    upps, I meant 1 min 14,5 for HH.

    (I'm quite interested in the F430's times too, I think it will improve a lot over the F360 as well.)

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    upps, I meant 1 min 14,5 for HH.

    (I'm quite interested in the F430's times too, I think it will improve a lot over the F360 as well.)



    Maybe we should start a Rennteam.com bet.

    I'd say 1 min 13,9 sec in Hockenheim and 7 min 59 sec. on the Nordschleife. The Nuerburgring still requires lots of power. The braking performance could also improve the track time. Imagine that the brake point can be set later, this would definetely improve track time.

    Regarding the F430: a little birdie told me that something around 7 min 50 sec is realistic. But of course we have to wait for the real thing to be tested by an independent source, not Ferrari or (in Porsche's case) Porsche themselves.
    SPORT AUTO has a lot of credibility among car manufacturers and sportscar enthusiasts, so the results will be highly interesting. But of course don't expect the 997 Carrera S to be faster than the F430 on the track. The F430 is a different league and the target competitor is the 997 Turbo, not the 997 Carrera S.
    The F430 will very likely cost twice as much as a 997, so there is no doubt about it.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Thanks RC for sharing and translating

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    upps, I meant 1 min 14,5 for HH.

    (I'm quite interested in the F430's times too, I think it will improve a lot over the F360 as well.)



    Maybe we should start a Rennteam.com bet.

    I'd say 1 min 13,9 sec in Hockenheim and 7 min 59 sec. on the Nordschleife. The Nuerburgring still requires lots of power. The braking performance could also improve the track time. Imagine that the brake point can be set later, this would definetely improve track time.

    Regarding the F430: a little birdie told me that something around 7 min 50 sec is realistic. But of course we have to wait for the real thing to be tested by an independent source, not Ferrari or (in Porsche's case) Porsche themselves.
    SPORT AUTO has a lot of credibility among car manufacturers and sportscar enthusiasts, so the results will be highly interesting. But of course don't expect the 997 Carrera S to be faster than the F430 on the track. The F430 is a different league and the target competitor is the 997 Turbo, not the 997 Carrera S.
    The F430 will very likely cost twice as much as a 997, so there is no doubt about it.



    Impressive times above, however I can't wait to hear about the Nordschleife time. Although in different classes, it's fun to think that the Carrera S may be only 10 seconds slower on the ring than a F430, cost half as much, and be more reliable and practical to boot.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    Very impressive results. Do you know if 996TT cited is w/ or w/o X-50 and/or X-73 and/or PCCB? Thanks.



    The 996TT times stated are for the standard model without X50, without X73 and without PCCB. Time was recorded in 1999 or 2000, i.e. is rather old. At least I think so.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    Very impressive results. Do you know if 996TT cited is w/ or w/o X-50 and/or X-73 and/or PCCB? Thanks.



    The 996TT times stated are for the standard model without X50, without X73 and without PCCB. Time was recorded in 1999 or 2000, i.e. is rather old. At least I think so.



    Appreciate the clarification Can't wait to see what 996TTS does on these metrics....I would suspect material improvements over original 996TT

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    very good times for a pasm carrera (whiout LSD!!) ,but I'd like to know how PCCB improves in a track time. They're lighter ....but I think that the braking power is the same ....lighter brakes are used 4 better handling, imho.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Thanks guys for the infos

    Just can't wait

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Auto Zeitung already tested the 997 Carrera S on the Nordschleife - 7:56. With 20mm chassis and PCCB I would guess something around 7:50. Hockenheim could be around 1:14.5. Impressive in any case given GT3 facelift's performance (7:52, 1:13.2).

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    xyz said:
    Auto Zeitung already tested the 997 Carrera S on the Nordschleife - 7:56. With 20mm chassis and PCCB I would guess something around 7:50. Hockenheim could be around 1:14.5. Impressive in any case given GT3 facelift's performance (7:52, 1:13.2).



    That sounds a little strange, both lap numbers (7:56 997S - 7:52 MkII GT3) are 3 secs faster than Walter Rorhl himself in factory testing (-20mm 997S) and 2 secs faster than Von Saurma (MkII GT3). Who was the driver?

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    Do you know if 996TT cited is w/ or w/o X-50 and/or X-73 and/or PCCB?



    I don't think you'll see any track times for the Turbo with X50 alone, or X73 alone, or X50 and X73 on the same car.

    Porsche doesn't want the cat out of the bag. A Turbo with both of these options and PS2 tires (not currently available for the Turbo with an N rating) would be substantially faster on the big track; very close to GT2 numbers IMHO.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    Do you know if 996TT cited is w/ or w/o X-50 and/or X-73 and/or PCCB?



    I don't think you'll see any track times for the Turbo with X50 alone, or X73 alone, or X50 and X73 on the same car.

    Porsche doesn't want the cat out of the bag. A Turbo with both of these options and PS2 tires (not currently available for the Turbo with an N rating) would be substantially faster on the big track; very close to GT2 numbers IMHO.



    Excellent point....those clever marketing people trying to maintain perceived performance differences within the P lineup . I can't recall any car magazines having tested 996TT w/X73...yet P makes specific distinctions re: N-ring times of 997S w/sport suspension vs 997S w/PASM. I suppose test data on 996TTS will be our closest sense of capabilities of a fully factory-refined 996TT....though we'll prob not see a 996TTS w/X73 and X75 tested....

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    xyz said:
    Auto Zeitung already tested the 997 Carrera S on the Nordschleife - 7:56.



    I'm not aware of any Auto Zeitung testing of the 997 Carrera S on the Nordschleife. Do you have any more information? To my knowledge, the only testing Auto Zeitung ever did with the 997 Carrera S was the comparison test to the Mercedes SL500.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    carlos, I've looked the numbers up again, you were right: GT3's performance was 7:54 and 1:13,2. In Auto Zeitung it was only stated that Röhrl was "20 seconds faster" than with the 996 Carrera. I thought von Saurma was performing at 8:17 and Röhrl at 8:16 with the Carrera.
    But, 7:56 or 7:58 or 8:00, all numbers are brilliant. But I will keep my 2003 996 GT3 in any case!

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    xyz, an MkII GT3 is definately a keeper!

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    xyz, an MkII GT3 is definately a keeper!



    Definetely, no doubt about it.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    RC, though I understand the value of suspensions and brakes, I find it really hard to believe that a car who's hp/kg ratio is substantially worse could touch the 996TT... Especially on a long track where power matters. Plus, the S' standard brakes are the Turbo's aren't they? They just have about 100kg less to stop... Anyway, real interesting numbers that actually lead me to believe that it would be very surprising to dyno a 997S. My guess is that there are many more horses than what are claimed...
    JM

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    JMR,

    are you referring to the Hockenheim or N'ring laptimes?

    The car seems to be equal or slightly slower than a 996 Turbo on the above mentioned tracks - each with the equivalent suspension setting (sport or std.) which is nothing magical in my eyes. I think the laptimes are alright considering the development leap in the recent past, in suspension, brakes and of course tyres. The Carrera S has good power deliverance at high RPMs which comes in handy on a track.

    Greetings!

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    I agree with Ferdie, the 996TT tested officially in the ring was a very early model, not only is the 997S that matched the TT lighter and with a much sportier suspension (-20mm/rear LSD), but I bet the new tires on the 997S (purposedly made by Michelin for this car) also have a lot to do with it also since the tires have come a long way from those standard tires fitted by the early turbos. Now if you take a current MY 996TT with the equivalent X73 suspension and rear LSD options and equivalent tires, and I bet you the 996TT would open a gap between the 997S in the ring.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    I agree with Ferdie, the 996TT tested officially in the ring was a very early model, not only is the 997S that matched the TT lighter and with a much sportier suspension (-20mm/rear LSD), but I bet the new tires on the 997S (purposedly made by Michelin for this car) also have a lot to do with it also since the tires have come a long way from those standard tires fitted by the early turbos. Now if you take a current MY 996TT with the equivalent X73 suspension and rear LSD options and equivalent tires, and I bet you the 996TT would open a gap between the 997S in the ring.



    I completely agree. I find it funny that no one has gotten numbers from an X73 X50 996TT. I mean we know the GT3 7:54, the GT2 7:46, and the GT3 RS 7:47. (I'm taking these numbers from memory so correct me if I'm off at all). I'd like to know just for my curiosity what a potent factory 996TT could do as well as the more recent GT2 with more power and a revised suspension.

    Re: 997 Carrera S tested by SPORT AUTO on the track!

    We know that a X73/X50 fitted 996TT could easily match the Gallardo, and in the ring probably beat it by a small margin so my guess would be around 7:50 (Gallardo did 7:52 - Von Saurma).

     
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