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Re: Should I stay or should I go?
I can make a good deal right now
997 or 997s will not be a exclusive car and that is the problem I have right now with Porsche
The production number are growing to big so I look for the exclusive 911
The 997Turbo will to expensive due to the taxes in Holland
What ever happens the Turbo will always be an exclusive car
1 1/2 Years ago we bought a Cayenne and now they are all over the place,production is to big
997 or 997s will not be a exclusive car and that is the problem I have right now with Porsche
The production number are growing to big so I look for the exclusive 911
The 997Turbo will to expensive due to the taxes in Holland
What ever happens the Turbo will always be an exclusive car
1 1/2 Years ago we bought a Cayenne and now they are all over the place,production is to big
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
pffff, hard decision. The GT3 is an all time favorite, one of the most beautiful cars in the world. But jeez, so is the turbo. As a true lover, I'd say; make sure you sell the GT3 to someone who'll put it to good use, not a garage queen, and haave fun with the tt. But the; if you dont go to tracks; why a sportscar at all? Why not a rolls, or an M5 or so?
-Joost-
-Joost-
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
I am sorry dedam but i don't get your point.
You're talking about 997's as if they were almost "popular" cars.Exclusive is what you like,not how many are around.
I drove 996 turbo fot the past four years and i never felt more exclusive than regular 996's.And now that i decided to switch to a 997 i don't feel less exclusive.
You're talking about 997's as if they were almost "popular" cars.Exclusive is what you like,not how many are around.
I drove 996 turbo fot the past four years and i never felt more exclusive than regular 996's.And now that i decided to switch to a 997 i don't feel less exclusive.
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Quote:
Joost said:
pffff, hard decision. The GT3 is an all time favorite, one of the most beautiful cars in the world. But jeez, so is the turbo. As a true lover, I'd say; make sure you sell the GT3 to someone who'll put it to good use, not a garage queen, and haave fun with the tt. But the; if you dont go to tracks; why a sportscar at all? Why not a rolls, or an M5 or so?
-Joost-
Joost
I had so narrow escape on the back on the Zandvoort track(Scheivlak)
I was not insured so I decided not to go anymore
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Quote:
dedam said:
I have a 2000 GT3
Now I am thinging of buying a 2000 996Turbo with 100000km on the speedo
Any advice?
dedam
Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I remember, the 996 Turbo started with MY 2001 (first cars went to customers beginning of June 2000 but they already were MY 2001 cars).
I would buy a Turbo starting with MY 2002 or better, MY 2003. There have been some minor technical changes, the engines also became a little bit more powerful.
I also would NEVER buy a 996 Turbo without a warranty, so the used car Porsche warranty (only available from an official Porsche dealer) is a good thing to get.
You want comfort and great performance at the same time? The first GT3 series wasn't much stiffer than the 996 Turbo, so I'm not sure about comfort.
The current 997 Carrera S has a similar performance as the first GT3 series. Get a car with PASM and you'll be happy.
The second series GT3 has practically 996 Turbo performance, this would be a good choice too but comfort is definetely not really available with this car.
You're looking for a "seldom" car? Get a Trabant.
Honestly, Harry...I didn't think you're "that" kind of guy.
Of course there will be plenty of 997 around next year but probably not as many as you think due to limited production numbers in the first model year and of course due to the appearance of the 997 Cab. But you can see even more 996 around and trust me, most people are too dumb to see the difference between a 996 GT3, 996 Turbo or 996 C2/C4. Only thing they'll know is: this one is the OLD 911 and the other one is the NEW one. Trust me, I talked to so many people at the fuel station, at parking lots, my neighbors...a 911 is a 911 to them, they can't make a difference by the wings, spoilers, air intakes, etc. They look at the front and they look at the rear and thats it.
The 996 Turbo is no rare car, in Germany you can see it at almost every corner. No wonder, compared to the former 993 Turbo, the 996 Turbo is a mass product.
You have to set priorities: no track racing but you still want to have that special feeling, no real comfort? Get the 996 GT3 MkII (substantially improved and more powerful than your GT3 MkI). You want some sort of exclusivity but still lots of power? Get a 996 Turbo Cabriolet.
You want something new, something which might be allover the Netherlands in two years but also something which people recognize as the new 911, maybe THE modern 911.
And of course some comfort too? Get the 997 Carrera S with PASM.
You want something really special, not too stiff but really sporty? Get a 996 GT2, there are MkI models available at very attractive prices all over Germany.
Or just get a 997 Carrera S Cabriolet next spring and enjoy a little open air fun.
No, it doesn't make much sense to sell your GT3 MkI for a 996 Turbo MY 2001 in my opinion. Unless you really want additional power.
As I said, you have to set priorities.
When I wanted a sportscar again, I actually had four choices (two from my dealer and two others from Porsche factory sales but I didn't really want a used car, so I didn't mention it):
1. 997 Carrera S
2. 996 GT3 MkII
3. 996 Turbo X50 with PCCB and full carbon, 22000 km, very attractive price tag
4. 996 GT2 Mk1 with PCCB, a bit more kms but I don't remember, not really cheap but still interesting
My choice for the 997 Carrera S was justified by the following thoughts:
1. performance, especially handling with the 20 mm is spectacular and more important to me than power because I drive this fun car mostly on country roads and for fun
2. insurance and maintenance cost pretty low
3. two little places in the rear for the two kids
4. looks, quality and of course it is the "newer" car
You have to understand one thing: due to the fact that the 997 is pretty new, due to the fact that people are surprised by it's looks and quality (people on the street, at the fuel station, etc. keep "applauding" all the time, no kidding) and of course due to the fact that the 997 Carrera S is right now the sportiest 997 model, the 997 attracts much more attention than any 996, including the Turbo. And I'm sure this will go on for the next 2-3 years until people "get used" to the 997 and until the 997 GT3/Turbo show up.
I can see what happens with the Cayenne: Cayennes are pretty seldom over here in Germany because there is no Diesel. People are starring at my car like I was driving an exotic sportscar. Unbelievable. And they keep asking and asking...sometimes this can be very tiresome.
I hope you make your right decision but don't forget one thing: money is important of course but if you save money on a car you don't really want sooner or later, you'll be very disappointed and this will cost you even more money.
Good luck with your decision.
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Dedam,
I wouldn't go for the Turbo. Why do you believe it to be a good offer? Is it a friend of yours, who wants to sell it? Otherwise I would have my doubts. RC's comments are pretty valuable in my opinion, and repairs on engine/transmission on the turbo can be very expensive.
Honestly, a turbo with -20mm sport suspension can't be a lot more comfortable than your GT3 - and I have my doubts that a moonroof and heated seats are reason enough for you to change the car!
How many KMs have you driven with your GT3? Do you live close to Zandvoort?
I wouldn't go for the Turbo. Why do you believe it to be a good offer? Is it a friend of yours, who wants to sell it? Otherwise I would have my doubts. RC's comments are pretty valuable in my opinion, and repairs on engine/transmission on the turbo can be very expensive.
Honestly, a turbo with -20mm sport suspension can't be a lot more comfortable than your GT3 - and I have my doubts that a moonroof and heated seats are reason enough for you to change the car!
How many KMs have you driven with your GT3? Do you live close to Zandvoort?
Aug 19, 2004 9:37:25 PM
- 03-turbo911
- Pilot
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- Loc: Bahrain
- Posts: 337, Gallery
- Registered on: Aug 17, 2004
- Reply to: Joost
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
I say that a 2000 GT3 is more exclusive than a 996 tt. They were never made in huge numbers like the turbo and you don't see that many of those first ones. I undertand the appeal for a change to a tt but, from someone who owns a tt, I can tell you that it doesn't deliver half the thrill that's found in an early GT3.
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Was the 993 TT considered more exclusive when the 996 was already out? I was more interested in 993 TTs, but maybe others were interested in the "new" thing. I really don't know what "regular" people think of Porsches since I was asked whether my 1979 turbo was a 2001. I have 17 inch wheels and new front and rear bumpers, but those bumpers were 70s race pieces, definitely not modern. So exclusive to who? People who know nothing about the cars choose whatever looks different or cool. 996 TTs would be chosen over 996 C2s, but 997s have attractive curves, so it's anyone's guess. Those who know about newer car models and are interested only in what's new will pick the 997. Those who know about history and performance will choose the turbo and not the 997, but the 997S is a special car. Too me, none of these are as special as a GT3 though. Test drive all the cars that you're thinking about and find out if any of them make up for whatever you're doubting about the GT3.
Aug 20, 2004 7:12:12 AM
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Super Darius
- Rennteam Moderator
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- Loc: Italy-Como , Italy
- Posts: 4084, Gallery
- Registered on: Apr 7, 2002
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Reply to:
RC
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Quote:
RC said:Quote:
dedam said:
I have a 2000 GT3
Now I am thinging of buying a 2000 996Turbo with 100000km on the speedo
Any advice?
dedam
Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I remember, the 996 Turbo started with MY 2001 (first cars went to customers beginning of June 2000 but they already were MY 2001 cars).
I would buy a Turbo starting with MY 2002 or better, MY 2003. There have been some minor technical changes, the engines also became a little bit more powerful.
I also would NEVER buy a 996 Turbo without a warranty, so the used car Porsche warranty (only available from an official Porsche dealer) is a good thing to get.
You want comfort and great performance at the same time? The first GT3 series wasn't much stiffer than the 996 Turbo, so I'm not sure about comfort.
The current 997 Carrera S has a similar performance as the first GT3 series. Get a car with PASM and you'll be happy.
The second series GT3 has practically 996 Turbo performance, this would be a good choice too but comfort is definetely not really available with this car.
You're looking for a "seldom" car? Get a Trabant.
Honestly, Harry...I didn't think you're "that" kind of guy.
Of course there will be plenty of 997 around next year but probably not as many as you think due to limited production numbers in the first model year and of course due to the appearance of the 997 Cab. But you can see even more 996 around and trust me, most people are too dumb to see the difference between a 996 GT3, 996 Turbo or 996 C2/C4. Only thing they'll know is: this one is the OLD 911 and the other one is the NEW one. Trust me, I talked to so many people at the fuel station, at parking lots, my neighbors...a 911 is a 911 to them, they can't make a difference by the wings, spoilers, air intakes, etc. They look at the front and they look at the rear and thats it.
The 996 Turbo is no rare car, in Germany you can see it at almost every corner. No wonder, compared to the former 993 Turbo, the 996 Turbo is a mass product.
You have to set priorities: no track racing but you still want to have that special feeling, no real comfort? Get the 996 GT3 MkII (substantially improved and more powerful than your GT3 MkI). You want some sort of exclusivity but still lots of power? Get a 996 Turbo Cabriolet.
You want something new, something which might be allover the Netherlands in two years but also something which people recognize as the new 911, maybe THE modern 911.
And of course some comfort too? Get the 997 Carrera S with PASM.
You want something really special, not too stiff but really sporty? Get a 996 GT2, there are MkI models available at very attractive prices all over Germany.
Or just get a 997 Carrera S Cabriolet next spring and enjoy a little open air fun.
No, it doesn't make much sense to sell your GT3 MkI for a 996 Turbo MY 2001 in my opinion. Unless you really want additional power.
As I said, you have to set priorities.
When I wanted a sportscar again, I actually had four choices (two from my dealer and two others from Porsche factory sales but I didn't really want a used car, so I didn't mention it):
1. 997 Carrera S
2. 996 GT3 MkII
3. 996 Turbo X50 with PCCB and full carbon, 22000 km, very attractive price tag
4. 996 GT2 Mk1 with PCCB, a bit more kms but I don't remember, not really cheap but still interesting
My choice for the 997 Carrera S was justified by the following thoughts:
1. performance, especially handling with the 20 mm is spectacular and more important to me than power because I drive this fun car mostly on country roads and for fun
2. insurance and maintenance cost pretty low
3. two little places in the rear for the two kids
4. looks, quality and of course it is the "newer" car
You have to understand one thing: due to the fact that the 997 is pretty new, due to the fact that people are surprised by it's looks and quality (people on the street, at the fuel station, etc. keep "applauding" all the time, no kidding) and of course due to the fact that the 997 Carrera S is right now the sportiest 997 model, the 997 attracts much more attention than any 996, including the Turbo. And I'm sure this will go on for the next 2-3 years until people "get used" to the 997 and until the 997 GT3/Turbo show up.
I can see what happens with the Cayenne: Cayennes are pretty seldom over here in Germany because there is no Diesel. People are starring at my car like I was driving an exotic sportscar. Unbelievable. And they keep asking and asking...sometimes this can be very tiresome.
I hope you make your right decision but don't forget one thing: money is important of course but if you save money on a car you don't really want sooner or later, you'll be very disappointed and this will cost you even more money.
Good luck with your decision.
Well said Christian...all words are true..
I'm in the same situations..
Before i had a 996 Turbo MY2003..a great car,fast,etc...i love it..but i don't whant to loose too much money with the upcoming 997 so i toke the decision to sell it in May of this year..i had a CAyenne S on order so i decided to make a good compromise with my dealer that buy me my Turbo,give my the Cayenne and with the difference take down an account for my next 911,the 997 Turbo..
Now i'm from 3 months without my 911 and i'm bad...
all days i think to my great car..the handling,but the most part of it thet i need is the great power..it was chipped..and was fast,really fast..I love also my Cayenne,is comfortable,i use it all week instead of the 911 that was in the box all week,fast(for a SUV) and looks great..people look at you the same while driving a 911 or a Ferrari or a spaceship...
But...is no a 911..
So..what to do??
I love the 997 S...but if i buy one now i know that as soon as the Turbo or the GT3 comes out i drive crazy to have it..
I dont' whant to take a 997 S now and in two years change it again...i whant to stay with a car at least 4 years...i can't burn in car 35/40.000 Euro every two years..i cant!
Now..i think to know me well and i'm not able to stay with a 997 S for so long time..and the fault is of the Turbo..when you drive one..you can't came back....
Another solution is go with a second hand 996 GT2(new is a far out of my budget)..the prices are god..the car is great..i love to have one Speed Yellow.. but is not easy to find one with a few km,with no track days on it,in the right colour etc..
I find imperfection on a new car..you bet on an used car..i never bought one for this reason too..i whant that the car looks like new ever..
So..is difficult..the best solution for me is to stay calm with the Cayenne S..and wait the 997 Turbo..then buy it,love it and stay with it...
Dedam..with a 996 Gt3 MK1 i think a 997 S will be a right choice..but yes i'm also with you with the exclusivity of a model..and the 997S in two years will not be an exclusive model..sure;in Italy also the 996 Turbo is no exclusive..(exclusive are only the GT3 and Gt2 due to be hard to drive)...and i think that with Wiedeking strategy of 100.000 model for year,Porsche in the future will not be an exclusive brand..
So..or wait the 997 Turbo with me..or buy a 997 S..no more a 996..
Aug 20, 2004 9:36:10 AM
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dhayek
- Rennteam Master
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- Loc: Beirut , Lebanon
- Posts: 3839, Gallery
- Registered on: Jul 7, 2004
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Reply to:
Super Darius
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
if we talk about excusivity ,just think of it logically ,the 996 has been in the market since 1997,do you know how many they produced during 7 years?a lot...meaning the streets are full of 996,and people are bored..but with the 997 since its new ,streets are empty,you have 2 or 3 years to start and see large numbers..and by this time the tt will be out..go 997 ,and try to enjoy something else than exlusivity... 
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
boh .....now i'd like to sell my 996 cabrio .....for a 996 GT3 or for a 997 S .
I'm crazy ,yesterday I prepared the 997 S option list ,now I'd like the 996 GT3.
the price is similar ,but 4 exclusivity ...I'don't know ...a Gt3 is better ,but now ( or in an hear)it's old . I know the 997 S power and handling increase ,but I think that it's impossible that this car is an other planet versus my loved 996 cabrio.
I decided to don't buy an other cabriolet due my racing passion , so the Gt3 is better (in germany 500 km used cars are sold for 95000 euro) ...but I love also luxus ,leather ...so my brain say 997 S .
for the racing look I prefer the 996 Gt3 ,for the all day use I prefer the 997 S .
the power is similar ,the price also ...I don't know ...
help me.
I'm crazy ,yesterday I prepared the 997 S option list ,now I'd like the 996 GT3.
the price is similar ,but 4 exclusivity ...I'don't know ...a Gt3 is better ,but now ( or in an hear)it's old . I know the 997 S power and handling increase ,but I think that it's impossible that this car is an other planet versus my loved 996 cabrio.
I decided to don't buy an other cabriolet due my racing passion , so the Gt3 is better (in germany 500 km used cars are sold for 95000 euro) ...but I love also luxus ,leather ...so my brain say 997 S .
for the racing look I prefer the 996 Gt3 ,for the all day use I prefer the 997 S .
the power is similar ,the price also ...I don't know ...
help me.
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Dedam to make it easier: Ever thought about a used F360?
Not really a comfortable sportscar but those H&R springs on the lowered turbo won't give you much more comfort than the GT3, also not to forget: the higher unsprung weight of the Turbo's chassis compared with the GT3. The 360 is way more exclusive and will be in future. The problem is getting a good deal on one since it's a very small market here in holland mostly dominated by the off. (kroymans)network. Maintainance cost could be in a different league too.
Not really a comfortable sportscar but those H&R springs on the lowered turbo won't give you much more comfort than the GT3, also not to forget: the higher unsprung weight of the Turbo's chassis compared with the GT3. The 360 is way more exclusive and will be in future. The problem is getting a good deal on one since it's a very small market here in holland mostly dominated by the off. (kroymans)network. Maintainance cost could be in a different league too.
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Quote:
GM Austin said:
[
Dedam!! ... look what you've started!!
Thank guys for all the advice especially RC with his long reply
The last year I became almost a sleeping Rennteam member the only thing I do in the morning is read my paper en the Rennteam site
Now suddenly I ask you guys some advice and look how great your support is makes my realize that the Rennteammember site is an nice addition to owning a Porsche.
B.T.W Did not decide yet
Ferdi
I live 25 minutes from the Zandvoort track.
RC
Maybe you are right that I am looking for the same "applauding" like we have with our Cayenne the last 1 1/2 years it makes you proud off owning a Porsche again
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Quote:
donnyj said:
I would never buy a car because of it's exclusivity. If I were you I would part/exchange it for a newer GT3 and put my name down for the new 997 Turbo due in 2006.
Donny J
He wants more comfort, the GT3 MkII does a lot of things much better than the MkI but it definetely doesn't offer more comfort, on the contrary.
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Quote:
dhayek said:
if we talk about excusivity ,just think of it logically ,the 996 has been in the market since 1997,do you know how many they produced during 7 years?a lot...meaning the streets are full of 996,and people are bored..but with the 997 since its new ,streets are empty,you have 2 or 3 years to start and see large numbers..and by this time the tt will be out..go 997 ,and try to enjoy something else than exlusivity...
Whether you like or not many people will look at the 997 as being nothing more than an updated 993 a 10 year old car. AND that is precisely what it is.
BTW the 360 is not a high maintenance vehicle. If compared to a 996 out of warranty it probably would cost much less.
Re: Should I stay or should I go?
Quote:
nberry said:
Whether you like or not many people will look at the 997 as being nothing more than an updated 993 a 10 year old car. AND that is precisely what it is.
If you're right with your statement (which I tried to ignore because you sound like a virgin talking about sex
), this would put Ferrari to shame. How can a 10 year old car outrun almost every current Ferrari model? Oh forgot, Fiat.
Have you ever wondered why Italians prefer Porsche over Ferrari? Do you know what a Fiat is, Nick?! But to on a more "intellectual" level: how can you comment on a car you never saw in person and you never drove?
Honestly Nick, a while ago I thought you're just enjoying teasing Porsche owners but the more I think and analyze your posts, the more I come to the conclusion that it must be something pathological from a medical point of view.
The 993 and 997 don't have anything in common, the body looks completely different (talking about seing the 997 live) and the only thing both cars might have in common is the flat-six design engine (not the engine itself) and the rear wheel drive. Maybe the sound too.
Your comments are ridiculous because they're founded on your weird personal understanding that a car has always to have a completely new spectacular design.
But the success of the 911 is based on continuity, this is the last of a few of "classic" cars which made it to the 21st century. And furthermore, the 911 is a car which has been somehow socially "accepted", especially over here in Germany and Europe, something very important to people who don't live in Beverly Hills and who have to be cautious not to show off too much to avoid provoking customers and other people. Not to speak about the great daily driver capabilities due to reliability and driveability.
You've made your point, you're looking for looks and not performance, we already understood that. You don't have to repeat the same thing again and again just using different words and commentaries.
You don't like the 911? So what? I'm not sure I like you and do you see me bragging and talking about you all day long, day after day, week after week? Get a life, Nick. You have a serious problem and we won't accept this provoking behaviour anymore.
You had your first and second warning shots, the third one won't miss. Promise.
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