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    Jul 4, 2008 7:39:49 PM

    Greentree
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    Greentree
    Loc: Texas, USA , United States
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    Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    It's Independence Day here in the States. Time to hop in the car and visit dear ol' Mom who lives about 45 miles away. But I didn't take the 911; I took the Cayenne. Why? Well, I have about 26,000 miles on my 997 Cab and I have already replaced the rear tires twice! The first time they cost $540 each; the second time $591 each (plus stems, balance, etc). You do the numbers. The front tires, on the other hand, are the originals.

    This is irksome and a waste of money for a daily driver. I've had a four wheel alignment so that's not the problem. Somewhere in these pages, I read that the 911 rear suspension is intentionally set with lots of negative camber. In every case, I wore the tire down to the cords on its inside edge.

    These are 19" Carrera Sport wheels with Michelin PS2s. Has anybody out there decided to dispense with that tire/wheel combination and try something different? Maybe you found a better solution. I can't be the only one with this problem.

    Jul 4, 2008 7:45:48 PM

    ADias
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    ADias
    Loc: Southwest USA , United States
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    Reply to: Greentree

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    11s wear rears faster than fronts. Where were your tires wearing? center thread or outer thread? If center thread, that means your tires were under-inflated... (yeah, I know, counter-intuitive).

    Jul 4, 2008 8:20:59 PM

    Nugget
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    Nugget
    Loc: Houston Texas USA , United States
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    Reply to: ADias

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Rapid wear is just the natural consequence of soft, sticky rubber.

    Jul 4, 2008 9:31:41 PM

    Nidge
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    Reply to: Nugget

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    I normally get 11K per set of rears. One of the happy consequences of 911 ownership.

    Jul 4, 2008 9:48:55 PM

    ResB Offline
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    ResB
    Loc: Yorkshire, where roads are twisty... , United Kingdom
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    Reply to: Nidge

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    I'm on my 4th rear set in 32,000 miles.

    Jul 4, 2008 10:17:16 PM

    JoeRockhead
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    Reply to: ResB

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    My Boxster S chewed up rears faster than my 997. I used to replace the rear on my motorcycle every 4000 kilometers! Having said that, I expect to get about 18000 km's on mine.

    Jul 5, 2008 12:32:35 AM

    Jim48
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    Reply to: ResB

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Not surprised. I had the Continental ContiSportContact 2's as standard equipment, and I had to replace the rears at about 10,100 miles. The fronts were still good (early last December).

    I did some track time in late May, and last week, I had a "flat" reading on my Tire Pressure Monitoring System on the right front tire (about 13,200 miles on it then). Not wanting to take a chance on my next trip to the track (late this July), I decided to bite the bullet and got a set of Michelin PS2's put on. Not cheap - $2,134 for the tires and another $259 for mounting, balancing, and new valve stems. They didn't find any nail or other reason (rim not bent or cracked) for the slow leak I had in the right front, so I might have gotten away with just replacing the valve stem.

    Maybe I am overly cautious, but when it comes to brakes and tires, I don't like to pinch pennies.

    Jim

    Jul 5, 2008 1:08:08 AM

    Greentree
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    Greentree
    Loc: Texas, USA , United States
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    Reply to: JoeRockhead

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    The concensus seems to be "Suck it up, buddy". (Grumble) (Sigh) I guess I like the car too much to do otherwise.

    Here's a side story: When I took the car for a test drive I told the salesman I really liked it, but there was a problem. "What's that?", he said. "The sticker says it's equipped with 19 inch Carrera Sport wheels and these are 18 inch wheels". He was very embarrassed and immediately arranged to have the proper wheels installed.

    I've always wondered how that might have happened. Did another customer want the wheels for his purchase, none were available, so mine got cannibalized? Or did another customer want this car, knew the wheel set didn't last very long, arranged to have them swapped out, then failed to consumate the sale? Anyway, supposing my set was cannibalized off yet another vehicle on the lot, I wonder who eventually ended up with those 18 inch wheels.

    Jul 5, 2008 1:11:29 AM

    ADias
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    Reply to: Greentree

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    Greentree said:
    The concensus seems to be "Suck it up, buddy". (Grumble) (Sigh) I guess I like the car too much to do otherwise.

    Here's a side story: When I took the car for a test drive I told the salesman I really liked it, but there was a problem. "What's that?", he said. "The sticker says it's equipped with 19 inch Carrera Sport wheels and these are 18 inch wheels". He was very embarrassed and immediately arranged to have the proper wheels installed.

    I've always wondered how that might have happened. Did another customer want the wheels for his purchase, none were available, so mine got cannibalized? Or did another customer want this car, knew the wheel set didn't last very long, arranged to have them swapped out, then failed to consumate the sale? Anyway, supposing my set was cannibalized off yet another vehicle on the lot, I wonder who eventually ended up with those 18 inch wheels.



    Irrelevant! The 18" tires do not last any longer than the 19" tires. They may be more comfortable though.

    Jul 5, 2008 2:30:48 AM

    GRN2RSMO
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    Reply to: ADias

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    I do about 70% highway in my C2S and have p zero's. At about 12500mi they began to become really noisy, however they only needed to be changed at 15200 mi. Cost : 1100 USD including everything. I expect my next change will be 30-31000mi, and probably will have to change all 4 tires.

    Jul 7, 2008 4:16:26 AM

    Heist
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    Heist
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    Reply to: GRN2RSMO

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Think about Porsche 911 and you'll answer your own question.

    - 60% of the weight is on the REAR of the car.
    - Rear wheel drive (or bias in the case of AWD) car.
    - Lots of agressive negative camber dialed in at the factory
    - Lots of rear suspension geometry to keep the back end at the back during a turn.

    In all it yields the perfect design to chew through rear tires. The only car I've known to chew through street tires at the same pace was the Acura NSX.

    Jul 7, 2008 11:48:37 AM

    MMD
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    Reply to: Heist

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    As we all know deep down: there's nothing basic and practical about these cars. They're expensive luxury items. They're fun to own. Blowing money on them is part of the "fun."

    Just buy new tires when the old ones wear out. Make sure you're enjoying all 12K miles you get out of the tires. Otherwise drive your other car(s) more often.

    I dunno. No offense intended. Maybe try harder to ignore the extra zero that's always attached to the bottom line on the P-car bills we get. Cut back in other areas if necessary, like kid's tuition, wife's shoes, vacation trips with GF.

    Jul 7, 2008 12:04:19 PM

    Neil Schneider
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    Neil Schneider
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    Reply to: MMD

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    On my 996 I got 20k out of the conti's. The ps2 do not fair as well. I have 10k presently, but they are still going.

    Jul 7, 2008 12:11:18 PM

    Georgie997S
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    Loc: Greece
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    Reply to: Heist

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    Heist said:
    Think about Porsche 911 and you'll answer your own question.

    - 60% of the weight is on the REAR of the car.
    - Rear wheel drive (or bias in the case of AWD) car.
    - Lots of agressive negative camber dialed in at the factory
    - Lots of rear suspension geometry to keep the back end at the back during a turn.

    In all it yields the perfect design to chew through rear tires. The only car I've known to chew through street tires at the same pace was the Acura NSX.

    Very good point! . Also may I add that the engine's power and the way it's manipulated by the driver and the car itself is really aggressive to the tires. Every 911 driver has and will be having the same problem.

    Jul 7, 2008 2:05:24 PM

    NM
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    Reply to: Georgie997S

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Don't think its a problem restricted to 911's. My Cayman S goes through tyres pretty rapidly also. Roughly 11k/12k miles. Tyres are continental contisportcontact 2s, have already replaced once and am getting close to needing a third set, have a problem though:

    I understand that the contisportcontact 2s have been discountinued and replaced with a contisportcontact 3. Is it wise to replace the rears with this new type and keep the contisportcontact 2s on the front wheels? Will this imbalance the car? Don't fancy shelling out for new tyres all round seeing as the front's are looking ok at the moment and probably have a good 5k miles left in them...

    Jul 7, 2008 3:20:02 PM

    Orient Express
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    Orient Express
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    Reply to: NM

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    You should be getting between 17 and 24K miles out of the rears. One thing that can help stretch out the life of the rears is to make sure that the rear alignment had the camber set to as close to 0 degrees as possible. many alignment setups will dial in lots of negative camber which will enhance the handling, but will eat up the inside tread of tire.

    Jul 7, 2008 3:24:47 PM

    planenuts4speed
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    planenuts4speed
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    Reply to: Orient Express

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    If you have the camber set to 0 degrees to save the tires and drive the car aggressively around curves, how will this effect the handling?

    Jul 7, 2008 5:21:34 PM

    yemenmocha
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    yemenmocha
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    Reply to: planenuts4speed

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    About 10k miles for my first set. I'm a fairly spirited driver, but do not drop the clutch for launches or anything like that intending to get excess wheelspin. I have no idea how you would get 20k out of the rears.

    Jul 7, 2008 6:07:28 PM

    Equiraptor
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    Equiraptor
    Loc: Austin, TX
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    Reply to: Orient Express

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    Orient Express said:
    You should be getting between 17 and 24K miles out of the rears. One thing that can help stretch out the life of the rears is to make sure that the rear alignment had the camber set to as close to 0 degrees as possible. many alignment setups will dial in lots of negative camber which will enhance the handling, but will eat up the inside tread of tire.

    The fact that you (Greentree) report that you wear the inside edge of the tire faster than the outside, I'd recommend less camber, as well. I don't know if "as close to 0 degrees as possible" is really the correct setting, but "less" is certainly wise. Find a good shop in your area and make sure they listen to your concerns. When you had the alignment before, they may not have knows you were so concerned about tire wear, or they may not have changed the camber if they didn't have a strong reason to (assuming it was the same, side to side). A good shop can help you choose the right numbers for you.

    The disadvantage of less camber is less grip is available for hard cornering. However, if you're wearing the inside edge of the tires faster, you're not using that grip much of the time.

    As a side-note: Where in Texas are you? If you're in the Austin area, Nugget and I can probably help you find a good shop (ok, can definitely help you find a good shop - we know a few ).

    Jul 7, 2008 8:27:07 PM

    Nugget
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    Nugget
    Loc: Houston Texas USA , United States
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    Reply to: Equiraptor

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    Equiraptor said:As a side-note: Where in Texas are you? If you're in the Austin area, Nugget and I can probably help you find a good shop (ok, can definitely help you find a good shop - we know a few ).



    Failing that, we can also help you find some good events to start making better use of that camber and maybe even out your tire wear without resorting to a less aggressive alignment. A few days at H2R or a summer full of autocross events might be just the ticket.

    Jul 7, 2008 11:27:49 PM

    PJPR
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    Reply to: NM

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    NM said:
    Don't think its a problem restricted to 911's. My Cayman S goes through tyres pretty rapidly also. Roughly 11k/12k miles. Tyres are continental contisportcontact 2s, have already replaced once and am getting close to needing a third set, have a problem though:

    I understand that the contisportcontact 2s have been discountinued and replaced with a contisportcontact 3. Is it wise to replace the rears with this new type and keep the contisportcontact 2s on the front wheels? Will this imbalance the car? Don't fancy shelling out for new tyres all round seeing as the front's are looking ok at the moment and probably have a good 5k miles left in them...



    I had exactly this situation a few months ago, and my reliable local Discount Tire was able to source me 1 more rear Conti #2, which was great. The tread pattern and speed rating if I recall correctly on the #3 vs. the #2 is different, so not recommended to mix.

    Even though the tire is discontinued, there does seem to be still a reasonable supply available. Failing your local store finding one, PM me back and I'll see if my local store can use his contacts to source another one.

    Oh...and about 12k miles is what I also got out of the first rear set, so it seems like a 2:1 duration ratio for front to rear in terms of wear, not uncommon apparently...even if a little pricey.

    One other note...Discount Tire is $330 for the rear Conti, and even with mounting, Hunter Road Force balancing and full road hazard warranty, it should be about $400 fully loaded...much less than the prices quoted by others above.

    Jul 8, 2008 3:34:13 AM

    vern
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    vern
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    Reply to: PJPR

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Try Bridgestone RE050 tires. Paid $325 out the door per tire. Size: 295 X 30 X ZR19. Many forum members recommend these tires. Replaced my rear Michelins @ 14,000 miles. This price may lesson some of the pain of the short life span of the rear tires.

    Jul 8, 2008 3:39:54 AM

    Orient Express
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    Reply to: planenuts4speed

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    planenuts4speed said:
    If you have the camber set to 0 degrees to save the tires and drive the car aggressively around curves, how will this effect the handling?



    It is not quite as crisp or laser like, but by no means dangerous. I found it is just fine, and the gains I get in tread life offsets the handling difference.

    Jul 8, 2008 5:28:50 AM

    Georgie997S
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    Reply to: planenuts4speed

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    planenuts4speed said:
    If you have the camber set to 0 degrees to save the tires and drive the car aggressively around curves, how will this effect the handling?

    huh... you don't change 911's camber... A 911 is not a MB cls...

    Jul 8, 2008 7:51:42 PM

    Jim48
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    Reply to: MMD

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Quote:
    MMD said:
    As we all know deep down: there's nothing basic and practical about these cars. They're expensive luxury items. They're fun to own. Blowing money on them is part of the "fun."



    Just buy new tires when the old ones wear out. Make sure you're enjoying all 12K miles you get out of the tires. Otherwise drive your other car(s) more often.

    I dunno. No offense intended. Maybe try harder to ignore the extra zero that's always attached to the bottom line on the P-car bills we get. Cut back in other areas if necessary, like kid's tuition, wife's shoes, vacation trips with GF.



    My sentiments exactly!!!!

    Jim

    Jul 8, 2008 8:16:18 PM

    911Fanatic
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    Reply to: Jim48

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Change your camber to a less aggressive setting. I encountered the same situation....after 12-13K, inside rear tires (Michelin PS2s) were worn out. I now have 26K with 2nd set of Michelin PS2s with 60-70% tread remaining. Front tires are still original, but need to be replaced soon. Handling...I haven't noticed a difference driving around town, but would imagine a difference if you track your car.

    Jul 9, 2008 12:09:58 AM

    cibergypsy
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    Reply to: 911Fanatic

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    I had my Carrera S aligned to a more tire friendly setting only to find the handling affected in an adverse manner. I'd rather go through a set of rear tires every 12k or 14k miles and have the car handle the way it was meant than trying to make them last longer and not enjoy the car fully. I mean, the handling literally su*&ed!

    Jul 9, 2008 7:27:17 AM

    Jeannot
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    Reply to: cibergypsy

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    What is even worse is how the 911s eat WINTER tires...As soon as spring is back, I immediately swap or otherwise I see those poor winters being eaten alive by the warmer & dryer road!!!

    Jul 9, 2008 1:25:22 PM

    Greentree
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    Reply to: Jeannot

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    I think I'll just leave the camber alone and pay the freight --it's just that replacing tires that often is like culture shock. But it goes around corners like it's on rails. Gets the wife all upset. She'll pinch a big bruise on my leg.

    Jul 9, 2008 1:52:02 PM

    reginos
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    Reply to: Greentree

    Re: Does your 911 eat rear tires?

    Tyres (especially rear) on modern Porsches including Boxsters are consumable items. Their useful life if driven exclusively out of town and in a hot climate is 10,000km give or take a few hundred. My Boxster S has 95,000km and it went through 8 sets of rear and 4 sets of front tyres.
    I drive it in town very seldom and pick B routes for most of my journeys to enjoy driving more. The climate can get very hot Mediterranean here which is also a factor.

    So the attrition most of you mentioned can be considered very good.
     
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