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Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
GA997S said:Quote:
Pabs1 said:
GA997s.
You must have had a very sad childhood, you never got to watch " Bambi "...........
Compassion and tolerance towards other " Sentient Beings " will make you a better " human ".
colonel: "I was coming home on I380 in PA. A deer jumped in front of me"
nberry: "A Deer does not come out of nowhere. Most Dear crossings are well marked. The driver was not paying attention. An attentive driver would have been able to avoid the accident."
Do you agree with Nick and insinuate that I'm not compassionate to wildlife without even knowing me? That makes all kinds of sense.
I suspect your idea of compassion to animals is rather than kill them by use of a gun is use a bow and arrow. Much more "sporting" regardless it may cause longer suffering and pain in death.
Good drivers on highways adjacent to forested areas are ALWAYS on the look out of animals trying to cross highways. Most if not all collisions can be avoided.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Nick, Deer do funny things. You must have miracle vision, ESP or have never driven in real Deer country much.
Outside Seattle on a 2 lane highway at 11AM in the morning I saw a deer by the road ahead. I stopped to let it cross. It charged right into my rented Cadillac 3 times and badly injured itself in doing so.
Deer arent exactly the smartest critters in the Animal kingdom.
And I have had other deer just jump out into the road from the woods for near misses. Im sorry to say that I cant see thru trees and brush like you can.
You shouldnt condemn Colonel. PA is loaded with deer, Wisconsin is the worst and Lassen County in Cali at night you see herd after herd when on side roads. Its not like SD
at all.
Outside Seattle on a 2 lane highway at 11AM in the morning I saw a deer by the road ahead. I stopped to let it cross. It charged right into my rented Cadillac 3 times and badly injured itself in doing so.
Deer arent exactly the smartest critters in the Animal kingdom.
And I have had other deer just jump out into the road from the woods for near misses. Im sorry to say that I cant see thru trees and brush like you can.
You shouldnt condemn Colonel. PA is loaded with deer, Wisconsin is the worst and Lassen County in Cali at night you see herd after herd when on side roads. Its not like SD
at all.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
AUM said:
100,000 animals are slaughtered every minute of every day for people to eat. Yet humans have no nutritional need for animal products and are in fact healthier and happier with a vegetarian diet.
Beef provides a lower quality protein, it's a less healthy source of protein, produces much less protein per acre and waaaay more pollution than..., wait for it..., soybeans.
WOW
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:
GA997S said:Quote:
Pabs1 said:
GA997s.
You must have had a very sad childhood, you never got to watch " Bambi "...........
Compassion and tolerance towards other " Sentient Beings " will make you a better " human ".
colonel: "I was coming home on I380 in PA. A deer jumped in front of me"
nberry: "A Deer does not come out of nowhere. Most Dear crossings are well marked. The driver was not paying attention. An attentive driver would have been able to avoid the accident."
Do you agree with Nick and insinuate that I'm not compassionate to wildlife without even knowing me? That makes all kinds of sense.
I suspect your idea of compassion to animals is rather than kill them by use of a gun is use a bow and arrow. Much more "sporting" regardless it may cause longer suffering and pain in death.
Good drivers on highways adjacent to forested areas are ALWAYS on the look out of animals trying to cross highways. Most if not all collisions can be avoided.
There you go again. I've never hunted a day in my life and don't think I ever will. I implied nothing else but that deer are sometimes hard to avoid when traveling 75 mph in traffic on the interstate and that your statement was asinine.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
AUM said:
100,000 animals are slaughtered every minute of every day for people to eat. Yet humans have no nutritional need for animal products and are in fact healthier and happier with a vegetarian diet.
In this country humans kill billions of animals for food.
In this country humans kill 10 million Dogs and Cats because there are no homes.
In this country humans experiment on hundreds of thousands of animals with no purpose ( just for the glorification of scientist egos, pharmaceuticals,teaching hospitals,corporations that are mandated by the government to do inane tests on animals, so humans won't burn their poor little eyes when they use shampoo, Etc.) not to mention the use of higher intelligence animals , like Apes, and other domesticated animals.
In this country Humans abuse and kill animals for " sport "
In this country Humans ........
In this country Humans.........
And that is in this country, the rest of the world does it part too.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
AUM said:
100,000 animals are slaughtered every minute of every day for people to eat. Yet humans have no nutritional need for animal products and are in fact healthier and happier with a vegetarian diet.
So tell us your BMW or Porsche interior choices and what the heck you use for shoes. Got a belt? Got any leather furniture? Wallet? How many cows must die to please your lifestyle??
Good luck being consistent and sanctimonious!
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:Quote:
AUM said:
100,000 animals are slaughtered every minute of every day for people to eat. Yet humans have no nutritional need for animal products and are in fact healthier and happier with a vegetarian diet.
So tell us your BMW or Porsche interior choices and what the heck you use for shoes. Got a belt? Got any leather furniture? Wallet? How many cows must die to please your lifestyle??
Good luck being consistent and sanctimonious!
(Edited)
All my shoes, belts and any part of our wardrobe that can be vegan it is..........
Regarding cars, our two other cars do not have leather.
The Porsche, I tried to get without leather but no luck, that is why I got with the least amount of it possible.
The issue here is maybe a little to advance for you, but the use of animals will never stop unfortunatly the issue is the treatment and the abuse done to this beings, and the arrogance by which Humans use and exploit animals.
Hope you can comprehend this .
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
MY two cents: RESPECT AND GRATITUDE.
It's just maybe an issue of everybody having MORE RESPECT for the animals we _USE_.
You love your cat or dog, right?
Go to a 4H club and there's people there who love their cows and pigs the same way.
Just because a pig or steer is bred for slaughter and is "anonymous" doesn't mean it's life is worthless and needless of respect.
Next time you eat or sit on animal products maybe say a little "prayer" of thanks for the animal. (doesn't have to be a "religious" prayer)
It's just maybe an issue of everybody having MORE RESPECT for the animals we _USE_.
You love your cat or dog, right?
Go to a 4H club and there's people there who love their cows and pigs the same way.
Just because a pig or steer is bred for slaughter and is "anonymous" doesn't mean it's life is worthless and needless of respect.
Next time you eat or sit on animal products maybe say a little "prayer" of thanks for the animal. (doesn't have to be a "religious" prayer)
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Pabs1 You are the one who is inconsistent.
If you were a true believer in animal protection you would not buy a car with a leather interior period! Full Stop!
But no, you seem like a bespoiled elitist drunk on a few excuses to assauge your condoning of murder of innocent animals just to use for trinkets in your fashionable lifestyle.
Your selfish compromise causes deaths, agony and suffering. And its people thinking like you that cause it to not stop.
Why should nice Norwegian cows be killed to fit your spending habits for frkkn luxury goods? Why? Why?
"I got a Porsche with least animals killed to make it" is not like saying "I will not buy a car that is made with the suffering of animals" Now is it? Its self serving, selfish and intellectual dishonest.
You should be ashamed!
Maybe that concept is too evolved for you! Now go count your money as nice friendly cows are killed for the baubles of your elitist rich a$$ lifestyle that you so need.
If you were a true believer in animal protection you would not buy a car with a leather interior period! Full Stop!
But no, you seem like a bespoiled elitist drunk on a few excuses to assauge your condoning of murder of innocent animals just to use for trinkets in your fashionable lifestyle.
Your selfish compromise causes deaths, agony and suffering. And its people thinking like you that cause it to not stop.
Why should nice Norwegian cows be killed to fit your spending habits for frkkn luxury goods? Why? Why?
"I got a Porsche with least animals killed to make it" is not like saying "I will not buy a car that is made with the suffering of animals" Now is it? Its self serving, selfish and intellectual dishonest.
You should be ashamed!
Maybe that concept is too evolved for you! Now go count your money as nice friendly cows are killed for the baubles of your elitist rich a$$ lifestyle that you so need.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
And there goes down the thread to hell in a hand basket... How PC can people be. Most of these self-appointed deer protectors have no sense of reality. Due to deer protective actions, there are too many deer in many places where there were no deer in the past.
I like deer as much as the next guy but to attack/insult people on this topic is cheap. Most of these people drive their boat-sized SUVs or garage queen poseur cars to the next watering hole, country club or Starbucks to show off, avoiding racking miles on proper roads - because those belong to the deer...
I like deer as much as the next guy but to attack/insult people on this topic is cheap. Most of these people drive their boat-sized SUVs or garage queen poseur cars to the next watering hole, country club or Starbucks to show off, avoiding racking miles on proper roads - because those belong to the deer...
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
There are more deer in America now then in 1776. Why? agriculture, lack of predators and suburban sprawl that provides cover and food in many cases, such as golf courses, parks and greenbelts.
Let the whiney PC rich figure that out if they can. The only animals they really know are the seats in their cars and their fancy shoes and handbags.
Let the whiney PC rich figure that out if they can. The only animals they really know are the seats in their cars and their fancy shoes and handbags.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Pabs1 You are the one who is inconsistent.
If you were a true believer in animal protection you would not buy a car with a leather interior period! Full Stop!
But no, you seem like a bespoiled elitist drunk on a few excuses to assauge your condoning of murder of innocent animals just to use for trinkets in your fashionable lifestyle.
Your selfish compromise causes deaths, agony and suffering. And its people thinking like you that cause it to not stop.
Why should nice Norwegian cows be killed to fit your spending habits for frkkn luxury goods? Why? Why?
"I got a Porsche with least animals killed to make it" is not like saying "I will not buy a car that is made with the suffering of animals" Now is it? Its self serving, selfish and intellectual dishonest.
You should be ashamed!
Maybe that concept is too evolved for you! Now go count your money as nice friendly cows are killed for the baubles of your elitist rich a$$ lifestyle that you so need.
Obviously you didn't comprehend the issue, my bad for trying to " enlighten " (Edited)
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Yes, you are the enlightened one, sorry we forgot!
After all you have three cars and made sure that only the third one had to have a animal killed for it! WOW! You really do care! Mr. BIG Carbon Vegan Enviro footprint you really care!!
So preach more please! Go get some spots on cable TV and explain to the world how u are a vegan and hate animals to be killed! BUT when you HAD to buy your new Porsche you made sure only one animal was executed, gutted, skinned and processed to meet the needs of your luxury lifestyle!!!
Your logic is ridiculous and makes you look selfish.
After all you have three cars and made sure that only the third one had to have a animal killed for it! WOW! You really do care! Mr. BIG Carbon Vegan Enviro footprint you really care!!
So preach more please! Go get some spots on cable TV and explain to the world how u are a vegan and hate animals to be killed! BUT when you HAD to buy your new Porsche you made sure only one animal was executed, gutted, skinned and processed to meet the needs of your luxury lifestyle!!!
Your logic is ridiculous and makes you look selfish.
Jun 16, 2007 11:45:30 PM
- palenimbus
- Expert
-
- Loc: Baden-Württemberg, Germany
- Posts: 1824, Gallery
- Registered on: Jul 6, 2004
- Reply to: JimFlat6
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
I agree with Jim, if you care about animals that much you would sacrifice your Porsche for the sake of your principles.
Just a note, I am a huge animal lover and when I first saw picture of colonel's wrecked car my first thought was what happened to the dear. (Obviously I knew colonel was OK because he was writing this thread after all).
Just a note, I am a huge animal lover and when I first saw picture of colonel's wrecked car my first thought was what happened to the dear. (Obviously I knew colonel was OK because he was writing this thread after all).
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Well I may have misjudged you. I owe you an apology.
Jim, we all know that highways through forested areas pose problems for drivers and animals. Presumeably we are the more intelligent species and therefore the responsibility rests with us to avoid collisions. No doubt there will be rare occasions when the accident is unavoidable. The collision in this case may be one of those. However, they are few and far between.
BTW you really shouldn't play the "well you are wearing leather yada yada yada" card. It is a specious argument and beneath you. The harvesting of animals is entrenched in our society. Their byproducts are almost every where. We must start somewhere.
The main purpose of harvesting animals is food. Stop eating it and everything else follows. Do you recall when smoking was the national past time? Who would have thought that today and each day going forward it is being phased out with possible elimimation within 25years?
Finally, how did you come up with the statement that there are more dear today than in 1776. Have you been picking at your rear-end again?
Jim, we all know that highways through forested areas pose problems for drivers and animals. Presumeably we are the more intelligent species and therefore the responsibility rests with us to avoid collisions. No doubt there will be rare occasions when the accident is unavoidable. The collision in this case may be one of those. However, they are few and far between.
BTW you really shouldn't play the "well you are wearing leather yada yada yada" card. It is a specious argument and beneath you. The harvesting of animals is entrenched in our society. Their byproducts are almost every where. We must start somewhere.
The main purpose of harvesting animals is food. Stop eating it and everything else follows. Do you recall when smoking was the national past time? Who would have thought that today and each day going forward it is being phased out with possible elimimation within 25years?
Finally, how did you come up with the statement that there are more dear today than in 1776. Have you been picking at your rear-end again?
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Yes, you are the enlightened one, sorry we forgot!
After all you have three cars and made sure that only the third one had to have a animal killed for it! WOW! You really do care! Mr. BIG Carbon Vegan Enviro footprint you really care!!
So preach more please! Go get some spots on cable TV and explain to the world how u are a vegan and hate animals to be killed! BUT when you HAD to buy your new Porsche you made sure only one animal was executed, gutted, skinned and processed to meet the needs of your luxury lifestyle!!!
Your logic is ridiculous and makes you look selfish.
(Edited)
First I didn't say I was vegan.
I wrote a thread that said how many animals are killed, how many animals are abused, how many animals are used for research, how many animals are killed because there are no homes for them, if fact if you have an ounce of brains you will notice that the gest of it is to bring up the fact that animals are being abused and mistreated, regardless if they are being killed for food or not.
You were the one who got all as yo said " sanctymonious " about my thread.
I am not going to explain myself or my lifestyle, but we all fight the battles we can somehow win and we try to accomodate and live with the battles that we can't.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Nick, deer populations in the US are estimated by the US Department of Fish and Wildlife. They are the primary recognized source for info about the deer, their populations and historic wildlife population levels in the US.
But Hitting deer is more common then you think. Not only in this country, but even in the EU. Germany for example, the police still breed and train one specific breed of dog just for the purpose of tracking deer wounded by cars.
Its not just in "forrested areas" its even in urban areas, it can be in any area! Their behaviour around man is unpredicatable especially during the rutting season. You cant count on stopping or whatever, they just go, they dont think to any std of human of logic and they move so fast so quick that your claim that human superiority allows us not to hit them is just unrealistic as a cureall.
I dont know what the deer population of La Jolla is. But in Southern Marin there are many many deer that dont get drivers licenses or take safety courses or watch bambi !!!!
I once counted 15 in my backyard alone. This is all within 1 mile of 101 and only a few miles North of the Golden Gate bridge. They often just jump out of hedges at night into the street! So there is no way to see, predict, guess, deduce, chart or control their behaviour and no way for any mortal being to react in time! Its just to luck that they dont land in your windshield and kill you with them.
In Southern Marin they will cause a serious fatality one day. There are too many of them and some need to be shot dead now and some Does need to be sterilized before the hazard develops into a life death tragedy for some innocent humans.
Nick, I dont accept the logic in your remarks about your excuse for buying animal products. Its so self serving. Simply you dont need a leather car interior, coat, wallet whatever. Its your desire for luxury consumer items that makes you a gross offender against the very animals you claim you seek to protect. I guess that protection works until you want some nice shoes eh? Vegan red perhaps?
But Hitting deer is more common then you think. Not only in this country, but even in the EU. Germany for example, the police still breed and train one specific breed of dog just for the purpose of tracking deer wounded by cars.
Its not just in "forrested areas" its even in urban areas, it can be in any area! Their behaviour around man is unpredicatable especially during the rutting season. You cant count on stopping or whatever, they just go, they dont think to any std of human of logic and they move so fast so quick that your claim that human superiority allows us not to hit them is just unrealistic as a cureall.
I dont know what the deer population of La Jolla is. But in Southern Marin there are many many deer that dont get drivers licenses or take safety courses or watch bambi !!!!
I once counted 15 in my backyard alone. This is all within 1 mile of 101 and only a few miles North of the Golden Gate bridge. They often just jump out of hedges at night into the street! So there is no way to see, predict, guess, deduce, chart or control their behaviour and no way for any mortal being to react in time! Its just to luck that they dont land in your windshield and kill you with them.
In Southern Marin they will cause a serious fatality one day. There are too many of them and some need to be shot dead now and some Does need to be sterilized before the hazard develops into a life death tragedy for some innocent humans.
Nick, I dont accept the logic in your remarks about your excuse for buying animal products. Its so self serving. Simply you dont need a leather car interior, coat, wallet whatever. Its your desire for luxury consumer items that makes you a gross offender against the very animals you claim you seek to protect. I guess that protection works until you want some nice shoes eh? Vegan red perhaps?
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
nberry said:
Well I may have misjudged you. I owe you an apology.
You know...I like leather goods and I'll eat a steak or hamburger now and then like 99% of us. I'm a pretty laid back guy and don't have time to let things bother me. I could've used a little softer language toward you too. It's just that you're sometimes an easy target but you know that.
Pabs1's direct personal insult of JimFlat6 is surprising. I hope he doesn't do that to the wrong person and end up in a ditch. Be careful Pabs1...especially in your state.
And now my 911th post is not about a 911!
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
My last comment:
I didn't want to hit the deer. Yes. there were signs for deer, but the entire PA has these signs everywhere. I saw the deer in the tall grass. It all happened within a few seconds. I was really hoping that it won't come out, but in the last moment, it did but then decide to go back. Having to avoid a stationary odject on the road is one thing, but try to avoid an animal that you don't know which way it wants to go is next to impossible.
I think the commment about deer accident is avoidable is ridiculous. How do you know if what the deer would do? How do you know if the deer would come out of the road or not?
The state trooper told me that I was better off just hit the deer as he has seen worst accidents when people has gone off the road, hit a tree, or roll their vehicles trying to avoid the deer cause serious injuries.
Thanks everyone...
I didn't want to hit the deer. Yes. there were signs for deer, but the entire PA has these signs everywhere. I saw the deer in the tall grass. It all happened within a few seconds. I was really hoping that it won't come out, but in the last moment, it did but then decide to go back. Having to avoid a stationary odject on the road is one thing, but try to avoid an animal that you don't know which way it wants to go is next to impossible.
I think the commment about deer accident is avoidable is ridiculous. How do you know if what the deer would do? How do you know if the deer would come out of the road or not?
The state trooper told me that I was better off just hit the deer as he has seen worst accidents when people has gone off the road, hit a tree, or roll their vehicles trying to avoid the deer cause serious injuries.
Thanks everyone...
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Common sense tells you if they were easy to avoid it wouldn't be necessary to post so many signs warning drivers... 
I agree with Jim, deer- animals in general are unpredictable. During a drive today with the Porsche Club, I saw a dead deer off to the side of the road - must of been hit within the past several hours.
This thread made me a bit more attentive for deer darting across the road. I was also wondering if PSE provides a warning signal for deer?
Damn, Pabs- WTF, did your dogs soil your leather seats? You must be the toughest cat around to be talking that way.
I agree with Jim, deer- animals in general are unpredictable. During a drive today with the Porsche Club, I saw a dead deer off to the side of the road - must of been hit within the past several hours.
This thread made me a bit more attentive for deer darting across the road. I was also wondering if PSE provides a warning signal for deer?
Damn, Pabs- WTF, did your dogs soil your leather seats? You must be the toughest cat around to be talking that way.
Jun 17, 2007 8:29:55 AM
-
Carlos from Spain
- Rennteam Moderator
-
- Loc: Spain. , Spain
- Posts: 21156, Gallery
- Registered on: Feb 9, 2003
- Reply to: Pabs1
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
PABS1,
There will be no infantile insulting and direct personal attacks in this forum. I come in here and find that you have done so in your last THREE consecutive posts no less. I'm going to edit them and give you a serious warning about this, if you want to say something argument it but done insult people, even if out just out of respect for your fellow forum members.
I would appreciate everyones cooperation to not to bite into the provocation and maintain respect and manners
There will be no infantile insulting and direct personal attacks in this forum. I come in here and find that you have done so in your last THREE consecutive posts no less. I'm going to edit them and give you a serious warning about this, if you want to say something argument it but done insult people, even if out just out of respect for your fellow forum members.
I would appreciate everyones cooperation to not to bite into the provocation and maintain respect and manners
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
Pabs1 said:Quote:
JimFlat6 said:Quote:
AUM said:
100,000 animals are slaughtered every minute of every day for people to eat. Yet humans have no nutritional need for animal products and are in fact healthier and happier with a vegetarian diet.
So tell us your BMW or Porsche interior choices and what the heck you use for shoes. Got a belt? Got any leather furniture? Wallet? How many cows must die to please your lifestyle??
Good luck being consistent and sanctimonious!
(Edited)
All my shoes, belts and any part of our wardrobe that can be vegan it is..........
Regarding cars, our two other cars do not have leather.
The Porsche, I tried to get without leather but no luck, that is why I got with the least amount of it possible.
The issue here is maybe a little to advance for you, but the use of animals will never stop unfortunatly the issue is the treatment and the abuse done to this beings, and the arrogance by which Humans use and exploit animals.
Hope you can comprehend this .
I try to limit the amount of harm I inflict on animals and humans. I am a dietary vegan who chooses non-leather interiors when possible.
Jun 17, 2007 10:57:21 AM
- 550 Spyder
- Junior
-
- Loc: MD, USA
- Posts: 90, Gallery
- Registered on: Dec 25, 2004
- Reply to: AUM
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Life is full of hypocracy and irony. In today's modern civilization, it is almost impossible to not take part in some form of human infliction towards other living animals. If you own and drive a Porsche or any other luxury automobile then that obviously says something about your persona.
All of us enthusiast owners are selfish to a certain extent.
All of us enthusiast owners are selfish to a certain extent.
Jun 17, 2007 5:03:20 PM
- AUM
- Veteran
-
- Loc: Germany
- Posts: 1203, Gallery
- Registered on: May 2, 2006
- Reply to: 550 Spyder
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
550 Spyder said:
Life is full of hypocracy and irony. In today's modern civilization, it is almost impossible to not take part in some form of human infliction towards other living animals. If you own and drive a Porsche or any other luxury automobile then that obviously says something about your persona.
All of us enthusiast owners are selfish to a certain extent.
Very true. But we can limit the damage to other beings while still having lots of motorsport and other fun.
Hurting and killing creatures for fun is sick. And the pain we cause returns to us. Karma is inescapable.
Re: hit a deer this past Tues
Quote:
colonel said:
The state trooper told me that I was better off just hit the deer as he has seen worst accidents when people has gone off the road, hit a tree, or roll their vehicles trying to avoid the deer cause serious injuries.
Years ago I swerved to avoid a cat on the highway. I smashed my car by going off the road (was not injured).
Since that day I trained myself NOT to swerve. Every time I see an animal in or near the road I GRIP the wheel tightly and hold it straight-on as I apply brakes as needed.
Unless I'm going around 35 mph or slower, I trained myself to make a mental decision to go straight and into the animal if necessary if braking doesn't work.
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