Crown

Board: Porsche - 911 - 997 Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread

    Jul 30, 2006 11:21:00 AM

    Porsche-Jeck
    Rennteam Master
    Porsche-Jeck
    Loc: Rheinland , Germany
    Posts: 4856, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 27, 2005

    7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    According to the latest issue of Autobild the 997 MK II (2008) will get the following technical upgrades:

    > 7 gear manual gearbox (keeps us manual guys on par with the auto-tranny guys )

    > more HP (no numbers mentioned)

    > reworked chassis (no details mentioned, but it may refer to the retractable front spoiler- see other thread)

    You may take it with a grain of salt, but AB talks about the changes like they are facts rather than rumors.

    Jul 30, 2006 1:16:59 PM

    boxsterboy
    Junior
    boxsterboy
    Loc: uk
    Posts: 109, Gallery
    Registered on: Jan 7, 2006
    Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    That must be a first 7 speed manual???

    Jul 30, 2006 1:54:35 PM

    Emperor
    Veteran
    Emperor
    Loc: London & Gothenburg
    Posts: 1013, Gallery
    Registered on: Jan 6, 2006
    Reply to: boxsterboy

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    manual tranny with 7 gears, you have got to be kidding me?

    Jul 30, 2006 3:12:29 PM

    MMD
    Rennteam VIP
    MMD
    Loc: usa
    Posts: 9652, Gallery
    Registered on: Dec 16, 2004
    Reply to: Emperor

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Quote:
    luwalira said:
    manual tranny with 7 gears, you have got to be kidding me?




    7 gearings would only be good for refinements on the track; since tracking voids warrenty it won't be useful to the street car. The car which has so much hp/tq it really only needs a two speed gearbox: 1st and 3rd gear (ok and 6th to get top speed).

    Jul 30, 2006 4:08:51 PM

    Hurst
    Veteran
    Hurst
    Loc: Potomac, MD
    Posts: 1255, Gallery
    Registered on: Apr 15, 2005
    Reply to: MMD

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    It's almost impossible to work a 7 gear manual that isn't sequential. Think of the gearing, the shifts would be loopity loop?

    Jul 30, 2006 5:13:35 PM

    U Boat Commander
    Veteran
    U Boat Commander
    Loc: Los Angeles, CA
    Posts: 1250, Gallery
    Registered on: May 8, 2004
    Reply to: Hurst

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    7 gear manual - sounds fishy.

    Jul 30, 2006 5:25:35 PM

    The Groom
    Expert
    The Groom
    Loc: EU
    Posts: 1779, Gallery
    Registered on: Jan 23, 2005
    Reply to: Hurst

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    It's almost impossible to work a 7 gear manual that isn't sequential. Think of the gearing, the shifts would be loopity loop?


    I was going to post the exact same thing. At the very first blown engine due to a driver downshifting 3 gears instead of 1, we're going to see the good ol' 6-gear tranny rise from the dead in 30 seconds flat.

    Jul 31, 2006 7:21:32 AM

    Porsche-Jeck
    Rennteam Master
    Porsche-Jeck
    Loc: Rheinland , Germany
    Posts: 4856, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 27, 2005
    Reply to: boxsterboy

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Quote:
    boxsterboy said:
    That must be a first 7 speed manual???



    Indeed the article emphasizes that it will be the first 7 spd. manual ever, but maybe they are just mixing it up with the 7spd PDK auto tranny

    Jul 31, 2006 8:12:14 AM

    Alex_997TT
    Rennteam Master
    Alex_997TT
    Loc: Reading , United Kingdom
    Posts: 3320, Gallery
    Registered on: Nov 20, 2005
    Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Yes, this doesn't look like manual to me, much more like PDK (DSG equiv)...

    http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=56...=1&sparte=4

    Jul 31, 2006 9:11:20 AM

    Emperor
    Veteran
    Emperor
    Loc: London & Gothenburg
    Posts: 1013, Gallery
    Registered on: Jan 6, 2006
    Reply to: Alex_997TT

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Quote:
    Alex (UK) said:
    Yes, this doesn't look like manual to me, much more like PDK (DSG equiv)...

    http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=56...=1&sparte=4


    Exactly. It must be a DSG type of tranny. I don't think there are alot of people who wants to fiddle with a 7 speed manual. There is simply too much work with the clutch which means that there is a big chance of people not being able to reach the claimed 0-100km/h or 0-200km/h times.

    Aug 1, 2006 7:51:12 AM

    Alex_997TT
    Rennteam Master
    Alex_997TT
    Loc: Reading , United Kingdom
    Posts: 3320, Gallery
    Registered on: Nov 20, 2005
    Reply to: Emperor

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    More news from yesterday:

    New Transmission Will Replace Tiptronic

    For many years now Porsche has set the sports car benchmark. Their engineering department has taken what is considered the worst layout for a sports car, a rear-mounted engine hanging out the back, and made it work to a degree that front- and mid-engined sports cars are often left in its dust. Almost more impressive, however, the 911 doesnt compromise from the perspective of drivability, resulting in a car that can hang with everything from a Viper to a Ferrari on the racetrack but, on the way home, offers comfort, convenience features, reliability and fuel economy matched by few rivals. But as good as their current cars are, Porsche has one weak point: its less-than-sporting automatic transmission.

    Shared with Volkswagen, the Porsche-developed slushbox is the well-known torque-converter equipped Tiptronic transmission. Outselling the manual by quite a margin, this automatic gearbox was one of the first manual-shifted automatics on the market, and while it was heralded as excellent and ingenious in its day, the onset of newer, more advanced (and simply better) technology has left it in the proverbial dust. Recognizing this, Volkswagen contracted BorgWarner to build a newer, better box for use in the various high-performance Audi models. What BorgWarner came back with was the Direct-Shift Gearbox, or DSG.

    Sporting two clutches in place of the Tiptronics torque converter, the DSG sequential-manual was greeted with open arms by the enthusiast community. Always engaged, the DSG unit uses an inner and an outer clutch to engage and disengage cogs. The outer pack drives gears 1, 3, and 5; while the inner clutch pack drives 2, 4, and 6. Using complicated electronic algorithms, the drivers selected gear is engaged by one clutch pack while the previous gear is disengaged by the other. The result is lag-free, seamless, predictable shifts that can be easily tuned for different situations by simply changing the clutch packs modulation. Compared to the slow, jerky, and cumbersome Tiptronic gearbox, the DSG is light years ahead and miles better.

    So, it makes logical sense that Porsche should choose to assimilate that technology at the first opportunity (especially now that theyre a majority owner of VW group); which they did. But in grand Porsche over-engineering fashion, theyve gone one better; quite literally. Developing their own variant of the DSG box, Porsche filed a patent indicating the company will be unleashing the worlds first seven speed DSG gearbox upon the public.

    Expected to see duty in everything from the lowly (relatively) Cayman and Boxster models all the way up to the upcoming Carrera GT-based GT1 racecar, it turns out the development program is surprisingly far along, and Porsche apparently hoped to have had the gearbox completed for use in the new 911 Turbo.

    This said, they havent publisized even a tentative date of release, although, it an announcement is expected soon

    Aug 1, 2006 7:59:48 AM

    Jeannot
    Expert
    Jeannot
    Loc: Currently in Hong-Kong , Switzerland
    Posts: 1745, Gallery
    Registered on: Feb 13, 2005
    Reply to: Alex_997TT

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    I would hate to have ordered a 997TT tip, because despite the magic perf they achieved, you have nothing more than a model 'in-waiting' for the DSG whose development was delayed...
    Anyway, manual for me :-) Always !

    Aug 1, 2006 1:50:30 PM

    JWW
    Newbie
    JWW
    Loc: Connecticut, USA
    Posts: 38, Gallery
    Registered on: Oct 6, 2005
    Reply to: Jeannot

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    I doubt there is going to be a 7 speed manual. BMW couldn't figure out how to make one and are bringing out a 6 speed manual as an alternative to the 7 speed SMG on the M5.

    Aug 1, 2006 5:28:25 PM

    turbolite
    Veteran
    turbolite
    Loc: Switzerland , Switzerland
    Posts: 1012, Gallery
    Registered on: Jul 26, 2004
    Reply to: Alex_997TT

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Quote:
    Alex (UK) said:
    More news from yesterday:

    New Transmission Will Replace Tiptronic

    For many years now Porsche has set the sports car benchmark. Their engineering department has taken what is considered the worst layout for a sports car, a rear-mounted engine hanging out the back, and made it work to a degree that front- and mid-engined sports cars are often left in its dust. Almost more impressive, however, the 911 doesnt compromise from the perspective of drivability, resulting in a car that can hang with everything from a Viper to a Ferrari on the racetrack but, on the way home, offers comfort, convenience features, reliability and fuel economy matched by few rivals. But as good as their current cars are, Porsche has one weak point: its less-than-sporting automatic transmission.

    Shared with Volkswagen, the Porsche-developed slushbox is the well-known torque-converter equipped Tiptronic transmission. Outselling the manual by quite a margin, this automatic gearbox was one of the first manual-shifted automatics on the market, and while it was heralded as excellent and ingenious in its day, the onset of newer, more advanced (and simply better) technology has left it in the proverbial dust. Recognizing this, Volkswagen contracted BorgWarner to build a newer, better box for use in the various high-performance Audi models. What BorgWarner came back with was the Direct-Shift Gearbox, or DSG.

    Sporting two clutches in place of the Tiptronics torque converter, the DSG sequential-manual was greeted with open arms by the enthusiast community. Always engaged, the DSG unit uses an inner and an outer clutch to engage and disengage cogs. The outer pack drives gears 1, 3, and 5; while the inner clutch pack drives 2, 4, and 6. Using complicated electronic algorithms, the drivers selected gear is engaged by one clutch pack while the previous gear is disengaged by the other. The result is lag-free, seamless, predictable shifts that can be easily tuned for different situations by simply changing the clutch packs modulation. Compared to the slow, jerky, and cumbersome Tiptronic gearbox, the DSG is light years ahead and miles better.

    So, it makes logical sense that Porsche should choose to assimilate that technology at the first opportunity (especially now that theyre a majority owner of VW group); which they did. But in grand Porsche over-engineering fashion, theyve gone one better; quite literally. Developing their own variant of the DSG box, Porsche filed a patent indicating the company will be unleashing the worlds first seven speed DSG gearbox upon the public.

    Expected to see duty in everything from the lowly (relatively) Cayman and Boxster models all the way up to the upcoming Carrera GT-based GT1 racecar, it turns out the development program is surprisingly far along, and Porsche apparently hoped to have had the gearbox completed for use in the new 911 Turbo.

    This said, they havent publisized even a tentative date of release, although, it an announcement is expected soon



    The Bugatti DSG is the first and only 7 gear DSG ever built (also belonging to VW group). So it wouldnt be a world first for Porsche. Trouble with the Bugatti DSG is the weight which is commanded by the fact that it has to support 1000NM of tourque. This is not the case with Porsches so they are working on a much smaller and lighter version...

    Aug 2, 2006 10:16:31 AM

    Porsche-Jeck
    Rennteam Master
    Porsche-Jeck
    Loc: Rheinland , Germany
    Posts: 4856, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 27, 2005
    Reply to: turbolite

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Quote:
    turbolite said:
    The Bugatti DSG is the first and only 7 gear DSG ever built (also belonging to VW group). So it wouldnt be a world first for Porsche.



    That's exactly the confusing element in the AB article.
    They are saying: "das weltweit erste Siebengang-Schaltgetriebe" = world-wide first seven gear manual gearbox.
    So the world first claim only could be true if it's a manual gearbox. But it may be just another example of bad journalism
    Here's the link to the short article: http://www.autobild.de/erlkoenige/neuheiten/artikel.php?artikel_id=11902

    Aug 2, 2006 11:49:40 AM

    Crash
    Rennteam VIP
    Crash
    Loc: Never been to , Antarctica
    Posts: 8287, Gallery
    Registered on: Oct 17, 2002
    Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

    Re: 7 gear manual + more hp for MY 08 ?

    Quote:
    Porsche-Jeck said:
    Quote:
    turbolite said:
    The Bugatti DSG is the first and only 7 gear DSG ever built (also belonging to VW group). So it wouldnt be a world first for Porsche.



    That's exactly the confusing element in the AB article.
    They are saying: "das weltweit erste Siebengang-Schaltgetriebe" = world-wide first seven gear manual gearbox.
    So the world first claim only could be true if it's a manual gearbox. But it may be just another example of bad journalism
    Here's the link to the short article: http://www.autobild.de/erlkoenige/neuheiten/artikel.php?artikel_id=11902



    Schaltgetriebe means manual in German, we can agree on that. A 7-speed manual... That will be cool !
     
    Edit

    Forum

    1. All 

    Boards

     
    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II) 5/15/24 8:44 AM
    art.italy     		804103 1808
    Porsche Sticky Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos) 4/7/24 11:48 AM
    Boxster Coupe GTS     		448750 565
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022 3/12/24 8:28 AM
    DJM48     		266370 323
    Porsche Sticky The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche 1/30/24 9:18 AM
    RCA     		90171 45
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift 3/15/24 1:23 PM
    CGX car nut     		6763 50
    Porsche The moment I've been waiting for... 2/1/24 7:01 PM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    		 886099 1364
    Porsche 992 GT3 7/23/23 7:01 PM
    Grant     		834568 3868
    Porsche GT4RS 4/21/24 11:50 AM
    mcdelaug     		400080 1454
    Porsche Welcome to the new Taycan Forum! 2/10/24 4:43 PM
    nberry     		396158 1526
    Others Tesla 2 the new thread 12/13/23 2:48 PM
    CGX car nut     		383477 2401
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 7/3/23 12:30 PM
    Porker     		371054 797
    Porsche Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour 5/12/24 6:23 PM
    blueflame     		293681 669
    Porsche Collected my 997 GTS today 10/19/23 7:06 PM
    CGX car nut
     
     
     
     
     
    		 266041 812
    Lambo Huracán EVO STO 7/30/23 6:59 PM
    mcdelaug     		244117 346
    Lotus Lotus Emira 6/25/23 2:53 PM
    Enmanuel     		238685 101
    Others Corvette C8 10/16/23 3:24 PM
    Enmanuel     		222427 488
    Others Gordon Murray - T.50 11/22/23 10:27 AM
    mcdelaug     		173228 387
    Porsche Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS 6/11/23 5:13 PM
    CGX car nut     		145015 144
    BMW M 2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now 12/29/23 9:04 AM
    RCA     		121202 303
    Motor Sp. 2023 Formula One 12/19/23 5:38 AM
    WhoopsyM     		111970 685
    Porsche 2022 992 Safari Model 3/7/24 4:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		85743 239
    AMG Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758 2/23/24 10:03 PM
    blueflame     		75949 297
    Porsche 992 GT3 RS 3/3/24 7:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		55000 314
    Motor Sp. Porsche 963 5/14/24 7:53 AM
    Porker     		26618 247
    Ferrari Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6) 1/21/24 4:29 PM
    GT-Boy     		21799 103
    BMW M 2022 BMW M5 CS 4/8/24 1:43 PM
    Ferdie     		20321 140
    AMG G63 sold out 9/15/23 7:38 PM
    Nico997     		17153 120
    AMG [2022] Mercedes-AMG SL 4/23/24 1:24 PM
    RCA     		14544 225
    Motor Sp. 24-Hour race Nürburgring 2018 5/25/23 10:42 PM
    Grant     		11598 55
    Porsche Porsche Mission X Hypercar 12/3/23 8:52 AM
    996FourEss     		11206 63
    123 items found, displaying 1 to 30.