Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
First the transmission and now the engine 
http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/130700-official-nissan-we-recalls-certain-engines.html
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
BiTurbo:
First the transmission and now the engine
http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/130700-official-nissan-we-recalls-certain-engines.html
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I'm not surprised at all, you get what you pay for. The 4WD system of the GT-R overheated in a comparison test with the Lamborghini Gallardo and Porsche 911 Turbo FL.
So this is very likely the next source of problems...the 4WD system.
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
RC:
BiTurbo:
First the transmission and now the engine
http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/130700-official-nissan-we-recalls-certain-engines.html
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I'm not surprised at all, you get what you pay for. The 4WD system of the GT-R overheated in a comparison test with the Lamborghini Gallardo and Porsche 911 Turbo FL.
So this is very likely the next source of problems...the 4WD system.
what test ? when ? 
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Jan 22, 2010 2:56:20 PM
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Carlos from Spain
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
why wasn't I surprised when I read the title of this thread on the thread list? 
considering the hit the owners of these cars are going to take when they try to re-sell them, and add to that maintenace costs, repairs, etc, it doesn't look like its such a bargain after all either...
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Jan 22, 2010 4:06:52 PM
- Heist
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Super Darius
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
LOL @ the thing overheating in the COLD & SNOW. Makes me wonder if all the electronic traction wizardy can take the latent heat build up from constant sliding and drifting in the snow.
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
How many more of these stories will we hear by end of 2010 ? 
http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/135046-my-gearbox-has-broken.html
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
Did this car undergo any testing at all before it went to the market? It must have done, so Nissan must have known about these issues. I feel for their owners who appear to have been duped.
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
ResB:
Did this car undergo any testing at all before it went to the market? It must have done, so Nissan must have known about these issues. I feel for their owners who appear to have been duped.
I suspect there there were maybe two development teams working in parallel, one testing the car thoroughly under normal road conditions to ensure durability in the hands of normal drivers and another spending months at the Nürburgring concentrating on a getting a ringer to a stage where Suzuki-san could lap the 'Ring in a sensational time.
Both teams would have signed off their respective cars.
Problems would then start to arise when "less normal" drivers buy the production car based on Nissan's sensational publicity and think they can try to emulate Tochio Suzuki.
This could even have resulted in the 'Ring team being praised for accomplishing its mission, and the "normal" development team being condemned for allowing a buggy car to be signed off.
All of the above is just idle speculation on my part, and does not necessarily bear any similarity to how this situation really arose.
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fritz
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
fritz:
ResB:
Did this car undergo any testing at all before it went to the market? It must have done, so Nissan must have known about these issues. I feel for their owners who appear to have been duped.
I suspect there there were maybe two development teams working in parallel, one testing the car thoroughly under normal road conditions to ensure durability in the hands of normal drivers and another spending months at the Nürburgring concentrating on a getting a ringer to a stage where Suzuki-san could lap the 'Ring in a sensational time.
Both teams would have signed off their respective cars.Problems would then start to arise when "less normal" drivers buy the production car based on Nissan's sensational publicity and think they can try to emulate Tochio Suzuki.
This could even have resulted in the 'Ring team being praised for accomplishing its mission, and the "normal" development team being condemned for allowing a buggy car to be signed off.
All of the above is just idle speculation on my part, and does not necessarily bear any similarity to how this situation really arose.
Sounds about right though...
It seems to be an interesting symptom of lots of these major manufacturing outfits getting so big that departments, for one reason or another, don't/can't communicate. These are the types of effects that contributed strongly to the current situation in the Big 3 (Ford just figured it out sooner, and on their own), as well as possibly the Toyota fiasco.
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
Friend of mine already changed the engine back in feb. Also reporting gearbox overheating issues. This guy does not track the car and is very very careful when driving it "hard"ish..!
If you ask me this is a farce of a product (unfortunately).. I feel for the owners that were sold a "dream" of buying a 911tt and GT3 beater for half the price. Nissan marketed this as a track weapon!! Now owners have to look at that playstation screen for signs of overheating or other failure when they redline through a couple of gears..
Can you imagine the price hit in those cars as they get out of warranty? I mean think about all of the problems and the car is hardly 1 year old..
Nissan is guilty as sin imo.
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
GT:
Friend of mine already changed the engine back in feb. Also reporting gearbox overheating issues. This guy does not track the car and is very very careful when driving it "hard"ish..! If you ask me this is a farce of a product (unfortunately).. I feel for the owners that were sold a "dream" of buying a 911tt and GT3 beater for half the price. Nissan marketed this as a track weapon!! Now owners have to look at that playstation screen for signs of overheating or other failure when they redline through a couple of gears.. Can you imagine the price hit in those cars as they get out of warranty? I mean think about all of the problems and the car is hardly 1 year old.. Nissan is guilty as sin imo.
These were strange times when we had to argue with these ignorant posters who really believed the fairy tale about the GTR being a serious performance car. They continued the Nissan marketing BS again and again. Hopefully, they feel a bit ashamed now, knowing the truth about this product 
Thing is: the truth was obvious to everybody with a decent judgement for high-performance cars.
Apr 11, 2010 8:20:36 PM
- Atzporsche
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
GT:
Friend of mine already changed the engine back in feb. Also reporting gearbox overheating issues. This guy does not track the car and is very very careful when driving it "hard"ish..! If you ask me this is a farce of a product (unfortunately).. I feel for the owners that were sold a "dream" of buying a 911tt and GT3 beater for half the price. Nissan marketed this as a track weapon!! Now owners have to look at that playstation screen for signs of overheating or other failure when they redline through a couple of gears.. Can you imagine the price hit in those cars as they get out of warranty? I mean think about all of the problems and the car is hardly 1 year old.. Nissan is guilty as sin imo.
+1 I always said it and im somewhat happy this is happening. It's sad for the owners but it's life. Didn't think it would be this bad though. We heard a lot of stories so far. GT-R = FAIL
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indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine.. I happen to like both :)
Apr 11, 2010 8:52:14 PM
- BiTurbo
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
BiTurbo:
It will never stop, this one's fresh
Don't know which of the posts in that thread you are really referring to, but those guys appear have tuned their engines before they failed, so any such failures cannot really be blamed on insufficient development work on Nissan's part. 
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fritz
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
But not like 911 engines are failing at that rate even when we tune ours......................
Porsche engineered a good safety margin within the basic design, Nissan stretched the performance razor close to the safety margin, one reason those Nissans are much cheaper, they are not over-engineered to be bullet proof.
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
fritz:
I suspect there there were maybe two development teams working in parallel, one testing the car thoroughly under normal road conditions to ensure durability in the hands of normal drivers and another spending months at the Nürburgring concentrating on a getting a ringer to a stage where Suzuki-san could lap the 'Ring in a sensational time.
Both teams would have signed off their respective cars.Problems would then start to arise when "less normal" drivers buy the production car based on Nissan's sensational publicity and think they can try to emulate Tochio Suzuki.
This could even have resulted in the 'Ring team being praised for accomplishing its mission, and the "normal" development team being condemned for allowing a buggy car to be signed off.
Hopefully no Hara Kiri resulted from this.
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
fritz:
BiTurbo:
It will never stop, this one's fresh
Don't know which of the posts in that thread you are really referring to, but those guys appear have tuned their engines before they failed, so any such failures cannot really be blamed on insufficient development work on Nissan's part.
But some people think the VR38 is overengineered and it can be pushed upwards of 700whp while the stock one seems to fail on German tracks (HHR, AMS.....)
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
The whole GT-R thingie reminds me a little bit of the Lancia Delta HF Integrale story. Great product with a performance out of this world (for 1984) but very unreliable and always with technical problems, despite the modern technology used.
It may sound cheesy but the old saying "you get what you pay for" never dies. 
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
Whoopsy:
But not like 911 engines are failing at that rate even when we tune ours......................
Porsche engineered a good safety margin within the basic design, Nissan stretched the performance razor close to the safety margin, one reason those Nissans are much cheaper, they are not over-engineered to be bullet proof.
Let's not slam Nissan so much fellas. Admittedly this car is having some "teething" problems, but when it's all working - the GT-R is one hell of a formidable car that has really pushed the envelope and opened boundaries. Not to mention, it can be had for 1/2 the price of most of the competitors in its league. They've exposed a lot of car makers for the overpriced stalwarts they are.
No one is immune from technical and engineering issues. 1/2 this car was developed by Lotus (Chassis) & Renault (Engine management / LC) and had to be designed in conjunction with them, so sounds like there were some quirks in the integration.
Almost every high performance car with this much new tech packed in it is bound to have issues. But even the established players have problems.
Porsche had their own engine issues last generation with all the RMS's blowing out and going bad.
BMW, the 1st batch of E46 M3 engines would grenade themselves. DSG was a holy horror.
E92 M3, DSG 2 would make the car stall, buck, and shift like a mule kick until a software bug was worked out.
Ferrari, Lambo - they still can't figure out how to keep their cars from spontaneously bursting into flames. 
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Apr 13, 2010 6:08:16 PM
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Carlos from Spain
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Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
RMS issue doesn't begin to compare with NIssan's troubles, a 1000€ fix when out of warranty without any further danger than a small leak than you get around to bring the car in to get fixed is not comparable with a 20,000$ tranny replacement, most after warranty have been voided for track use or simply disengaging the ESP on a sportcar.
And as much as Italian sportcars have a reputation of not being as reliable as german for example, none of the italian competitors have had problems to the extent of the Nissan one lap wonder disposable sportcar, which is scandalous.
The GT-R has been an embarrasement, true they have gotten great performance out of a boring overweight AWD automatic ESP all controlling car, but they have cut many corners in trying to make it cheap, and you get what you paid for: a fully automatic traction/tranny sportcar that is too heavy and unreliable to be driven as a sportcar... so what's it good for? 
and who's good inicial pricetag value will drop like a ton of bricks after warranty is over, and with very expensive maintenance issues, making it not such a good deal after ownership is through.
And to add to that embarrasement is the manipulation of the Ring lap times by the marketing department, who fooled many people except the more experienced sportcar enthusiasts. And latter proven by Sport Auto and other mags to be artificially exagerated claims, when they managed to get a fast lap around the ring without the car breaking down that is 
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Apr 13, 2010 10:21:59 PM
- BiTurbo
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Carlos from Spain
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
Re: Nissan GTR engine failure recall in some parts of Europe
Heist:
Ferrari, Lambo - they still can't figure out how to keep their cars from spontaneously bursting into flames.
That 'feature' was working properly, they were designed to self-destruct in order to keep the number cars low and maintain their perceived high value.
For all the RMS trouble Porsche had with their 1st gen watercooled engines, it's nothing more than a annoying wet spot on the driveway, it won't make the engine blow up spectacularly.
BMW's DSG trouble were software based, the design of the gearbox is sound.
Even the M3's engine trouble were only confined to a few initial batch, which BMW fixed quite quickly.
But Nissan? The GTR has been on sale almost 2 years now, they billed the GTR as a faster and cheaper version of the 997 Turbo, unfortunately for the general public, only the specially modified non-production version of the GTR driven by Suzuki is faster, the regular version is not.
In order to keep cost low, Japanese car makers traditionally cut corners vs the Germans. Or even the Americans for that matter. Witness the thinner gauge steel used to make cars, one can tell the difference when slamming car doors, German cars have that solid thug, even the American cars has a pretty good thug, but all Japanese cars, even Lexus, makes a tin can sound.
Engines, say a Corvette V8, it makes 400-500hp easy, with headroom of upwards of close to 1000hp without much modification needed, that block is bulletproof. GT1 block in the Turbo is well known to be able to withstand almost anything that gets throw at them. The GTR block was basically modified version of their regular VQ V6 as found in a Quest minivan, making around 230hp. In order to get to the power level the GTR is making, Nissan has already stretch the capability of that block to almost the limit, there is no safety margin left.
But bottom line is that by using their regular production block, Nissan got to save a lot of money and that's one of the reason of the lowered list price compared with other super cars.
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