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    Ferrari = embarassing?

    Was browsing thru the current issue of EVO when I stopped at page 27, I saw a photo that really embarrasses the owner of said vehicle.

    http://www.evo.co.uk/front_website/gallery.php?id=272151

    That's a close up.

    Not only did Ferrari copied the Lexus tailpipe design, they also copied the Japanese way of surrounding a TINY exhaust with a HUGH fake outlet. Ricer look for the win.

    At least the bottom one didn't look as embarrassing.

    I feel better about the 997TT stock outlet already, at least it's ALL REAL!!!!

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Yes, I saw that as well. I was disappointed that Metcalfe didn't get a reply from the technical director on that subject.

    These will be very easy to see for everyone driving behind the car. Maybe people will think that they are looking at a Ferrari kit car replica.

    I am not able to comprehend how this feature got past all of the decision-making design, technical and fabrication levels and made it into production. On a Ferrari.

    The triangular new gen Honda Civic exhausts sport the same treatment. Some role model the Ferrari has here.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    If I am not mistaken, don't the S models of Porsche have false tips?

    FWIW, I agree a $200,000 car should not have anything phony about it. Ferrari is losing its soul.


    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    You don't like it because you look on those pipes and think "damn that is the new Ferrari, how could they do that, to such a brand".
    Now stop, calm down, look again and think:
    "new fiat coupe designed and created to make money in emerging markets, cut the costs, make everything as bling bling as you can, put a ferrari sticker on it, and look as the company budget improves over time, cause the money will come for sure"
    Suddenly everything matches.


    Shame on them for this Ferrari SL.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Nberry, I always mean to look at that when I see an S, but always forget. Anyway, I just looked in the parts catalogue and it seems that for each of the two outlets on either side, there is an exhaust tube behind them. It's just that the actual muffler tips are much bigger than the tubes themselves, so in that sense, yes, they are false.

    I think someone here should have a detailed photo...

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Although yes, it looks chincy, here is what I am seeing...

    The optimum design for the exhaust required Ferrari to use different sized tubing for the upper and lower pipes, both being too small to look good cosmetically... so they made some tips to fit the design of the car.

    What concerned me most was the pieces of extra paint and overspray on the black grill around the pipes. Isn't this a Ferrari?




    /dirty hotlinker

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    ozglxvr6 said:
    Although yes, it looks chincy, here is what I am seeing...

    The optimum design for the exhaust required Ferrari to use different sized tubing for the upper and lower pipes, both being too small to look good cosmetically... so they made some tips to fit the design of the car.

    What concerned me most was the pieces of extra paint and overspray on the black grill around the pipes. Isn't this a Ferrari?




    /dirty hotlinker



    Good find! I didnt notice it until you have mentioned. How pure!!!!! And the exhaust pipes are really crazy, this car is getting a more and more to a "what the heck were they thinking car!"
    But guys, the happy end of this story will be a long long waiting list with a good profit for Ferrari!

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    599 GTB:


    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    Wrubel said:
    You don't like it because you look on those pipes and think "damn that is the new Ferrari, how could they do that, to such a brand".
    Now stop, calm down, look again and think:
    "new fiat coupe designed and created to make money in emerging markets, cut the costs, make everything as bling bling as you can, put a ferrari sticker on it, and look as the company budget improves over time, cause the money will come for sure"
    Suddenly everything matches.


    Shame on them for this Ferrari SL.



    Ferrari executives are on record as saying the one car company they hold in very high regard is Porsche. Why? Because they make a ton of money. It now is apparent that Ferrari, just as Porsche did in the early ninties emulated Japanese production, is embracing the Porsche way. Price and sell based on the marque irrespective as to what the product represents.

    As I said, they are losing their soul.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    ozglxvr6 said:
    What concerned me most was the pieces of extra paint and overspray on the black grill around the pipes. Isn't this a Ferrari?



    Of course it is and that explains the bad paint quality.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    I'm pretty sure the car used in the photo's is a pre-production model that did not have all of the final finished production parts fitted hence the tailpipes. If you look closely at the outer pipes they look like they are purely a cosmetic mock up and are painted silver rather than chromed.

    The pipes on this other car however are different and are chromed with no sign of the narrow inner pipe.


    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    could it possibly not be for sound level reasons? top smaller pipe for lower sound and lower bigger one when on the throttle for louder sound?

    No idea if that's possible, so i may be talking rubbish

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    The sound levels are controlled by butterfly valves that bypass part of the silencer above certain RPM's.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    hmm ok then maybe not!

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    nberry said:

    Ferrari executives are on record as saying the one car company they hold in very high regard is Porsche. Why? Because they make a ton of money. It now is apparent that Ferrari, just as Porsche did in the early ninties emulated Japanese production, is embracing the Porsche way. Price and sell based on the marque irrespective as to what the product represents.

    As I said, they are losing their soul.



    Nick, me think Ferrari lost theirs a long time ago before Porsche. Have you seen what products Ferrari have been granting their name to be associated with? Ferrari is chasing the last possible cent in merchandising.

    At least Porsche Design is a proper designer name brand.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    I'm thinking the small pipe is for cruising around town and the butterfly valve will open up a higher rpms for the larger pipe for better sound and less back pressure.

    Just my 2 cents.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    wow really dissapointing, i hope they find a way to fix that. After all the attention to detail is a huge part of this kind of cars.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    ? I don't know why it's such a big deal here. It's been discussed on F-Chat :

    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=207763

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Wrubel said:
    You don't like it because you look on those pipes and think "damn that is the new Ferrari, how could they do that, to such a brand".
    Now stop, calm down, look again and think:
    "new fiat coupe designed and created to make money in emerging markets, cut the costs, make everything as bling bling as you can, put a ferrari sticker on it, and look as the company budget improves over time, cause the money will come for sure"
    Suddenly everything matches.


    Shame on them for this Ferrari SL.



    Ferrari executives are on record as saying the one car company they hold in very high regard is Porsche. Why? Because they make a ton of money. It now is apparent that Ferrari, just as Porsche did in the early ninties emulated Japanese production, is embracing the Porsche way. Price and sell based on the marque irrespective as to what the product represents.

    As I said, they are losing their soul.




    When You look on it from corporate side, everything is as it should be. If I or You were Porsche AG or FIAT S.p.A shareholders, we would be kissing the management in their asses for implementing those cost-effective initiatives.

    Then if you love the brand and what it represents, suddenly you become aware that it's not the figures that matters most. But I agree, Porsche isn't saint, they have their Cayenne. Someone posted a list on our forum with sales figures from PAG for 2007, Cayenne is the bestseller.
    Remember back then when Cayenne had her debut, what the "PAG crowd" was shouting
    But there is a small difference
    Porsche AG is independent company, PAG ownes (VW...etc
    they did it to remain in that state.
    Now Ferrari... Ferrari is owned
    they did it to..????

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    Wrubel said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Wrubel said:
    You don't like it because you look on those pipes and think "damn that is the new Ferrari, how could they do that, to such a brand".
    Now stop, calm down, look again and think:
    "new fiat coupe designed and created to make money in emerging markets, cut the costs, make everything as bling bling as you can, put a ferrari sticker on it, and look as the company budget improves over time, cause the money will come for sure"
    Suddenly everything matches.


    Shame on them for this Ferrari SL.



    Ferrari executives are on record as saying the one car company they hold in very high regard is Porsche. Why? Because they make a ton of money. It now is apparent that Ferrari, just as Porsche did in the early ninties emulated Japanese production, is embracing the Porsche way. Price and sell based on the marque irrespective as to what the product represents.

    As I said, they are losing their soul.




    When You look on it from corporate side, everything is as it should be.




    agreed.

    Look, even when the great man himself still alive, the only reason Enzo Ferrari sold road cars with the prancing horse badge on them is to fund his passion which is racing cars. He couldn't care less about his road cars.

    When people bash the Cali for having its engine in front of the driver, remember that even E. Ferrari preferred this placement and he sneered at mid-engined cars. Ferrari fanboys should learn its history better. Ferrari's to E. Ferrari are front-engined road cars.

    Luca is doing a really great job in preserving E. Ferrari's passion. First he made the pracing horse the most lusted after badge in racing and now it's time to reap the profits which will be used back in racing for even more achievements.

    Ferrari fanboys flaming Luca for whoring the brand? They should learn Ferrari's history better and what it's all about.

    E. Ferrari couldn't care less if the people buying his road cars are obese guys who never once take their F-cars to the track, as long as he got more money to race his cars. He could not have been happier if he were alive today.

    Customers? Pah. It's the racing fans that matter. You don't feel like buying the Cali because you don't like how it's styled? Point NOT NOTED, just step aside, there is a thousand people lining up behind you all eager with their checkbooks. Just because one has the money to buy a Ferrari does not mean he has any hand in saying what Ferrari should or should not do. The kids who are Ferrari fans today, will grow up to people aspiring to have a Ferrari and these are the customers Ferrari and Luca are targetting.

    Selling his road cars was just his way making money. Not any different today.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    shin said:
    ? I don't know why it's such a big deal here. It's been discussed on F-Chat :

    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=207763



    Your point? That's F-chat and is a completely different board. Anyway it's also filled with biased Ferrari owners.

    So in your mind if someone else posted a topic on some other board means we can't discuss the same thing here on rennteam? I called BS.

    We here in rennteam can have our own discussions on any topic we like, not everyone here is a member of every single car site in the internet.

    shin, I believe this is the second time in a week that you harass my posts, I do not want to see a third time. if you have anything against me, you are welcome to send me pms and we can discuss in private, stop wasting everyone's bandwidth. And if you don't like my posts, period, you could always use the ignore function.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    Quote:
    shin said:
    ? I don't know why it's such a big deal here. It's been discussed on F-Chat :

    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=207763



    Your point? That's F-chat and is a completely different board. Anyway it's also filled with biased Ferrari owners.

    So in your mind if someone else posted a topic on some other board means we can't discuss the same thing here on rennteam? I called BS.

    We here in rennteam can have our own discussions on any topic we like, not everyone here is a member of every single car site in the internet.

    shin, I believe this is the second time in a week that you harass my posts, I do not want to see a third time. if you have anything against me, you are welcome to send me pms and we can discuss in private, stop wasting everyone's bandwidth. And if you don't like my posts, period, you could always use the ignore function.



    Never my intention. My point was that the 599 and the Scuderia have similar exhausts too but no one bashes them for having them. Why only now, with the California?

    My guess is someone saw a pic of these exhausts and because they dislike the California so much, they thought it would have been the perfect reason to bash the car, without properly finding out if these exhausts are common set ups on other cars before the Cali.

    How correct is what I say?

    P.S. Likewise, if you do not like my posts, simply use the ignore function.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Ferrari very belately realised that they cannot sell 200.000+ Euro cars that nobody can use for more than a few hours a few times in the month.

    Brand name counts but Ferrari had to tip their toes in the mainstream for long term viability.

    The California is a step in the right direction and it will be a hit in many buyer segments and perhaps the first Ferrari for a long time for normal use as an automobile and as not as a toy or sculpture.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    shin said:

    Never my intention. My point was that the 599 and the Scuderia have similar exhausts too but no one bashes them for having them. Why only now, with the California?

    My guess is someone saw a pic of these exhausts and because they dislike the California so much, they thought it would have been the perfect reason to bash the car, without properly finding out if these exhausts are common set ups on other cars before the Cali.

    How correct is what I say?

    P.S. Likewise, if you do not like my posts, simply use the ignore function.



    You sure about the 599 and Scuderia have Lexus style stacked exhaust outlet complete with fake big exhaust tips enclosing tiny real ones?

    That's news to me as I haven't seen a single 599 or Scuderia with those features.

    It's really not a big deal to modders as a simple Tubi exhaust will fix that. But for someone laying out that kind of cash for a Ferrari, that someone might expect something more original and elegant from the factory in the first place.

    Personally, I think apart from the Lexus style exhaust, the whole car looks really good and I already have a deposit for one, but if the 'production' car kept that embarrassing feature, I am gonna skip the car all together.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    Quote:
    shin said:

    Never my intention. My point was that the 599 and the Scuderia have similar exhausts too but no one bashes them for having them. Why only now, with the California?

    My guess is someone saw a pic of these exhausts and because they dislike the California so much, they thought it would have been the perfect reason to bash the car, without properly finding out if these exhausts are common set ups on other cars before the Cali.

    How correct is what I say?

    P.S. Likewise, if you do not like my posts, simply use the ignore function.



    You sure about the 599 and Scuderia have Lexus style stacked exhaust outlet complete with fake big exhaust tips enclosing tiny real ones?

    That's news to me as I haven't seen a single 599 or Scuderia with those features.

    It's really not a big deal to modders as a simple Tubi exhaust will fix that. But for someone laying out that kind of cash for a Ferrari, that someone might expect something more original and elegant from the factory in the first place.

    Personally, I think apart from the Lexus style exhaust, the whole car looks really good and I already have a deposit for one, but if the 'production' car kept that embarrassing feature, I am gonna skip the car all together.



    Did you not see the 599 exhaust pic on first page or what ?

    and, you really are awfully uninformed. Ferrari copying Lexus? Please. Ferrari was FIRST with stacked tailpipes since the 330 P4. This is what inspires the California. Ferrari takes design from their own heritage and not from Toyota, doh.

    You think Lexus was around that time ?? It's Lexus copying Ferrari not the other way around.

    You bash this and that without firstly trying to educate yourself of things you hadn't known before. I am straighting things out for people.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Stacking fake exhaust pipes for cosmetic styling is completely different than stacking real exhaust pipes for function. And the Scuderia exhaust is absolutely nothing like the Cali.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    I don't think we should go so far as to say that Lexus is copying Ferrari. I think Lexus looked at M3 exhaust, C63 exhaust and had the stupid idea to just turn the tips 90 degrees to look different, which doesn't mean it's suddenly more palatable.

    The big deal here with the fake exhausts on expensive sports cars regardless of the brand is that out of all the car categories, you expect the least travesty from these cars.

    If they want to make you believe it's a "race car for the road" and "racing improves the breed" bla bla, how does that fit in with having fake rear diffusers, fake side engine air vents, fake exhausts, fake brake vents and fake hood vents?

    Design can only be totally beautiful and enjoyable over a long time if it is true to you and itself. Anything fake is kitsch!

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    JoeRockhead said:
    Stacking fake exhaust pipes for cosmetic styling is completely different than stacking real exhaust pipes for function. And the Scuderia exhaust is absolutely nothing like the Cali.



    I am not talking about any stacked pipes on the Scud, its pipes are clearly not stacked. I'm tvlking about the smaller exhaust pipe INSIDE the bigger outlet pipe. It's clearly visible in your pic. The bigger outlet has no function other than cosmetics. Remove the shiny pipes and the Scud will not be any slower.

    Same principle used by Ferrari for the Scud, 599, California.

    Re: Ferrari = embarassing?

    Quote:
    JoeRockhead said:
    Stacking fake exhaust pipes for cosmetic styling is completely different than stacking real exhaust pipes for function. And the Scuderia exhaust is absolutely nothing like the Cali.



    Thank you. Someone people strike a nerve whenever someone say something negative about their beloved car/brand.

    But it's useless talking to these people as they will never accept reality.

    shin, what you are showing is a Ferrari race car with stacked exhaust INBOARD, but they are the REAL deal, no tiny ones inside. What the Cali has is a Lexus IS-F style diagonally stacked on the OUTBOARD, with the added touch of tiny real exhaust tube inside HUGH fake tipes. With bad paint work added. It's really clearly not Ferrari's finest.

    Try as you might, but it's already clearly a losing battle.

    All is not lost, someone mentioned the EVO car is a pre-production model and there is still hope that Ferrari fix that on the production models, and if that's the case, I will take back what I said, but I am definitely not betting the farm on it.

     
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