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Feb 19, 2008 11:11:40 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
.. which means that the cargraphic stage 1 is not 544ps.. but more. It would nbot surprise me, ecu and exhaust should give much more, especially since most stock cars are more than 480hp to begon with. (Mine was dynoed at 499hp in normal mode with 100kms on te clock!). My info says that ecu and exhaust can yield 580hp if tuner is knowledgeable (rs tuning is definately)
Feb 20, 2008 3:14:31 PM
- edz
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
It was the sportec dyno which is a wheel dyno. I can't guarantee their accuracy but these guys only do 911 turbos for 10 years so they are very specialised. We dynoyed the car before and after and they said that most 997tt are more than 480, they ve seen some cars at 510hp! In any case my car dynoed at 650hp (their stage 3 + ICs) and I measured 100-200 at 6.1 secs and 200-300kms at around 13-14 seconds which is pretty consistent for the claimed power of their dyno.
Btw I have cargraphic stage 1 exhaust and am very happy with its performance (even though its pretty loud for my taste).
Btw I have cargraphic stage 1 exhaust and am very happy with its performance (even though its pretty loud for my taste).
Feb 20, 2008 7:05:20 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Quote:
edz61 said:Quote:
Alex_ said:
Still waiting for my CG kit parts to come in, scheduled for tomorrow. Can't wait to feel the results myself
Alex you already have the CG exhaust right? The kit has the software and exhaust and what else?
Not yet, getting the whole lot together - package deal (Pounds2k off on the Parr special offer!!). It's a BCM air-filter, plus the exhaust, plus the ECU remap.
Feb 20, 2008 7:06:51 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Quote:
edz61 said:
Who offers CG tuning in the U.S.? Since I have the Plenum and CG exhaust if I decide to do anything else I will add the software, most likely Revotechnik if I can't get CG.
> CarGraphic US reseller <
Feb 20, 2008 7:55:29 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Quote:
GT said:
.. which means that the cargraphic stage 1 is not 544ps.. but more. It would nbot surprise me, ecu and exhaust should give much more, especially since most stock cars are more than 480hp to begon with. (Mine was dynoed at 499hp in normal mode with 100kms on te clock!). My info says that ecu and exhaust can yield 580hp if tuner is knowledgeable (rs tuning is definitely)
Yes the CG BHP numbers are supposed to be very conservative, but surely that 800Nm torque makes a mighty difference too (less BHP than the 550 Ruf kit, but more torque).
Feb 21, 2008 3:17:31 AM
- LAT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
This understating nonsense is just that nonsense. Ruf does NOT understate their output. My CTR-2 puts out 582 PS on their dyno and I was there to see it. The engine is rated at 580 PS. The RT12 motors can wind up to over 720 PS on the dyno but are set at 650 PS in the car. Keep in mind that Ruf offers warranties on their cars.
I am assured that RS is the same as are any of the engine dyno users.
Think about it if they could get more for the price why not advertise it, power sells. Stop dreaming.
I am assured that RS is the same as are any of the engine dyno users.
Think about it if they could get more for the price why not advertise it, power sells. Stop dreaming.
Feb 24, 2008 6:57:04 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Found the article scanned on another site:
http://www.supercars.net/PitLane?viewThread=y&gID=3&fID=0&tID=152681
Also a full PDF on the Cargrphic site: http://www.cargraphic.de/stepone/data/downloads/8a/0d/00/SportAuto0308_1.pdf
Can't wait to get mine
http://www.supercars.net/PitLane?viewThread=y&gID=3&fID=0&tID=152681
Also a full PDF on the Cargrphic site: http://www.cargraphic.de/stepone/data/downloads/8a/0d/00/SportAuto0308_1.pdf
Quote:
the ultimate comparo of tuned Porsche 997 Turbos by sport auto magazine
Cargraphic 997 Turbo RSC 3.6
544 PS at 6,200 rpm
798 Nm at 3,770 rpm
151.1 PS/litre
1550 kg
357 bhp/ton
MSRP: 176,757 EUR (with options as tested)
vs.
Gemballa Avalanche GTR600
600 PS at 5,000 rpm
840 Nm at 4,600 rpm
166.7 PS/litre
1720 kg
345 bhp/ton
MSRP: 360,000 EUR (with options as tested)
vs.
Speedart BTR-XL 600
600 PS at 6,200 rpm
800 Nm at 4,000 rpm
166.7 PS/litre
1654 kg
357 bhp/ton
MSRP: 243,215 EUR (with options as tested)
vs.
Techart Turbo Cabrio
600 PS at 6,400 rpm
800 NM at 3,800 rpm
166.7 PS/litre
1717 kg
345 bhp/ton
MSRP: 225,000 EUR (with options as tested)
Acceleration
0-100 km/h: 3.3 vs. 3.7 vs. 3.5 vs. 3.5 secs.
0-160 km/h: 6.8 vs. 7.8 vs. 7.1 vs. 7.5 secs.
0-200 km/h: 10.4 vs. 11.9 vs. 10.8 vs. 11.3 secs.
Vmax: 316 vs. 320 vs. 335 vs. 339 km/h
18m slalom: 72.5 vs. 69.8 vs. 68.5 vs. 69.2 km/h
Hockenheim short track: 1:10.3 vs. 1:12.1 vs. 1:10.7 vs. 12.6 km/h
The verdict:
the Cragraphic 997 Turbo RSC 3.6 is the winner of that comparison even though it has 10 per cent less power than the others but thanks to the perfect suspension and an effective engine tuning, it is the quickest at the handling track and Hockenheim short track. It is the less expensive in the test, makes it the best buy out of these tuned 997 Turbos
the Speedart BTR-XL600 and the Techart Turbo Cabrio come in 2nd place, Speedart because of the slightly difficult handling of the 20" wheels and being less a daily driver because of the low front spoiler lip, the Techart 997 Turbo Cabrio because of the high weight.
the most brute looking Gemballa Avalanche GTR600 Roadster, also the most expensive on the test grid, comes last, the whole package needs some more süice here and there, it is the fastest in top speed but shows some weakness when it comes to handling.
Can't wait to get mine
Feb 24, 2008 7:10:00 PM
- TB993tt
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Feb 24, 2008 7:23:56 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Well I think the mods for the CG car were (my German is not good):
* Increase in output incl. exhaust
* Bilstein Coilovers incl. stabilizers
* Wheel set
* Something to do with the sport brake lining
So I guess they saved weight on the wheels and 5kg on the exhaust. And given the pic, also on Porsche lightweight racing seats. The brakes are red though so probably not ceramic.
* Increase in output incl. exhaust
* Bilstein Coilovers incl. stabilizers
* Wheel set
* Something to do with the sport brake lining
So I guess they saved weight on the wheels and 5kg on the exhaust. And given the pic, also on Porsche lightweight racing seats. The brakes are red though so probably not ceramic.
Feb 24, 2008 11:21:33 PM
- Crash
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Quote:
Alex_ said:
Well I think the mods for the CG car were (my German is not good):
* Increase in output incl. exhaust
* Bilstein Coilovers incl. stabilizers
* Wheel set
* Something to do with the sport brake lining
So I guess they saved weight on the wheels and 5kg on the exhaust. And given the pic, also on Porsche lightweight racing seats. The brakes are red though so probably not ceramic.
Pagid brake pads are the final item.
Feb 25, 2008 1:33:15 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Yes the 600bhp powerkit is CG Kit 3
The car tested had kit 2 with the following options:
BTW, not confirmed by CG themselves yet (waiting on this) but initially looks like the CG car had the following options fitted:
* CarGraphic / Rs-Tuning ECU map and exhaust including manifolds
* Bilstein Pss9 suspension with front carbon strut brace
* Front Aero Lip PU
* Carbon Rear Wing
* Short Shift Kit
* CarGraphic Racing 19" wheels,
* Pagid brake pads and steel braided hoses
The car tested had kit 2 with the following options:
BTW, not confirmed by CG themselves yet (waiting on this) but initially looks like the CG car had the following options fitted:
* CarGraphic / Rs-Tuning ECU map and exhaust including manifolds
* Bilstein Pss9 suspension with front carbon strut brace
* Front Aero Lip PU
* Carbon Rear Wing
* Short Shift Kit
* CarGraphic Racing 19" wheels,
* Pagid brake pads and steel braided hoses
Feb 25, 2008 3:17:58 PM
- Ferdie
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Lightweight bucket seats and removal of rear seats as well. The comparison was certainly made difficult since the other three cars were convertibles, two of them even equipped with automatic gearbox. Furthermore, the CG was primarily aimed at track performance, with appropriate suspension layout.
The tire choices were very inconsistent as well, making the comparison difficult and those scoring system somewhat obsolete. Except for TechArt (using Mich. Pilot Sport 2) the cars were equipped with Michelin SportCup tires of some sort. The TechArt and CG models made a good impression on me, the later being the performance winner under these circumstances.
Regarding hp figures, my understanding is that the CG Stage I and II systems use the OEM chargers. I assume that, for longetivity reasons, the boost pressure is kept rather conservative beyond 5000 RPM. Looking at the engine graph on the CG website, this supports my assumption. The more powerful CG stage with 600 hp makes a difference at higher RPM and utilizes different turbochargers to do so. I wouldn't be surprised if the testcar had a slightly higher power output but the reasons for the superior performance should be seen elsewere. CG presented the only test candidate with 19" lightweight wheels, furthermore in smallest dimensions as well.
The tire choices were very inconsistent as well, making the comparison difficult and those scoring system somewhat obsolete. Except for TechArt (using Mich. Pilot Sport 2) the cars were equipped with Michelin SportCup tires of some sort. The TechArt and CG models made a good impression on me, the later being the performance winner under these circumstances.
Regarding hp figures, my understanding is that the CG Stage I and II systems use the OEM chargers. I assume that, for longetivity reasons, the boost pressure is kept rather conservative beyond 5000 RPM. Looking at the engine graph on the CG website, this supports my assumption. The more powerful CG stage with 600 hp makes a difference at higher RPM and utilizes different turbochargers to do so. I wouldn't be surprised if the testcar had a slightly higher power output but the reasons for the superior performance should be seen elsewere. CG presented the only test candidate with 19" lightweight wheels, furthermore in smallest dimensions as well.
Feb 25, 2008 6:46:01 PM
- Alex_997TT
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Feb 25, 2008 8:25:24 PM
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eclou
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
This testing seems to confirm the excellent experiences many of us had with mild reprogramming, exhaust restriction removal, and suspension enhancement. I just wish Porsche had made all of this available as the stock configuration from the factory.
Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Quote:
eclou said:
This testing seems to confirm the excellent experiences many of us had with mild reprogramming, exhaust restriction removal, and suspension enhancement. I just wish Porsche had made all of this available as the stock configuration from the factory.
No we don't, it is part of what makes this hobby what it is, the ability to learn change and in effect personalize our cars.
Harley knows this and has taken it one better and they sell as much or more in accessories as they do in bikes.
Mar 6, 2008 10:02:11 AM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Anyone care to venture an opinion on whether with the CG powerkit 2 would NEED a whole upgraded clutch?
RS-Tuning Powerkit 2
400KW / 544PS / 6200 1/min
798Nm / 3770 1/min
To compare...
RS-Tuning Powerkit 4
459KW / 624PS / 6280 1/min
826Nm / 3770 1/min
And this only has an upgraded Sports Pressure Plate (890Nm).
So do you think the Pressure Plate would be be sufficient to stop the stock clutch having an issue handling 800Nm torque?
RS-Tuning Powerkit 2
400KW / 544PS / 6200 1/min
798Nm / 3770 1/min
To compare...
RS-Tuning Powerkit 4
459KW / 624PS / 6280 1/min
826Nm / 3770 1/min
And this only has an upgraded Sports Pressure Plate (890Nm).
So do you think the Pressure Plate would be be sufficient to stop the stock clutch having an issue handling 800Nm torque?
Mar 6, 2008 10:26:02 AM
- Crash
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Mar 6, 2008 10:59:27 AM
- Alex_997TT
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Quote:
Crash said:
Anyone care to venture a guess about how the 624 and the 645 PS kits compare to the Ruf 650?
Just from a price comparison (excluding taxes and fitting)
CG Kit 1: 507PS/651Nm 3635 EUR
CG Kit 2: 544PS/798Nm 8495 EUR
CG Kit 3: 598PS/811Nm 19995 EUR
CG Kit 4: 624PS/826Nm 34995 EUR
CG Kit 5: 645PS/855Nm 59995 EUR
CG Kit 6: 680PS/867Nm 69995 EUR
Ruf Kit 1: 510hp/705Nm 4700 EUR
Ruf Kit 2: 550hp/780Nm 10650 EUR
Ruf Kit 3: 600hp/850Nm 29380 EUR
Ruf Kit 4: 650hp/870Nm 85000 EUR
Mar 6, 2008 11:05:56 AM
- Crash
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Re: Test of Cargraphic 544PS vs Gambella and other
Quote:
Alex_ said:Quote:
Crash said:
Anyone care to venture a guess about how the 624 and the 645 PS kits compare to the Ruf 650?
Just from a price comparison (excluding taxes and fitting)
CG Kit 1: 507PS/651Nm 3635 EUR
CG Kit 2: 544PS/798Nm 8495 EUR
CG Kit 3: 598PS/811Nm 19995 EUR
CG Kit 4: 624PS/826Nm 34995 EUR
CG Kit 5: 645PS/855Nm 59995 EUR
CG Kit 6: 680PS/867Nm 69995 EUR
Ruf Kit 1: 510hp/705Nm 4700 EUR
Ruf Kit 2: 550hp/780Nm 10650 EUR
Ruf Kit 3: 600hp/850Nm 29380 EUR
Ruf Kit 4: 650hp/870Nm 85000 EUR
The RS 680 kit looks like quite a bargain compared to the Ruf 650.
Mar 6, 2008 11:09:39 AM
- Alex_997TT
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