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    12-nov-2007 23.35.12

    nberry Off-line
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    News on the 430 Replacement

    I am told by a reasonably reliable source that Ferrari was able to get an additional year exemption for the 430 to Sept. 2009. They were able to do this by selling a special seat for minor passengers after Sept. 2008.

    Additionally, I am told that a Ferrari model below the 430 (introductory) is not in the cards. The project was cancelled because of the perceived negative impact on the brand.

    If this information is true, I am disappointed. I was looking forward to a new Ferrari late 2008 or early 2009. Who keeps a car for a fricking five years?

    Obviously, our European friends will be impacted with this information as well.

    12-nov-2007 23.58.31

    JimFlat6
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    What is so bad about the F430 that Ferrari should stop making them soon?

    Im sure one can last 5 years!

    2009 isnt that far away. They still sell well and few people can tell a F360 from a F430 anyway.

    Why worry about it?

    13-nov-2007 0.28.54

    nberry Off-line
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    In risposta a: JimFlat6

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Jim I turned my back on the Scuderia because I was certain the replacement would be announced in Sept. 2008. It may still happen but now I am not optimistic.

    I know I am getting bored with a car when I don't look forward to washing it.

    13-nov-2007 0.45.39

    JimFlat6
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Ownership experience is always relative and sometimes owning multiple cars dilutes the thrill anyway.

    But maybe you should try testing something that lacks the heroin of high speed and has a unique driving experience ---like a Super 7 or a Morgan.

    13-nov-2007 3.27.28

    Turbo Al Off-line
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Jim I turned my back on the Scuderia because I was certain the replacement would be announced in Sept. 2008. It may still happen but now I am not optimistic.

    I know I am getting bored with a car when I don't look forward to washing it.



    Nick, how about the ultimate about-face, which I am sure will never induce boredom-get a 997GT2?!

    13-nov-2007 3.29.05

    Heist
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    In risposta a: JimFlat6

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    I'm sooo bored of my Ferrari ... it's almost 5 years old ... I don't enjoy washing it...

    <<Plays violin strings>>

    My heart weeps for you.

    13-nov-2007 3.29.33

    Turbo Al Off-line
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    In risposta a: JimFlat6

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said:
    Ownership experience is always relative and sometimes owning multiple cars dilutes the thrill anyway.




    No Jim, owning multiple cars only with stock horsepower dilutes the thrill.

    13-nov-2007 5.10.05

    WBH
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Rumors re: Dino cancellation sound suspect....

    F has already invested R&D developing Dino for ?mid-'08 launch....hard to walk away from sunk costs....need to be able to generate revenues/rev&profit growth in CY08 (599 and Scud are too low volume)....and develop more profitable pricing precedents/positioning for 430 successor in ?CY09....and poss Enzo 2.0 in CY09.....

    High-end economy in US/London/Germany is cooling, but product cycles are difficult to synch vs economic/financial cycles....interestingly, P/AMG are already scrambling to develop 997TT 2.0/SL63 Blk in preparation for the marketing&profit bloodbath vs high-volume Dino launch in a recessionary economy....isn't competition great???

    F also faces financial "constraints" of developing profit growth in advance of any IPO, LBO, etc....

    Besides, who keeps any car more than 6mos anyway???....or chooses to use own time/oppty cost personally washing any car????

    Spec another copy of 430/599/Scud to keep self entertained while waiting for whatever new models....any car is about as obsolescent/disposable as any smartphone/iPod anyway.....

    13-nov-2007 7.28.47

    timr
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    In risposta a: WBH

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    New car (below 430) will be announced at Paris 2008 at price of Euros 130k. Replacement 430 in 2009 (deliveries in 2010) with Spider out in 2011.

    13-nov-2007 7.37.00

    andrea
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    In risposta a: timr

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    timr said:
    New car (below 430) will be announced at Paris 2008 at price of Euros 130k. Replacement 430 in 2009 (deliveries in 2010) with Spider out in 2011.



    I think too.No geneve 2008 for little ferrari?

    13-nov-2007 8.06.35

    tony h
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    In risposta a: andrea

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    according to the ferrari uk guy i met on saturday , there deffo WILL be a new entry level ferrari. It wont be badged dino tho. There's a whole new production line going in to make the car

    13-nov-2007 9.33.13

    Rich C (UK)
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    In risposta a: tony h

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Well I hope there is... I've had a 'speculative' deposit down on such a car since 2004 (targetting a 40th b'day present for myself)- I was almost at the stage of looking at the 430 or it's replacement, but if that's going upmarket then the 'baby' will fit even better (that said I hope I've still got a job and can afford it the way things are going!)

    13-nov-2007 10.18.20

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: tony h

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    tony h said:
    according to the ferrari uk guy i met on saturday , there deffo WILL be a new entry level ferrari. It wont be badged dino tho. There's a whole new production line going in to make the car



    In fact this new production line has already been built.

    13-nov-2007 10.26.09

    zzbobaA
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    In risposta a: Rossi

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Yes. The car is coming, it will be called "Ferrari California GT"

    13-nov-2007 11.01.22

    Patriek
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Who keeps a car for a fricking five years?



    ........ you would speak another language if you would have to pay for them (maybe you even won't be driving a F car

    13-nov-2007 15.58.44

    nberry Off-line
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    In risposta a: Patriek

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Patriek, your right. If Ferrari depreciated like a Porsche then I certainly would consider other cars.I see no reason for me to bend over and grab my ankles everytime I step into a car dealership.

    Some guy's like to get hosed and don't care. I am not one.

    BTW, I have never understood ownership of multiple performance cars. Either the one you have does it for you or replace it. Very similar to marriage.

    13-nov-2007 16.19.32

    racerx
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    BTW, I have never understood ownership of multiple performance cars. Either the one you have does it for you or replace it. Very similar to marriage.



    In the same way, I have never understood the need or desire to get the supposed next best thing. If you are so enthralled by your particular car why the need for the replacement.

    If you do maintenence, performance should always be as good.


    So Nick, blonde or brunette?

    13-nov-2007 16.31.30

    Italo
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Patriek, your right. If Ferrari depreciated like a Porsche then I certainly would consider other cars.I see no reason for me to bend over and grab my ankles everytime I step into a car dealership.

    Some guy's like to get hosed and don't care. I am not one.

    BTW, I have never understood ownership of multiple performance cars. Either the one you have does it for you or replace it. Very similar to marriage.



    Are you now taking an indirect dig at MikeS

    13-nov-2007 17.38.59

    Marwan Arakji Off-line
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    In risposta a: Italo

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    guys, very reputable french magazine "Sport Auto": a front engine V8 is in the works, 2+2, built on the 430 platform, but NOT a 430 replacement, and NOT an entry-level Ferrari... to be priced between the 430 and the 599... engine derived from the 430, but with more cc., and slightly less bhp (450 to 480 bhp)... to be named "California GT"...

    13-nov-2007 18.00.22

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: racerx

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    racerx said:
    In the same way, I have never understood the need or desire to get the supposed next best thing. If you are so enthralled by your particular car why the need for the replacement.



    Because development goes on and on and by the time you own your beloved car for let's say three to five years, the new model thrills you so much, that you have to get it. It's as simple as that.

    13-nov-2007 18.05.43

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: Marwan Arakji

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    Marwan Arakji said:
    guys, very reputable french magazine "Sport Auto": a front engine V8 is in the works, 2+2, built on the 430 platform, but NOT a 430 replacement, and NOT an entry-level Ferrari... to be priced between the 430 and the 599... engine derived from the 430, but with more cc., and slightly less bhp (450 to 480 bhp)... to be named "California GT"...



    I don't think that we will see something in between the 430 and 599. The price of the midengined-V8-model is going up, making room for a new "entry" level car in the price range of the Porsche Turbo or the former 360 Modena. With the Scuderia and its price tag of more than 200k Euro you can expect the 430-replacement to cost that amount of money as well. So even with the recent price hike of the 599 (CCM included) there still is not enough room for a frontengined V8 in between these two models.

    Also if the California GT will have around 460hp (which is true), why should it cost more than the 490hp-F430?

    13-nov-2007 18.07.08

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: nberry

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    BTW, I have never understood ownership of multiple performance cars. Either the one you have does it for you or replace it. Very similar to marriage.



    Very nice comparison.

    13-nov-2007 18.37.07

    mv
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    In risposta a: Rossi

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Rossi,
    it comes from several sources that the California GT will cost slightly more than the F430. However, is is also said to be slightly more powerful (510hp?). So it probably won't be an entry-level car when it is introduced, but that will change in less than a year after the introduction with the arrival of the beast - "F142".

    13-nov-2007 20.06.42

    racerx
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    In risposta a: Rossi

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    racerx said:
    In the same way, I have never understood the need or desire to get the supposed next best thing. If you are so enthralled by your particular car why the need for the replacement.



    Because development goes on and on and by the time you own your beloved car for let's say three to five years, the new model thrills you so much, that you have to get it. It's as simple as that.



    Only on these boards Rossi, not measured by the assometer.

    To be down a second 0-60 is not noticeable if driving one at a time. I can compare a 997 C2S and a stradale to my car and 0 - 60 is not a yardstick. Braking was the only noticeable difference.

    Looks and sound are the keys and if you find the one that does it then there you go. All I can say is many must purchase cars they really didn't want in the first place.

    13-nov-2007 20.45.17

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: racerx

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    racerx said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    racerx said:
    In the same way, I have never understood the need or desire to get the supposed next best thing. If you are so enthralled by your particular car why the need for the replacement.



    Because development goes on and on and by the time you own your beloved car for let's say three to five years, the new model thrills you so much, that you have to get it. It's as simple as that.



    Only on these boards Rossi, not measured by the assometer.

    To be down a second 0-60 is not noticeable if driving one at a time. I can compare a 997 C2S and a stradale to my car and 0 - 60 is not a yardstick. Braking was the only noticeable difference.

    Looks and sound are the keys and if you find the one that does it then there you go. All I can say is many must purchase cars they really didn't want in the first place.



    Well, but it's not all about 0 to 60, is it?

    For example you not only get faster cars, but cars that become safer, cars that are easier to drive fast (we can argue, if that's really an advantage, but I think most buyers prefer cars which can be driven fast without exploiting the driver), cars with advanced technology for the chassis, cars that become lighter (and so more fun to drive) thanks to exotic materials, cars that consume less fuel. And there are many other examples.

    Of course sound and looks are very important, but they are not the only reasons. Take a look at the F355 for example: for me this is one of the best looking modern Ferrari. I also absolutely love the sound that its V8 makes. Would I prefer it to a F430, a car that is surely not as good looking and which sound is great but not as harmonic as that of a F355? No, because the F430 is a so much better car overall.

    13-nov-2007 20.46.22

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: mv

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    mv said:
    ...but that will change in less than a year after the introduction with the arrival of the beast - "F142".



    First in line.

    13-nov-2007 20.58.58

    GaussM
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    In risposta a: Rossi

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    mv said:
    ...but that will change in less than a year after the introduction with the arrival of the beast - "F142".



    First in line.



    Pardon my ignorance, but is F142 the Dino?

    13-nov-2007 21.26.41

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: GaussM

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    Gauss said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    mv said:
    ...but that will change in less than a year after the introduction with the arrival of the beast - "F142".



    First in line.



    Pardon my ignorance, but is F142 the Dino?



    Nope. It's the F430 replacement.

    EDIT: Dino is F149 BTW.

    13-nov-2007 21.38.12

    mv
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    In risposta a: Rossi

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Rossi,
    any word on delivery ? Spring 2009 ?

    13-nov-2007 21.41.15

    Rossi
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    In risposta a: mv

    Re: News on the 430 Replacement

    Quote:
    mv said:
    Rossi,
    any word on delivery ? Spring 2009 ?



    No concrete date yet. When I first heard of it, date given was late 2008. I highly doubt car will come that early, perhaps presentation will be end of 2008, but first deliveries surely not before 2009 I guess.
     
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