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    McLaren Killer

    Call me a heretic, but id love it if ferrari made an insanely unpractical, but insanely powerful car. Something like enzo with its motor modified with over 35psi of boost, three turbochargers, and put in a 360 chassis. I don't know the exact dimensions of the car, but if you worked on it, I'm sure it can be done. Use a bigger hood, larger air intakes, whatever it takes. I really mean it, everything you can do to a car to make it as undriveable as it is powerful.

    Some may say that this would be "cheating" putting this many turbos on a car, but porsche has been doing it for years, and some of the best ferraris ever (F40, 288 GTO) have been turbos.

    If ferrari made say...200 of these, just enough to make it a "real" car, and not some concept or something, and had all the major magazines review it...I promise you that all those records held by the McLaren F1 will be shattered.

    People will buy this car too, I promise you, to drive the car that is the fastest in the world....

    I'd usually say that handling, driver experience, and all of that is what matters, but McLaren's records need to be broken, I was very dissapointed when it turned out that the enzo's gearing would limit it to 217, where the McLaren has been clocked at what, I believe something like 254.

    I would also want a car like this to shatter any american misconceptions in detroit that anything made by ford or chevy can compete with a ferrari. I hear all the time about people talking about their blown 454 cubic inch motors that will beat a ferrari in the quarter, well, how bout a ferrari "drag racer".

    People would buy this car even if the motor lasted only 20k miles per rebuild, just to say that they have the fastest production car in the world.

    Please don't burn me at the stake here, I know this would be a huge departure from the classical image of what a ferrari is, but isn't a ferrari also supposed to be the best, fastest, most powerful car in the world too?

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    Scuderia said:
    If ferrari made say...200 of these, just enough to make it a "real" car, and not some concept or something, and had all the major magazines review it...I promise you that all those records held by the McLaren F1 will be shattered.
    People will buy this car too, I promise you, to drive the car that is the fastest in the world....



    For all its performance and technical virtues, the McLaren F1 was not a sales or commercial success.
    Would you wish that on Ferrari?


    Quote:
    Scuderia said:
    I would also want a car like this to shatter any american misconceptions in detroit that anything made by ford or chevy can compete with a ferrari. I hear all the time about people talking about their blown 454 cubic inch motors that will beat a ferrari in the quarter, well, how bout a ferrari "drag racer".



    Do you really worry about the views of people who are so ill-informed as to suffer from such misconceptions
    Who cares about the quarter? What relevance does a hotrod have in the real world?.


    Quote:
    Scuderia said:
    People would buy this car even if the motor lasted only 20k miles per rebuild, just to say that they have the fastest production car in the world.



    The same people would also be up front in the warranty-claim line when an engine really did need a rebuild after 20k miles, as Ferreri undoubtedly already knows from past experience.
    (How many posts have we read from people who resent manufacturers taking a dim view of repairing after-market-tuned engines under warranty?).


    Quote:
    Scuderia said:
    I know this would be a huge departure from the classical image of what a ferrari is, but isn't a ferrari also supposed to be the best, fastest, most powerful car in the world too?



    But not at the expense of being drivable!

    Re: McLaren Killer

    I have no doubt most car maufacturers can produce a car which would exceed the records of the McLaren. The new Chrysler supercar made do it.

    The problem is do you rape your company of valuable resources to enhance the corporate ego or image without generating a profit. Many CEO's would have a problem with their stockholders.

    While we are on the subject, Porsches' production of the CGT in my view was from the outset to sell it commercially and make a profit. They represented to the public that the car was designed for racing (Le Mans?) and never raced it. Ask yourself, since they put all the money in developing it why not race it?

    It was nothing more than a ruse to entice buyers to buy the car. These comments are not meant to cast aspersion regarding the car. Except for the McLaren, I believe it is the best mass produced TRACK car Enzo included.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    Scuderia said:
    For all its performance and technical virtues, the McLaren F1 was not a sales or commercial success.
    Would you wish that on Ferrari?




    too late, did you see last quarter's earnings ...err failure report?

    a 28 million euro posted loss i believe.

    i fear fiat may sell ferrari to an american company, and that will be the end of that.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    The MacLaren F1 is not a great car because it holds all those speed and accleration marks. It's great because it's very light, powerful, nimble, attractive and has all the right driving feeling (manual steering, sharp throttle response, center seating, etc.). The car you describe sounds like a monstrosity to me. Might do the 1/4 mile in 9 seconds, but who cares. Ferraris are meant to be sports cars, not dragsters.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    I have no doubt most car maufacturers can produce a car which would exceed the records of the McLaren. The new Chrysler supercar made do it.



    Are you reffering to that Chrysler supercar concept that only ever existed in a computer that they fed to all the media for the sole purpose to get some free brand publicity and afterwards say that they now decided not to make it into production?

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    Grant said:
    The MacLaren F1 is not a great car because it holds all those speed and accleration marks. It's great because it's very light, powerful, nimble, attractive and has all the right driving feeling (manual steering, sharp throttle response, center seating, etc.). The car you describe sounds like a monstrosity to me. Might do the 1/4 mile in 9 seconds, but who cares. Ferraris are meant to be sports cars, not dragsters.


    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    Are you reffering to that Chrysler supercar concept that only ever existed in a computer that they fed to all the media for the sole purpose to get some free brand publicity and afterwards say that they now decided not to make it into production?



    That's the one. The car that was meant to draw our attention away from all the real-world problems that Daimler-Chrysler has by showing us a piece of fantasy.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    Scuderia said:
    Call me a heretic, but id love it if ferrari made an insanely unpractical, but insanely powerful car. Something like enzo with its motor modified with over 35psi of boost, three turbochargers, and put in a 360 chassis. I don't know the exact dimensions of the car, but if you worked on it, I'm sure it can be done. Use a bigger hood, larger air intakes, whatever it takes. I really mean it, everything you can do to a car to make it as undriveable as it is powerful.

    Some may say that this would be "cheating" putting this many turbos on a car, but porsche has been doing it for years, and some of the best ferraris ever (F40, 288 GTO) have been turbos.

    If ferrari made say...200 of these, just enough to make it a "real" car, and not some concept or something, and had all the major magazines review it...I promise you that all those records held by the McLaren F1 will be shattered.

    People will buy this car too, I promise you, to drive the car that is the fastest in the world....

    I'd usually say that handling, driver experience, and all of that is what matters, but McLaren's records need to be broken, I was very dissapointed when it turned out that the enzo's gearing would limit it to 217, where the McLaren has been clocked at what, I believe something like 254.

    I would also want a car like this to shatter any american misconceptions in detroit that anything made by ford or chevy can compete with a ferrari. I hear all the time about people talking about their blown 454 cubic inch motors that will beat a ferrari in the quarter, well, how bout a ferrari "drag racer".

    People would buy this car even if the motor lasted only 20k miles per rebuild, just to say that they have the fastest production car in the world.

    Please don't burn me at the stake here, I know this would be a huge departure from the classical image of what a ferrari is, but isn't a ferrari also supposed to be the best, fastest, most powerful car in the world too?


    I see your point...
    And...
    I think they should!
    And why: Certainly not just to take the crown from McLaren F1. The only reason why today's supercars isn't faster then McLaren F1 is because of the huge downforce their generate. Their are made to the track - that wasn't McLaren F1.
    I like the idea of taking a car like Lotus and then put a rocket of a V12 engine in it. That will be like a dragracer but it should

    I hope Ferrari will with F60 make a lightweight with a huge engine to the racetrack. I really like the idea of an F1 which the car (F60) should also be styled around.

    But who knows? Well, I will make some drawings about what I think a car of this calliper...

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    StradaleF1 said:The only reason why today's supercars isn't faster then McLaren F1 is because of the huge downforce their generate. Their are made to the track - that wasn't McLaren F1.



    I'm not sure I'd agree with that. The McLaren, in its time, won Le Mans 24hrs twice consecutively I believe, a lot more track and racing pedigree that what can be said about any of the current supercars.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    Quote:
    StradaleF1 said:The only reason why today's supercars isn't faster then McLaren F1 is because of the huge downforce their generate. Their are made to the track - that wasn't McLaren F1.



    I'm not sure I'd agree with that. The McLaren, in its time, won Le Mans 24hrs twice consecutively I believe, a lot more track and racing pedigree that what can be said about any of the current supercars.


    Well, I'm talking about the "normal" F1 not the LM...

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    I have no doubt most car maufacturers can produce a car which would exceed the records of the McLaren. The new Chrysler supercar made do it.



    Are you reffering to that Chrysler supercar concept that only ever existed in a computer that they fed to all the media for the sole purpose to get some free brand publicity and afterwards say that they now decided not to make it into production?



    When was that announced? I missed it. By golly I am human afterall.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    Grant said:
    The MacLaren F1 is not a great car because it holds all those speed and accleration marks. It's great because it's very light, powerful, nimble, attractive and has all the right driving feeling (manual steering, sharp throttle response, center seating, etc.). The car you describe sounds like a monstrosity to me. Might do the 1/4 mile in 9 seconds, but who cares. Ferraris are meant to be sports cars, not dragsters.


    You said, but it could be fun to see a Ferrari with the "Murray concept"...

    Re: McLaren Killer

    I wish it was that easy to put together some specs for my next supercar and we usually turn to tuning companies for this. The specs you've mentioned sounds a lot like a Koenig 360TT. However, putting together a 'great car' takes a lot more ingenuity and engineering than that. I suspect that if you were to build a supercar in the purest form, it would closely resemble the McLaren F1, after dealing with layout, building materials, chassis rigidity, aerodynamics, and all the goodies.

    I wonder if Ferrari will ever give all that freedom to Murray, although it would be interesting to see what happens.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    I don't think it would be that expensive to build. Im sure ferrari has the books still on how to make a turbo engine back from the old 80s/90sF1, 288 GTO, F40, etc. days.

    Regardless of what wed all like to think, image is alot in the modern automobile world.

    I myself don't care about the quarter mile (I drive a 328, not exactly a "drag racer"), and for the same ammount of money I could have bought or built some american car that would out class my car in every straight line test, but the magazines do care about those tests, and the 20-something year old millionares do too. (the group soon becomming the primary buyers of ferraris) I am only saying this to address the financial concerns.

    Ferrari lost the top speed record a long time ago, and I think that it woudl be hugely beneficial if ferrari could have the title of "The Fastest Car in The world".

    BTW, I was inspired to write this post after reading an article in a few month old car and driver about how the enzo shatters all the other records (skidpad, 0-60, 0-100, 0-100-0, 7-0 breaking, etc) but not top speed.

    Ferraris are the stuff of dreams, and if you built this car, youd have every 12 year old kid in the world playing with models of it, and dreaming one day to own a ferrari, and lets face it, our children are the future of car buying, when they grow up, I think it would be fantastic if they remembered in their childhood about a car that was the "best" and that was what they wanted to drive. This is the feeling I remember having a long time ago, and now that I have finally gotten one of these masterpieces, it saddens me somewhat that ferrari is no longer the absolute master of the streets in pure performance (at least in this measure of it).

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Ferrari didn't need to build a top speed record car. They knew they could do that. The Enzo has similar HP as the F1 and would take the F1 on a track. It handles better and has virtually the same straight line performance. I never thought the F1 was all that. Its surely not the best looking supercar and it has very soft springs so it rolls a ton on the track. The F1Lm won Lemans ONCE and that was only because of Mario crashing the Courage Porsche and losing 30 min in the pits. The Courage team made up all but a minute or so in an all rain race. As for Porsche saying the CGT was build for racing is false. They always stated it was for street only. They said the ENGINE was build for racing, which it was. Their engine will race more than likely next year.

    Re: McLaren Killer

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    ...The McLaren, in its time, won Le Mans 24hrs twice consecutively I believe, a lot more track and racing pedigree that what can be said about any of the current supercars.



    McLaren won once OA in '95. They posted the best ever debut manufacturer result (1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 13th).

    A long-tail F1 GTR also won the GT class and finished 2 OA while another finished 3 OA in '97.

    Joest won OA in '96 & '97 with the TWR Porsche LMP and the GT1-98 won in '98.

    Greg A

     
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