Crown

Board: Other Sports Cars Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread

    Oct 2, 2002 9:35:50 AM

    zzbobaA
    Rennteam Administrator
    zzboba
    Loc: Germany
    Posts: 3115, Gallery
    Registered on: Apr 8, 2002

    the unbelievable S 600 L

    automotorsport [german car mag] today published a road test of the merc S 600 L...

    erm, i'm a little disturbed. i knew before that with 800 Nm and 500 HP this thing is an overland rocket in a way... but not THIS fast.

    0-100 kph: 4,5 sec
    0-200 kph: 15,2 sec

    IMHO this is FASTER than the tiptronic turbo. and we're speaking of a 2600kg 4-door car here.

    something really weird is happening... will our beloved sports car only be good for track days and some posing?

    Oct 2, 2002 9:54:52 AM

    RCA
    Rennteam Administrator
    RC
    Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany
    Posts: 59604, Gallery
    Registered on: Mar 26, 2002
    Reply to: zzbobaA

    Times are changing...

    ...I bet in two or three years, we see a Cayenne Turbo S which outruns the 996 Turbo Tip.

    But to be serious: yes, Porsche has to raise power and try to stay at the same level with the weight. Reducing weight is almost impossible if they want to cope with future safety standards. Cost is also an issue when talking about weight.

    It wouldn't have been a problem for Mercedes to adapt the SL55's weight to the 996 Turbo's weight but I guess they would have charged 20000 EUR more for such a car.
    Mercedes did a very clever thing (Porsche seems to have started to learn that lesson with the Cayenne Turbo): instead of reducing weight and increasing the car's production/development cost, they increased the power. Most people who own a SL55 will never seriously track race this car and 500 HP are very impressive for street use.

    Porsche will loose some customers to Mercedes, no doubt about it. The upcoming E55 AMG will hurt them most because of it's interesting price tag, performance and enough room for four people or a small family.
    Some people say they were surprised that the Cayenne Turbo is that cheap but I don't find the Cayenne Turbo cheap at all.
    You get a fully equipped E55 AMG for the Cayenne Turbo's price tag and much better performance too. Not to speak that you'll still have some money left to buy your wife something nice.
    A well equipped Cayenne Turbo including all goodies will cost around 115000 EUR. My ML55 AMG is around 80000 EUR and I'm sure that the next generation ML55 with rumored 460 HP won't pass the 85000 EUR barrier.

    As much as I started to like the Cayenne, I don't think that it will be really competitive, especially not right now when people think twice when spending their money on a new car.
    I'm sure that the Cayenne will be a huge success in former Eastern Europe, the Middle East and some parts of Asia but I still have my doubts regarding Europe and the main target market: the US. Time will tell.

    Oct 2, 2002 12:19:48 PM

    zzbobaA
    Rennteam Administrator
    zzboba
    Loc: Germany
    Posts: 3115, Gallery
    Registered on: Apr 8, 2002
    Reply to: RCA

    Re: Times are changing...

    i agree. times are changing. and the number of porsche customers who are on the race track from time to time are VERY small i suppose [not among the members of this forum, but in general ]. most of them are driving their sport cars on ordinary streets, which is pain already. big diesels are pushing from behind and the S 600 is overtaking easily and we are the dumb nuts and have only one "advantage": the highest price tag.

    if it's true that the 2004 porsche 997 will keep the 320 HP flat six machine, i really have some doubts if the porsche image is taking a leakage. today we have all these overstyled poseurs cars like the audi TT or the Z3, but a carrera is still a damn honest and fast car in the eyes of most people out there. but for how long?

    and the question is, why do sports car drivers have to pay that much if not for power and performance? the cayenne turbo is not a bargain, but it is cheap in comparison to the 996 turbo. sports car drivers have to pay a premium price and want premium performance. the 1995 993 turbo got 405 HP (if i remember it right), the actual 996 turbo 420 HP.

    anyway, merc is in attack mode and the other brands have to react. the future will be very exciting i suppose.
     
    Edit

    Forum

    1. All 

    Boards

     
    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II) 5/15/24 8:44 AM
    art.italy     		803863 1808
    Porsche Sticky Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos) 4/7/24 11:48 AM
    Boxster Coupe GTS     		448706 565
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022 3/12/24 8:28 AM
    DJM48     		266300 323
    Porsche Sticky The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche 1/30/24 9:18 AM
    RCA     		90152 45
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift 3/15/24 1:23 PM
    CGX car nut     		6732 50
    Porsche The moment I've been waiting for... 2/1/24 7:01 PM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    		 886029 1364
    Porsche 992 GT3 7/23/23 7:01 PM
    Grant     		834093 3868
    Porsche GT4RS 4/21/24 11:50 AM
    mcdelaug     		399969 1454
    Porsche Welcome to the new Taycan Forum! 2/10/24 4:43 PM
    nberry     		396063 1526
    Others Tesla 2 the new thread 12/13/23 2:48 PM
    CGX car nut     		383228 2401
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 7/3/23 12:30 PM
    Porker     		371002 797
    Porsche Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour 5/12/24 6:23 PM
    blueflame     		293635 669
    Porsche Collected my 997 GTS today 10/19/23 7:06 PM
    CGX car nut
     
     
     
     
     
    		 265963 812
    Lambo Huracán EVO STO 7/30/23 6:59 PM
    mcdelaug     		244074 346
    Lotus Lotus Emira 6/25/23 2:53 PM
    Enmanuel     		238665 101
    Others Corvette C8 10/16/23 3:24 PM
    Enmanuel     		222387 488
    Others Gordon Murray - T.50 11/22/23 10:27 AM
    mcdelaug     		173198 387
    Porsche Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS 6/11/23 5:13 PM
    CGX car nut     		144985 144
    BMW M 2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now 12/29/23 9:04 AM
    RCA     		121169 303
    Motor Sp. 2023 Formula One 12/19/23 5:38 AM
    WhoopsyM     		111924 685
    Porsche 2022 992 Safari Model 3/7/24 4:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		85713 239
    AMG Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758 2/23/24 10:03 PM
    blueflame     		75918 297
    Porsche 992 GT3 RS 3/3/24 7:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		54971 314
    Motor Sp. Porsche 963 5/14/24 7:53 AM
    Porker     		26584 247
    Ferrari Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6) 1/21/24 4:29 PM
    GT-Boy     		21785 103
    BMW M 2022 BMW M5 CS 4/8/24 1:43 PM
    Ferdie     		20304 140
    AMG G63 sold out 9/15/23 7:38 PM
    Nico997     		17139 120
    AMG [2022] Mercedes-AMG SL 4/23/24 1:24 PM
    RCA     		14527 225
    Motor Sp. 24-Hour race Nürburgring 2018 5/25/23 10:42 PM
    Grant     		11570 55
    Porsche Porsche Mission X Hypercar 12/3/23 8:52 AM
    996FourEss     		11202 63
    123 items found, displaying 1 to 30.