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    Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    http://www.sniffpetrol.com/

    I don't know if that is a good name for this topic?

    Following last month's announcement that Michael Mauer is to replace Harm Lagaay as head of design at Porsche, industry spies say the former SAAB styling boss is already furiously preparing for his move to Germany. Sources close to the German designer suggest that, following close scrutiny of the 997 model, Mauer has already brushed up on many of the key techniques required in his new role.
    "Stylists often talk of a 'design language,'" noted car design pundit Fnrk Hamsandwich. "But at Porsche that literally means learning the correct language. Michael will have to be familiar with phrases such as 'phoning it in', 'not bothering' and 'exactly the [****] same'." Experts also believe Mauer is well on his way to deliberately 'unlearning' important words such as 'change', 'radical' and 'brave new direction'. The 41-year-old designer is also said to be practising the actions required for the Porsche style position, by sitting around doing bugger all.
    However, some car design analysts have been quick to point out that it's not all loafing around for five years and then deciding to make the headlights a slightly different shape. Now that Porsche has the Cayenne, Mauer must also get used to catching sight of one driving past his house and the subsequent two hours spent sitting in a darkened room gently sobbing

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Hilarious but true. I believe the press/media is becoming somewhat exasperated with Porsche styling. Hopefully Porsche will take the CGT and use it as a model to sire its next generation 998. The 997 is kaput except for the die hards.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    nberry said:The 997 is kaput except for the die hards.



    Nick, do you see yourself in this picture? I'm sure I'm not the only one thats starting to. You just don't know were the line between sharing constructive critizisms vs nag-nag, nag-nag, nag-nag... and just becoming the typical pain in the a** of the group do you

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:The 997 is kaput except for the die hards.



    Nick, do you see yourself in this picture? I'm sure I'm not the only one thats starting to. You just don't know were the line between sharing constructive critizisms vs nag-nag, nag-nag, nag-nag... and just becoming the typical pain in the a** of the group do you



    I did not post the article. Did you read it? You must admit its funny. Hey, if it is true Porsche monitors this site then if enough people compalin about outdated styling they may change things.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    I wasn't reffering to what you said about the article, but what I speciffically quoted of your post. Personally. I thought the article was indeed very funny too

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    if enough people compalin about outdated styling they may change things


    You're the only one here that considers the 911 'outdated'.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    The 997 is kaput except for the die hards.



    Let me do a little reality check for you: I can't speak about the US but in Germany, the 10-15 cars each dealer seems to get, some more or some less, are already almost sold out.
    Dealers already started to complaint that they don't get enough cars to satisfy customer demand.
    Now Germany has a pretty slow economy right now and it is surprising to see how many people are interested in buying the new 997. The US seems to have a growing economy, people are still in the mood to buy expensive cars and maybe I'm wrong but I think that US dealers won't be able to fully satisfy 997 customer demand, at least not in the first year of production. Kaput(t)? Maybe your imagination.

    The 997 design looks outdated? You didn't see one yet personally. Most people like the 911 design evolution because it keeps a steady shape and no real surprises, good or bad.
    Why completely changing a design if people like it?

    And may I ask a last question: why did you buy a Mini Cooper? I mean this is the same thing as with the 911, right?

    To be honest, I wish I'd be a professional psychiatrist and I bet I'd find the motives of you loosing time to comment on a car you're not really interested in. Maybe you're in love and you don't want to admit it. A beautiful wife is nice to have but if the sex is bad...

    BTW: I'm curious about two things. How long do you own your 360 Modena now and how many km do you have on your Ferrari?

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Hilarious but true. I believe the press/media is becoming somewhat exasperated with Porsche styling.



    Nick,

    You were obviously not previously familiar with the "sniffpetrol" site, or you would not use the expression "press/media" when referring to it. Sniffpetrol is intended to be hilarious, and frequently is. It is not generally meant to be taken seriously, though part of the joke probably is the fact that the guy behind it knows there are people out there sufficiently demented to do just that.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    You were obviously not previously familiar with the "sniffpetrol" site, or you would not use the expression "press/media" when referring to it. Sniffpetrol is intended to be hilarious, .......



    Darn, I've fouled up!

    I've accused Nick in the past of not coming up with any rational arguments or facts in his rants against Porsche.

    He has just had his attention drawn to sniffpetrol, and immediately took it seriously! If I hadn't just made the mistake of explaining to him that it is really just meant to be funny, we might in future have been treated to him regularly harvesting "arguments" and "facts" from sniffpetrol, which would at least have made his posts funny and irritating, instead of just irritating.

    Sorry guys. I just didn't think it through in time.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Sorry guys. I just didn't think it through in time.



    fritz, you really didn't think it through and I tell you why:
    Nick doesn't care about what the media says or what anybody says, he just cares to provoke and to make the 997 look bad. So no matter if Sniffpetrol is a satirical site or if the Wall Street Journal would have posted the article, Nick cares only about stirring up emotions, not about reality.

    I read at least a dozend publications regarding the 997 and I didn't read a single one where the 997 design was criticized.
    Most of them actually asked "why not earlier, Porsche?".
    Maybe Nick isn't happy that the 997 doesn't look like a Carrera GT, so he can afford one. Or maybe he's just afraid of the "real thing" because of the clutch. At least he has to move the Carrera GT through city downtown so people can see him, right? Not an easy task with the CGT clutch.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Maybe Nick isn't happy that the 997 doesn't look like a Carrera GT, so he can afford one. Or maybe he's just afraid of the "real thing" because of the clutch. At least he has to move the Carrera GT through city downtown so people can see him, right? Not an easy task with the CGT clutch.



    LOL! That's totally hilarious, RC. I think you're right too.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Hey Guys...Let's calm down a litlle bit...

    I dont want to take any part but this forum has become a litle bit of a war field in the last couple of days regarding the sc upgrade and the 997.

    Let's chill out and relax, after all we're all internet friends here and we all (i think) are here because we love porsche...

    Relax people....

    By the way, Portugal are in the quarter finals...

    Woshhhh and have a nice weekend start...

    Double woshhhhhhhhhhh

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    paulorangelmelo said:
    this forum has become a litle bit of a war field in the last couple of days



    We just took your brazilian soccer trainer by his words...

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    I hate to say this (I'd much prefer , of course to see Spain there), but congratulations to Portugal, sincerely....

    In any case, we are all europeans (I really feel this way), so not being there for my country is a bit less "painful"

    Sorry for the off topic.

    In any case, I'm really surprised to see, there are still short minds (YES!) that persevere on negative attitudes towards one of the best and more attractive attractive in history: 997S. It makes me laugh (not to cry), but, and still never driven one, I'd have a lot of fun to beat ANY other car in the same league, of course....(and maybe others in other leagues) in a twisted road with my future 997.

    I said it inmediatelly when the first photos arrose: this is the best 911 ever. And I'm a bit tired to hear topic comments as "vintage model". "remake", "Cosmetics", "marketing", "it could be better" and bla, bla....

    The fact is simple: if you don't like it, just don't buy it.....

    The only thing that really worries me is: Will the people at Porshe be able to even evolute this ultimate 911 (Ultimate 2004)?...........

    I'm shure, in spite my previous worry, that in one way or another, the genious at Porsche will continue (If economy allows it)....even after all of us will continue discussing, driving, enjoying and talting at heaven.

    ....In any case, those who complain with no consistent reasons are very afraid with "our" newborn.....jajaja just wait for the turbo! They will need Prozak!

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    I don't really care what other people say about porsche and the 997 in this case, my opinion counts first for myself, they might be right, but that is the way I like it somehow....what I don't like is the idea of the porsche 4 door, it is pissing me off...

    and yes, it was a funny read...I should go to sniffpetrol more often... I've got a friend whose dad owns a Ferrari and keeps telling me Ferrari is way better than Porsche, offcourse I disagree, have lots of arguments and stuff...But such a funny article would shut him up, as long as he won't find out about this site

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    The Sniff Petrol article is funny, but I would say that it is a bigger challenge to be a Porsche (911) designer than a designer at any other car manufacturer!

    Because with the 911 you have to KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) and you have many limitations on what you can and can't do, unlike f.ex BMW where you can start with a clean sheet of paper like Bangle did.

    The BIG challenge is to keep the 911 looking fresh and up to date with each update while retaining the familiar and classic shape.

    It's just like making pizza The hardest pizza to make is the Margherita, because all you have to work with is the pizza dough, the tomato sauce and cheese. And making a good tasting pizza out of just those ingredients is a real challenge. Unlike a Pizza Hut Super Supreme pizza which is loaded with just about every ingredient known to man.

    Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

    T

    How anyone can dislike this look is beyond me...

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    temm said:... but I would say that it is a bigger challenge to be a Porsche (911) designer than a designer at any other car manufacturer!

    Because with the 911 you have to KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) and you have many limitations on what you can and can't do...



    This is exactly right!

    In the same way, ballet is more confining than modern dance. Yet ballet has survived the ages with grace, while few compositions in modern dance will be remembered even 10 years after they are performed.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    Radar said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    Maybe Nick isn't happy that the 997 doesn't look like a Carrera GT, so he can afford one. Or maybe he's just afraid of the "real thing" because of the clutch. At least he has to move the Carrera GT through city downtown so people can see him, right? Not an easy task with the CGT clutch.



    LOL! That's totally hilarious, RC. I think you're right too.



    What I can afford is irrelevant. I would not pay for a car I cannot use and CGT is one of those cars. The way I see it, a cars performance on a track is the least likely reason for me to buy it since I would not track it. I am not alone; 99% of Porsche owners do not track their cars.

    More important to me is the feeling of driving the car around the city and the excitement it generates not only within me but the people around me. That is what I pay for. The Spider gives me the feeling of a race car with looks that cause people to take pictures while I am driving or ask to have their pictures taken in or alongside of the car. Try that with a 997.

    Taking a car like the 997 and making it look like a car over 10 yrs old does will not generate excitement in me or the driving public despite it performance numbers at the ring. It is a VW Beetle on testastrone.

    RC, I owned a 2001 Yellow Spider manual and sold it and ordered a new 2004 Red Spider F1 which I took delivery in Feb 2004. I have 2800 miles on it. The worst part of my day is when I have to garage it for the night. The Mini is my wife's car and it is a blast to drive. I lot more fun than my previous 996 and a lot cheaper.

    Fritz, you know as well as I do the article though fun and written in jest clearly was pointing out what they and most other people think.

    What Porsche is doing with the 997 to its customers is what the picture Carlos posted shows.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    More important to me is the feeling of driving the car around the city and the excitement it generates not only within me but the people around me. That is what I pay for.



    I must say, Nick, your sense of altruism is much greater than I really ever realized. You are willing to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars, in part, just to bring joy and excitement to the dreary lives of those that see your car passing by on the street?

    Here this whole time, I thought your previous rants on exclusivity were just about your own ego and sense of self worth. Turns out, you were bearing the burden of driving around in a Ferrari just for the tired and huddled masses! Maybe that's why everyone on this board loves Porsche so much--we don't give a rat's *ss about the well-being of others! We are selfish b*stards who drive these cars strictly for ourselves!

    Yours is a sainthood that will be chronicled and sung about for generations. Truly, heavy is the head that wears the crown.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    Barrett said:


    I must say, Nick, your sense of altruism is much greater than I really ever realized. ..
    Here this whole time, I thought your previous rants on exclusivity were just about your own ego and sense of self worth. Turns out, you were bearing the burden of driving around in a Ferrari just for the tired and huddled masses!

    Yours is a sainthood that will be chronicled and sung about for generations. Truly, heavy is the head that wears the crown.



    Well , if you have attended concours like the one at Pebble Beach, there is certainly the feel of " huddled masses " paying $$ entry fees for the privilege to bow before their royal owners like John Mozart , Ralph Lauren or Jay Leno.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Nick,

    Curious that you assert so few Porsche drivers use their cars in anger...perhaps you are correct. However, I'd vouch that whatever the %, it is orders of magnitude greater than the equivalent Fcar group...and before you assert that this is Pcar hubris on my part, am an ardent fan of the 360. Just love to see rather more of them at the track...

    It is amusing that your largese - in permitting the masses to see you and your beloved chariot - is such a strong substantiation point for your 360 ownership. Rings an almost Feudal bell...where is Freud when you need him?

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    What I can afford is irrelevant. I would not pay for a car I cannot use and CGT is one of those cars. The way I see it, a cars performance on a track is the least likely reason for me to buy it since I would not track it. I am not alone; 99% of Porsche owners do not track their cars.

    More important to me is the feeling of driving the car around the city and the excitement it generates not only within me but the people around me. That is what I pay for. The Spider gives me the feeling of a race car with looks that cause people to take pictures while I am driving or ask to have their pictures taken in or alongside of the car. Try that with a 997.

    Taking a car like the 997 and making it look like a car over 10 yrs old does will not generate excitement in me or the driving public despite it performance numbers at the ring. It is a VW Beetle on testastrone.



    maybe i'm the only one here (and maybe i shouldn't say this ) but i can't deny that i agree to this.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    At first, I thought that the 997 was a beetle... And to be honest, it shares a lot of lines... the headlights, the directionals, the lines between the hood and the light... the round corners of the front bonnet, etc... But now the 997 is starting to grow on me, and since the new press pics released... wOw... I love this car!!! Especially in dark colors or silver... it just is a 911 after all... Really great. Adn people that complain: So what; get another car! Buy a ferrari!
    -Joost-

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    That is what I pay for. The Spider gives me the feeling of a race car with looks that cause people to take pictures while I am driving or ask to have their pictures taken in or alongside of the car. Try that with a 997.

    Too bad that is why you pay for it . As for trying it with a 997, it will produce the same results. Granted here in SoCal. people are used to seeing Ferraris, Porsches, Lambos, etc.(admitadly more Porsches than the others) but even here, not to mention around the rest of the world, the majority of people equate Porsche with Ferrari. Before you attack, I said the majority, I know not all do. But like we have read in another post regarding womens views, is a Porsche is a Porsche. They don't know the cost or performance differnce between a Boxster and a Turbo, and that does not just apply to women. Alot of people don't know the difference. You should also know that any new model gets attention over the old. Next summer you will pull up to a cafe, to get your moneys worth, and a 997 will be sitting there. One is arguably better looking than the other, but the people will be noticing the 997, I can't say more than yours it is spectacular looking, but right on par. Its the new Porsche, its different, people are interested. Thats why you got the mini. Its new, its different, people like it. Funny though for someone that doesn't like the retro look of the 997, and thinks they should make mini CGTs, you own a retro car! The mini isn't stepping forward in looks, technology yes, but looks no! Its a modern take on the original, the same thing you critizise the 997 for. I have to agrre with RC on the counseling Anyway good luck with your car, but when you pull up to a 997 next year, and he's stealing your thunder, please, remember your friends here at rennteam!

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    BillC4S said:
    ...where is Freud when you need him?



    He's probably turning in his grave at the thought of what he could have earned as Nick's shrink, if he had only been born 150 years later!

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    zzboba said:
    Taking a car like the 997 and making it look like a car over 10 yrs old does will not generate excitement in me or the driving public despite it performance numbers at the ring. It is a VW Beetle on testastrone.



    maybe i'm the only one here (and maybe i shouldn't say this ) but i can't deny that i agree to this.



    zzoba,

    I think when you have seen the car in the metal (I have) then you will realise that it does not look in the least bit "retro" or "beetle-like". Early photographs and reports didn't do the car justice by highlighting the styling elements which looked as if they were intended to remind us of the 993.

    My Prediction: In a year's time we'll have stopped thinking of the car as being a rehash of the 993, and we'll have come to think of it as a classic in it's own right.

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    More important to me is the feeling of driving the car around the city and the excitement it generates not only within me but the people around me. That is what I pay for. The Spider gives me the feeling of a race car with looks that cause people to take pictures while I am driving or ask to have their pictures taken in or alongside of the car. Try that with a 997.



    Different worlds I tell ya, if that would happen with 996/997's like that, I would not buy one!! thats simply embarrasing and a handicap IMO! I sometimes have to wait before I approach my car and get in it because I see people looking at the car up close or trying to look through the windows, its so embarrasing I sometimes wait a moment till they leave...

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Quote:
    Barrett said:
    I must say, Nick, your sense of altruism is much greater than I really ever realized.

    Here this whole time, I thought your previous rants on exclusivity were just about your own ego and sense of self worth. Turns out, you were bearing the burden of driving around in a Ferrari just for the tired and huddled masses!!

    Yours is a sainthood that will be chronicled and sung about for generations. Truly, heavy is the head that wears the crown.



    Hey Barrett,

    You've opened my eyes; I'd never thought of it like that.

    For me, nberry has just gone from being "Old Nick" to "Saint Nick" in the space of one post.

    I thought he drove a Spider because it's better for posing. I now realise he needs the headroom for his halo!

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Well, as I'm sure Nick can tell you, his noblesse oblige knows no bounds.

    For the price of a $200,000 cup of coffee, you too can brighten a poor, starving child's day!

    Re: Sh*tting on 997 and new designchef

    Well,lets make it clear-Porsche is not Mitsubishi or Toyota to change the styles every 3 years. Some stuff dinamically changing and some classicaly stable in this life. The classical traditional mens suit didn't change much over past 100 years but look at ever changing teenagers fashion trends. Look on Patek Philippe watches from 40's-another good example.
    I like Porshe cars for three reasons: great performans, classik styling and everyday practicality. When I've seen Lamborghini Gallardo for the first time I got so tempted to get one and then I thought I won't be able to drive it every day. Also we have only 2 dealerships in Chicago area that can service Gallardo. On the other hand porsche is so easy to maintain and it is not so flasy.
    Just my few cents...

     
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