Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of? - Page1

May 29, 2006 1:35:32 PM

mike m: Newbie; Loc: Europe and USA; Posts: 2, Gallery; Registered on: May 29, 2006

Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Hi there
I've just bought an 4S convertible and will pick it up this week. My dealer has sent me a pretty unexpected form, a "Non Export Agreement". It says that there was a $15,000.- penalty which I would have to pay if the car was exported outside of the USA within 12 months of the initial purchase date. Porsche apparently doesn't like Europeans to buy cars in the USA which could be attractive for them due to the favorable exchange rate. I live and work in Europe and Seattle and the dealer probably thought that I plan something like that... I've protested but the dealer insists that every buyer of a Porsche in the USA has to sign this agreement. I just can't believe that. Is that true? I think it's an unacceptable restriction which probably not many of us would be willing to accept. If I buy and pay a car, I want to do with it whatever I wish. Did all of you 997 buyers have to sign such an agreement? Thanks for your quick and appreciated replies
Cheers,
Mike

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May 29, 2006 1:53:16 PM

Joost: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Dordrecht , Netherlands; Posts: 8058, Gallery; Registered on: May 3, 2004; Reply to: mike m

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

OK, so, you pay for the car, right? After you paid for it, it is your possession. So, if the seller wants to tell you what to do and what not to do with the car AFTER you bought it from him, I'd tell him to go fish, OR sell you the car for a lower amount of money, because he restricts you in what to do with the car... At least, that is the way I see it.
-Joost-

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May 29, 2006 2:04:35 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: mike m

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Sell the car to an American, who can then export it. What he does is out of your control. And tell the dealer to shove it up his hiney.

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May 29, 2006 2:27:05 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59605, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Joost

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Quote:
Joost said:
OK, so, you pay for the car, right? After you paid for it, it is your possession. So, if the seller wants to tell you what to do and what not to do with the car AFTER you bought it from him, I'd tell him to go fish, OR sell you the car for a lower amount of money, because he restricts you in what to do with the car... At least, that is the way I see it.
-Joost-

I'm afraid things aren't that easy. If he signs the agreement, he has to fullfill it. Otherwise I can assure you that he will be sued. Porsche already carries a "blacklist" with dealers in various countries (especially USA and Germany) which aren't supposed to get cars from official Porsche dealers due to their involvement in various export/grey market activities.

I myself have to sign an agreement that I won't sell my car for the next three months as soon as I pick it up. Of course there is the old saying "what Porsche doesn't know..." but IF they find out, well...no mercy I'm afraid.

But since I don't plan to sell my car after I get it (10000 Euro should be easy to get for it...additional money!), I won't have any problems.

Yes, apparently some US dealers are selling cars to Europe, mostly Boxsters but also other models like the Cayenne for example. Customers buying such cars don't seem to realize the disadvantages of saving a couple of thousands. First, resale value. Then, warranty (there could be issues), especially when the "official" warranty is over...no chance of getting ANYTHING outside the warranty period. And of course there is the problem with country specific standard options and setups.

Little hint: if somebody doesn't plan to sell the car to a third party after he buys it, sign this damn' agreement and forget about it.

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May 29, 2006 2:57:15 PM

Damian: Senior; Loc: Pa, USA; Posts: 646, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 10, 2005; Reply to: mike m

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Nonsense. Don't sign it. This isn't a Ferrari FXX you are buying, go to the next dealer if necessary.

Porsche's Canadian MSRP's are exorbitantly high, they don't want it resold in Canada. Porsche can alleviate their concerns by bringing Canadian prices into line with U.S.

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May 29, 2006 3:45:40 PM

Porsche-Jeck: Rennteam Master; Loc: Rheinland , Germany; Posts: 4856, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 27, 2005; Reply to: mike m

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Quote:
mike m said:
I've just bought an 4S convertible and will pick it up this week. My dealer has sent me a pretty unexpected form, a "Non Export Agreement".

I'm not an expert in US law, but I think it's reasonable to assume that a bilateral contract can't be changed in a unilateral way. So if you really have "bought" the car (i.e. signed a purchase agreement which does not comprise any reselling restriction) he has to deliver the car under the terms of the purchase agreement and is not entitled to ask for any "amendments" afterwards.

Sure, if you do not intend to export the car within the next 12 months you can follow RC's pragmatic approach of signing the document, but I find it simply unfair to surprise a customer with this sort of extra agreement AFTER you have signed a purchase agreement.

Also I highly doubt, if a dealer within the EU could enforce such a stipulation (even if the customer formally has agreed to it) as it might not comply with consumer laws and competition laws (I'm talking about B2C business - B2B business might be a different case).
In the B2C business the only exception to the rule might apply if for "special marketing" purposes a customer receives a highly discounted car and PAG or the dealership wants to avoid the customer to abuse the "special discount" via promptly reselling the car (such restrictions might apply to the manufacturer's employees for example or to journalists' cars).

But again, as your purchase agreement should be ruled by US law you might ask a US lawyer (where's Nick

)

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May 29, 2006 4:05:12 PM

Joost: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Dordrecht , Netherlands; Posts: 8058, Gallery; Registered on: May 3, 2004; Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

I understand your point RC, and I think I would not have any problems with it either, because I would not want to sell it anytime

But it is the idea behind it... Might differ if the dealer has told Mike so before purchase. But still... my gut feeling tells me to tell the dealer the truth!

-Joost-

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May 29, 2006 10:02:07 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59605, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

If somebody ordered a car with a signed contract and the dealer asks him to sing a non-export agreement when the car arrives without having told him BEFORE he signed the contract for the car, I don't think that the dealer has the right to "force" the customer to sign the contract. It doesn't sound right. I'm no legal expert and I'm no lawyer but it sounds strange to me. Unfortunately the same thing happens over here: when you pick up the car, you get that paper rubbed under your nose. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't stand a chance in court, I think I even read something about a court decision against BMW over here in Germany but if somebody really wants to keep and drive the car, why all that fuss and hot blood. Just sign the damn' thing and get over it, your dealer is happy, you are happy (as long as you don't want to sell the car immediately

) and Porsche is happy. But I can understand that some people don't like it to be forced to do that, especially since they ordered the car with a written contract (hopefully!) and the dealer didn't tell them anything about this non-export agreement (which would be a non-sale agreement over here in Germany).
But like I said, I think there is already a court ruling regarding such agreements in Germany and as far as I remember, they aren't quite legal.

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May 30, 2006 7:57:25 AM

mike m: Newbie; Loc: Europe and USA; Posts: 2, Gallery; Registered on: May 29, 2006; Reply to: RC

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Thanks for your opinions and feedback. I hate that the dealer told me that this was the ususal procedure and all buyers would have to sign it. But I can clearly see that this is just not true. And that's even worse than the paper itself...

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May 30, 2006 1:28:23 PM

Porky Tokyo: Senior; Loc: Tokyo, Japan; Posts: 617, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 8, 2005; Reply to: mike m

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Mike, go to Porsche in Newport - they would sell me a Porsche to ship to Japan. I wouldn't annouce it to them, but they didn't want any stupid agreements signed.

At any rate, Porsche in most countries boasts of their INTERNATIONAL WARRANTY - not very international if you can't take the car out of the USA.

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May 30, 2006 2:42:19 PM

easy_rider911: Rennteam VIP; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 22190, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 8, 2004; Reply to: mike m

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Mike M,

I can't comment on the law in the State of Washington where you are based or the Uniform Commercial Code. However, I can offer some generic input as an English qualified lawyer with similar Anglo-Saxon common law traditions.

As Porsche-Jeck rightly said, you signed a contract on certain terms. The dealer has no right to unilaterally vary the terms of your agreement. Even if he wanted to vary the agreement, he would need your consent AND he would need to provide 'consideration' to make your reciprocal promise enforceable i.e. he would need to provide you with something of some economic value. If you merely consented to vary the agreement without any consideration passing to you, your agreement to vary the contract would in fact be unenforceable.

Suppose you agreed to vary the arrangement in this way. Is it enforceable? Effectively it's a restrictive covenant upon your title to the car i.e. a limitation on your right to use/enjoy the rights of an owner. This in itself is legal and enforceable against you provided you entered into this arrangement freely (not under duress) at arm's length for good consideration. Given that you are being given little choice and he is exercising unequal bargaining power, there's an arguable case that this agreement could be set aside if he ever tried to enforce it. It comes down to how strongly the civil courts in Seattle cling to the concept that you are both mature parties making your own bargain and that the court should not interfere but should merely enforce the bargain you both voluntarily made.

What remedies are open to the dealer? Either a common law action for damages (compensation) or an equitable remedy such as an injunction preventing you from doing the act you agreed not to do. Such a remedy would be available where the dealer could argue successfully that damages would not be an adequate remedy.

This is the position in English law which you can check in any standard practitioner's book on contract law such as Chitty, Treitel or Anson. I would assume that the position is similar in your jurisdiction.

Enough black letter law. If I were in your position I would walk. There must surely be another dealer who could supply you exactly what you need without all these restrictive legal shenanigans. It's complete paranoia by PCNA due to the price discrimination which they are practising as between their US and Canadian customers. Here in the EU, this would be a manifest breach of the Treaty of Rome which safeguards the free movement of goods throughout the EU by EU citizens.

Good luck!

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May 30, 2006 7:48:41 PM

The Groom: Expert; Loc: EU; Posts: 1779, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 23, 2005; Reply to: easy_rider911

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

I am altering the deal. Pray I don't alter it any further.

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May 30, 2006 7:57:27 PM

easy_rider911: Rennteam VIP; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 22190, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 8, 2004; Reply to: The Groom

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

Pardon? Your message is almost cryptic!

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May 30, 2006 10:24:51 PM

AJ: Junior; Loc: Vancouver Canada , Canada; Posts: 105, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 21, 2005; Reply to: easy_rider911

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

This is probably more intended for us now wealthy Canadains with an exchange of 1.09 we can go on a buying spree in the US. We had this situation a few years ago in Canada to prevent us from selling our Mercedes MLs to the US as the exchange was 1.60 at the time. If you have a few minutes compare pricing for a US 911 and CDN 911 same options/same car, dramatic difference.

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May 31, 2006 4:15:37 PM

W211: Pilot; Loc:; Posts: 410, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 18, 2003; Reply to: AJ

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

A few years ago, I bought a Ferrari 360 in Canada and signed the non export agreement.

I sold it to a US buyer before the period expired and nothing happend to me.

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Jun 1, 2006 12:51:25 AM

Silver Bullet: Veteran; Loc: Canada; Posts: 1126, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 24, 2004; Reply to: W211

Re: Non Export Agreement: Anybody heard of?

It would not surprise me if this particular dealer has been knowingly selling cars that were going to be exported to Canada, and what you are experiencing is headquarters imposing upon that particular dealer.

I was once told by a dealer that if PAG became aware of a US dealer knowingly selling a car that was going to be exprted to Canada, that dealer would have its order allocations severly reduced. Maybe this contract is a new policy arising out of the terrific strength of the CDN dollar in relation to the US dollar.

The NA Free Trade Agreement should allow us Canadians to buy our 911's in the US and save 10-20 grand (yes, 10-20 grand!). This is PAG's way of preventing it. It's clearly not happening at all dealers, and that's why I'm suspicious about this particular dealer. (Either that, or they have some reason to be suspicious about you)

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