Crown

pmarkow:

d997h:

I just thought about my two car companies I like most, ie., P. and BMW - there has been times when I thought to add an M-toy car to my DD (3series diesel) and leave P. completely and this nagging "what, if" question pops up from time to time...

I still think the idea with the swap of seats is something you should consider further ...it seems to me that neither, SWIMBO nor yourself, seem to be comfortable / happy with either choice ... my 2 cts...

i am fully with you on difficulty of those choices.....:::)))) first world issues though for all of us, not important in the grand picture of things. 

my dealer is already on the seat swap issue. thanks p

 

if it's just your wife, you only need 1 sport seat 

sfo:

if it's just your wife, you only need 1 sport seat 

...or a new wife 

tso:

sfo:

if it's just your wife, you only need 1 sport seat 

...or a new wife 

One of those options will not be cheap...

boytronic:

tso:

sfo:

if it's just your wife, you only need 1 sport seat 

...or a new wife 

One of those options will not be cheap...

The wife part is always the most expensive one...  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

Gnil:

I just came across a guy that is trying to sell his 997 GT3 RS 4.0 since last summer . It has low milage, and the asking price is lower then most other cars on the 2 nd market . Still high though ( 329K CHF ).  

He is not able to sell it ..... and the car is exposed at the OPC dealer .

I often wondered if those crazy asking prices for cars  do get buyers  and what kind of buyers . I am starting to more and more believe that these cars do not sell at those prices . They are only '' internet'' prices . But no real sound minded people buy these cars at those prices .  It is a bubble , as I mentioned many times .  Even 991 RS prices are coming down . Which makes sense . And pretty soon they could be at ' normal ' prices again .

--

 

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

 

I still think you should be getting one, once prices settle! 

2003 BMW M3 CSL (sold) / 2008 Porsche 911 GT3 RS / 2013 MINI John Cooper Works GP / 2014 BMW Alpina D3 biturbo Touring

You really think GT3 RS 4.0 prices will ever settle? I doubt it. This car is really special.

Many of the 991 GT3 RS prices seen on the internet cannot be achieved in real life. I know a guy who tried to sell his 991 GT3 (non RS) for months for 200k EUR, car is slightly used (5000 km) and he didn't succeed. He now sold it for 175k, so he claims. If true, still a nice profit. He paid 155k for it.

I also know a car (RS) which has been offered for 320k EUR since last autumn and it is still available as far as I know. Keep in mind that I am talking about the German market, not others.

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

Many PZs in Germany are selling 991 GT3s for 190k € to 200k €. Many of these cars are werkswagens. 

I know guy who bought 991 GT3 RS just to sell it for profit. He is asking 300k €. Best offer so far was 240k €. Original price was 217k €... 

Some people are greedy...

Porker:

Gnil:

I just came across a guy that is trying to sell his 997 GT3 RS 4.0 since last summer . It has low milage, and the asking price is lower then most other cars on the 2 nd market . Still high though ( 329K CHF ).  

He is not able to sell it ..... and the car is exposed at the OPC dealer .

I often wondered if those crazy asking prices for cars  do get buyers  and what kind of buyers . I am starting to more and more believe that these cars do not sell at those prices . They are only '' internet'' prices . But no real sound minded people buy these cars at those prices .  It is a bubble , as I mentioned many times .  Even 991 RS prices are coming down . Which makes sense . And pretty soon they could be at ' normal ' prices again .

--

 

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

 

I still think you should be getting one, once prices settle! 

I think exactly the same and still hit my head  that I did not take the plunge when there was that nearly new one ( 5 or 6'000 km ) for sale from a car collector in canton BE for 200 k . Or the other choice was  from Porsche Geneva   who had a car for 180k  ( but it had a wrap )    . 

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

Well, a German PZ sells a used GT4 for 120k, so...  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

RC:

You really think GT3 RS 4.0 prices will ever settle? I doubt it. This car is really special.

 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

 

Yes I think they will drop again . Not to the lowest there were , but once all this craziness about prices will start coming back to reason , they will correct . As I said, the asking prices do not find customers at curent prices .

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

KresoF1:

 

I know guy who bought 991 GT3 RS just to sell it for profit. He is asking 300k €. Best offer so far was 240k €. Original price was 217k €... 

Some people are greedy...

And that is a good example of the reality . I just heard of someone who had reserved a 991 GT3 RS for 280k ( normal price is 210k ) that he canceled the reservation . Not willing anymore to put that much money into the 991 RS .

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

Gnil:

RC:

You really think GT3 RS 4.0 prices will ever settle? I doubt it. This car is really special.

 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

 

Yes I think they will drop again . Not to the lowest there were , but once all this craziness about prices will start coming back to reason , they will correct . As I said, the asking prices do not find customers at curent prices .

I doubt you will ever see a GT3 RS 4.0 in a good shape for under 300k EUR again. The current crazy prices are...crazy but mainly for the older GT3 models and the current GT3/RS. The RS 4.0 is a very special car, so is the GT2 RS for example but the RS 4.0 is even more special in my opinion. It was the last GT3 with the "Mezger" engine and maybe the last GT3 with manual. Also, the only Mezger street version with 4.0 l engine as far as I'm aware. Too many special things about this car, it will not drop in value too much, unless people really find better occasions to "invest" their money. Not looking that way right now I'm afraid. Maybe in 10 or 15 years?! 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/

2 991 RS sold...price between 205 et 260 000 livres...

997 GT3 RS 3.6 - 964 RS - 991 GT3 RS

RC:

Well, a German PZ sells a used GT4 for 120k, so...  

A bargain for such an insane car! 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | White | Full Bucket Seats | Sport Chrono
2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | Sport Chrono | SPASM

pmarkow:

 

whoopsy, you are most likely spot-on with the TdF when in about RACE mode. the softer settings on the TdF (and on the Speciale) beat the GT3RS normal setting in terms of compliance. also the ferrari race seats can be reclined just as normal seats (manually). certainly the TdF is rather noisy but with the 12 cyl engine not as race care brutal as is the GT3RS (above 5K revs).

thanks for the hint with the velcro on the bucket seats, today i shall research into various seat questions. 

the GT3RS is a great car, i'd really like to keep it. :::)))

p

 

Yes, Ferrari's Magnetorheological suspension really works. My old Speciale certainly rides better than the GT3RS that's for sure. My wife also had no complaints about the race seats' comfort, her only complaint about them was that they sits a bit lower than normal seats, and with the carpet-less bare aluminum floors, she cannot get comfortable sitting in the car with heels on, she had to resort to taking off her shoes inside the car. But she can tolerate the fixed back buckets in the RS as those can be raised and create enough of an angle for her legs to find a comfortable position with the heels.

(Little things us guys won't noticed)

The Speciale is a noisy car even when driven in a civilized way, it does gets annoying after a while. I mean, it sounds great and exciting for the initial 30-60mins, but after that I needed a break. I have to imagine the TdF will be the same. No such problem in the RS, it is a car I do not want to get out of, my seat time in it is limited only by the gas tank size and my bladder size.

In the current environment it is not surprising that very little transactions will actually take place.

Check your portfolios, most assets are down so people will not necessarily be willing to lift the offers on the cars advertised. So yes market will soften, but only if sellers are in need to sell. Not sure if this can be described as a bubble bursting. Many assets will go down (991 RS) , rare ones won't (RS4.0). And btw I am not biased as I am lucky enough to own both. Have you tried buying property in Switzerland (say Geneva) just after the GFC? Prices kept going up. When interest rates are negative and banks start charging you, you need to store your wealth somewhere and in my view unique limited editions cars are a nice place to be.

RS 4.0 are mostly held by people who are not likely to be forced seller. And therefore, prices as displayed by sellers can remain high despite a softening in demand. If sellers reduce their price as they need to sell the car, then this should be seen as an opportunity imho.

This being said, a poor environment like this one is a good opportunity to get an allocation as there will be less buyers around. This is how I got my RS4.0 back in 2011.

RC:

I doubt you will ever see a GT3 RS 4.0 in a good shape for under 300k EUR again. The current crazy prices are...crazy but mainly for the older GT3 models and the current GT3/RS. The RS 4.0 is a very special car, so is the GT2 RS for example but the RS 4.0 is even more special in my opinion. It was the last GT3 with the "Mezger" engine and maybe the last GT3 with manual. Also, the only Mezger street version with 4.0 l engine as far as I'm aware. Too many special things about this car, it will not drop in value too much, unless people really find better occasions to "invest" their money. Not looking that way right now I'm afraid. Maybe in 10 or 15 years?! 

The guy I talked to yesterday is trying to sell his 993 GT3 RS 4.0  since last June . Asking price 329k . The car is spotless and is even exposed at my local OPC since last summer . The car is also listed on the Porsche used cars + auto scout  . His asking price is lower then most other 4.0  .   And he did not get once single serious offer in all these nearly 9 month !!!!!  What does it tell you ?  There are no, or hardly no buyers at these prices . It is well the put a big sticker price , but you need the buyers and they are way too many 4.0 for sale compared to the people willing to put these asking prices .   If owners want to sell, they will have to drop the prices ... and they will .  

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

LP997:

http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/

2 991 RS sold...price between 205 et 260 000 livres...

Prices in UK make no sense on this site . 964 RS are a bargain and way cheaper then any other place I have seen, but 991 GT3 RS are priced like they are made of diamonds . Looking at the rest of the prices it looks more like they are cars for poseurs customers ( they want the latest , not the most special )

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

pmpsch:

In the current environment it is not surprising that very little transactions will actually take place.

Check your portfolios, most assets are down so people will not necessarily be willing to lift the offers on the cars advertised. So yes market will soften, but only if sellers are in need to sell. Not sure if this can be described as a bubble bursting. Many assets will go down (991 RS) , rare ones won't (RS4.0). And btw I am not biased as I am lucky enough to own both. Have you tried buying property in Switzerland (say Geneva) just after the GFC? Prices kept going up. When interest rates are negative and banks start charging you, you need to store your wealth somewhere and in my view unique limited editions cars are a nice place to be.

RS 4.0 are mostly held by people who are not likely to be forced seller. And therefore, prices as displayed by sellers can remain high despite a softening in demand. If sellers reduce their price as they need to sell the car, then this should be seen as an opportunity imho.

This being said, a poor environment like this one is a good opportunity to get an allocation as there will be less buyers around. This is how I got my RS4.0 back in 2011.

 

What you say makes sense, but I still believe current prices are inflated by speculation and hype . They will come down once the market realizes they do not sell ..... or at latest when interests rates will raise again ( and they eventually will )

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

Any RS is a good value if you keep the car for 10 years - historically proven. 991 will be no exception when turbo & hybrid combination will be "normal" a old fashioned screaming 3.8 or 4.0 will easily sell for today's LP

BjoernB:

 a old fashioned screaming 3.8 or 4.0 will easily sell for today's LP

agreed . But not at + 40 % of LP 

 964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 

I am willing to do a bet with you - in times of fast approaching turbo aera - the RS even if produced 2500 times is still a very rare car in 10 years. 

in rennlist there is a thread on a recent GT3 RS recall for gearbox exchange. does anyone here have information on this?

peter

pmarkow:

in rennlist there is a thread on a recent GT3 RS recall for gearbox exchange. does anyone here have information on this?

peter

I have a call today by my porsche center not concerned but one car is sold is going to change the gearbox... For information the gearbox have some different interns changing than the GT3...

997 GT3 RS 3.6 - 964 RS - 991 GT3 RS

LP997:

pmarkow:

in rennlist there is a thread on a recent GT3 RS recall for gearbox exchange. does anyone here have information on this?

peter

I have a call today by my porsche center not concerned but one car is sold is going to change the gearbox... For information the gearbox have some different interns changing than the GT3...

my car was built last week, i wonder whether it is due for PDK exchange already:::)))

pmarkow:

LP997:

pmarkow:

in rennlist there is a thread on a recent GT3 RS recall for gearbox exchange. does anyone here have information on this?

peter

I have a call today by my porsche center not concerned but one car is sold is going to change the gearbox... For information the gearbox have some different interns changing than the GT3...

my car was built last week, i wonder whether it is due for PDK exchange already:::)))

he said me its depending on VIN number but new car have no problem ;)

997 GT3 RS 3.6 - 964 RS - 991 GT3 RS

LP997:

pmarkow:

LP997:

pmarkow:

in rennlist there is a thread on a recent GT3 RS recall for gearbox exchange. does anyone here have information on this?

peter

I have a call today by my porsche center not concerned but one car is sold is going to change the gearbox... For information the gearbox have some different interns changing than the GT3...

my car was built last week, i wonder whether it is due for PDK exchange already:::)))

he said me its depending on VIN number but new car have no problem ;)

thanks. no problem until the next recall of GT cars.....

pmarkow:

d997h:

I thought of that too, but I assume it is still more of  an issue of F vs. P...

F vs P....the honest answer is: had the issue with my wife not popped up then it would have been the GT3 RS all the way. i could have lived with that given that my deposit and pre-contract for the 488 GTO (or speciale or whatever name) is in, with guaranteed second slot in my dealership.

peter

In the other thread you wrote that the 488 leaves you cold. Why do you think it will be different in case of the Speciale-successor? 

We're at the point where you can be the fastest or just sound like you're the fastest.



The secret of life is to admire without desiring.

Rossi:

pmarkow:

d997h:

I thought of that too, but I assume it is still more of  an issue of F vs. P...

F vs P....the honest answer is: had the issue with my wife not popped up then it would have been the GT3 RS all the way. i could have lived with that given that my deposit and pre-contract for the 488 GTO (or speciale or whatever name) is in, with guaranteed second slot in my dealership.

peter

In the other thread you wrote that the 488 leaves you cold. Why do you think it will be different in case of the Speciale-successor? 

yes i think it will be very different with the speciale successor. what i hear from maranello is very promising. think F40 and 288 GTO :::)))

pmarkow:

yes i think it will be very different with the speciale successor. what i hear from maranello is very promising. think F40 and 288 GTO :::)))