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Sep 9, 2009 8:07:21 AM
- Boxster Coupe GTS
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Reply to:
Ron (Houston)
Sep 9, 2009 8:51:27 AM
- reginos
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Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
Lots of tech but the design is not successful. It has neither grace nor dynamism. It is a mish-mash of already seen and saturated mid-engined design elements. Moreover, it doesn't look good from any angle. Great pity after investing into so much technology.
Perhaps, the Mclaren designers never had a clue of how the 458 Italia would develop into its striking shape.
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Sep 9, 2009 8:54:12 AM
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4trac
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Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
Wow... I think this car will need to be seen in person, and it will have an understated elegance that will be less overt than the Italian comparos. IMO this car is not about pure design flamboyance, it is likely about the driving and needs customers who appreciate this.
Big statement in McLaren making not only a new engine, but a custom sequential gearbox as well... but given this I would prefer to let somebody else be the first buyers to help settle in reliability etc. Final comment: I also like what appears to be the smaller dimensions as this can help enormously on narrow roads (eg. the 911 advantage) but perhaps need to see the final specs as this is just based on the photo comparisons with the original F1 that was quite small.
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Sep 9, 2009 8:59:27 AM
- Boxster Coupe GTS
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Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar launch...
What a breath of fresh air! I was getting so fed up with Porsche, Ferrari, Lambo being so conservative with the HP output of their vehicles. Only 10-20hp more with each model. This should make them step up their game.
IMO I would take this over the 458 Italia in a heartbeat. A) It's a McLaren! Everybody has a Ferrari these days. B) Gullwing doors! 
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar launch...
To my eyes the McLaren looks graceless and dare I say little clumpsy next to the Ferrari.
Also I don't want to doubt the technology into the MP4-12C(which on paper looks impressive) but where does this engine come from? McLaren (basically a racing team) have never produced a racing engine themselves so what's the point of experimenting with an unknown engine for their road car?
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It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts
Sep 9, 2009 9:51:01 AM
- Boxster Coupe GTS
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Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar launch...
"Jay Walking at Woking"
(Motor Trend, 8 September 2009)
Leno Gets Up-Close and Personal with New McLaren Supercar...
The canteen at the McLaren Technology Centre near Woking is buzzing. Seated on a table overlooking a lake that also acts as an eco-friendly heat sink for the HQ of the famous F1 team and road-car maker is Jay Leno.
America's most famous TV host and collector of cars from the first decade of the last century to the first decade of this century -- including a McLaren F1 -- is enjoying a plate of pizza.
A-list celebrities visiting McLaren are normally entertained in a private dining room, but time is tight and so the plan for a formal lunch has been hastily adapted to a snack with the workforce -- something Jay is much happier doing.
No wonder Leno has an appetite. All morning, he has been given a premiere of McLaren Automotive's new supercar, the P11 (or as it will be known in production, the MP4-12C). For two hours he has been salivating...
Just getting Leno to Woking has been an achievement. Hosting America's most popular nightly TV show 46 weeks a year does not leave many windows for long overseas trips. So, in the summer, between stopping his 17-year run on "The Tonight Show" and starting "The Jay Leno Show," Jay had a rare chance to leave L.A. behind and jet to England for a week of petrolhead indulgence.
"I love England and I love English cars, so having a week like this lined up was hardly a hardship," smirks Leno.
He has not been to Woking since he took delivery of his beloved F1 in the late 1990s. At that time McLaren's home was spread around Woking's town center. Now it has a cutting-edge hub nearby in the Surrey countryside. And seeing the lake-shrouded yin/yang-shaped HQ appear through the windscreen impresses the comedian.
"To see something that is so in tune with its environment in terms of the way that lake out front works as a heat sink, all the technology that has gone into designing the factory makes you know that whatever you're gonna see inside should be equally fascinating," he says.
McLaren Automotive managing director Antony Sheriff is Jay's host. Before entering the secret inner sanctum where the P11 has been created, Sheriff takes Leno on a lap of the Grand Prix team base and then to see the last batch of Stirling Moss SLR's being finished. Leno has the first SLR in America.
Finally, Sheriff leads us through a door that says NO UNAUTHORISED ACCESS. Leno turns to me and beams, "I like going through doors like this."
The first stop is a studio where Sheriff shows of the key elements of the new car, the one-piece carbon-fiber tub. Off this hollow, lightweight structure, which sits in the center of the car, is bolted the rest of the car's components. That means repairs can be made easily. Together, two men lift the tub with ease.
If the tub is the backbone of the car, its heart will be a V-8 motor made by McLaren. The engine is not on show, but the fact that the MP4-12C will have a McLaren-made engine is important to Leno.
"That's when you're really serious about producing a car with your name on it. The motor really is the heart of it. The idea that you sit down and design what you think the motor should be and how you want it to be. It gives it personality and its own unique sound. That's what it's all about. I mean they build racing cars, so they should build their own motor. If they weren't using their own motor, I think it would be a whole different ball game; and that's the heart and soul of it. "
Decisions about the all-important launch color for the car are in full swing as Leno makes his visit. Sheriff asks for his opinion. For reference, Jay's F1 is black.
"I like the orange," Leno points out from a palette of colors. It's a buzz to find out weeks later that the same color ends up as the launch color. It is then through to a private screening room, where the car's designer, Frank Stephenson (best known for the Mini) greets Jay. Sheriff and Stephenson sit their guest down before a screen almost big enough to show the car life-size. The moment of truth, the first sight of the P11, comes in the shape of an interactive video.
Jay likes the flowing lines of the car and the fact it looks like a McLaren. "The thing I like about McLaren is they design the mechanicals first, then shape the body over it. This looks like pure design. It looks like they designed the mechanicals of the car and then figured out how to style the body over it."
Last, we go down to a viewing room to see the real thing...well almost. Months before the MP4-12C is shown to the world, the P11 prototype is close to but not quite the final product. Nevertheless, Jay's reaction is telling.
"Very impressive. It's terrific," he says, hand on chin, as if appraising a piece of art.
McLaren-MP4-12C_Jay-Leno_Motor-Trend_Link
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
reginos:
Lots of tech but the design is not successful. It has neither grace nor dynamism. It is a mish-mash of already seen and saturated mid-engined design elements. Moreover, it doesn't look good from any angle. Great pity after investing into so much technology.
Perhaps, the Mclaren designers never had a clue of how the 458 Italia would develop into its striking shape.
I totally disagree with you regarding MP4-12C design. That's life I guess... IMHO MP4 looks totally awsome and will become a true icon in coming years. This is the car that will look good in any color. Technically, it is a class above 458 Italia IMHO.
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
KresoF1:
reginos:
Lots of tech but the design is not successful. It has neither grace nor dynamism. It is a mish-mash of already seen and saturated mid-engined design elements. Moreover, it doesn't look good from any angle. Great pity after investing into so much technology.
Perhaps, the Mclaren designers never had a clue of how the 458 Italia would develop into its striking shape.
I totally disagree with you regarding MP4-12C design. That's life I guess... IMHO MP4 looks totally awsome and will become a true icon in coming years. This is the car that will look good in any color. Technically, it is a class above 458 Italia IMHO.
The technology looks good on the specs and most probably it will be good, although the engine is an unknown yet.
My point is they should have come up with a more memorable design with more character. This one looks like it could be any mid-engined car from any small manufacturer like Lotus and Noble or even an attempt to resurrect MG. Look at the pictures and don't tell me that the 458 Italia doesn't have more personality and is not more pleasing to the eye?
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It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
Actually I like 458 Italia. Just, to my eyes MP4-12C looks better. More incognito and with more harmony... Personality? Ferrari is all about its heritage and McLaren can only use its F1 model heritage. Totally honestly-I like MP4-12C more then 458 Italia.
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
WAY:
Is McLaren road car division 40% owned by Mercedes like the F1 team? If so, then you can bet your life that Mercedes has something to do with the engine development (which isn't McLaren's forte).
McLaren Automotive which makes the MP4-12C is a subsidiary (like the F1 Racing Team) of McLaren Group which has the following shareholding:
Daimler 40%, Bahrain Mumtalakat Holding Company 30%, Ron Dennis 15% and Mansour Ojjeh 15%.
I've read that the engine is a British effort, unrelated to Mercedes. Also for the DCT transmission they chose Oerlikon-Graziano (a swiss-italian company) instead of the Mercedes DCT of the SLS.
McLaren and Mercedes couldn't see level in terms of road cars (see the confused SLR) so McLaren developed their car and Mercedes developed the SLS, a totally different concept.
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It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
Thanks Regino. Mansour still has shares in McLaren? How come we don't see Tag clocks in this car? 
Ok, if it's unrelated to Mercedes, then it was probably outsourced to another high performance car engine builder like Cosworth. McLaren doesn't have the know how to do it themselves. Cosworth would makes sense.
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
some new pics here
http://www.worldcarfans.com/109090921591/2011-mclaren-mp4-12c-officially-revealed--35-photos
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Dedi La vita è troppo corta per non guidare italiano.....
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
Looks too generic, not impressed at all. Engine is actually going to have less than 600, it's going to be close to 570 bhp just like the 458. Weight is going to be 458 neighbourhood also giving similar performance. What dissapoints is the specific output for a 3.8 twin turbo; Ferrari achieve these numbers with a 4.5 NA motor! Overall, I would chose the Ferrari over the McLaren any day as they will have similar performance but the F is much more emotional and is also a stunner.
Also gross lies from McLaren! Ferrari is by far the most succesful racing outfit!!! 
But I guess Dennis is used to liying! 
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FERRARI RULES!!!
Sep 9, 2009 3:51:52 PM
- Atzporsche
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Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
When is Porsche doing a drivers car based on racing tech in which they don't really participate?
I like this MP4 as it is a very understated car. It wasn't meant to stand out, its just a drivers car designed by racing engineers. I applaud everytime such a car comes to the market even though there are some things i do not like such as the rims.
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indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine.. I happen to like both :)
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Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
REALZEUS:
Looks too generic, not impressed at all. Engine is actually going to have less than 600, it's going to be close to 570 bhp just like the 458. Weight is going to be 458 neighbourhood also giving similar performance.
Source ?
It would not be a smart move to claim 600hp now and then in 2011 release it with only 570hp.
I would actually expect slightly over 600hp.
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
Well, officially they claim "around 600" which would allow for deviations. Rumours say less than 600 though. Also we will have to see the actual performance figures in independent tests. I reckon close to the 458 but 2 years later than the Ferrari! By that time the 458 Scuderia will be getting ready to be released and the goal posts will have moved once again...
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FERRARI RULES!!!
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
REALZEUS:
Well, officially they claim "around 600" which would allow for deviations. Rumours say less than 600 though. Also we will have to see the actual performance figures in independent tests. I reckon close to the 458 but 2 years later than the Ferrari! By that time the 458 Scuderia will be getting ready to be released and the goal posts will have moved once again...
I think mp4-12c will be available next year and not in 2011 (the same for not v.i.p. 458 customers)
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Dedi La vita è troppo corta per non guidare italiano.....
Re: McLaren MP4-12C supercar: official press release...
REALZEUS:
Well, officially they claim "around 600" which would allow for deviations. Rumours say less than 600 though. Also we will have to see the actual performance figures in independent tests. I reckon close to the 458 but 2 years later than the Ferrari! By that time the 458 Scuderia will be getting ready to be released and the goal posts will have moved once again...
Rumors from where?
Did you know that 458 Italia power of 570hp is with 5hp of ram effect included? No? I guess so. I have pretty extensive press file about 458 Italia and it is very clearly stated there that 570hp is "with 5hp of ram effect included".
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