Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: PASM - Useless? - Page1

Jan 19, 2006 5:58:02 AM

NDRFUN: Newbie; Loc: SF- BAY AREA; Posts: 18, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 28, 2005

PASM - Useless?

Like many of you I really enjoy the sport button that accompanies the Sport Chrono package...that is I enjoy the throttle elements. I find the suspension set-up in sport mode totally unusable. Even on smooth roads (well at least Northern California smooth which on a scale basis is like 60 grit sandpaper) I find it bone jarring and unsettling. So each time I hit the Sport button I immediately deactivate the suspension button. I know, I know, not too much of a pain. But still....I cannot imagine anyone enjoying this set-up.

Rant off....here are my questions:

1. Does anyone know how the PASM works? Is it a magnetic set-up like Cadillac has on the XLR where the shock dampening properties are changed instantaneously with an applied electrical charge? The change is so immediate it is hard to imagine a valve actuator moving.
2. Does anyone know if the properties of the PASM dampening can be controlled or mitigated through a software modification....like a re-flash by the dealer? It would be wonderful if there was a range of properties that could be set by the dealer. I imagine this is the case at some level...just wondering if anyone knows or cares to speculate.

Thanks for your thoughts.

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Jan 19, 2006 7:50:30 AM

maoun: Co-Pilot; Loc: Seattle, WA, USA; Posts: 223, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 19, 2005; Reply to: NDRFUN

Re: PASM - Useless?

1) yes, i believe it is
2) i'm sure you could, but i have yet to hear or an available re-flash for consumers

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Jan 19, 2006 8:22:55 AM

mateoche: Co-Pilot; Loc: Santa Monica, CA; Posts: 243, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 19, 2004; Reply to: NDRFUN

Re: PASM - Useless?

you would think that on forthcoming models they will offer three settings (doesn't the ferrarri offer this?) like the 959 did i believe. one for normal, one for sporty on imperfect pavement and one for track.

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Jan 19, 2006 11:09:46 AM

Matt C: Veteran; Loc: Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 1092, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 28, 2003; Reply to: mateoche

Re: PASM - Useless?

PASM works by using a "bypass-valve" that is opened or closed. So it is not really an electrical change.

On this page of the Porsche website, you'll find a explanation and an animation on how it works:

CLICK ME
(on this page, just click on PASM link).

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Jan 19, 2006 1:16:33 PM

SonOfStig: Pilot; Loc: United Kingdom; Posts: 387, Gallery; Registered on: May 28, 2005; Reply to: Matt C

Re: PASM - Useless?

I must be weird, but... I like the sport setting - feel connected to the road and car. Clearly on cobblestones it might get a bit

but on motorways (freeways in the US?) it seems fine to me.

Sorry to say this but I find the sport throttle too aggressive for cruising around - use it as a boost when I am overtaking a lot, but otherwise leave it off. I have the sports suspension setting on more often than the sport throttle setting - going round corners with it on is gooooood.

OK, I know, I AM weird!

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Jan 19, 2006 2:23:15 PM

AeroSmith: Co-Pilot; Loc: Saint Petersburg, FL; Posts: 202, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 3, 2005; Reply to: SonOfStig

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
SonOfStig said:
I must be weird, but... I like the sport setting - feel connected to the road and car. Clearly on cobblestones it might get a bit but on motorways (freeways in the US?) it seems fine to me.

Sorry to say this but I find the sport throttle too aggressive for cruising around - use it as a boost when I am overtaking a lot, but otherwise leave it off. I have the sports suspension setting on more often than the sport throttle setting - going round corners with it on is gooooood.

I agree. Though sport mode isn't an issue for me as I didn't order the Sport Chrono. But I love PASM. Normal mode is great for around town and I like being able to dramatically firm things up at the push of a button. I've always prefered stiff suspensions in my cars and PASM can give you a firmer ride than the -20.

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Jan 19, 2006 3:19:14 PM

MMD: Rennteam VIP; Loc: usa; Posts: 9652, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 16, 2004; Reply to: AeroSmith

Re: PASM - Useless?

It's a track thing. You're not supposed to be comfortable on a track; you're supposed to be fast.

You buy a PASM-equipped car for the track. That's the idea anyway.

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Jan 19, 2006 3:31:20 PM

Le Chef: Veteran; Loc: Chicago , United States; Posts: 1059, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 3, 2003; Reply to: MMD

Re: PASM - Useless?

On the road the PASM sport setting seems to have too high a frequency spring rate. You get the feeling that the nose of the car is bobbing frantically up and down for little reason. On the track however it's perfect.

On the Sport Chrono setting I use sport for out of town and twisty roads, but in town the throttle setting on sport is too sensitive to make smooth progress.

I would like to see Porsche offer a "Manettino" like Ferrari, but we'll see if they can bring themselves to copy someone else's good idea...

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Jan 19, 2006 3:37:06 PM

JJBlade: Co-Pilot; Loc: UK; Posts: 190, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 11, 2005; Reply to: MMD

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
MMD said:
It's a track thing. You're not supposed to be comfortable on a track; you're supposed to be fast.

You buy a PASM-equipped car for the track. That's the idea anyway.

You buy a -20mm car for track not PASM, if it is available.

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Jan 19, 2006 4:24:27 PM

Avantgarde: Senior; Loc: City State; Posts: 708, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 6, 2005; Reply to: JJBlade

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
JJBlade said:
Quote:
MMD said:
It's a track thing. You're not supposed to be comfortable on a track; you're supposed to be fast.

You buy a PASM-equipped car for the track. That's the idea anyway.

You buy a -20mm car for track not PASM, if it is available.

PASM practically provide the flexibility of both worlds, I think that's what MMD implies.

Cheers

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Jan 19, 2006 4:38:16 PM

Porsche-Jeck: Rennteam Master; Loc: Rheinland , Germany; Posts: 4856, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 27, 2005; Reply to: MMD

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
MMD said:
You buy a PASM-equipped car for the track. That's the idea anyway.

I am wondering whether for the Cab owners PASM in normal mode may provide another advantage (compared to the stock suspension) : the softer setting may cause less stress for body/chassis which may pay off for those who hold the car for a long time (maybe the same reason, why you can't get the -20mm sport-suspension for the 997 cab)

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Jan 19, 2006 5:00:10 PM

Texas911: Senior; Loc: Houston, Texas - USA; Posts: 766, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2003; Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: PASM - Useless?

I tracked my PASM 997 and I love it. To me the non sport setting is just right for tooling around town but on sport its to stiff for just driving around but perfect for the track. I'm sure the 20mm suspension is better at the track but I don't want to drive that around the city.

It really is the best of both worlds.

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Jan 19, 2006 5:42:28 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
Porsche-Jeck said:

I am wondering whether for the Cab owners PASM in normal mode may provide another advantage (compared to the stock suspension) : the softer setting may cause less stress for body/chassis which may pay off for those who hold the car for a long time (maybe the same reason, why you can't get the -20mm sport-suspension for the 997 cab)

You might be right. I chose a 997S Cab (PASM) over a 997S X51 (-20mm) which were pretty much the same price at the time, and I haven't regretted the decision once. This way it's 4 cars in 1:

Top up, normal mode ... general touring about
Top up, sports mode ... when the roads get twisty and the sun's not out
Top down, normal mode ... ultimate cruising
Top down, sports mode ... ultimate fun!!!

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Jan 19, 2006 6:55:17 PM

Porsche-Jeck: Rennteam Master; Loc: Rheinland , Germany; Posts: 4856, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 27, 2005; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
Alex (UK) said:
Quote:
Porsche-Jeck said:

I am wondering whether for the Cab owners PASM in normal mode may provide another advantage (compared to the stock suspension) : the softer setting may cause less stress for body/chassis which may pay off for those who hold the car for a long time (maybe the same reason, why you can't get the -20mm sport-suspension for the 997 cab)

You might be right. I chose a 997S Cab (PASM) over a 997S X51 (-20mm) which were pretty much the same price at the time, and I haven't regretted the decision once. This way it's 4 cars in 1:

Top up, normal mode ... general touring about
Top up, sports mode ... when the roads get twisty and the sun's not out
Top down, normal mode ... ultimate cruising
Top down, sports mode ... ultimate fun!!!

Alex, thanx for sharing your experiences and the concise description of the different "operating modes" of your car

Though being a 987 S waiter myself, I guess I will enjoy a similar mutability of the car. I'm really into this Jekyll & Hyde character of the car and I guess PASM provides and advantage in exploiting this effect (I hope sport chrono and the short-shifter will even broaden the range from cosy cruising up to spirited driving)

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Jan 19, 2006 9:25:30 PM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: MMD

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
MMD said:
It's a track thing. You're not supposed to be comfortable on a track; you're supposed to be fast.

You buy a PASM-equipped car for the track. That's the idea anyway.

If that were true, PASM would come with an LSD. Since it comes with the -20mm, I infer that the -20mm is the "Track" suspension...

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Jan 19, 2006 9:37:45 PM

John H: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cheshire, UK , United Kingdom; Posts: 7682, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 20, 2005; Reply to: Grant

Re: PASM - Useless?

PASM in sport mode gives -10mm not -20mm, that is a different set-up altogether.

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Jan 19, 2006 10:03:29 PM

throt: Rennteam VIP; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 6078, Gallery; Registered on: May 9, 2005; Reply to: John H

Re: PASM - Useless?

John H what Grant is saying is that the LSD comes with the -20mm.

Also the 997S rides -10mm lower than the base 997 period , whether it be in sport mode or not..

throt..

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Jan 19, 2006 10:11:02 PM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: throt

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
throt said:
John H what Grant is saying is that the LSD comes with the -20mm.

Also the 997S rides -10mm lower than the base 997 period , whether it be in sport mode or not..

throt..

Exactly!

Sorry if I wasn't clear...

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Jan 19, 2006 11:01:29 PM

Tired: Co-Pilot; Loc: Michigan, USA; Posts: 160, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 2, 2005; Reply to: Grant

Re: PASM - Useless?

If you have PASM, the ride height doesn't change regardless of which mode you are in, does it?

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Jan 20, 2006 6:28:55 AM

Matt C: Veteran; Loc: Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 1092, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 28, 2003; Reply to: Tired

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
flap said:
If you have PASM, the ride height doesn't change regardless of which mode you are in, does it?

Correct, it is just -10mm compared to the standard, non-pasm setup (and +10mm compared to the sport-suspension).

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Jan 20, 2006 8:15:55 AM

Gnil: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: VD, Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 14174, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 11, 2005; Reply to: Matt C

Re: PASM - Useless?

Here are all the details: -20mm is -10mm to the PASM which is -10mm to normal making normal + 20mm to the -20mm, but only +10mm to the PASM which is always + 10mm to the -20mm and -10mm to the non PASM

oh and I forgot...-20mm is -10mm to PASM on normal mode and is -10mm to PASM on sports mode, Standard being +10mm to PASM on sport and normal mode....

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Jan 20, 2006 11:11:38 AM

Matt C: Veteran; Loc: Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 1092, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 28, 2003; Reply to: Gnil

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
Gnil said:
Here are all the details: -20mm is -10mm to the PASM which is -10mm to normal making normal + 20mm to the -20mm, but only +10mm to the PASM which is always + 10mm to the -20mm and -10mm to the non PASM oh and I forgot...-20mm is -10mm to PASM on normal mode and is -10mm to PASM on sports mode, Standard being +10mm to PASM on sport and normal mode....

Please forgive my compatriot. It seems that he was able to sneak out. We usually don't let our french speaking Swiss out into the wild without a healthy dose of tranquilizer, a jacket with no sleeves and a GPS-tracking device.

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Jan 20, 2006 11:19:49 AM

bluelines: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Argovia , Switzerland; Posts: 11655, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 29, 2005; Reply to: Matt C

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
Matt C said:
Quote:
Gnil said:
Here are all the details: -20mm is -10mm to the PASM which is -10mm to normal making normal + 20mm to the -20mm, but only +10mm to the PASM which is always + 10mm to the -20mm and -10mm to the non PASM oh and I forgot...-20mm is -10mm to PASM on normal mode and is -10mm to PASM on sports mode, Standard being +10mm to PASM on sport and normal mode....

Please forgive my compatriot. It seems that he was able to sneak out. We usually don't let our french speaking Swiss out into the wild without a healthy dose of tranquilizer, a jacket with no sleeves and a GPS-tracking device.

hahaha

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Jan 20, 2006 11:26:02 AM

John H: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cheshire, UK , United Kingdom; Posts: 7682, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 20, 2005; Reply to: throt

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
throt said:
John H what Grant is saying is that the LSD comes with the -20mm.

Also the 997S rides -10mm lower than the base 997 period , whether it be in sport mode or not..

throt..

Sorry, punctuation has never been my strong point.

Someone tell the nurse I'm out of bed.

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Jan 20, 2006 12:35:28 PM

John H: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cheshire, UK , United Kingdom; Posts: 7682, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 20, 2005; Reply to: Gnil

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
Gnil said:
Here are all the details: -20mm is -10mm to the PASM which is -10mm to normal making normal + 20mm to the -20mm, but only +10mm to the PASM which is always + 10mm to the -20mm and -10mm to the non PASM oh and I forgot...-20mm is -10mm to PASM on normal mode and is -10mm to PASM on sports mode, Standard being +10mm to PASM on sport and normal mode....

That's almost as well put as I could have done it in French!!

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Jan 20, 2006 1:52:52 PM

Gnil: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: VD, Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 14174, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 11, 2005; Reply to: bluelines

Re: PASM - Useless?

Quote:
bluelines said:
Quote:
Matt C said:
Quote:
Gnil said:
Here are all the details: -20mm is -10mm to the PASM which is -10mm to normal making normal + 20mm to the -20mm, but only +10mm to the PASM which is always + 10mm to the -20mm and -10mm to the non PASM oh and I forgot...-20mm is -10mm to PASM on normal mode and is -10mm to PASM on sports mode, Standard being +10mm to PASM on sport and normal mode....

Please forgive my compatriot. It seems that he was able to sneak out. We usually don't let our french speaking Swiss out into the wild without a healthy dose of tranquilizer, a jacket with no sleeves and a GPS-tracking device.

hahaha

Who said I went mad?

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