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Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
Quote:
Mike S said:Quote:
fritz said:Quote:
Mike S said:
the veyron also isn't sensible, because bugatti/VW are making a loss on it, but they're just making just to show that they can?
So far they've only showed us that they can't.
can't in what aspects?
To understand my comment, I suggest you check the net for details on when Bugatti initially intended to start production of the Veyron. They are "behind schedule "....
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
The bugatti veyron is my vision of a near perfect car. It has way too much horsepower, has a luxurious interior that is over the top (suede headliner) leather all over the place... a paint job that would make any other car look like a clown owns it... but on THAT particular car... looks sensible (the black and blue). It's a vision of perfection. The only problem is that it has taken forever to make and release- and as a result, certain portions of the car which were innovative, aren't too innovative anymore. Example- the lights (they look like audi A4 and A6 lights taken to the next level... but who cares about them now?). The 7 speed tranny... great, but bmw beat them to the punch with the M5 and M6. Worth over a million... yeah, probably. But they need to release that car quickly... everyone is stepping up on quality and luxury... and they aren't too far behind what Bugatti is trying to release.
Example- the SLR. Give the SLR 350ish more hp and bump up the interior quality, Mercedes would have a million dollar car on their hands.
Example- the SLR. Give the SLR 350ish more hp and bump up the interior quality, Mercedes would have a million dollar car on their hands.
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
Mike,
you've got some nice cars yourself. I think that counts more...
I saw one of the Bugattis on a Concours d'Elegance in Duesseldorf, held by AutoBecker which went bankrupt a couple of years ago. Germans will know that dealership and especially its owner!
Killer,
MB won't be able to pump out 300 additional hp out of the V8 engine! If you take a look what kind of technology Brabus needs to apply to add a couple of hp!
The 7-speed DSG is still a very unique and highly-technological approach, even more than BMW's 7-speed box! I'd say the overall impression about this car is that it is mainly extremely over the top, in about every aspect. It's not its character (so far) or some unique technological approach (aka on the Elise with its glued aluminium frame - a car that fits perfectly into Lotus' philosophy) but sheer power that makes this car.
let's see and find out, I am very curious how this car compares to the rest of the supercar bunch - if you want to count it to this group. We've seen MB put 500hp engines into the S-class and thought this'd be about it. It's not!
you've got some nice cars yourself. I think that counts more...
I saw one of the Bugattis on a Concours d'Elegance in Duesseldorf, held by AutoBecker which went bankrupt a couple of years ago. Germans will know that dealership and especially its owner!
Killer,
MB won't be able to pump out 300 additional hp out of the V8 engine! If you take a look what kind of technology Brabus needs to apply to add a couple of hp!
The 7-speed DSG is still a very unique and highly-technological approach, even more than BMW's 7-speed box! I'd say the overall impression about this car is that it is mainly extremely over the top, in about every aspect. It's not its character (so far) or some unique technological approach (aka on the Elise with its glued aluminium frame - a car that fits perfectly into Lotus' philosophy) but sheer power that makes this car.
let's see and find out, I am very curious how this car compares to the rest of the supercar bunch - if you want to count it to this group. We've seen MB put 500hp engines into the S-class and thought this'd be about it. It's not!
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
The only thing that I can think that even comes close to what Bugatti is trying to release in the Veyron would be the Maybach exelro (sp...ha). There simply isn't anything like the veyron- Ultra Luxury... Ultra Power... Ultra Style. It's number one in everything. It's a "cost is not object" type of vehicle. They used the top of the line of everything to build it. Although it doesn't quite work perfectly, it's a statement of what a car is. A Bugatti is not a perfect car.. it's a benchmark type of vehicle. A lambo doesn't look as sexy as a bugatti- A bentley or rolls royce doesn't look w/ a two tone body color doesn't look as classy as a bugatti... it's just a fact. The old ones are basically sex on wheels.
the only vehicle that has come around in recent years that could even evoke such a type of car... (meaning, making a car just because you have the talent and power to do so) would be a BMW Z8. BMW could have made a car that would be like an SL (a sexy car with tour de force technology for TODAY)... opposed to what the Z8 is (a car that has the modern appointments of technology....but not overkill.. there is passion in a Z8). I would dare Lambo to make anything that looks as SEXY as a Z8. Mercedes can make car that is as sexy as a Z8 but they haven't... Their SL series is beautiful... but a different type of beautiful. Ferrari makes Ferrari's- they don't try to be or do anything else.. so they are a different type of car builder.
Beyond the power of the Veyron.. it's what it is that makes the car. It's a Bugatti. Have you seen the cars that they have made in their prototype's?! They have a car there from 92' and I would rather buy THAT car than a 06' Bentley. What I believe we will see in the future is something GREAT from Jaguar. Jag has made great cars in its past... and in the early 90's made a supercar that was ahead of its time. I expect one by 2010 to be sex on wheels as well.
I think we are all fortunate to live in the times in which we are. Look at the cars that builders are pumping out... they are GREAT. Even some of the suckiest Ford's are GREAT. Power and luxury in everything is taking on a new level that WASN'T available in the 80's- I'm excited to see what is next... when the Veyron debuts it will be more than just a powerful and luxurious car.. it will be a testament to the times that we are living in.
(sorry, that history and political science education just kicked in).
the only vehicle that has come around in recent years that could even evoke such a type of car... (meaning, making a car just because you have the talent and power to do so) would be a BMW Z8. BMW could have made a car that would be like an SL (a sexy car with tour de force technology for TODAY)... opposed to what the Z8 is (a car that has the modern appointments of technology....but not overkill.. there is passion in a Z8). I would dare Lambo to make anything that looks as SEXY as a Z8. Mercedes can make car that is as sexy as a Z8 but they haven't... Their SL series is beautiful... but a different type of beautiful. Ferrari makes Ferrari's- they don't try to be or do anything else.. so they are a different type of car builder.
Beyond the power of the Veyron.. it's what it is that makes the car. It's a Bugatti. Have you seen the cars that they have made in their prototype's?! They have a car there from 92' and I would rather buy THAT car than a 06' Bentley. What I believe we will see in the future is something GREAT from Jaguar. Jag has made great cars in its past... and in the early 90's made a supercar that was ahead of its time. I expect one by 2010 to be sex on wheels as well.
I think we are all fortunate to live in the times in which we are. Look at the cars that builders are pumping out... they are GREAT. Even some of the suckiest Ford's are GREAT. Power and luxury in everything is taking on a new level that WASN'T available in the 80's- I'm excited to see what is next... when the Veyron debuts it will be more than just a powerful and luxurious car.. it will be a testament to the times that we are living in.
(sorry, that history and political science education just kicked in).
Sex on wheels!
Killer,
nice comments but I beg to differ slightly!
The Veyron is definately a statement and I will be cautious with comments until we have seen the final product and some comments by experienced journalists. The driving impression on this car is what makes huge percentage of it, so I will save my lst comment for a while..
Money wsn't an issue on the McLaren either nd if you consider that this car had almost 400 hp less than the Bugatti and had similiar astonishing topspeed, handled magnificent and since it probably even does so in comparison to the new Bugatti I would say that this is definately an achievement. I have lots of respect for the Bugatti development but it isn't as avantgarde as it could have been.
Lamborghini wouldn't and couldn't make a car like that, simply because this wouldn't be Lamborghini. They always were different, almost odd in some aspects but had a supreme character that made you forgive some of the flaws in the past. They are not perfect either by now but people love them because of the character!
It is sad, and I have met enough people who share this opinion, that the top-of-the-range coupes or convertibles of BMW never mde it in the hall of fame - save the 507 maybe. Neitehr the 8-series, the new 6 or the Z8 were desired enough! Regarding Mercedes' technology tour de force, it was actually BMW who started it in the 80ies with their 7- and 8-series back then. After all I would love to see BMW do another Z8, maybe we should help them work on it?
nice comments but I beg to differ slightly!
The Veyron is definately a statement and I will be cautious with comments until we have seen the final product and some comments by experienced journalists. The driving impression on this car is what makes huge percentage of it, so I will save my lst comment for a while..
Money wsn't an issue on the McLaren either nd if you consider that this car had almost 400 hp less than the Bugatti and had similiar astonishing topspeed, handled magnificent and since it probably even does so in comparison to the new Bugatti I would say that this is definately an achievement. I have lots of respect for the Bugatti development but it isn't as avantgarde as it could have been.
Lamborghini wouldn't and couldn't make a car like that, simply because this wouldn't be Lamborghini. They always were different, almost odd in some aspects but had a supreme character that made you forgive some of the flaws in the past. They are not perfect either by now but people love them because of the character!
It is sad, and I have met enough people who share this opinion, that the top-of-the-range coupes or convertibles of BMW never mde it in the hall of fame - save the 507 maybe. Neitehr the 8-series, the new 6 or the Z8 were desired enough! Regarding Mercedes' technology tour de force, it was actually BMW who started it in the 80ies with their 7- and 8-series back then. After all I would love to see BMW do another Z8, maybe we should help them work on it?
Re: Sex on wheels!
Quote:
Ferdie said:Quote:
Mike S said:
answer this question, can the SLR or anything else for that matter accelerate from 0-300 in 13 seconds?
I wanto to see that data achieved by a third person! Anyways, impressive numbers!
it can apparently also go from 400-0 standstill in under 10 seconds!
once again these are all claimed figures, but hey just imagine they're true, would be one HELLOVA car!
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
Quote:
Mike S said:Quote:
Ferdie said:
Have seen two EB110s though!
heheh, you lucky (insert word)!i will never get to see a bugatti here...ever
Unless you buy one, I won't doubt you can afforf it...
BTW i dnt really know alot about classic Ferraris, but i've seen quite a few 288 GTO's already, here at my university i even saw a student drive one.
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
i think you're confusing it with a 308 or 328, there are very few 288 GTO's in the country, i doubt some university student is driving one. plus they are worth at least 4 times more than a 308... one of my friends has a 288 GTO, a F40 and a F50. he lives about 20 mins away from me, i got my facts from him
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
Quote:
Mike S said:
i think you're confusing it with a 308 or 328, there are very few 288 GTO's in the country, i doubt some university student is driving one. plus they are worth at least 4 times more than a 308...
That'll just be Killer simultaneouly doing a second degree at a South African Uni to increase his later earning potential.
Dr. Phil, this is your fault!
You've infected me.
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
i'm pretty sure it is either a 308 or a 328, or his dad is WAY TOO trusting, i wouldn't let my son drive to class with a colletors item that is irreplacable! especially when i know he won't be able to resist to try and show off and maybe wrap the car around some street light
Sep 6, 2005 1:41:44 AM
- Erik McKenna
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Sep 6, 2005 1:44:35 AM
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Sep 6, 2005 1:45:55 AM
- Erik McKenna
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Sep 6, 2005 2:48:44 AM
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Porsche930S
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Sep 6, 2005 11:12:15 AM
- Erik McKenna
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Sep 6, 2005 11:48:49 AM
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Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
Interesting drive of a prototype 959 in this month's 911 & Porsche World. Apparently, the roof is carbon fibre, and bonded on to the rest of the shell (not a 911 coupe shell as you might guess).
This means that although the purchase cost is no longer that much above a high end 911 Turbo S, the servicing and parts cost are frightening - Pounds6000 for a basic service, or Pounds54,000 (!!) for front / rear wing & sill panel. Yikes.
How about a slightly cheaper alternative - here .
It's not the looks that make them special, though - so a replica is pretty bogus (I'd rather have the 993 Turbo on which it's based) - it's the tech, and the fact that this was built 20 years ago. Phenomenal.
This means that although the purchase cost is no longer that much above a high end 911 Turbo S, the servicing and parts cost are frightening - Pounds6000 for a basic service, or Pounds54,000 (!!) for front / rear wing & sill panel. Yikes.
How about a slightly cheaper alternative - here .
It's not the looks that make them special, though - so a replica is pretty bogus (I'd rather have the 993 Turbo on which it's based) - it's the tech, and the fact that this was built 20 years ago. Phenomenal.
Re: What ever happened to the 959?!
Oh no,
please don't compare the real thing to a replica. Even the 993 Turbo is far from the 959 - it's not ONLY looks that count on such a car.
Erik,
pardon my ignorance but can you shed some light on the reason you have been driving that car - I suppose - out in the U.S.? Are you a TV presentator?
please don't compare the real thing to a replica. Even the 993 Turbo is far from the 959 - it's not ONLY looks that count on such a car.
Erik,
pardon my ignorance but can you shed some light on the reason you have been driving that car - I suppose - out in the U.S.? Are you a TV presentator?
How About a 959 Built from Spare Parts?
When the 959 was introduced, I tried to convince a business associate in Germany that he should buy a 959. I told him that they were planning on building only 200, and the value would appreciate. At $250,000, he thought that this would be a very speculative investment and declined.
I met up with him again a year later following one of his visits to Japan. While there he noticed an ad by a Japanese collector who was offering $1,000,000 for a 959. Now my associate HAD to have a 959. His company did business with Porsche design and he had a Porsche AG board member as a member on his board. Through these connections, he was offered one of 2 or 3 cars that Porsche was planning to build from spare parts leftover at Weissach following the development of the 959. So he purchased one of these and was happily burning through tires in 5000 km in his new toy.
I never asked him what the car cost him.
Cheers,
I met up with him again a year later following one of his visits to Japan. While there he noticed an ad by a Japanese collector who was offering $1,000,000 for a 959. Now my associate HAD to have a 959. His company did business with Porsche design and he had a Porsche AG board member as a member on his board. Through these connections, he was offered one of 2 or 3 cars that Porsche was planning to build from spare parts leftover at Weissach following the development of the 959. So he purchased one of these and was happily burning through tires in 5000 km in his new toy.
I never asked him what the car cost him.
Cheers,
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