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    I am questioning my sanity

    Over the past month I have read where traffic enforcement will increase throughout the US because of the direct relationship between speed and fatalities. Police are now monitoring favorite haunts of those who want to take their sport cars for spirited drives. Today at a national conference of law enforcement, police were criticised for allowing speeding up to ten miles per hour without ticketing.

    Our road are congested like I have never seen. My 430 has barely made it to 120mph before having to slow down. It is rare I even have the pleasure of finding out what it can do because traffic and law enforcement just do not allow it.

    My other choice is the track. However considering the circumstances surrounding Ben's death and other accidents I am aware, this option at least for now is not something I want to do.

    So what the hell am I doing with a $200,000 high performance sport car.I could autocross with a Miata and probably have a lot of fun. Am I insane or just getting old.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Getting old. Don't give up (seriously). Write your Congressman and explain why certain foreign countries with no speed limits in certain areas have fewer auto accidents per capita. Speed doesn't kill. Bad driving skills kill. Speed tickets are more for revenue generation than safety. How many people have been hurt in this country via police chases? I doubt tougher enforcement about speeders is our increasing public safety. If the government really wanted to save lives on the highway, the same standards established for getting, for example, a German drivers license would be set here in the States. It's too easy to get a license here!

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Am I insane or just getting old.



    Insane

    If you believe one word issued by the Governors Highway Safety Association , you are, indeed, clinical.

    Their "National Forum on Speeding" is a blatant attempt to excuse the States' gargantuan appetite for their residents' cash as some sort of moral crusade. It's pure hogwash and the driving public should get ready to guard their wallets from bandits posing as officers of the law.

    If the police patrolling our highways are giving a 10 MPH cushion before issuing a citation, it's only because the 85th percentile speeds are even higher than 10 over the nominal limit. When the 85th percentile speeds are way higher than the posted limit, it's because the limit is too low in the eyes of the vast majority of drivers using the roadway.

    This GHSA press release is the prelude to the States pursuing yet another avenue to raise money off the backs of whomever they can demonize next. Nothing more.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Over the past month I have read where traffic enforcement will increase throughout the US because of the direct relationship between speed and fatalities. Police are now monitoring favorite haunts of those who want to take their sport cars for spirited drives. Today at a national conference of law enforcement, police were criticised for allowing speeding up to ten miles per hour without ticketing.

    Our road are congested like I have never seen. My 430 has barely made it to 120mph before having to slow down. It is rare I even have the pleasure of finding out what it can do because traffic and law enforcement just do not allow it.

    My other choice is the track. However considering the circumstances surrounding Ben's death and other accidents I am aware, this option at least for now is not something I want to do.

    So what the hell am I doing with a $200,000 high performance sport car.I could autocross with a Miata and probably have a lot of fun. Am I insane or just getting old.



    Nick. Theres always the next step by the media, political and special interest groups, and that is that the mere possession and sale of such vehicles is in itself a public outrage and hazard. They did that with "categories" of firearms in Kalifornia, and have no doubt that fast cars will become the next career builder for some state politician. Afterall, "who really needs a car that goes
    100mph" 90 is evil enough to law enforcement and ten over that cause for 90 days jail and 2years license suspension.

    Sorry, but the chicken little politics of it all are going to happen sooner than later.


    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    Holminator said:
    Speed doesn't kill. Bad driving skills kill.



    I 100% agree.

    The amount of people who can't drive a vehicle is amazing. Sure someone can push the gas pedal and turn the wheel. In my opinion, ANY speed limit should not be the limit of the driver; the limit at which a driver can safely drive a vehicle should be well above the posted limit. This is obviously not the case as I daily see people driving 100km/h on a perfectly straight 4 lane highway who seem petrified. Anybody agree? what are all your opinions?

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Owning a $200,00 sports car is NOT just about the ability to test it's speed. It's about the looks you get when you drive it, the satisfaction in knowing you can afford it, and the gratification in seeing that everyone else wishes they were you. Age and sanity are irrelevant here.

    annonymous wife of Nick.

    Note I have no business posting, but just happened to read this while doing some work- guess I got hooked with the Ben thread and the passion everyone here has.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Welcome to the board Mrs. Berry. Didn't know Ben nearly as well as the two of you, so I can only say sorry for your loss. Your logic seems sound, but I wonder how many exotic owners would admit it. A $200k Ferrari cannot be justified in the performance department If speed is the only issue, a $65k Chevy Z06 is your best bet.

    I think you have to pick which roads to drive more carefully and be willing to accept that you could be ticketed. Buy yourself a cheap track car if the road is not enough. Autox isn't bad, but some people don't like the lack of speed.

    At Qualcomm stadium, with the Lotus club, we can run courses up to 1.5 miles long and get a bit above 65mph. Not too fast, but many more steering inputs than a typical track day. Much safter venue as well, where spinning is not nearly as dangerous. Some of the pros prefer it over high speed tracks like Willow Springs due to the skill required. There's less waiting for the next turn to arrive.

    - J

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    My other choice is the track. However considering the circumstances surrounding Ben's death and other accidents I am aware, this option at least for now is not something I want to do.



    The track will always be safer than running over a 100 on the street. (assuming it's just a DE and you have six point belts and roll bar)

    Most of the time I feel MUCH safer on the track than in traffic at 65 mph on the highway.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    You are insane, and you're old.


    All the best!!



    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    I guess it's also not just only happening here! Guess you have it in the states too! the weird thing is the traffic cops only setup speed traps on the weekend, over here one can genuinely say it is to rob you of your money. there are hundreds if not thousands of unroad worthy vehicles driving our roads everyday, yet they will pull over some guy in his mercedes without his seatbelts on...

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    Mike S said:
    I guess it's also not just only happening here! Guess you have it in the states too! the weird thing is the traffic cops only setup speed traps on the weekend, over here one can genuinely say it is to rob you of your money. there are hundreds if not thousands of unroad worthy vehicles driving our roads everyday, yet they will pull over some guy in his mercedes without his seatbelts on...



    Everyone has their own opinions on inexcusable driving practices... I think no seatbelts is one of them.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Nick.
    I drive a Miata (MX5). I choose it over the faster and cheaper WRX b/c i knew i would lose my license within a few weeks. With the MX5 i have more fun going around a corner at 60km/h then i could in the WRX. To make the WRX fun on the same corner, I would need to be doing about 85km/h.

    But with all of that being said. I'm still on the lookout for a Boxster to do up. And i'm sure that will go around the same corner at about 85km/h.

    BTW in Aust (victoria) we get booked for being 3km/h over the limit. Loss of license occurs at about 30km/h over. We are living in a Nazi state!

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    the satisfaction in knowing you can afford it, and the gratification in seeing that everyone else wishes they were you.

    annonymous wife of Nick.





    Two peas in a pod! Welcome aboard Mrs. nick.

    tom

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    Holminator said:
    Speed doesn't kill. Bad driving skills kill. Speed tickets are more for revenue generation than safety.



    Holminator is right.

    Nick you live in an extremely dense area (population wise) which puts a crimp on your driving style. There are many places in this country where you could easily drive at speed if you chose. Life is full of compromises so if you want the CA sunset every night you have to fart around more than others.

    As far as the track, i think it gives many drivers a false sense of security. It removes your inhibitions that are in place on regular roads. I drive fast, but only where it is reasonable to do so.

    Why not hook up with other like-minded drivers on long week-ends to less populated areas with lots of challenging roads.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Owning a $200,00 sports car is NOT just about the ability to test it's speed. It's about the looks you get when you drive it, the satisfaction in knowing you can afford it, and the gratification in seeing that everyone else wishes they were you. Age and sanity are irrelevant here.

    annonymous wife of Nick.

    Note I have no business posting, but just happened to read this while doing some work- guess I got hooked with the Ben thread and the passion everyone here has.



    Welcome Mrs. Berry.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Nick - I can certainly understand your reticence to go to the track in light of recent events. However, once the emotions subside a bit, I think you'll see that you're relatively safe on a well-designed and administered track (note: this may not apply to the state of the track where Ben was lost) in a car like the F430.

    I'd much rather see you going 120mph there than on an empty highway.

    As tragic as Ben's loss is, I think there were several conspiring circumstances that caused the accident. By learning from it, I think those risks can be largely avoided or mitigated.

    Give yourself some time and then give the track a try. Choose a track with a good safety record and reputation and I think you'll really enjoy it again...

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    Yargk said:
    Quote:
    Mike S said:
    I guess it's also not just only happening here! Guess you have it in the states too! the weird thing is the traffic cops only setup speed traps on the weekend, over here one can genuinely say it is to rob you of your money. there are hundreds if not thousands of unroad worthy vehicles driving our roads everyday, yet they will pull over some guy in his mercedes without his seatbelts on...



    Everyone has their own opinions on inexcusable driving practices... I think no seatbelts is one of them.



    lol yargk

    but answer me this, have you ever seen a car with wooden blocks as brake pads, brake lights totally don't work, a monkey wrench in place of a steering wheel, doors held closed with wires...?

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    My other choice is the track. However considering the circumstances surrounding Ben's death and other accidents I am aware, this option at least for now is not something I want to do.

    So what the hell am I doing with a $200,000 high performance sport car.I could autocross with a Miata and probably have a lot of fun. Am I insane or just getting old.



    Neither. You are getting wiser.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    racerx said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    the satisfaction in knowing you can afford it, and the gratification in seeing that everyone else wishes they were you.

    annonymous wife of Nick.





    Two peas in a pod! Welcome aboard Mrs. nick.

    tom



    racerx.

    I second his welcome, Mrs. Nick!

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    Mike S said:

    lol yargk

    but answer me this, have you ever seen a car with wooden blocks as brake pads, brake lights totally don't work, a monkey wrench in place of a steering wheel, doors held closed with wires...?



    Nope, and I hope I don't, gives me the chills.. You have a point.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Owning a $200,00 sports car is NOT just about the ability to test it's speed. It's about the looks you get when you drive it, the satisfaction in knowing you can afford it, and the gratification in seeing that everyone else wishes they were you. Age and sanity are irrelevant here.





    Welcome Mrs. nberry. You're right, many people love these cars for more than just the speed. It depends on the person. In fact there are those that either classify them by their exclusivity or simply as a mode of transportation in such a singular way(second point applies to all cars) that they will honestly ask whether it's necessary to ever drive aggressively. These people annoy me because although I like to use my Porsche as enjoyable transportation on trips, I mostly think of it as expensive sporting equipment. If for me it's sporting equipment, then its whole purpose is wasted if I don't take it to the track. It's like having a set of golf clubs that I just look at. Sure I could have bought a go-cart to enjoy motorsports, so there are other things I enjoy about the car and being able to use it on the street, but those are secondary.

    That being said, I personally think that the "test its speed" idea is a very bad way to put it. This reminds me of reckless punks trying to see what they can hit on a crowded highway. Any of the supercars we talk about on this board test you way before you can test them. It would take years to extract every ounce of performance from many of them. Driving on a track isn't a daredevil 150 mph public road drive. Besides being in a controlled environment and safer (when organized properly) you're also driving in a more controlled manner. Instead of a quick burst of speed on a public highway, you go out for sessions that last at least 20 minutes and can actually learn to drive at the limits better which I believe can save your butt on the street in many occasions. I love the sport aspect and challenging myself to be smoother and more controlled in my driving (hence safer, and on a track, faster), however there are times I think a couple track days should be required to buy any of these cars simply because they are sharper and someday may require you to act in a proper way when the car is at its limits to avoid disaster. To do this you must spend some time actually at those limits on a track.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Nick, it will pass...just give it some time.
    I had the same thoughts after Ben's accident.
    When we get older, we start to think more about choices and risks and sometimes I wish I wouldn't loose so much time to think about this stuff.

    When we are faced with horrible events, we tend to over-react a little bit, which is quite understandable.

    Just relax and try not to think about it, you'll enjoy your car sooner or later again.

    Right now, I don't have much fun driving mine either, I always find an "excuse" not to drive it and do something else in my precious spare time. It never happened before.
    Getting older? Definetely yes. But maybe this is also some sort of learning process resulting in protecting us from ourselves, maybe without us even realizing it.

    I'm 39 now and I just hope that I'll "survive" my upcoming midlife crisis sometimes in the future. Or maybe I'll be too busy to even think about it.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Today, we in California have been put on notice that all violation of the motor vehicle code will be enforced regardless if the violation is minor . You will be ticketed for going 1-2 miles over the speed limit. Ignoring the incredible enforcement problems the have on their hands, it seems to me that the message they are sending is cars are for transportation and nothing else.

    Who wants to drive on roads and highways constantly looking in your rearview mirror, monitoring your radar device and looking skyward for air traffic enforcement planes? It just is a lousy experience.

    RC to your point about it will pass. I agree but somehow driving a high performance car seems stupid. Having said that, I just spec out my Spider for a Sept build date. Yellow with black interior/yellow stitching with carbon fiber and carbon fiber engine bay. You think I will get noticed?

    BTW for you Seinfeld fans..do you recall the episode when George becomes engaged and his fiancee begins going to "his" restaurant invading his "sanctuary"? Well, Holly my lovely wife just did the same. But I love her dearly and all I can do is shrug my shoulders.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    hi nick, when did you place your order for the spider? i don't understand why everything has to be done so slow here in africa

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Nick Troll and Mrs. Trollina...we salute you.

    Get your Valentine-One's, your sms-warnings, laser-jammers, camouflage paint, non-reflective coatings and what have you, cuz this is only getting worse. In Copenhagen they have been talking for a while about getting "road pricing" - the system where a GPS monitors your driving (geographically) and taxes you accordingly. If that is taken into use we will probably have all cars equippped with a GPS that simply monitors our every move and automatically sends us a ticket when we do 1 km/h past the limit.

    It's probably nott possible, but they ought to issue DL's and group them according to skill. "Level A", "level B" etc.
    But like Mike says this is all a big money machine. They really aren't interested in traffic safety as number one. Had they been, they'd probably forced the carmakers to buy their brakes from Porsche and suspension from Ferrari.
    Doing 50mph in a wobbly american POS van or sedan is a lot more dangerous than going 85 mph in a hi performance sports car on the same road, same conditions with the same driver.
    But there are very few HP sportscars - and many regular POS cars....hence many voters with POS cars and few with HP sports cars.
    Speed versus safety versus money versus politics.
    Sorry, I can't say where one ends and the other begins-

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    Mike S said:
    hi nick, when did you place your order for the spider? i don't understand why everything has to be done so slow here in africa



    The allocation should be issued before the end of this month. The factory closes for the month of August so materials must be order soon for the September build date.I would think S. Africa with very limited allocations nevertheless should get at least one monthly. Twist your dealers arm since I am sure many others are.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    thanks nick, but apparently my dealer says we only get around 20 ferrari's per year and that's including ALL the ferrari models, 612, 575, 360, etc. so maybe as little as 10 or less f430's per year

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Today, we in California have been put on notice that all violation of the motor vehicle code will be enforced regardless if the violation is minor . You will be ticketed for going 1-2 miles over the speed limit. Ignoring the incredible enforcement problems the have on their hands, it seems to me that the message they are sending is cars are for transportation and nothing else.

    Who wants to drive on roads and highways constantly looking in your rearview mirror, monitoring your radar device and looking skyward for air traffic enforcement planes? It just is a lousy experience.

    RC to your point about it will pass. I agree but somehow driving a high performance car seems stupid. Having said that, I just spec out my Spider for a Sept build date. Yellow with black interior/yellow stitching with carbon fiber and carbon fiber engine bay. You think I will get noticed?

    BTW for you Seinfeld fans..do you recall the episode when George becomes engaged and his fiancee begins going to "his" restaurant invading his "sanctuary"? Well, Holly my lovely wife just did the same. But I love her dearly and all I can do is shrug my shoulders.



    Nick,

    I am sorry for the loss of your friend Ben. What you are feeling and thinking is a perfectly understandable grief reaction, and will gradually fade over time and you'll be an enthused driver in due course (I am qualified to tell you this since I am a practicing neurologist). As soon as your Spider comes, you'll be ready to hit the pavement with aplomb. BTW, any idea how long the wait list is for one of those Spiders? Next to the P997TSCab and AMAMV8 in supercharged volante form, that is the third car I obsess about.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Nick, it will pass...just give it some time.
    I had the same thoughts after Ben's accident.
    When we get older, we start to think more about choices and risks and sometimes I wish I wouldn't loose so much time to think about this stuff.

    When we are faced with horrible events, we tend to over-react a little bit, which is quite understandable.

    Just relax and try not to think about it, you'll enjoy your car sooner or later again.

    Right now, I don't have much fun driving mine either, I always find an "excuse" not to drive it and do something else in my precious spare time. It never happened before.
    Getting older? Definetely yes. But maybe this is also some sort of learning process resulting in protecting us from ourselves, maybe without us even realizing it.

    I'm 39 now and I just hope that I'll "survive" my upcoming midlife crisis sometimes in the future. Or maybe I'll be too busy to even think about it.



    RC,

    That makes me your senior-I'm 40! I wish here in the USA we had access to an American Autobahn. I spent a summer in Bremen in 1981 (exchange student), and was able to experience the Autobahn-but only in the passenger seat of my exchange father's car-he had a Peugeot sedan and drove it only to the middle lane, never the inside lane much to my chagrin! As I recall, it was fairly safe, the only major accident with an ensuing fatality around Bremen was from a Geisterfahrer-for all readers of this, a driver who entered the Autobahn by driving the wrong way onto the exit lane late at night-the result was a head-on collision.

    Given the added delays of airplane travel from additional security checks since the World Trade Center terrorist incident, I believe a two-lane American Autobahn running parallel to the US interstate highway system could succeed with strict entry requirements (passing a skilled driving test for high-speed travel) and a decent toll charge to help finance it. I invite all readers of this to chime in.

    Re: I am questioning my sanity

    Quote:
    Dr. Phil said:
    Nick Troll and Mrs. Trollina...we salute you.

    Get your Valentine-One's, your sms-warnings, laser-jammers, camouflage paint, non-reflective coatings and what have you, cuz this is only getting worse. In Copenhagen they have been talking for a while about getting "road pricing" - the system where a GPS monitors your driving (geographically) and taxes you accordingly. If that is taken into use we will probably have all cars equippped with a GPS that simply monitors our every move and automatically sends us a ticket when we do 1 km/h past the limit.

    It's probably nott possible, but they ought to issue DL's and group them according to skill. "Level A", "level B" etc.
    But like Mike says this is all a big money machine. They really aren't interested in traffic safety as number one. Had they been, they'd probably forced the carmakers to buy their brakes from Porsche and suspension from Ferrari.
    Doing 50mph in a wobbly american POS van or sedan is a lot more dangerous than going 85 mph in a hi performance sports car on the same road, same conditions with the same driver.
    But there are very few HP sportscars - and many regular POS cars....hence many voters with POS cars and few with HP sports cars.
    Speed versus safety versus money versus politics.
    Sorry, I can't say where one ends and the other begins-



    Dr. P-RP&G,

    I like your idea of camouflage paint and other tech. means of eluding radar. Is there an ideal paint color and type that is least reflective and most able to escape visual detection? Obviously black would work at night. For daylight, what do you think would work best? I wonder if there is a chameleon color option for the 911 (a car that changes color to blend in to the environment-like white in snow, forest green in summer. . .)?

     
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