Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer? - Page1

May 9, 2005 8:26:02 AM

EricAlain: Veteran; Loc: Paris, France , France; Posts: 1037, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 14, 2002

Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

I remember a while ago a thread from nberry arguing that Porsche wasn't a niche player any longer. I was recently able to put my hand on some interesting numbers:

World demand for cars with a sticker price:
- $90k-$150k is around 100,000 units.
- $150k-$200k is around 15,000 units
- above $200k is 3,000 units

For the past fiscal year (2003/2004), Porsche sales in the respective segments were:
$90k-$150k: 25,046 units (market share 25%)
$150$-$200k: 411 units (GT2)(market share 3%)
above $200k: 222 units (CGT) (market share 7%)

So in the ultra high-end segment Porsche is still a niche player while in the "entry luxury" segment it is a "mass maker" with a 25% market share !!!

Next
Threads

May 9, 2005 9:26:56 AM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: EricAlain

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

Here's another perspective:
According to statistics there are 6,446,131,400 (July 2005 est.) people on this planet.
Last year Porsche produced 81,531 "units", meaning 81,531 people bought a new Porsche.

That's one in every 79,063 person who bought a Porsche.

I dunno. Ferrari, Porsche, Aston...I feel pretty darn privileged owning the car I do.
Exclusivity to me by the way, is owning something that very few people own, or having the possibility of experiencing things that can't be bought.
Be it finding a special, old Austin Healey abandoned in a barn or getting a chat with your favourite F1-driver in your local pub.

Owning any Porsche is exclusive to some extent, but since they keep producing a certain car as long as people want it and can afford it, it will never get to be super-exclusive. That goes for Ferrari too.

The CGT is exclusive to the extent that they only produce 1200 units, other cars are exclusive because it takes forever to get them (Ferrari e.g.).

If you want true, 100% pure exclusivity...have someone build a car specifically for YOU. Not just adjusted, but built solely for you.
A Jesse James or Orange County Choppers car if you will...
Sure, it will run you several million dollars, but then you can yell "exclusive" all day long

Next
Threads

May 10, 2005 12:05:36 AM

Jeff (in SF): Pilot; Loc: SF, CA, USA , United States; Posts: 340, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 13, 2003; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

It's also relative. Consider that of the 81K Porsches that were sold, how many were sold in Namibia or the Congo. In those markets you're probably the only 996/997 driver. In places like San Diego (where Nick trolls, I mean lives) Porsches are much more common but then again so are Ferraris. It's just hard to notice all the Ferrari's as much because they're all behind garage doors, in the shop being serviced or a few are at the track where most folks aren't. Porsches on the other hand, are out on the streets being driven.

Next
Threads

May 10, 2005 1:33:17 AM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: EricAlain

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

This discussion is likely to become one of semantics. My answer is yes and no.

No:
While Porsche does not exactly cater to the masses so that everyone can own a Porsche, in the world of luxury vehicles and sports cars (which some people may call a rather large niche), Porsche is going after as many customers as they can find.

It started with kinder, heavier, and more gentle sports cars like the 911 Cab C4S Tip. Then came the Cayenne V6 and eventually we will also have a sedan on our hands.

Yes:
Porsche still makes the cars for enthuisiasts like the GT2, GT3, CGT, etc. These are very much niche vehicles. Even if you consider the variety of cars they sell, they are still catering to a slightly upmarket crowd. These are no economy cars.

So the answer tends to become stronger in the no category as time passes by, but if you look at it from a global market point of view, Porsche is still somewhat of a niche manufacturer.

Ferrari is a little different. They are a niche manufacturer that wants everyone to aspire to own one. They is evidenced by their marketing strategies.

Next
Threads

May 10, 2005 3:09:47 AM

Jeff (in SF): Pilot; Loc: SF, CA, USA , United States; Posts: 340, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 13, 2003; Reply to: Justin

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer? (sorry I ramble a bit)

You're right - I smell a thread about to be speckled with semantics. I'd simply kick it off that if you're talk about Porsche as a company being mass market oriented, I'd say that they do certainly make it easier than some companies (Ferrari, Lotus, Noble and others) to own their vehicles. Things like aggressive financing, lots of dealerships located conveniently to where the more affluent customers are, and designing their cars to be used on an everyday basis (20K service intervals on the new 997 and the ability to drive in reverse up hill (vs. F1 F cars

)as but 2 examples). Their strategy to design a platform that is capable of being modified to support multiple models (11 in the case of the 911) is to me, a sound business decision while some may criticize that they divvy up the range too much. When it comes to exclusivity, I think many on this board seem to equate "exclusivity" with "resale value" and "being difficult to get". Surely people must recognize that there are more F430's being built than Porsche builds GT2's and both cars compete for the same customer (both RWD, $190K-ish, minimum of driver aids, etc.).

I think if you were to ask prospective customers of either a Ferrari or Porsche what those brands mean to them, you'll likely get a variety of answers - some of them consistent and others not. To me, Porsche doesn't only mean air cooled, rear engined cars as it may to the Porsche purist brought up on 356's and 70's 911's. Things change and Porsche recognizes this. I used to play with BB guns and GI Joes but thankfully I don't anymore and Porsche realizes that my lifestyle needs have changes since then. Once upon a time, you couln't say Ferrari without also saying 12 cylinder in the same sentence but Ferrari has changed too although probably not to the degree that Porsche has over the same period of time. While Porsche has been successful in each of its new model launches since the Boxster, including the Cayenne which infuriated many, Ferrari's efforts outside the 360/430 range have been been less so. I'm anxious to see how Ferrari does once it's a publicly traded company and it comes time to replace the 430. Since this model is the equivalent of Ferrari's 3-series (BMW) that represents the lion's share of revenues and profits, I bet they stay pretty conservative on the styling evolution because if they get it wrong it could seriously affect the company. It would be nice to see them develop more attractive and appealing models to replace the 612 and 575 but if they don't the numbers are much smaller so it probably doesn't matter as much.

Anyway, as to 'niche', in the grand scheme of the total car business, Porsche and Ferrari are both dwarfed by Toyota, GM, etc. As someone posted earlier, slicing the car market by price point, doesn't tell the whole story. You can say Porsche has X% marketshare of the vehicle segment comprising sportscars at a $80K to $100K level but as we all know, sportscars as a rule are by definition niche products because they're not as practical as other vehicle alternatives.

Top
Threads

Board	Subject	Last post	Views	Replies
Porsche	SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II)	4/17/24 7:16 AM Gnil	763529	1798
Porsche	Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos)	4/7/24 11:48 AM Boxster Coupe GTS	435999	565
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Cayman GT4 RS (2021)	5/12/23 12:11 PM W8MM	260814	288
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022	3/12/24 8:28 AM DJM48	257774	323
Porsche	The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche	1/30/24 9:18 AM RC	82561	45
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift	3/15/24 1:23 PM CGX car nut	5325	50
Porsche	The moment I've been waiting for...	2/1/24 7:01 PM Pilot	872847	1364
Porsche	992 GT3	7/23/23 7:01 PM Grant	808337	3868
Porsche	Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!	2/10/24 4:43 PM nberry	387672	1526
Porsche	GT4RS	4/17/24 8:53 PM Gauss	385698	1452
Others	Tesla 2 the new thread	12/13/23 2:48 PM CGX car nut	368734	2401
Porsche	Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design	7/3/23 12:30 PM Porker	366651	797
Ferrari	Ferrari 812 Superfast	4/21/23 8:09 AM the-missile	289717	550
Porsche	Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour	4/11/24 12:32 PM Ferdie	286422	668
Porsche	Collected my 997 GTS today	10/19/23 7:06 PM CGX car nut	259212	812
Lambo	Huracán EVO STO	7/30/23 6:59 PM mcdelaug	237530	346
Lotus	Lotus Emira	6/25/23 2:53 PM Enmanuel	225546	101
Others	Corvette C8	10/16/23 3:24 PM Enmanuel	220083	488
Others	Gordon Murray - T.50	11/22/23 10:27 AM mcdelaug	167098	387
Porsche	Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS	6/11/23 5:13 PM CGX car nut	139029	144
BMW M	2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now	12/29/23 9:04 AM RC	115772	303
Motor Sp.	2023 Formula One	12/19/23 5:38 AM Whoopsy	107626	685
Others	Valkyrie final design?	4/28/23 2:45 AM Rossi	99342	219
Porsche	2022 992 Safari Model	3/7/24 4:22 PM Whoopsy	83651	239
AMG	Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758	2/23/24 10:03 PM blueflame	74906	297
Porsche	992 GT3 RS	3/3/24 7:22 PM Whoopsy	53222	314
Motor Sp.	Porsche 963	3/16/24 9:27 PM Whoopsy	24709	237
Ferrari	Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6)	1/21/24 4:29 PM GT-Boy	20963	103
BMW M	2022 BMW M5 CS	4/8/24 1:43 PM Ferdie	19234	140
AMG	G63 sold out	9/15/23 7:38 PM Nico997	16471	120

Crown

Forum - Thread

Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer?

Re: Is Porsche a niche manufacturer? (sorry I ramble a bit)

Forum

Boards