Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: What Would You Buy? - Page1

Apr 18, 2005 8:19:00 PM

ben, lj: Expert; Loc:; Posts: 1373, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 6, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
nberry said:
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
Quote:
nberry said:
Now now Ben lets not be too sensitive. As much as I love your CGT, you and I both know owners have to be stealth drivers worrying about losing their warranty should they decide to track or put the car through its spirited paces. You literally have to wear a mask and cover up your license plate in fear of someone reporting to Porsche how the car was driven. I happen to believe for $450,000 you should be allowed to track your car without fear of warranty voidance.

The Corvette Z6 warranty openly covers track work and that is a $70,000 car. Ferrari allows it as well.

Regarding resale value and maintenance, Porsche has not distinguished itself and you are well aware of the details.

Gas mileage for an everday car is important and will get more important. I deliberately left out SUV's and trucks for the reasons you cite.

Nick, don't mislead people, how about showing me WERE its stated or written in thet Z06's warranty that it specifically covers tracking? I hope you can back up your claims.

As to "Ferrari alows it well", big deal, same as Porsche. Neither officially cover it but both will do it in most instances if claims are reasonable.
Secondly, with Ferrari, few of their cars ever see the track, as opposed to Porsches. That changes many things.
And thirdly is what the dealers think about it, I would love to see you F-car dealer's face if you told him you were tracking that F360 Spider you were trading in for the F430 like Ben said, which car do you take to the track?

Carlos the instruction manual for the Z6 discusses settings for track work. I doubt should some thing happen GM would void the warranty. Now distinguish that from comments of Porsche officials who are on record that should something happen at a track your Porsche warranty is Kaput!

the CGT manual also makes several referrences to track settings including the TPM. does this then mean the CGT has warranty on the track? i'd scan and post the relevant portions for you but the car is having new tires mounted today and my manual is in the glove box.

incidentally, how'd you see the owner's manual for the Z06 since it's not yet on sale?

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Apr 18, 2005 9:10:44 PM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21152, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
nberry said:
Carlos the instruction manual for the Z6 discusses settings for track work. I doubt should some thing happen GM would void the warranty. Now distinguish that from comments of Porsche officials who are on record that should something happen at a track your Porsche warranty is Kaput! This is from a sport car manufacturer who markets their cars for track and other performance events.

You are a lawyer for heavens sake Nick, were does it state that tracking is specifically covered? nowere, and you know why they don't state it in the warranty? Ok, then...
All Corvette does is avoids not staing the opposite, that tracking may void warranty, which is a start though since that is what all other main manufacturers do like Ferrari, Porsche, etc.

Quote:
nberry said:
Why in the hell should Ben, Mike and other CGT owners not be assured by Porsche that their $450,000 car will be covered under warranty in tracking events unless by clear and convincing evidence abuse is the cause of the failure? The car is designed for the track. Let Porsche stand up and be customer oriented to some of their best customers and tell them enjoy your cars at track events. We are behind you.

Same reason Enzo owners are not assured either, nor any other. Why this going back to Porsche all the time

Quote:
nberry said:
Regarding me tracking cars, I have had my share of track time. Today I have no interest in tracking a car unless it was in a private setting with drivers that I know and trust.

hence why you drive a Ferrari that you "have" to garage queen for your dealer to resell later, yes I know... people buy sportcars for a variety of reasons, to each his own.

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Apr 18, 2005 9:43:55 PM

CarreraGtRacer: Veteran; Loc: Houston, TX; Posts: 1181, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 1, 2004; Reply to: ben, lj

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
ben, lj said:
Quote:
CarreraGtRacer said:
I think I'd be happy with a Carrera GT

i dunno about that, nick brings up a point that is at the crux of importance to all those buying $400K+ cars - fuel economy

Totally forgot about the gas prices...I think I'm going to buy a Civic instead.

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Apr 18, 2005 11:29:41 PM

MAVERICK: Veteran; Loc: Cincinnati, OH (USA) , United States; Posts: 1145, Gallery; Registered on: May 31, 2004; Reply to: CarreraGtRacer

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
CarreraGtRacer said:
I think I'm going to buy a Civic instead.

Unless you are not a lead-foot, driving a Civic doesn't guarantee savings on gasoline unless you use cruise control in the city as well.

I never imagined this day would arrive. I have to say it: "I LOVE cruise control."

Lo Siento. Back to, "Who's afraid of a voided warranty?"

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Apr 19, 2005 2:29:01 AM

W8MM: Rennteam Master; Loc: Cincinnati, OH , United States; Posts: 3995, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 8, 2003; Reply to: MAVERICK

Re: What Would You Buy?

Well, ... I already bought a CGT and a 996TT cab.

They go with my wife's car, my daughter's Honda, my "beater" Lexus truck and a nice go-to-the-theater-and-dinner sedan.

I sold a 962, a McLaren-BMW 320 racer, an IROC 911/RS, a 996C2 cab, and a 966TT coupe to make room (sq-ft & $$$) for the CGT and Turbo cab.

The CGT is something I can take out and drive around, just as I did this evening, as well as take to the track. It's way faster than the IROC car or McLaren-BMW, and more practical than the 962.

The Turbo cab might seem redundant, but I can actually leave it with a valet if my wife and I go out to dinner with the top down. No way I feel comfortable doing that with the Carrera GT!

Also, the CGT is an instant riot wherever it goes. The 996TT is lower key when it comes to impromptu stop-light conversations. A big help when one wants to go about one's business without delay. Hemmingway had his "moveable feast", but the CGT is a "moveable instant car-club meeting"!

Tonight, I had a very clean '85 930 chase me down in traffic and the driver ask for a ride. He waved for me to turn into a nearby empty country club parking lot and, ... I did. He was a really nice guy who admitted to being a real estate investor with a bad Porsche habit and said it would make his day if I'd give him a ride. We took a few mile loop with a leg of freeway in the mix. He was overjoyed with the experience (even limited to break-in revs) and had a great story to tell his pals when he finally showed up at their watering hole.

I really enjoy the CGT, but the total experience is so intense and necessarily involving that the Turbo cab lets me enjoy driving at a different level that is rewarding in an entirely different way. I like them both very much, and wouldn't be happy if I had to give up either one of them.

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Apr 19, 2005 2:42:01 AM

CarreraGtRacer: Veteran; Loc: Houston, TX; Posts: 1181, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 1, 2004; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

[quote

Tonight, I had a very clean '85 930 chase me down in traffic and the driver ask for a ride. He waved for me to turn into a nearby empty country club parking lot and, ... I did. He was a really nice guy who admitted to being a real estate investor with a bad Porsche habit and said it would make his day if I'd give him a ride. We took a few mile loop with a leg of freeway in the mix. He was overjoyed with the experience (even limited to break-in revs) and had a great story to tell his pals when he finally showed up at their watering hole.

Your such a nice guy Mike

All Carrera GT owners need to be like you and Ben

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Apr 19, 2005 5:17:24 AM

ha: Expert; Loc: Riyadh , Saudi Arabia; Posts: 1695, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2003; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
W8MM said:
..Tonight, I had a very clean '85 930 chase me down in traffic and the driver ask for a ride. He waved for me to turn into a nearby empty country club parking lot and, ... I did. He was a really nice guy who admitted to being a real estate investor with a bad Porsche habit and said it would make his day if I'd give him a ride. We took a few mile loop with a leg of freeway in the mix. He was overjoyed with the experience (even limited to break-in revs) and had a great story to tell his pals when he finally showed up at their watering hole..

Wow

.. I applaud your spirit

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Apr 19, 2005 5:44:46 AM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8633, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: Grant

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
Grant said:
Quote:
Grant said:
I would buy:

1. Mitsubishi EVO (daily driver)- $30k
2. Real (and perfect) 1973 Carrera RS 2.7 Lightweight - $170k
3. Replica 1973 RSR 2.8 racecar - with 308hp, 8k rpm period-correct motor, great upgrades and track setup (4-way Motons, etc.) - $70k
4. Real 993RS 3.8 (street legal for US if done right). - $85k
5. Lotus Elise/Exige - $50k
6. Corvette C6 Z06 - $70k
7. 997 GT3 - $110k

Total - $585k

The other combo that I might try, since I've never had a Ferrari:

1. F430 6-speed manual Coupe - $160k
2. Noble M12 - $80k
3. Real RS 3.8, RS 2.7 and replica RSR 2.8 from above - $325k
4. Mits EVO $30k

Total - $595k

No Carrera RS 2.7 for me!

I prefer to slum, so I would get a original 916 and add a
"period correct" a 2.8 twin plug motor. You can park it anywhere and they are stinking fast.

A ferrari Daytona Spyder. None of those metrosexual 8cyl Ferraris please.

Hyundai Santa Fe, so I can have Cayenne style but not the headaches. Not only can you take it off road, but you can leave it off road when you get sick of it.

I guess that would hit the 600K price.

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Apr 19, 2005 11:58:59 AM

W8MM: Rennteam Master; Loc: Cincinnati, OH , United States; Posts: 3995, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 8, 2003; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
... I would get a original 916 and add a
"period correct" a 2.8 twin plug motor. You can park it anywhere and they are stinking fast.

Sort of like this, but with bigger flares?
(it says 2.8 on the back -- it's kinda hard to see in this pic)

It was 10 #/hp. The IROC 911/RS was 6.5 #/hp. The CGT is 5. The 962 was less than 3

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Apr 19, 2005 4:01:57 PM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8633, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

Thanx for sharing the pic.

Yeah sort of like that....

Speed Yellow 914's are pretty unusual, much less a 914/6, much less yet one with a 2.8 stuffed into it. Do you still own it?

It looks cool as hell!

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Apr 19, 2005 4:15:29 PM

Alex18_996CC: Rennteam Master; Loc: Madrid , Spain; Posts: 3218, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 13, 2004; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: What Would You Buy?

Well its too much money but I'll have::

1)Porsche 9974Scabriolet with PSE

, driving it 2 or 3 days a week

.

2)Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale(exterior colour:black with the stripe and interior:beige sport seats)

, driving it only in the weekends and some special days

3)Mini Cooper S John Works, for daily driving(dark green xterior and beige arena interior)

Rest of the money for insurance, petrol

, and of course for fines

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Apr 19, 2005 5:05:24 PM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
JimFlat6 said:A ferrari Daytona Spyder. None of those metrosexual 8cyl Ferraris please.

Jim - I got to drive a 71 Daytona Coupe (Silver with Red interior) with only 12k miles on it a couple years ago. One of the great pleasures of my life - unbelievable sound at 7,700 rpm

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Apr 19, 2005 5:08:52 PM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
W8MM said:
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
... I would get a original 916 and add a
"period correct" a 2.8 twin plug motor. You can park it anywhere and they are stinking fast.

Sort of like this, but with bigger flares?
(it says 2.8 on the back -- it's kinda hard to see in this pic)

It was 10 #/hp. The IROC 911/RS was 6.5 #/hp. The CGT is 5. The 962 was less than 3

Mike - If you had an RSR-spec 2.8L in a 914, wouldn't that make the power/weight ratio alot better than 10#/hp?

I was thinking about 2,000# and 300hp for 6.7#/hp...

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Apr 19, 2005 5:50:10 PM

SoCalHoosier: Veteran; Loc: California , United States; Posts: 896, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 13, 2003; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: What Would You Buy?

1) F430
2) 997 GT3 or 997 turbo (depends on performance/looks)
3) BMW 760Li (gf's car)
4) a good SUV
5) a good roadster

Already have a good SUV, but would have to upgrade my BMW and 996. The F430 looks much cleaner than the outgoing 360. I doubt I'd consider a spyder since it would already draw too many stares. Maybe the new upcoming M3 would be a good high mileage car.

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Apr 19, 2005 6:13:41 PM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8633, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: Grant

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
Grant said:
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:A ferrari Daytona Spyder. None of those metrosexual 8cyl Ferraris please.

Jim - I got to drive a 71 Daytona Coupe (Silver with Red interior) with only 12k miles on it a couple years ago. One of the great pleasures of my life - unbelievable sound at 7,700 rpm

6 Webers always make for a nice induction sound

With the exception of the Carrera GT, most of the modern sports cars bore me to death. They dont require a lot of
effort to drive fast, they dont impart any added skill
after you do drive them fast and their is very little mechanical artistry or aura to them .

On this silly poll, I almost opted for a CGT, I like how the side windows look like they are from the 914 parts bin

. But at 450K I want to see some gnarly velocity stacks under the hood and have a spare tire in case I
get a flat out in the boonies. Besides the Ferrari Daytona has plenty of ground clearance. You can actually drive it like a normal car and not be stuck with lowered show car problems such as steep driveways or speed bumps.

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Apr 19, 2005 11:36:36 PM

W8MM: Rennteam Master; Loc: Cincinnati, OH , United States; Posts: 3995, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 8, 2003; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Speed Yellow 914's are pretty unusual, much less a 914/6, much less yet one with a 2.8 stuffed into it. Do you still own it?

It looks cool as hell!

Thanks!

It's actually Signal Orange. I sold it to a local Porsche dealer when I wanted to buy a 996 C2 cab more than I wanted to keep the 914/6-2.8.

HE PAINTED IT SILVER!

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Apr 20, 2005 1:32:24 AM

svtrader1: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 821, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2003; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
JimFlat6 said:

A ferrari Daytona Spyder. None of those metrosexual 8cyl Ferraris please.

F430 metrosexual. Puhlease!

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Apr 20, 2005 2:28:05 AM

Holminator: Veteran; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 1041, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 28, 2004; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
W8MM said:
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
... I would get a original 916 and add a
"period correct" a 2.8 twin plug motor. You can park it anywhere and they are stinking fast.

Sort of like this, but with bigger flares?
(it says 2.8 on the back -- it's kinda hard to see in this pic)

It was 10 #/hp. The IROC 911/RS was 6.5 #/hp. The CGT is 5. The 962 was less than 3

Wow! That paint job looks better than the original!

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Apr 20, 2005 2:53:08 AM

W8MM: Rennteam Master; Loc: Cincinnati, OH , United States; Posts: 3995, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 8, 2003; Reply to: Grant

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
Grant said:
Mike - If you had an RSR-spec 2.8L in a 914, wouldn't that make the power/weight ratio alot better than 10#/hp?

I was thinking about 2,000# and 300hp for 6.7#/hp...

Grant,

Stoddard built the motor out of 2.8 race parts, but used carbs instead of a Kugelfischer einspritzer. The cams were "E-intake/S-exhaust" custom grind developed by Stoddard for good low-end torque compared to a strictly race-oriented set-up. It dynoed at around 245 hp.

The car was not especially light since I added S-calipers and struts in the front and vented disks in the back. Stoddard also added a front mounted oil cooler in the chin spoiler (including the big oil lines) and did some 914/6-GT chassis reinforcing around the rear suspension mounting points. It had a stock interior modified to include a moveable passenger seat and armrest pockets converted to hold some ADS speakers. It kept getting heavier.

I think 10 #/hp is about right. It was still loads of fun!

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Apr 20, 2005 4:20:37 AM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
W8MM said:
I think 10 #/hp is about right. It was still loads of fun!

I have no doubt it was a blast

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Apr 20, 2005 5:27:53 AM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8633, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
W8MM said:
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Speed Yellow 914's are pretty unusual, much less a 914/6, much less yet one with a 2.8 stuffed into it. Do you still own it?

It looks cool as hell!

Thanks!

It's actually Signal Orange. I sold it to a local Porsche dealer when I wanted to buy a 996 C2 cab more than I wanted to keep the 914/6-2.8.

HE PAINTED IT SILVER!

Yikes on the silver respray

I get bahama yellow, signal orange and signal yellow
mixed up at times, too many leaking heat exchangers
I guess

Is your 996TT Cab Signal Orange or Signal Yellow also?
Im not too good on recalling the yellows because I always
ordered mine in Light Ivory

Hell, just line em all up and shoot a group pic

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Apr 20, 2005 3:07:31 PM

W8MM: Rennteam Master; Loc: Cincinnati, OH , United States; Posts: 3995, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 8, 2003; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Hell, just line em all up and shoot a group pic

Here's my sold Signal yellow coupe next to my current Lapis TT Cab:

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Apr 20, 2005 3:09:44 PM

W8MM: Rennteam Master; Loc: Cincinnati, OH , United States; Posts: 3995, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 8, 2003; Reply to: Holminator

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
Holminator said:
Wow! That paint job looks better than the original!

Thanks!

Here's another shot:

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Apr 20, 2005 4:09:34 PM

TEE: Veteran; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 929, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 5, 2003; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

All interesting choices and reasons - can't fault anyone's logic.

My Choice would be something like this:

1. Lotus Elise
2. GT3
3. 1989 911 Turbo (5 speed)
4. F40
6. RS6 (need a family 4WD)
7. Lambo
8. Caterham R400
9. 300SL Convertible

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Apr 20, 2005 4:22:04 PM

993Targa: Rennteam Pro; Loc: ZH , Switzerland; Posts: 2522, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 16, 2004; Reply to: TEE

Re: What Would You Buy?

My pics:
1. 997 (daily driver)
2. Cayenne Turbo (wintersports, boating and shopping)
3. F360 Spider (for posing

)
4. 996 GT3 MK1 for trackdays
5. Jeep Wrangler

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Apr 20, 2005 7:37:53 PM

Ryan in SD: Senior; Loc: San Diego; Posts: 604, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 14, 2004; Reply to: 993Targa

Re: What Would You Buy?

Its about time I post my dream car garage.

1 CGT
2 997T or 993TS

or

1 GT2
2 M5 (supercharged) for "comfort/room"
3 Ultima GTR to drive to track and drive the shiznit out of while learning more about cars since I would have to build it from a kit.

4 F430 spider
5 and maybe an offroad vehicle of some kind because I love off roading.

...and some hotwheels

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Apr 20, 2005 7:39:09 PM

Ryan in SD: Senior; Loc: San Diego; Posts: 604, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 14, 2004; Reply to: W8MM

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
W8MM said:
Quote:
Holminator said:
Wow! That paint job looks better than the original!

Thanks!

Here's another shot:

Thats a very sharp looking 914, a shame someone didnt appreciate the color.

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Apr 21, 2005 3:14:05 PM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Ryan in SD

Re: What Would You Buy?

ah, the dream garage... always nice to think about it...

here's mine:

- Ferrari F430 Berlinetta
- Porsche 996 GT3 RS
- Lamborghini Miura
- Lotus Esprit (007 white Mk I)

...and an Alpina B5 for rainy days and/or family touring

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Apr 21, 2005 6:53:51 PM

Rossi: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Home , Germany; Posts: 12681, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: zzboba

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
zzboba said:
ah, the dream garage... always nice to think about it...

here's mine:

- Ferrari F430 Berlinetta
- Porsche 996 GT3 RS
- Lamborghini Miura
- Lotus Esprit (007 white Mk I)

...and an Alpina B5 for rainy days and/or family touring

Very good chosen! Nearly same as mine,
change 996 GT3 RS to 997S
and Lotus Esprit to Caterham Superseven,

rest will be the same.

Hey zz, fancy "car sharing"?

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Apr 27, 2005 8:08:09 AM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Rossi

Re: What Would You Buy?

Quote:
Hey zz, fancy "car sharing"?

something like this?
http://www.p1international.com/

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