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Re: [2022] Formula 1
And Red Bull has signed the ABA, Accepted Breach Agreement, for breaching the cost cap. Details will be released later today.
So despite all the misdirections and gaslighting from Horner, he still signed and admit they had cheated. Wonderful human being, he was basically talking and acting like Amber Heard all these time.
By signing the agreement it means there won't be points adjustment for 2021 nor 2022.
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Re: [2022] Formula 1
Whoopsy:By signing the agreement it means there won't be points adjustment for 2021 nor 2022.
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I honestly feel a little bad for Max, two championships and both have an Asterisk beside them for a big chunk for the F1 fanbase. He does not deserve that and its not his fault in either circumstance. Its like the Houston Astros in the US, 2017 still haunts them. They need to win so bad this year.
Oct 28, 2022 2:36:09 PM
- JoeRockhead
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Gauss
Re: [2022] Formula 1
Red Bull has been given a $7 million fine and a reduction on aerodynamic testing in its agreement on its penalty over its Formula 1 cost cap breach in 2021
The Cost Cap Administration recognised that RBR has acted cooperatively throughout the review process and has sought to provide additional information and evidence when requested in a timely manner, that this is the first year of the full application of the Financial Regulations which are a very complex set of rules that competitors were required to adapt to and that there is no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in a fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information from the Cost Cap Administration.
Re: [2022] Formula 1
Nah, I don't think as asterisk is warranted for this year. It has and will always be with 2021 however.
The Red Bull are so far out ahead of the rest of the pack, even cutting 5% of the performance this year still won't matter one bit. Max has matured as a driver and he doesn't do idiotic things like last year, so he will still be crown championship with the rocket ship underneath him. But then again it could be that he knows he has the fastest car so he doesn't have to panic when someone gets close, unlike last year when Hamilton was pushing him to a mental breakdown.last year was a total roller coaster ride for Max, his Red Bull was quickest, pulling out a big lead but then Mercedes and Hamilton came back hard and he had to resort to questionable driving to stay ahead, and still almost lost it all if not for Masi's intervention.
This year is all on merit from the Newey car and Max's driving. Legit win. Clean win. That extra couple millions or whatever isn't gonna make a difference.
Max drove very maturely this year, pushing Leclerc into making mental mistakes, not unlike last year where Hamilton pushed Max into doing the same.
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Re: [2022] Formula 1
Whoopsy:Nah, I don't think as asterisk is warranted for this year. It has and will always be with 2021 however.
Wasn't part of the expenses in 2021 also inclusive of any spending during that period on the 2022 car? HAAS for example did not spend any money developing the 2021 car in the 2021 season to focus on the 2022 car. There was discussion in the later part of the 2021 season that the close battle between Mercedes & RedBull would delay them switching in season to the 2022 car development and that the continued development of the 2021 cars would hurt both going into the 2022 season as a result. So if Mercedes stayed within cap it would hurt them in 2021 season and 2022, and conversely if RedBull overspent in 2021 it would help them in 2021 AND 2022.
Re: [2022] Formula 1
Whatever Red Bull over spent last year is not going to make an iota of difference for this year's car as they are so far out ahead and superior to anything out there.
2021 was a difference story. Even that little bit of extra would have meant an extra front wing upgrade or 2, and that's a big deal in that tight race.
2020 was a trial year, ironing out the 'bugs', if teams have any questions they could have asked for clarifications. Same with 2021, Red Bull could have called up the FIA and ask the whole season, they didn't and use a 'difference in interpretation' as an excuse. It's probably more like they knew they will go over last year, but stye were chasing Max's first title, so they went all in and apply one or two extra upgrades that they really can't afford but they did and will deal with the consequences after. Some creative accounting probably hide enough and make it looks like it was some extra 'catering' expenses or whatever.
For the tiny sum of extra spending last year, how much extra speed they would get out of it this year? 1%? 2%? 5%? That's not going to make a difference to the results. Verstappen sport the rest of the pack by over 10 seconds in the pitstop and he still win in Austin for example. Don't forget, Ferrari can only maintain race pace for 75% of a race, and Mercedes and the rest of the field are in a lower division even. Red Bull cars only need to finish and they will win, most of the time.
So yeah, I really do not think the extra spending went towards 2022 car, it was all about their 2021 car. The 2022 season really is a clean win for Max.
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Re: [2022] Formula 1
Okay so my understanding is correct. 2021 overage would impact 2022, 2023 and so on.. Hence the attempt to claw back on the 10% development time penalty in addition to the fine. I do agree through, looks like RedBull would likely have won in 2022 anyway. Development time etc only is of benefit really if you go down the right development tree.
Re: [2022] Formula 1
https://www.planetf1.com/news/fia-announce-red-bull-fine-and-10-reduction-in-car-development/
Link to the details.
The top billing is their 'tax credits'. Even if those can be used, they are still over by over 400k pounds. Not even counting other stuff, and that's certainly enough for a new wing design.
A slap on the wrist for the $7mil fine. That's not going to hurt at all, cost of doing business.
The 10% reduction for testing time for 2023, also is a slap on the wrist, even when Horner tried to dramatized it by saying it's down to 63% of the median instead of 70%. The heavy lifting of designing the car for the new regulations was done. Whatever testing needed after is just to refine the car. For stuff that they wanted to do with 10 tests, they can certainly get those done in 9 tests, really not a big deal.
Horner certainly weighted his options carefully, between admitting cheating and sign the ABA, or fight it and risk Max losing the title with a points reduction penalty, on top of others, this is certain lesser of 2 evils. he is a very capable negotiator!
It just means next year Ferrari will be this much closer to Red Bull.
One chapter closed. Book is almost finished, just a few races left for 2022.
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Oct 29, 2022 10:31:29 AM
- thuggy
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Carlos from Spain
Re: [2022] Formula 1
I know it’s pretty funny. RedBull breaches, the rest of the teams don’t. They reach an agreement where they officially state they agree they breached, and now Christian plays the victim and wants an apology? Classic gaslighter. 
Well at least this year they wrapped it up early so don’t need to run redline till the end so hopefully no repeat next year.
Oct 29, 2022 6:46:18 PM
- Boxster Coupe GTS
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Oct 30, 2022 1:14:31 AM
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Carlos from Spain
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Oct 30, 2022 2:33:11 AM
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John H
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Carlos from Spain
Re: [2022] Formula 1
Carlos from Spain:Whoopsy:I am beginning to think Horner is the new Flavio.
Horner, Toto, Dennis, Briatore... they are all made of the same stuff to put it politely, I guess the job attracts that kind of people.
Couldn't agree more Carlos...
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Oct 30, 2022 6:11:05 AM
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Whoopsy
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Carlos from Spain
Re: [2022] Formula 1
Carlos from Spain:Whoopsy:I am beginning to think Horner is the new Flavio.
Horner, Toto, Dennis, Briatore... they are all made of the same stuff to put it politely, I guess the job attracts that kind of people.
While Toto isn't a squeaky clean one, the other 3 is well above him.
One can hate him all them want, but Toto do run a straight and narrow ship at Mercedes. It was why they are so successful.
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not really impressed based on the amount of races per season.Oct 31, 2022 10:09:23 AM
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Carlos from Spain
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Oct 31, 2022 2:56:41 PM
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Whoopsy
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Re: [2022] Formula 1
As far back as one can count, the F1 Championship has always been about the car more than the driver.
Whichever team has the fastest car will have the greatest chance of producing a driver's champion. it's not even a secret, F1 is a constructor's series, driver title is just incidental. Good drivers will wish they can get into the fastest car, the fastest car team will also wanted to have the best drivers lineup.
Some great drivers will luck out and be at the right team at the right time, thus producing one or multiple driver's titles. The one offs? Button with Brawn is the most recent one. While others won't as they will be stuck in mid field teams or worse. Not that those are any less capable. Put Alonso in either the Ferrari, Red Bull or Mercedes in the last couple years, he will surely be up there within striking distance of the driver's title if not win it.
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Re: [2022] Formula 1
Whoopsy:As far back as one can count, the F1 Championship has always been about the car more than the driver.
Whichever team has the fastest car will have the greatest chance of producing a driver's champion. it's not even a secret, F1 is a constructor's series, driver title is just incidental. Good drivers will wish they can get into the fastest car, the fastest car team will also wanted to have the best drivers lineup.
Some great drivers will luck out and be at the right team at the right time, thus producing one or multiple driver's titles. The one offs? Button with Brawn is the most recent one. While others won't as they will be stuck in mid field teams or worse. Not that those are any less capable. Put Alonso in either the Ferrari, Red Bull or Mercedes in the last couple years, he will surely be up there within striking distance of the driver's title if not win it.
I defintely agree with that!
Re: [2022] Formula 1
Josef:Whoopsy:. Put Alonso in either the Ferrari, Red Bull or Mercedes in the last couple years, he will surely be up there within striking distance of the driver's title if not win it.I defintely agree with that!
Imagine Alonso at MB, he'd crush Lewee. He hasn't lost that much with age
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