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Board: Porsche - 911 - 997 Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

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    Mar 2, 2005 7:37:47 AM

    vtrader
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    Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Did anyone else notice January sales? Besides the 987(S) during very well, the base 997 accounted for two-thirds of the 997/S sales in the US. The 997 sold 242 units and the 997S sold only 150 units. From previous months, the 997 sales have been trending up. Considering that the USA is the largest Porsche market accounting for at least 40% of Porsche worldwide sales, is the 997 more popular than the 997S?

    Mar 2, 2005 12:05:45 PM

    Rossi
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    Reply to: vtrader

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    Did anyone else notice January sales? Besides the 987(S) during very well, the base 997 accounted for two-thirds of the 997/S sales in the US. The 997 sold 242 units and the 997S sold only 150 units. From previous months, the 997 sales have been trending up. Considering that the USA is the largest Porsche market accounting for at least 40% of Porsche worldwide sales, is the 997 more popular than the 997S?


    Strange, I would have expected it to be the other way round. Anybody knows the 997:997S ratio in Germany?

    Mar 2, 2005 12:15:46 PM

    Ron (Houston)M
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    Reply to: vtrader

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    Did anyone else notice January sales? Besides the 987(S) during very well, the base 997 accounted for two-thirds of the 997/S sales in the US. The 997 sold 242 units and the 997S sold only 150 units. From previous months, the 997 sales have been trending up. Considering that the USA is the largest Porsche market accounting for at least 40% of Porsche worldwide sales, is the 997 more popular than the 997S?



    I believe 997 is more available than 997S. When the buyer goes to the dealership and no 997S is available, since majority of them are ready to open the check book, they buy the available cars in the showroom rather than waiting for few months.

    Couple months ago I mentioned that for each 997S that the dealers order they have to accept/buy few Boxsters, Cayennes, and 997 Standard from Porsche, per Sales rep. statement. So selling more 997 is actually good for them.

    Mar 2, 2005 1:08:17 PM

    vtrader
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    Reply to: Ron (Houston)M

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:

    I believe 997 is more available than 997S. When the buyer goes to the dealership and no 997S is available, since majority of them are ready to open the check book, they buy the available cars in the showroom rather than waiting for few months.

    Couple months ago I mentioned that for each 997S that the dealers order they have to accept/buy few Boxsters, Cayennes, and 997 Standard from Porsche, per Sales rep. statement. So selling more 997 is actually good for them.



    In the beginning, there were more 997S's sold than 997's, so it is possible that they had to accept (or better yet their allocation) was 1 S for every non-S. But now it is completely reverse where it is 1 S for every 2 non-S. Just does not make any sense unless the non-S is requested more in the USA and just maybe for the ROW, it could be reversed. Too bad Porsche does not publish ROW figures until the end of the MY year.

    Mar 2, 2005 1:37:10 PM

    69bossnine
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    Reply to: vtrader

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    I concur that it has everything to do with on-the-showroom-floor availability. I think a year's worth of sales is the minimum you could use to paint an accurate picture.

    Mar 2, 2005 3:30:15 PM

    PS CA Offline
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    Reply to: vtrader

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    The salesman at my dealership (in the top 5 in USA) told me that they have sold their entire S allocation (coupes and cabs) for model year 2005. If you want an S from them it will be a 2006. They still have 2005 allocation for non-S coupes and cabs. So, the recent surge for the non-S models may be because in many cases it is the only car you can get unless you are willing to wait until October. So, even if the non-S versions ultimately outsell the S versions, it may have more to do with lack of S models than the non-S being more popular.

    Phil

    Mar 2, 2005 3:35:07 PM

    MMD
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    Reply to: 69bossnine

    What motivates order/wait vs. see/buy?

    Quote:
    69bossnine said:
    I concur that it has everything to do with on-the-showroom-floor availability.



    Yeah, it's funny how all the bases are covered.

    What's the psychology? On the 997/S boards we all seem normal to order and wait (and wait) for the cars we want.

    The guy who walks in and buys off the showroom floor the street just wants..., what?

    Geez, maybe we're too frickin fussy?

    What percentage of Porsche buyers are as picky as we seem to be on these boards?

    What percentage of Porsche cars are bought off the showroom floor?

    Mar 2, 2005 3:57:57 PM

    vtrader
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    Reply to: MMD

    Re: What motivates order/wait vs. see/buy?

    The question is: Everyone knows that to get a 997S, you would have to wait longer than for a standard 997. Porsche knows this also, but are they reducing allocations of the 997S or is there just stronger demand for the non-S? Or are they trying to make the S more exclusive? It does not make sense that if the S is in more demand that they reduce allocations instead of increasing them. Remember when they first came out, they had more S's available than non-S's.

    Mar 2, 2005 4:34:29 PM

    SrfCity
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    Reply to: vtrader

    Re: What motivates order/wait vs. see/buy?

    Maybe P is just trying to balance out sales forecasts so it would seem there are more non S's available being pushed and sold. The possible predetermined sales forecast ratio of S vs non-S allows for a certain amount of marketing and availability issues that help increase demand. Anyway, it's part of their strategy.

    Mar 2, 2005 6:24:59 PM

    Texas911
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    Reply to: SrfCity

    Re: What motivates order/wait vs. see/buy?

    Probably just ran out of parts like wheels or exhaust or engine parts. Who knows?

    Mar 2, 2005 9:00:40 PM

    PS CA Offline
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    Reply to: vtrader

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Here is some info I found at www.wintonsworld.com:

    Boxster - significant costs savings on the new Boxster allow prices to be 9 per cent lower for the standard model and 6 per cent down for the "S" when adjusted for content, with no negative impact on margins. The Boxster annual sales target of 15,000 is very conservative. A coupe Boxster has the potential to double sales.

    Cayenne - Demand is exceeding capacity, but Porsche has no plans to exceed the current 40,000 output. V8 and Turbo sales remain between 20,000 and 30,000, with the V6 at 10,000 to 20,000.

    New 911 - Orders above expectations with basic C2 sold out for 6 months and C2S for 9 months.

    Fourth Model - Segment, design and volume targets have all been agreed by Porsche's board. Porsche has yet to decide whether to build the new car itself, or share it with another manufacturer or supplier.

    Phil

    Mar 2, 2005 9:08:39 PM

    MMD
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    Reply to: Texas911

    Re: What motivates order/wait vs. see/buy?

    Quote:
    Texas911 said:
    Probably just ran out of parts like wheels or exhaust or engine parts. Who knows?



    No no. Can't be simple. It's gotta be some MBA team that's gonna **** with everything to squeeze as much immediate profit and long term demand as possible by manipulating every variable at hand.

    At the core is that they know the guys who want an S will order and wait and the guys who want a car NOW will buy a non-S off the showroom floor. They think they'd lose a good number of "impulse buyers" if they can't have the P-car now.

    Hence they produce more non-S because otherwise we'd buy all the Ss as soon as they arrived.

    Mar 2, 2005 10:04:47 PM

    nberry Offline
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    Reply to: Ron (Houston)M

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    Did anyone else notice January sales? Besides the 987(S) during very well, the base 997 accounted for two-thirds of the 997/S sales in the US. The 997 sold 242 units and the 997S sold only 150 units. From previous months, the 997 sales have been trending up. Considering that the USA is the largest Porsche market accounting for at least 40% of Porsche worldwide sales, is the 997 more popular than the 997S?



    I believe 997 is more available than 997S. When the buyer goes to the dealership and no 997S is available, since majority of them are ready to open the check book, they buy the available cars in the showroom rather than waiting for few months.

    Couple months ago I mentioned that for each 997S that the dealers order they have to accept/buy few Boxsters, Cayennes, and 997 Standard from Porsche, per Sales rep. statement. So selling more 997 is actually good for them.



    Ron you are right on the money. The demand is clearly for the S but Porsche is extracting a price for the allocation. Many dealers stock the 996 facelifted 997 and restrict their orders for the performance S because of the requirement of floor planning other difficult to sell models.

    BTW, I believe Porsche is holding back on the 997 TT in order to squeeze as many orders out of the 997S. Once the TT is announced, many S's will be turned in and far fewer ordered.

    Mar 2, 2005 11:12:25 PM

    Texas911
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    Reply to: nberry

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Why should Porsche wait on the TT? Wouldn't they want to sell more higher priced and higher margin cars than less expensive models? I think you should compare it to is the Cayman.

    Mar 3, 2005 10:54:33 AM

    Dilinger
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    Reply to: Texas911

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    All of these opinions really stand out with some arguments, but is it really so important to play detectives here?
    Just wondering...

    Mar 3, 2005 3:17:48 PM

    MMD
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    Reply to: Dilinger

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    Dilinger said:
    All of these opinions really stand out with some arguments, but is it really so important to play detectives here?
    Just wondering...



    It's something to do which makes me look busy and annoyed at work so people hesitate come to me with _their_ problems (and ostensibly try to solve them themselves).

    Mar 3, 2005 3:36:41 PM

    RCA
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    Reply to: Rossi

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Strange, I would have expected it to be the other way round. Anybody knows the 997:997S ratio in Germany?



    As far as I heard, in Germany it is the other way around:
    2/3 Carrera S and 1/3 Carrera. I'm talking about customer demand/orders at dealers. With the Cabriolet versions, it seems the other way around: more 997 Carrera Cab demanded than Carrera S Cabs.

    Personally, I think that people like the 997 look, even if it isn't spectacular but almost all people I talked to find it too expensive for the power it delivers.

    Mar 3, 2005 5:53:27 PM

    nberry Offline
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    Reply to: Texas911

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    Texas911 said:
    Why should Porsche wait on the TT? Wouldn't they want to sell more higher priced and higher margin cars than less expensive models? I think you should compare it to is the Cayman.



    You do not introduce a new model and then provide a competitor against it within your model line. The S needs to pay for itself before enticing Porschephiles with the TT. They buy the S waiting for the TT. It works everytime for Porsche. They make a lot of money marketing their line of cars in this fashion.

    Mar 3, 2005 7:08:43 PM

    PS CA Offline
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    Reply to: nberry

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Texas911 said:
    Why should Porsche wait on the TT? Wouldn't they want to sell more higher priced and higher margin cars than less expensive models? I think you should compare it to is the Cayman.



    You do not introduce a new model and then provide a competitor against it within your model line. The S needs to pay for itself before enticing Porschephiles with the TT. They buy the S waiting for the TT. It works everytime for Porsche. They make a lot of money marketing their line of cars in this fashion.



    Porsche is not the only company that does that. Look at Corvette. First the C6 coupe, later the C6 convertible and finally the Z06. BMW does it with their M series. Mercedes does it with their AMG's. Even the Ford Mustang has come out with the coupe first, followed by the convertible and later additional versions.

    Phil

    Mar 3, 2005 7:44:49 PM

    Carlos from SpainM
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    Reply to: RCA

    Re: Did anyone else notice January Sales?

    Quote:
    RC said:
    As far as I heard, in Germany it is the other way around:
    2/3 Carrera S and 1/3 Carrera. I'm talking about customer demand/orders at dealers.



    Same for Spain.
     
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