Crown

Agree. Fantastic and very impressive car, but I can’t believe downforce at low speeds is anything other than miniscule.

2019 911 GT3 RS,1964 Type 1

Don’t forget the first man powered airplane, the Gossamer Condor, flew between 10 to 11 mph so even at slow speeds aerodynamic forces are present.  Whilst McLaren hasn’t divulged much on the aerodynamics package, the location of the exhaust could work in cooperation with the rear wing much like the blown diffuser did on McLaren’s F1 cars.  

CGX car nut:

Don’t forget the first man powered airplane, the Gossamer Condor, flew between 10 to 11 mph so even at slow speeds aerodynamic forces are present.  Whilst McLaren hasn’t divulged much on the aerodynamics package, the location of the exhaust could work in cooperation with the rear wing much like the blown diffuser did on McLaren’s F1 cars.  

When I was in High School, I had a semester internship with the founder of that company, Paul McCready.  Was a good time 

I built some flying radio controlled glider prototypes with them.

--

18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

Wow!  What a tremendous learning opportunity. AeroVironment pioneered low speed aerodynamics.  I never had the chance to work with them; however, I worked with the chief aerodynamicist of Scaled Composites and the former president of Piper Aircraft.  Every once in awhile I get the urge to build a microfilm model to fly in the great room.  
 

Returning to the subject, I do wish that McLaren would follow Ferrari’s lead and publish more information on its aerodynamics.  

CGX car nut:

Wow!  What a tremendous learning opportunity. AeroVironment pioneered low speed aerodynamics.  I never had the chance to work with them; however, I worked with the chief aerodynamicist of Scaled Composites and the former president of Piper Aircraft.  Every once in awhile I get the urge to build a microfilm model to fly in the great room.  

Very cool 

18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

Grant:

CGX car nut:

DaveGordon:

How could aero help with traction off the line? 

As the 765LT moves away from the line the rear spoiler rises into its air brake position to increase rear axle loading.  Aerodynamic forces are present with air flow of any velocity other than zero, albeit those forces increase with the square of the velocity.  Even a small amount of downforce helps provide increased traction over the 720.  As the car continues to accelerate, the rear spoiler retracts to mitigate the increase in drag associated with the increasing downforce. 

But maybe I'm wrong - whatever they're doing, it seems to be f***ing fast 

--

 

18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

 

2 in it as well, 1 in the 720

Blonde sort weighing in at around 58kilo 

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

991 GT3.2 pick up April/May 2018. ( Hairy Chest Spec ).

Vauxhall Zafira 1.6 Exclusive pick up June 2013. ( Shit Box )

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

Same dyno:

720S 659 WHP

765LT 769 WHP

At 13% drivetrain loss it's about 885HP

These US dynos are pretty useless at measuring manufacturer engine power, a 6 or 7 second power run on a turbo car really does not cut it. The talk of 100+ more WHP than the 720 means nothing whatsoever in relation to manufacturer measured braked engine dyno hp.

Wait until one of these is measured on a MAHA dyno, I think it will be more than 765PS but only by 20PS maximum

997 GT2 2014 3.9 Mezger, 800PS @ 1.2 bar

2021 McLaren 765LT incoming 

993 Turbo, 2006 built 3.8, 577PS/797NM, 1440kg DIN sold to a worthy enthusiast.

I agree that chassis dynos are notoriously inaccurate, but since same dyno, there should be some validity to the delta.  Unless the runs were far apart in time with significant changes to conditions or calibration...

18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

They are saying 110hp more than the 720 on that dyno so I guess 720+110 = 830..... I am thinking it may have the same output as the Senna so it is ballpark right 

997 GT2 2014 3.9 Mezger, 800PS @ 1.2 bar

2021 McLaren 765LT incoming 

993 Turbo, 2006 built 3.8, 577PS/797NM, 1440kg DIN sold to a worthy enthusiast.

TB993tt:

They are saying 110hp more than the 720 on that dyno so I guess 720+110 = 830..... I am thinking it may have the same output as the Senna so it is ballpark right 

Do you think Mclaren knows what Brooks does with his cars and sent him a HOT one?  I would. 

a sales booster 

Leawood911:

TB993tt:

They are saying 110hp more than the 720 on that dyno so I guess 720+110 = 830..... I am thinking it may have the same output as the Senna so it is ballpark right 

Do you think Mclaren knows what Brooks does with his cars and sent him a HOT one?  I would. 

 This wouldn't be entirely new...  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)

Leawood911:

TB993tt:

They are saying 110hp more than the 720 on that dyno so I guess 720+110 = 830..... I am thinking it may have the same output as the Senna so it is ballpark right 

Do you think Mclaren knows what Brooks does with his cars and sent him a HOT one?  I would. 

That did occur to me yes 

997 GT2 2014 3.9 Mezger, 800PS @ 1.2 bar

2021 McLaren 765LT incoming 

993 Turbo, 2006 built 3.8, 577PS/797NM, 1440kg DIN sold to a worthy enthusiast.

LIGHTNING LAP 2021

.........................................2021 McLaren 765LT: 2:38.4 onboard
...............................2021 Porsche 911 Turbo S: 2:42.5 onboard
..................2020 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500: 2:44.6 onboard
....................2020 Lamborghini Huracan EVO: 2:45.0 onboard
............2020 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray Z51: 2:49.0 onboard
.....................2020 Porsche 718 Cayman GT4: 2:50.3 onboard
.........................2020 Porsche Taycan Turbo S: 2:55.2 onboard
..............................2020 BMW M8 Competition: 2:55.5 onboard
............................2020 Mercedes-AMG CLA45: 2:58.2 onboard
......................................2021 Toyota Supra 3.0: 2:59.3 onboard
........................................2021 Jaguar F-type R: 2:59.5 onboard
...............................................2020 BMW M340i: 3:03.2 onboard
......................................2019 Subaru STI S209: 3:03.4 onboard
.................2021 Mini John Cooper Works GP: 3:03.8 onboard
.........................................2020 Cadillac CT5-V: 3:04.1 onboard
2020 Ford Mustang 2.3L High Performance: 3:04.4 onboard
.........................................2020 Cadillac CT4-V: 3:06.2 onboard
......................................2021 Toyota Supra 2.0: 3:09.0 onboard

3rd - 2020 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500

Lap Time: 2:44.6

The GT500 has an intimidating amount of muscle underhood—enough to make you check your shorts. (If you haven't heard, it's the most powerful production car ever to come out of Dearborn.) The Mustang tests your mettle on every stretch of pavement. If you're brave enough to keep your foot in it, though, this 760-hp pony car will give you the ride of your life.

2nd - 2021 Porsche 911 Turbo S

Lap Time: 2:42.5

It isn't breaking news that 911 Turbos are fast, or that we love them. This 2021 Turbo S, packing a 640-hp twin-turbo 3.7-liter flat-six, delivers 60 more horses than the last generation's 3.8-liter. This latest Turbo S bursts out of Turn 1 at 82.2 mph, the fastest speed we've ever recorded. What caught our attention, though, is that it broke into the all-time top 10 with relatively ordinary summer tires. What might it do with track rubber?  

1st - 2021 McLaren 765LT

Lap Time: 2:38.4

Best lap time of the year? Check. Third-fastest of our 14 Lightning Laps? Yep. Is 174.6 mph on the front straight any good? It is. In fact, that's the highest speed we've recorded at VIR. The 765LT's 2:38.4 time lands it just behind the McLaren Senna and the Porsche 911 GT2 RS Weissach. What's crazy is we probably left a few tenths on the track. Always read the manual, friends. You never know what you'll find in there.  

Grant:

I agree that chassis dynos are notoriously inaccurate, but since same dyno, there should be some validity to the delta.  Unless the runs were far apart in time with significant changes to conditions or calibration...

During some days of the year, the morning, noon, evening temperature could easily be at least 20 degree difference on any given day and 20 degree difference for turbo intake temp is a lot.

Tires:

2021 McLaren 765LT: Pirelli P Zero Trofeo R
2021 Porsche 911 Turbo S: Pirelli P Zero PZ4
2020 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500: Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2
2020 Lamborghini Huracan EVO: Pirelli P Zero Trofeo R
2020 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray Z51: Michelin Pilot Sport 4S ZP
2020 Porsche 718 Cayman GT4: Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2
2020 Porsche Taycan Turbo S: Pirelli P Zero PZ4 Elect
2020 BMW M8 Competition: Michelin Pilot Sport 4S
2020 Mercedes-AMG CLA45: Pirelli P Zero Trofeo R
2021 Toyota Supra 3.0: Pirelli P Zero PZ4
2021 Jaguar F-type R: Michelin Pilot Super Sport
2020 BMW M340i: Michelin Pilot Sport 4S
2019 Subaru STI S209: Dunlop SP Sport Maxx GT 600 A
2021 Mini John Cooper Works GP: Hankook Ventus S1 Evo Z
2020 Cadillac CT5-V: Michelin Pilot Sport 4S ZP
2020 Ford Mustang 2.3L High Performance: Pirelli P Zero Corsa PZC4
2020 Cadillac CT4-V: Continental SportContact 6 SSR
2021 Toyota Supra 2.0: Michelin Pilot Super Sport

Because of the excellent Porsche GT cars, people always overlook the turbo S.

turbo Ss are always up there somewhere in comparisons, maybe not the best best, but it can hold it's own.

They are the best all around sports car. Bar none. Nothing come close. Multi-role too, you want a canyon carver, it can be one, you want a highway eater, it is so too, even compliant enough for day to day city driving on bumpy roads.

Whoopsy:

Because of the excellent Porsche GT cars, people always overlook the turbo S.

turbo Ss are always up there somewhere in comparisons, maybe not the best best, but it can hold it's own.

They are the best all around sports car. Bar none. Nothing come close. Multi-role too, you want a canyon carver, it can be one, you want a highway eater, it is so too, even compliant enough for day to day city driving on bumpy roads.

They have a huge breadth of ability for sure.  They do everything well, but only a couple things great (like crossing a continent at high speed in any weather). 

And they can crush a race track (along with its tires), but your pulse will barely be above its resting state.

I think a Boxster 4.0 with Manual is probably much more satisfying as a canyon carver, for instance.

--

18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

I get my kicks from the lateral Gs pulled on corners. The rest are just a build up to the next sets of corners. 

But yes, it's nice to hear an engine sing to 9000rpm, but that's still secondary to lateral Gs. 

If one car can do 9000 rpm but can only pull 0.5G while another is muffled by turbos or silenced but can pull 0.9+G all day long, I will take the later. 

I am warming up to the capability of the silent Taycan 

For me, I get the most fun when playing with a car at the limit.  It’s not that important to me where that limit is (even fun at very low speeds on slippery surfaces at low lateral g’s) 

It is important to me that the car is super responsive to my inputs with lots of feel and feedback - makes dancing near the limit much more satisfying.

Playing at the limit in a Turbo S on public roads is usually pretty irresponsible or worse - I know I couldn’t do it safely in almost any conditions.

18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

Whoopsy:

Because of the excellent Porsche GT cars, people always overlook the turbo S.

turbo Ss are always up there somewhere in comparisons, maybe not the best best, but it can hold it's own.

They are the best all around sports car. Bar none. Nothing come close. Multi-role too, you want a canyon carver, it can be one, you want a highway eater, it is so too, even compliant enough for day to day city driving on bumpy roads.

 

 

1000% agree - and if they would take a wet lap time and average the times - it would shuffle the deck massively.

Whoopsy:

Because of the excellent Porsche GT cars, people always overlook the turbo S.

turbo Ss are always up there somewhere in comparisons, maybe not the best best, but it can hold it's own.

They are the best all around sports car. Bar none. Nothing come close. Multi-role too, you want a canyon carver, it can be one, you want a highway eater, it is so too, even compliant enough for day to day city driving on bumpy roads.

 

 

fully agree.....has always been one of the most complete sportscars since all wheel drive was introduced to it.

and its also one of the easiest to own and drive.....a perfect product in many ways.

Grant:

For me, I get the most fun when playing with a car at the limit.  It’s not that important to me where that limit is (even fun at very low speeds on slippery surfaces at low lateral g’s) 

It is important to me that the car is super responsive to my inputs with lots of feel and feedback - makes dancing near the limit much more satisfying.

Playing at the limit in a Turbo S on public roads is usually pretty irresponsible or worse - I know I couldn’t do it safely in almost any conditions.

Grant:

For me, I get the most fun when playing with a car at the limit.  It’s not that important to me where that limit is (even fun at very low speeds on slippery surfaces at low lateral g’s) 

It is important to me that the car is super responsive to my inputs with lots of feel and feedback - makes dancing near the limit much more satisfying.

Playing at the limit in a Turbo S on public roads is usually pretty irresponsible or worse - I know I couldn’t do it safely in almost any conditions.

I did a lot of dumb stuff in my cars when I was younger and I have to say that on public roads, the stupid stuff has basically disappeared. Mostly because I am more mature now and understand what can happen but also because of experience and...why should I lie...fear. Yes, I am scared to do my stunts on public roads anymore, actually anywhere, probably really has something to do with age (and a certain cost perspective ).

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)

RC:

Grant:

For me, I get the most fun when playing with a car at the limit.  It’s not that important to me where that limit is (even fun at very low speeds on slippery surfaces at low lateral g’s) 

It is important to me that the car is super responsive to my inputs with lots of feel and feedback - makes dancing near the limit much more satisfying.

Playing at the limit in a Turbo S on public roads is usually pretty irresponsible or worse - I know I couldn’t do it safely in almost any conditions.

I did a lot of dumb stuff in my cars when I was younger and I have to say that on public roads, the stupid stuff has basically disappeared. Mostly because I am more mature now and understand what can happen but also because of experience and...why should I lie...fear. Yes, I am scared to do my stunts on public roads anymore, actually anywhere, probably really has something to do with age (and a certain cost perspective ).

As you gain speed you think of your kiddies. Suddenly becomes not worth it 

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

991 GT3.2 pick up April/May 2018. ( Hairy Chest Spec ).

Vauxhall Zafira 1.6 Exclusive pick up June 2013. ( Shit Box )

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

throt:

RC:

Grant:

For me, I get the most fun when playing with a car at the limit.  It’s not that important to me where that limit is (even fun at very low speeds on slippery surfaces at low lateral g’s) 

It is important to me that the car is super responsive to my inputs with lots of feel and feedback - makes dancing near the limit much more satisfying.

Playing at the limit in a Turbo S on public roads is usually pretty irresponsible or worse - I know I couldn’t do it safely in almost any conditions.

I did a lot of dumb stuff in my cars when I was younger and I have to say that on public roads, the stupid stuff has basically disappeared. Mostly because I am more mature now and understand what can happen but also because of experience and...why should I lie...fear. Yes, I am scared to do my stunts on public roads anymore, actually anywhere, probably really has something to do with age (and a certain cost perspective ).

As you gain speed you think of your kiddies. Suddenly becomes not worth it 

Actually I was talking about money...  My last serious track experience left me with a 4000 EUR bill...I needed two new rims (this happens when you slide through gravel  and it is so bad that it cannot be repaired). Not worth it.

Also, most of the track experiences I would be interested in are way too expensive, they start at 5000 EUR and more, I really need the money for different stuff, not willing to pay that much anymore to make my ego happy. 

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)

5k for a track experience? What kind of trackdays are those? 👀

997.2 4S / BMW 745e / Donkervoort GT 

spudgun:

5k for a track experience? What kind of trackdays are those? 👀

Porsche runs some very fancy ones with Cup cars and 918s, and people like Mark Weber giving you tips.  These can cost 50k.. 

Think some forum members might have been on them 

2019 911 GT3 RS,1964 Type 1

spudgun:

5k for a track experience? What kind of trackdays are those? 👀

e.g. Curbstone, 2 days at Monza in March is more than 5k€ . Tracks in general have raised their prices this year for obvious reasons