Crown

Base model...Taycan. 

Starting price (with smaller battery) slightly under 90k as far as I heard.

4S is 106k in Germany (all prices incl. 19% VAT).

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)

Yeah, makes sense. 

Porsche, separates Le Mans from Le Boys

The same Taycan they are selling in China - 300kW, rear wheel drive.

911tts:

The same Taycan they are selling in China - 300kW, rear wheel drive.

Oh, forgot about it...yes, exactly. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)

Porsche Taycan Turbo vs Porsche 911 GT3 RS vs Porsche 911 GT3 Cup

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhTpj0b7WC0

I wonder how many calculations it took to make the outcome appear like this?  You can’t seriously think this was a win by the Taycan?  I mean, I love me an EV but this was a joke. This is how Porsche advertising works?  You know who not advertising looks pretty good to me right now.  Stay tuned for the next S in a few days. 

Leawood911:

I wonder how many calculations it took to make the outcome appear like this?  You can’t seriously think this was a win by the Taycan?  I mean, I love me an EV but this was a joke. This is how Porsche advertising works?  You know who not advertising looks pretty good to me right now.  Stay tuned for the next S in a few days. 

Of course there was some marketing involved but the Taycan Turbo is a very fast car on the track...at least for a round or two. Then, the heavy weight and the tires/brakes "kick" in. 

Drive a Taycan Turbo, it is not comparable to any Tesla you have driven. It (almost) feels like a 911.

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)

I was not talking Tesla but the model3 performance takes the Taycan 4s at the track. Not the Turbo of course. 

schmoell:

having driven all three cars, I just can't believe that rubbish

 

 

Taycan got a big head start over the other two.

Mike

918 Spyder + Taycan Turbo + Tesla Roadster 1.5 & Model S P100D AP2 + BMWs (Z8 + 3.0 CSi) + Bentley Arnage T

Base Taycan MSRP for the States is $79,900 with rear wheel drive and standard battery pack.  An extended battery pack and air suspension are available options.  Not sure who the target market is for this one. 

Leawood911:

I was not talking Tesla but the model3 performance takes the Taycan 4s at the track. Not the Turbo of course. 

Think that was a heavily tuned and modified Model 3..........

Has anyone on RT had a chance to see the MB EQS yet?

schmoell:

having driven all three cars, I just can't believe that rubbish

 

 

It is less rubbish than you think:

1. AWD

2. Instant throttle response

3. Much better acceleration on straights

Tires and breaks won't keep up for long of course but this wasn't the purpose of this video. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)

Whoopsy:

Leawood911:

I was not talking Tesla but the model3 performance takes the Taycan 4s at the track. Not the Turbo of course. 

 

Think that was a heavily tuned and modified Model 3..........

Bone stock. there is no way to modify a model3. Lol. 
I wish we could go do a little race. 

I showed my wife the recent email from Porsche USA introducing the base Taycan.  She said "it's electric?  So no rumbly sounds.  What's the point, just get a Tesla."  My wife has two car rules--no BMW and no Tesla and her second priority is that it goes fast when she floors it.  (Her first is that it be blue.)  She's probably much more indicative of the overall market than most of us here and just spells out the trouble for all higher end marques in an EV world.

Leawood911:

Whoopsy:

Leawood911:

I was not talking Tesla but the model3 performance takes the Taycan 4s at the track. Not the Turbo of course. 

 

Think that was a heavily tuned and modified Model 3..........

Bone stock. there is no way to modify a model3. Lol. 
I wish we could go do a little race. 

That would be the the wrong information. Or a lie.

Rennlist has someone that heavily modified their Model 3 on tracking Laguna Seca. Also more tuners are doing Model 3 mods. Randy Pobst ran Pikes on a modified Model 3 also. 

Model 3 isn't lacking in power, it just can't handle as Tesla don't know how to design suspensions for handling, this is where the aftermarket people comes in. 

I am waiting for the day there is a Tesla one make race series where they can learn how to make a car handle. 

If you know of some way to tune a model3 let me know.  Randy removed weight and tuned the suspension. Let me know if you know of anything else before you call people liars. Unnecessary.  And yes a stock model3 performance out handles the Taycan 4s. I am waiting for when Porsche can make a Taycan handle as well as a Model3 performance. You would think they would be very humble having even beaten by a Tesla. 
In the test in question it was a stock car. It would be happy to race you as well.  Before you disparage Tesla suspension you might want to be certain your Porsche is actually quicker. 
Let me remind you that Modified Porsches have also raced other cars that does not mean that all Porsches raced are modified. 

We need a N. American Rennteam meet up If Trudeau ever opens up the border

Leawood911:

If you know of some way to tune a model3 let me know.  Randy removed weight and tuned the suspension. Let me know if you know of anything else before you call people liars. Unnecessary.  And yes a stock model3 performance out handles the Taycan 4s. I am waiting for when Porsche can make a Taycan handle as well as a Model3 performance. You would think they would be very humble having even beaten by a Tesla. 
In the test in question it was a stock car. It would be happy to race you as well.  Before you disparage Tesla suspension you might want to be certain your Porsche is actually quicker. 
Let me remind you that Modified Porsches have also raced other cars that does not mean that all Porsches raced are modified. 

"Out handles"? You definitely gone of the deep end Leawood 

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

Carlos from Spain:

Leawood911:

If you know of some way to tune a model3 let me know.  Randy removed weight and tuned the suspension. Let me know if you know of anything else before you call people liars. Unnecessary.  And yes a stock model3 performance out handles the Taycan 4s. I am waiting for when Porsche can make a Taycan handle as well as a Model3 performance. You would think they would be very humble having even beaten by a Tesla. 
In the test in question it was a stock car. It would be happy to race you as well.  Before you disparage Tesla suspension you might want to be certain your Porsche is actually quicker. 
Let me remind you that Modified Porsches have also raced other cars that does not mean that all Porsches raced are modified. 

"Out handles"? You definitely gone of the deep end Leawood 

Poor word choice. I should have said better lap time.  Don’t worry about the deep end. I can swim. And if I’m going to spend money I want a better and faster driving experience, not just a bunch of buttons and ancient tech.  
On my drive to the lake will the Porsche make me drive?  Or can I just let it do the work?  (I say this just to trigger more deep end alerts - yes the autopilot is getting very very  good and as you know I do not have full self driving. ). 
 

Actually I have not driven the Taycan but I plan on it if the dealer will allow me. To be seen. The Model3 runs circles around my old turbo. Big time. No way it can match the low center of gravity. The Tesla has a very modern and sophisticated suspension and it really corners well for a sedan. You can update the shocks and lower it. As it stands stock it will take an M3. 
How deep is that deep end you are in?

My wife and I just completed our 1st "long-distance" EV trip to visit her brother & his wife.  The destination was Findlay, OH, located just off an interstate freeway in the middle of nowhere.  

We went through some careful planning in deciding to chose between her Tesla Model S P100D and my Taycan Turbo.  After reviewing the distance (161 miles from Cincinnati), considering low temperatures and the precipitation outlook, we started looking on the web for fast charger availability.

Not even close.  The Tesla and their supercharger network won the day.  There wasn't any possible route that made sense with the Taycan without adding serious trip time with severe range anxiety.  The Electrify America 350kW charging infrastructure is so very sparse in the middle of nowhere (it is OK at major city end-points), but the Tesla network had reasonable intervals along interstate highways.

We elected to stop for 30 minutes in Lima (pronounced Lie-mah, bigger than a dorf, but not a big city) at an 8-spot Supercharger next to a Hampton Inn on the way there.  We were the only car using it.    We arrived in good spirits.

When we began our return, the P100D navigation display mentioned we would have to limit our speed to 65 mph to have 5% charge remaining on arrival at home.   After a bit of driving through precipitation (winter mix), the suggested speed dropped to 60 mph and I became worried that more precipitation drag along the route would make things even worse.  So, we stopped at the Lima Supercharger once again for 30 minutes.  With the additional charge, we could drive 70 mph for the duration and not worry about running out of battery.  We arrived a little later than planned because of the "extra" charging stop.  In Summer, in the dry, we probably wouldn't need the 2nd charging stop.

Some day, the 350 kW J1772/CCS-connector charging infrastructure will be built out enough to make this kind of trip in the Taycan no big deal.  For now, Tesla has an important head start that will sway a lot of customers while the other brands play catch-up. 

Mike

918 Spyder + Taycan Turbo + Tesla Roadster 1.5 & Model S P100D AP2 + BMWs (Z8 + 3.0 CSi) + Bentley Arnage T

WOW. Having to go through all those calculations (+stress) isn’t worthy of any car. 

The only easy day was yesterday..

nberry:

WOW. Having to go through all those calculations (+stress) isn’t worthy of any car. 

I think what Mike pointed out is that this is an important factor and with the Tesla his only worry was if he should make that extra stop, which was not out of the way and which the car directs you to do.  The car does the calculations, you only worry about what you don’t understand.  My range anxiety for long trips is non existent.  If I had the Taycan - well for many reasons I do not  

If Tesla ever buys Ford, for instance, they could open their chargers for Ford products giving them a lot of additional value. 
 

Leawood911:

nberry:

WOW. Having to go through all those calculations (+stress) isn’t worthy of any car. 

I think what Mike pointed out is that this is an important factor and with the Tesla his only worry was if he should make that extra stop, which was not out of the way and which the car directs you to do.  The car does the calculations, you only worry about what you don’t understand.  My range anxiety for long trips is non existent.  If I had the Taycan - well for many reasons I do not  

If Tesla ever buys Ford, for instance, they could open their chargers for Ford products giving them a lot of additional value. 
 

Wishful thinking once again.  Tesla uses a proprietary charging system, although, it has started to adopt the latest charging standards.  As more EVs are sold, the Electrify America system will add capacity where it is most needed.  Tesla does have the benefit of a multi-year head start over its competitors for a charging network but investment and a larger installed base in the next couple of years will tip the balance.  

nberry:

WOW. Having to go through all those calculations (+stress) isn’t worthy of any car. 

That's fact of life for EVs. Not even Tesla with their supercharger network is immune. 

In a normal car, people just get in and go, gas stations are beyond numerous so there will always be one somewhere. Not so with EV chargers. 

I have been saying this from the beginning, infrastructure is always the key to adoption, when chargers can be remotely close to the density of gas station, EV will win the war.

Leawood911:

If you know of some way to tune a model3 let me know.  Randy removed weight and tuned the suspension. Let me know if you know of anything else before you call people liars. Unnecessary.  And yes a stock model3 performance out handles the Taycan 4s. I am waiting for when Porsche can make a Taycan handle as well as a Model3 performance. You would think they would be very humble having even beaten by a Tesla. 
In the test in question it was a stock car. It would be happy to race you as well.  Before you disparage Tesla suspension you might want to be certain your Porsche is actually quicker. 
Let me remind you that Modified Porsches have also raced other cars that does not mean that all Porsches raced are modified. 

Modifying suspension IS modifying a car. 

Tuning is more than just squeezing more power.

Stock showroom form, a Model 3 can't even come close to the Taycan in the handling department. 

I don't believe there is a 'stock' Model 3 time on track that beats a Taycan

BTW, even changing the factory tire to something else is already not 'stock'. 

Whoopsy:

nberry:

WOW. Having to go through all those calculations (+stress) isn’t worthy of any car. 

 

That's fact of life for EVs. Not even Tesla with their supercharger network is immune. 

In a normal car, people just get in and go, gas stations are beyond numerous so there will always be one somewhere. Not so with EV chargers. 

I have been saying this from the beginning, infrastructure is always the key to adoption, when chargers can be remotely close to the density of gas station, EV will win the war.

And herein lies the achilles heal of my Taycan Turbo S. It is surprisingly good to drive (in Sport or Sport Plus, very "floaty" in Normal) but never again will I use it for along journey. The charging infrastructure in the UK is currently woefully inadequate unless one has a Tesla.

Whoopsy:

Leawood911:

If you know of some way to tune a model3 let me know.  Randy removed weight and tuned the suspension. Let me know if you know of anything else before you call people liars. Unnecessary.  And yes a stock model3 performance out handles the Taycan 4s. I am waiting for when Porsche can make a Taycan handle as well as a Model3 performance. You would think they would be very humble having even beaten by a Tesla. 
In the test in question it was a stock car. It would be happy to race you as well.  Before you disparage Tesla suspension you might want to be certain your Porsche is actually quicker. 
Let me remind you that Modified Porsches have also raced other cars that does not mean that all Porsches raced are modified. 

 

Modifying suspension IS modifying a car. 

Tuning is more than just squeezing more power.

Stock showroom form, a Model 3 can't even come close to the Taycan in the handling department. 

I don't believe there is a 'stock' Model 3 time on track that beats a Taycan

BTW, even changing the factory tire to something else is already not 'stock'. 

 

I think you are confusing Randy’s car for likes peak with the one on YouTube which was stock and beat the Taycan 4s. I’m too bored to look it up.  Not only are these sedans - so who cares - but even if I’m right and the car costing half as much is quicker - you will go back to how it’s in a different car and these things don’t matter.  
 

And they do offer a Pilot  Cup tire package stock. It did not need those as I recall to beat the Taycan 4s.   

See this yet? https://www.motor1.com/news/480357/porsche-taycan-cross-turismo-spied-480357/