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Jun 12, 2020 4:36:59 AM
- CGX car nut
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Jun 12, 2020 7:28:48 AM
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996FourEss
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Jun 12, 2020 7:44:50 AM
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RC
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Re: Cayenne GTS
996FourEss:This is great news. The V8 is a Gem and prob all the shove you will ever need (although I am happy with my turbo...)
V8 Biturbo. 
Not sure how long Porsche will be able to keep this up though.
Mercedes seems to have removed the V8 from their future C63 models and apparently they are considering the same for the other "63" models. Big mistake in my opinion because I can certainly tell you that I won't buy any AMG Mercedes with a V6 or 4-cyl. engine. 
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)
Re: Cayenne GTS
RC:996FourEss:This is great news. The V8 is a Gem and prob all the shove you will ever need (although I am happy with my turbo...)
V8 Biturbo.
Mercedes seems to have removed the V8 from their future C63 models and apparently they are considering the same for the other "63" models. Big mistake in my opinion because I can certainly tell you that I won't buy any AMG Mercedes with a V6 or 4-cyl. engine.
I suppose they don't do that out of free will...
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1969 Mercedes-Benz 300SEL 6.3 / 2008 Porsche 911 GT3 RS (sold) / 2011 Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG Performance / 2014 BMW-Alpina D3 biturbo Touring / 2018 Porsche 911 GT3 Clubsport
Jun 12, 2020 10:40:11 AM
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the-missile
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Re: Cayenne GTS
Porker:RC:996FourEss:This is great news. The V8 is a Gem and prob all the shove you will ever need (although I am happy with my turbo...)
V8 Biturbo.
Mercedes seems to have removed the V8 from their future C63 models and apparently they are considering the same for the other "63" models. Big mistake in my opinion because I can certainly tell you that I won't buy any AMG Mercedes with a V6 or 4-cyl. engine.
I suppose they don't do that out of free will...
Of course not but I kind of have the feeling that Mercedes overslept EV development, which is a shame.
Their EQC is a joke...especially compared to what Audi, VW, BMW and others have to offer.
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)
Jun 12, 2020 2:49:47 PM
- amazon
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Re: Cayenne GTS
the-missile:with current regulations regarding global CO2 footprint, tax and etc... this downsizing fashion is just going to continue till they produce tons of EVs.
I've heard the exact opposite recently. And it comes from Porsche apparently. In Europe, the new emissions rules are more and more based on real emissions and Turbo engines are not that efficient at all compared to atmospheric engines. Most of the times, it's actually quite the opposite as consumptions are very high. Those engines are only efficient when you just cruise along and don't use the power. For manufacturers, it proved to be a good solution when emission's tests were made like in the old days. Not so much today (the norme EU7 is coming). It seems Porsche wants to develop a new flat-6, with no turbos and bigger displacement to reduce emissions in the future.
Frank Walliser:
"In 2026, the next wave of regulations will come with EU7. This will be the worldwide toughest regulations considering emissions, especially in the spread between real driving emissions and what we see on the test benches,"
"We will see a big change because it means for everybody, new engines and we will see bigger displacements coming back again."
"I expect 20 percent more displacement on average for these EU7 capable engines. A lot of manufacturers will jump from four to six, from six to eight [cylinders],"
Re: Cayenne GTS
amazon:the-missile:with current regulations regarding global CO2 footprint, tax and etc... this downsizing fashion is just going to continue till they produce tons of EVs.
I've heard the exact opposite recently. And it comes from Porsche apparently. In Europe, the new emissions rules are more and more based on real emissions and Turbo engines are not that efficient at all compared to atmospheric engines. Most of the times, it's actually quite the opposite as consumptions are very high. Those engines are only efficient when you just cruise along and don't use the power. For manufacturers, it proved to be a good solution when emission's tests were made like in the old days. Not so much today (the norme EU7 is coming). It seems Porsche wants to develop a new flat-6, with no turbos and bigger displacement to reduce emissions in the future.
Frank Walliser:
"In 2026, the next wave of regulations will come with EU7. This will be the worldwide toughest regulations considering emissions, especially in the spread between real driving emissions and what we see on the test benches,"
"We will see a big change because it means for everybody, new engines and we will see bigger displacements coming back again."
"I expect 20 percent more displacement on average for these EU7 capable engines. A lot of manufacturers will jump from four to six, from six to eight [cylinders],"
Yup, that is the reason why the 4.0 6 cyl. was developed - in general, the tests run with more rpm which is not helpful for the turbo engines ... strange world ...
Re: Cayenne GTS
EU7 is a real challenge, not only because of exhaust emissions. 
Bigger displacements make sense but with higher taxes for petrol cars (based on displacement capacity), I'm not so sure these cars will be a huge success.
Like it or not but I think that EVs are pushed more and more, so in the end, we are all going to end up in one...even if it will be a daily driver "only". I am already planning to get a Tesla model 3 Performance next year for my business, actually wanted a Taycan Turbo S but the tax laws favour only "cheap" EVs, so the Model 3 Performance makes most sense.
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)
Jun 12, 2020 5:25:24 PM
- CGX car nut
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RC
Re: Cayenne GTS
RC:EU7 is a real challenge, not only because of exhaust emissions.
Bigger displacements make sense but with higher taxes for petrol cars (based on displacement capacity), I'm not so sure these cars will be a huge success.
Like it or not but I think that EVs are pushed more and more, so in the end, we are all going to end up in one...even if it will be a daily driver "only". I am already planning to get a Tesla model 3 Performance next year for my business, actually wanted a Taycan Turbo S but the tax laws favour only "cheap" EVs, so the Model 3 Performance makes most sense.
That should be an entertaining observational experiment for the rest of us here.
Jun 12, 2020 5:50:52 PM
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the-missile
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Re: Cayenne GTS
There is a flat 6 of 4.8L sitting somewhere in Weissach but that doesn’t mean it will see the street with a production car. 992GT3RS is supposed to be a 4.2L but other than they are not going to spread NA engines all over the range from boxster to cayenne. Hybrid system is the first move toward more or less large EV range...
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GT Lover, Porsche fan
991.2 GT3 manual
Cayenne GTS 2014
Re: Cayenne GTS
amazon:the-missile:with current regulations regarding global CO2 footprint, tax and etc... this downsizing fashion is just going to continue till they produce tons of EVs.
I've heard the exact opposite recently. And it comes from Porsche apparently. In Europe, the new emissions rules are more and more based on real emissions and Turbo engines are not that efficient at all compared to atmospheric engines. Most of the times, it's actually quite the opposite as consumptions are very high. Those engines are only efficient when you just cruise along and don't use the power. For manufacturers, it proved to be a good solution when emission's tests were made like in the old days. Not so much today (the norme EU7 is coming). It seems Porsche wants to develop a new flat-6, with no turbos and bigger displacement to reduce emissions in the future.
Frank Walliser:
"In 2026, the next wave of regulations will come with EU7. This will be the worldwide toughest regulations considering emissions, especially in the spread between real driving emissions and what we see on the test benches,"
"We will see a big change because it means for everybody, new engines and we will see bigger displacements coming back again."
"I expect 20 percent more displacement on average for these EU7 capable engines. A lot of manufacturers will jump from four to six, from six to eight [cylinders],"
Slapping a turbo on a small displacement engine is basically slapping a emission defeating device to sneak past the 'regulation'. It served no purpose. Since the testing standard are public and known to manufacturers, defeating it is as simple as custom tune on a fuel map delaying the turbo boost for the headline power number.
Government testing methods are just that, a test. No human being drive the way they do the testing. Tests uses a very small throttle input, and manufacturers simply adjust their fuel map and transmission shift points for turbo cars accordingly. Engines don't make much power if at all in this setting, Not even tea people in coffins can tolerate a car accelerating at such a slow rate.
In real world driving, throttle opening will be much bigger, and that's where the crossover point on fuel consumption between a small displacement turbo car and a bigger N/A engine car happens. The turbo-ed engine will need more fuel to develop the power needed while the bigger engine doesn't need as much fuel simply because of the bigger displacement. Fuel is a form of coolant to cool the air fuel mixture in a turbo car, the higher the boost, the more fuel is pumped into the cylinder to cool the charge. Wasted in simple words. N/A engine cars doesn't need that coolant, it burns only the needed amount of fuel to develop the needed power.
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Jun 16, 2020 9:55:51 AM
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RC
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Re: Cayenne GTS
CGX car nut:RC:EU7 is a real challenge, not only because of exhaust emissions.
Bigger displacements make sense but with higher taxes for petrol cars (based on displacement capacity), I'm not so sure these cars will be a huge success.
Like it or not but I think that EVs are pushed more and more, so in the end, we are all going to end up in one...even if it will be a daily driver "only". I am already planning to get a Tesla model 3 Performance next year for my business, actually wanted a Taycan Turbo S but the tax laws favour only "cheap" EVs, so the Model 3 Performance makes most sense.
That should be an entertaining observational experiment for the rest of us here.
Indeed.
My son already told me that he won't speak a word with me anymore if I get an EV, even if for my business only. He thinks that people getting EVs, even if they own petrol cars, are supporting the spread of this technology, so they are the enemies for him. 
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)
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