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Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
The Ferrari V12-itch, I viciously have to fight it myself. I will therefore read your article with great interest. 
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1969 Mercedes-Benz 300SEL 6.3 / 2008 Porsche 911 GT3 RS (sold) / 2011 Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG Performance / 2014 BMW-Alpina D3 biturbo Touring / 2018 Porsche 911 GT3 Clubsport
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
I think you make an excellent point. I have always founded confounding that some gear heads find driving the oldies more fun than recent models. Of course, my position is biased because I never would buy an older car. I have sat in many and you immediately know you're in one. You could blindfold me and I would know. Oh and they smell.
I should add I'm not a big fan of multiple car ownership. I drive one car until I'm tired of it. I know when the time has come when I don't want to wash it. 
I replace it with something contemporary and appears to be fun to drive.
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When you're going through hell.....keep going.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
nberry:. Oh and they smell.
That's what my wife complaints the most about each time I take her in the 964 . She can not stand the smell 
I have not read the article yet, but I have always liked the V12 Ferrari's , specially the modern ones .
Read it now : That's probably why I'll never get one , or when I'll be too old to do spirited mountain drives . They are cars made for long highway road trips ...
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964 Carrera 4 -- 997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
I have not read the article yet, but I have always liked the V12 Ferrari's , specially the modern ones .
Read it now : That's probably why I'll never get one , or when I'll be too old to do spirited mountain drives . They are cars made for long highway road trips ...
964 Carrera 4 -- 997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS
That sums it up nicely. They are cars for long road trips but its the spirited mountain drive that I really enjoy.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
Gnil:nberry:. Oh and they smell.
That's what my wife complaints the most about each time I take her in the 964 . She can not stand the smell
I have not read the article yet, but I have always liked the V12 Ferrari's , specially the modern ones .
Read it now : That's probably why I'll never get one , or when I'll be too old to do spirited mountain drives . They are cars made for long highway road trips ...
--
964 Carrera 4 -- 997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS
I don't know...that F50 with us in the group yesterday was surely doing pretty well on those spirited mountain drives. 
The owner just got his Bugatti Chiron but didn't want to take the car on mountain roads yet. 
My numerous victims from yesterday's drive...
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
RC: I have not read the article yet, but I have always liked the V12 Ferrari's , specially the modern ones .I don't know...that F50 with us in the group yesterday was surely doing pretty well on those spirited mountain drives.
My numerous victims from yesterday's drive...
As a mid engine V12, F50 is in a completely different bucket in my mind to the front engine V12s. In fact it is probably the greatest car I have owned.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
Late to the party here. I was going to mention the F50 as well. Remarkably easy to drive - even in traffic. I really don’t see how anyone can have a multiple car garage without a Ferrari V12 in it for the sound alone. If you want the sound, practicality and extraordinary handling despite a large V12 in the front then a 812 Superfast is the answer despite its looks
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
crayphile:Late to the party here. I was going to mention the F50 as well. Remarkably easy to drive - even in traffic. I really don’t see how anyone can have a multiple car garage without a Ferrari V12 in it for the sound alone. If you want the sound, practicality and extraordinary handling despite a large V12 in the front then a 812 Superfast is the answer despite its looks.
And that summarizes my thoughts/lure exactly.
I would never be tempted out of GT-Porsches unless for another 'hardcore/pure' drivers car, or it would be by the LT's or the Speciale's of the world. Similar propositions from different brands.
But that Superfast keeps popping up in my head after our testdrive. It masterfully combines what I am missing in GT-Porsches; gorgeous leather, a properly special interior with what I enjoy in a driver's car. The dynamics are sharp, the explosive power really keeps you on your toes, and the engine, well...
Of course it still wouldn't be a machine to enjoy the Nordschleife with, but from spirited drives, to autobahn, to a tour around Europe with your better half. 
--
1969 Mercedes-Benz 300SEL 6.3 / 2008 Porsche 911 GT3 RS (sold) / 2011 Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG Performance / 2014 BMW-Alpina D3 biturbo Touring / 2018 Porsche 911 GT3 Clubsport
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
Porker:crayphile:Late to the party here. I was going to mention the F50 as well. Remarkably easy to drive - even in traffic. I really don’t see how anyone can have a multiple car garage without a Ferrari V12 in it for the sound alone. If you want the sound, practicality and extraordinary handling despite a large V12 in the front then a 812 Superfast is the answer despite its looks.
And that summarizes my thoughts/lure exactly.
I would never be tempted out of GT-Porsches unless for another 'hardcore/pure' drivers car, or it would be by the LT's or the Speciale's of the world. Similar propositions from different brands.
But that Superfast keeps popping up in my head after our testdrive. It masterfully combines what I am missing in GT-Porsches; gorgeous leather, a properly special interior with what I enjoy in a driver's car. The dynamics are sharp, the explosive power really keeps you on your toes, and the engine, well...
Of course it still wouldn't be a machine to enjoy the Nordschleife with, but from spirited drives, to autobahn, to a tour around Europe with your better half.
Time to take advantage of depressed valuations 
.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
mcdelaug:Crayphile can say a little more about the 812? It’s on my mind a lot lately...
I did a post on it compared to the F12 but can't find it now. Assuming you have had some exposure to the F12 then its a much more rounded car. The steering is not as light and quick as with the F12/458 Speciale so it feels like a more controlled driving experience. Also the later electronics mean there is less wheelspin with it than an F12 which easily spins even in a straight line. The key difference is in handling which is more precise and frankly alot more assured and pointy for amateurs like me. Moreover there is less of the giant lump of V12 weight in the front feel - it is amazing how much more like a rear engined drive it feels all accompanied by a spine tingling V12 opera.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
crayphile:mcdelaug:Crayphile can say a little more about the 812? It’s on my mind a lot lately...
I did a post on it compared to the F12 but can't find it now. Assuming you have had some exposure to the F12 then its a much more rounded car. The steering is not as light and quick as with the F12/458 Speciale so it feels like a more controlled driving experience. Also the later electronics mean there is less wheelspin with it than an F12 which easily spins even in a straight line. The key difference is in handling which is more precise and frankly alot more assured and pointy for amateurs like me. Moreover there is less of the giant lump of V12 weight in the front feel - it is amazing how much more like a rear engined drive it feels all accompanied by a spine tingling V12 opera.
Intersting, I might just have to go and set up a set drive in the 812. Its that giant lump oil the front feel that's always killed past V12s for me.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
crayphile:mcdelaug:Crayphile can say a little more about the 812? It’s on my mind a lot lately...
I did a post on it compared to the F12 but can't find it now. Assuming you have had some exposure to the F12 then its a much more rounded car. The steering is not as light and quick as with the F12/458 Speciale so it feels like a more controlled driving experience. Also the later electronics mean there is less wheelspin with it than an F12 which easily spins even in a straight line. The key difference is in handling which is more precise and frankly alot more assured and pointy for amateurs like me. Moreover there is less of the giant lump of V12 weight in the front feel - it is amazing how much more like a rear engined drive it feels all accompanied by a spine tingling V12 opera.
Thank you! Any quirks about it that just make you crazy? I’m a little compulsive, so it’s best I know ahead of time...
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
SSO.:I have not read the article yet, but I have always liked the V12 Ferrari's , specially the modern ones .
Read it now : That's probably why I'll never get one , or when I'll be too old to do spirited mountain drives . They are cars made for long highway road trips ...
964 Carrera 4 -- 997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS
That sums it up nicely. They are cars for long road trips but its the spirited mountain drive that I really enjoy.
Yes it’s a nice article thanks SSO! I wonder what you would’ve thought of the FF if that was in the mix too. I haven’t driven the FF but isn’t it a bit more spirited and enjoyable on mountain roads?
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
pgouveia:Hi SSO
A few questions
What is the best purchase, a 575 with AT or a 550 MT?
Which is the expected anual maintain cost?Cheers
I would definitely opt for the 550. The 575 I owned was a rare manual but I still prefer the 550 to the 575.
I'm just finishing up an article on maintenance costs. Should be posted on karenable tomorrow.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
boytronic:SSO.:I have not read the article yet, but I have always liked the V12 Ferrari's , specially the modern ones .
Read it now : That's probably why I'll never get one , or when I'll be too old to do spirited mountain drives . They are cars made for long highway road trips ...
964 Carrera 4 -- 997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS
That sums it up nicely. They are cars for long road trips but its the spirited mountain drive that I really enjoy.
Yes it’s a nice article thanks SSO! I wonder what you would’ve thought of the FF if that was in the mix too. I haven’t driven the FF but isn’t it a bit more spirited and enjoyable on mountain roads?
I quite like the FF. I left all the 2+2s out of the article (will come back to them later). Here a piece I did on the FF a while back: https://karenable.com/72-hours-with-a-ferrari-ff/
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
mcdelaug:crayphile:mcdelaug:Crayphile can say a little more about the 812? It’s on my mind a lot lately...
I did a post on it compared to the F12 but can't find it now. Assuming you have had some exposure to the F12 then its a much more rounded car. The steering is not as light and quick as with the F12/458 Speciale so it feels like a more controlled driving experience. Also the later electronics mean there is less wheelspin with it than an F12 which easily spins even in a straight line. The key difference is in handling which is more precise and frankly alot more assured and pointy for amateurs like me. Moreover there is less of the giant lump of V12 weight in the front feel - it is amazing how much more like a rear engined drive it feels all accompanied by a spine tingling V12 opera.
Thank you! Any quirks about it that just make you crazy? I’m a little compulsive, so it’s best I know ahead of time...
No - its a wonderful car. I am not a big fan of the looks though.
Re: Man Math & Ferrari V12s
SSO.:pgouveia:Hi SSO
A few questions
What is the best purchase, a 575 with AT or a 550 MT?
Which is the expected anual maintain cost?Cheers
I would definitely opt for the 550. The 575 I owned was a rare manual but I still prefer the 550 to the 575.
I'm just finishing up an article on maintenance costs. Should be posted on karenable tomorrow.
Ferrari 550 fuel pumps what you should know
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