Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la - Page1

Nov 8, 2004 2:32:22 PM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002

Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

I decided to pass this by my Ringers friends who should know about such things and got this comment almost immediately thanx to Christer:

Quote:
That'll be driven by Richard Göransson who've won
STCC(Swedish DTM/DTC-kindofthing) but it's also
complete bollocks;)
For Swedish-reading people the thread was on Rejsa
about 2 months ago:
http://www.rejsa.nu/forum/viewtopic.php?...5eed0757a52350a

The drive was done on Michelin Cups during free
Wednesday before Scuderia-Hanseat beginning of Sept
and the only real timing was 6:56 from Coca-Cola
corner(GP/T13) until Gantry, they happily assumed that
it takes 11s from Bridge to middle of T13 and got 7:07
BTG LOL:-)))
Indicated speed below Bridge 295km/h though:-O

They're still looking for a possibility to get a
SportAuto-type open track and also had some promises
from S.A. that Richard and Horst would both drive the
car sometime October, looks like it didn't happen as
planned because no news.

Still the above time equates to roughly 7.45 complete
lap(BTG~7.20) as I wrote as a reply to them on Rejsa,
not too bad that either!
Christer

7:20 BTG isn't bad either but there is a big difference between 7:20 BTG and 7:07 BTG. What's more, none of these numbers represent real laps!!!! People need to be more careful about the claims that they make.

Stephen

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Nov 8, 2004 6:01:56 PM

Velle M.: Newbie; Loc: Sweden; Posts: 26, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 7, 2004; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

It realy is sad that we can not share this with anyone without people being offended or thinking we are just a couple kids making this up:(
Now this Christer is also writing rubbish: "The drive was done on Michelin Cups during free
Wednesday before Scuderia-Hanseat beginning of Sept
and the only real timing was 6:56 from Coca-Cola
corner(GP/T13) until Gantry, they happily assumed that
it takes 11s from Bridge to middle of T13 and got 7:07
BTG LOL:-)))
Indicated speed below Bridge 295km/h though:-O"

He is taking this 7:07 time out of context! You can not pick one nummber out and compare it with another. You have to read the whole tread.
I have two professional race car drivers who will confirm our car being capable of 7:30 on a 20 km lap at the Ring.
Richard Göransson 2004 STCC Champion, and Johann Nimmersjö from Team Shwedenkreutz.
People tend to jump into conclusions too quickly, and stop listening onwards since they have made up their mind.
I'm realy dissapointed in people not having the presence of mind to listen what I say instead of listening on another guy which bases his knowledge on information that I have published, and he has got it all wrong anyway. So you belive in a filtered information more than original information. I wrote them both!! So why is his version more acceptable?

"That'll be driven by Richard Göransson who've won
STCC(Swedish DTM/DTC-kindofthing) but it's also
complete bollocks;)"
Now we have over 45 witnesses the Richard Göransson did drive that car that fast. What is he talking about??????
Creddible source? I think not!

"7:20 BTG isn't bad either but there is a big difference between 7:20 BTG and 7:07 BTG. What's more, none of these numbers represent real laps!!!! People need to be more careful about the claims that they make. "

I can claim this: 7:30 on a 20 km lap as Sport Auto messure. Thats the only time I have claimed here, and I did it just now.

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Nov 8, 2004 6:16:04 PM

Velle M.: Newbie; Loc: Sweden; Posts: 26, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 7, 2004; Reply to: Velle M.

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

And how can you writh here are the real facts?
This Stephan is himself approximating our performance on what he thinks is reasonable, 7:45.
Is that a fact? Hardly!
Richard Göransson has raced a 24h race at the Ring earlier this year, so hi is fammiliar with lap times and know exactly how much time he loses in missing an apex or braking too late or overtaking a car.
We have timed a 6:56 from Coca-cola kurve to gantry, on that lap Richard Göransson had to overtake, not pass 21 cars, of which none has steped asside to let him by. We are talking GT3 RS and Chalenge Stradalel here, not Fiat Punto. By shaving of approximated time it has taken to overtake 21 cars and adding an approximated time it takes to complete the distance, we can with a good margin say that 7:30 is reality.
Now this Christer thinks that we had a hot lap and were only hindered by 4-5 seconds on the whole lap while overtaking 21 sport cars. Thats fine. He can think that. But he can not say that that is a fact!!!!!
Don't you agree?

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Nov 8, 2004 6:16:52 PM

Velle M.: Newbie; Loc: Sweden; Posts: 26, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 7, 2004; Reply to: Velle M.

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Sorry that was Christer not Stephan....

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Nov 8, 2004 6:23:19 PM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: Velle M.

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Johann is a frequent poster on the Ringer's list. He hasn't commented yet but I am sure he will.

Christer does have a very entertaining way of expressing himself.

I guess I am getting confused now between what you are claiming and what Gabriel claimed in his initial post. I think most of us are. My response was to the 7:07 BTG / 7:30 flying lap figures. I think most of us think these numbers not reasonable. But 7:30 on the shorter SportAuto course in the hands of a pro sounds a lot more reasonable.

Whatever the time, the car is quite beautiful. I loved seeing the supercharger work in the video as well as the sound.

Stephen

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Nov 8, 2004 6:33:38 PM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: Velle M.

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Quote:
Velle M. said:
Richard Göransson has raced a 24h race at the Ring earlier this year, so hi is fammiliar with lap times and know exactly how much time he loses in missing an apex or braking too late or overtaking a car.
We have timed a 6:56 from Coca-cola kurve to gantry, on that lap Richard Göransson had to overtake, not pass 21 cars, of which none has steped asside to let him by. We are talking GT3 RS and Chalenge Stradalel here, not Fiat Punto. By shaving of approximated time it has taken to overtake 21 cars and adding an approximated time it takes to complete the distance, we can with a good margin say that 7:30 is reality.

Velle,

I can understand your logic and it might be reasonable but you cannot claim actual lap times on the basis of computation and adjustment. That isn't acceptable. You must actually do it! If you have a computed lap based upon section times then you need to make it clear that the quoted time is an estimate. This is the accepted practice.

I think Christer, in mentioning a 7:45 lap time, was actually trying to be complementary. As he said, "as I wrote as a reply to them on Rejsa, not too bad that either!" And I agree with Christer. A 7:45 is good. If you can do it, a 7:30 will be even better.

Stephen

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Nov 8, 2004 8:30:33 PM

Velle M.: Newbie; Loc: Sweden; Posts: 26, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 7, 2004; Reply to: FixedWing

I agree!

I agree!
I'm glad you like tha car. Hopefully we will do those est. times (7:30) in the spring, so we can make them official.
Have I posted the CSL to begin with, I'd probbably make it clearer. Now I just had to reply on all the comments...
Cheers!

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Nov 8, 2004 8:58:23 PM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21148, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Quote:

Velle,

I can understand your logic and it might be reasonable but you cannot claim actual lap times on the basis of computation and adjustment. That isn't acceptable. You must actually do it! If you have a computed lap based upon section times then you need to make it clear that the quoted time is an estimate. This is the accepted practice.

I think Christer, in mentioning a 7:45 lap time, was actually trying to be complementary. As he said, "as I wrote as a reply to them on Rejsa, not too bad that either!" And I agree with Christer. A 7:45 is good. If you can do it, a 7:30 will be even better.

Stephen

Velle, I have to subscribe what Stephen just said above word for word. If you would have made clear the 7:30 was an estimate, I for one would have been much more lenient since its an opinion which you are entitled to, but it seemed you were claiming an actual recorded full lap time of 7:30. There is a difference.

As to the Christer's 7:45 guess, if you look at my guess on my very first posts on the thread was of 7:46-7:47. Both are in the same ballpark. If Saurma makes a hot lap we will all see and it would be settled.

And lastly, I hope you don't get the impression I was bashing BMW (my previous car was a E36-M3 and loved it) nor your work with the CSL (though I do think supercharging a CSL engine is asking for it

), and I think trying to make the fastest street legal BMW around the ring is a great and worthy project, the problem was just with the 7:30 claim, so keep us informed

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Nov 8, 2004 9:10:13 PM

iia: Pilot; Loc: Canada; Posts: 342, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 24, 2004; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Quote:
carlos fromspain said:
If you would have made clear the 7:30 was an estimate, I for one would have been much more lenient since its an opinion which you are entitled to, but it seemed you were claiming an actual recorded full lap time of 7:30. There is a difference.

As to the Christer's 7:45 guess, if you look at my guess on my very first posts on the thread was of 7:46-7:47. Both are in the same ballpark. If Saurma makes a hot lap we will all see and it would be settled.

And lastly, I hope you don't get the impression I was bashing BMW (my previous car was a E36-M3 and loved it) nor your work with the CSL (though I do think supercharging a CSL engine is asking for it ), and I think trying to make the fastest street legal BMW around the ring is a great and worthy project, the problem was just with the 7:30 claim, so keep us informed

Well said! I followed the post in the whole morning and just understand it is an estimated.

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Nov 9, 2004 9:37:18 AM

Velle M.: Newbie; Loc: Sweden; Posts: 26, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 7, 2004; Reply to: iia

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

The point was that we wanted to share info on what we are upp to, what we have done, and what we set to do. I did not post any claims to begin with!
As the 7:45 estimate goes, keep in mind we passed 21 sport cars on that lap!! You'll agree with me that the CSL might be a surprise in the spRing....

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Nov 9, 2004 2:58:43 PM

iia: Pilot; Loc: Canada; Posts: 342, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 24, 2004; Reply to: Velle M.

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Quote:
Velle M. said:
I did not post any claims to begin with!

Quote:
Gabriel343 said:
BTG time: 7,07 sec
The whole track: 7:30 sec

This is the quote from the 1st post...

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Nov 9, 2004 7:16:27 PM

frazze: Newbie; Loc: Sweden; Posts: 9, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 7, 2004; Reply to: iia

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Its a claim I can stand for.
I know it can go even faster than 7:30! And that Christer guy dont know any facts, I didnt see him around that day :/.

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Nov 9, 2004 8:50:59 PM

NeverLift: Newbie; Loc:; Posts: 47, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 30, 2003; Reply to: frazze

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Claims and estimates. LOL Make an official run of the full Nring and be done with it. Until then save YOUR breath. Most will not believe a 480HP street car with semi slicks will hit 7:30 much less break it. Good luck in proving everyone wrong. hehe

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Nov 9, 2004 9:11:48 PM

johann: Newbie; Loc: Nürburgring; Posts: 2, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 9, 2004; Reply to: NeverLift

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

The GT2 Mk1 did 7:46 on the Ring with the head editor of SportAuto as driver.

How much faster would it be if it had a 480 hp NA engine, 100 kg lower weight and Pilot Sport Cups driven by a professional race driver?

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Nov 9, 2004 11:29:29 PM

frazze: Newbie; Loc: Sweden; Posts: 9, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 7, 2004; Reply to: NeverLift

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Quote:
NeverLift said:
Good luck in proving everyone wrong. hehe

"U can take that to the bank"

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Nov 10, 2004 3:01:46 AM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: johann

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Johann .. Welcome to Rennteam! Nice to see you on-board.

Stephen

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Nov 10, 2004 6:10:11 AM

99e36m3: Newbie; Loc:; Posts: 14, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 30, 2003; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

sorry Off topic but i did find out about the AC-Schnitzer CSL a month ago but wasn't sure if it was fake or not because i have never seen it or heard about it except for its exceptional time at Hockenheimring. does anybody have any information or pictures of the AC-Schnitzre CSL? thanks

btw, commednable project and hope to see some real laptimes soon, i am interested in what this is capable of

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Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly lap

I agree!

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

Re: Here are the real facts .. approx 7:20 BTG / 7:45 fly la

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