Crown

Yes and believe it is rear wheel drive only which could be entertaining.  

CGX car nut:

Yes and believe it is rear wheel drive only which could be entertaining.  

No. The base model is actually the Taycan 4.

North America won't get the RWD only model.

Your dealer has all these info since June.

That doesn’t sound as entertaining.  

I agree about the 4, but think Porsche has done a fantastic job with the Taycan overall. They will surely be other models, like a GTS model, and improvements along the way. It’s really all quite extraordinary.
 

And by the way, happy new year to everyone. Great fun having fellow nuts around the world.🎉👍

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/why-electric-cars-still-dont-live-up-to-the-hype/2019/12/30/242ce200-2b29-11ea-bcd4-2459...

Not much new here, but worth a post...

Wonderbar:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/why-electric-cars-still-dont-live-up-to-the-hype/2019/12/30/242ce200-2b29-11ea-bcd4-2459...

Not much new here, but worth a post...

However, the author does fairly point out that the legacy auto makers are entering the EV market, not based on consumer demand, but instead to meet regulations on carbon emissions.  With a price delta in favor of ICEs and other limitations, including low incentives, the consumer, in North America and parts of the EU have shied away from EV adoption.  

The next few years should prove very interesting for the automakers and the regulators.

Wonderbar:

I agree about the 4, but think Porsche has done a fantastic job with the Taycan overall. They will surely be other models, like a GTS model, and improvements along the way. It’s really all quite extraordinary.
 

And by the way, happy new year to everyone. Great fun having fellow nuts around the world.🎉👍

RoW will have a RWD base Taycan, and knowing Porsche there will also be a GTS coming.

CGX car nut:

Wonderbar:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/why-electric-cars-still-dont-live-up-to-the-hype/2019/12/30/242ce200-2b29-11ea-bcd4-2459...

Not much new here, but worth a post...

However, the author does fairly point out that the legacy auto makers are entering the EV market, not based on consumer demand, but instead to meet regulations on carbon emissions.  With a price delta in favor of ICEs and other limitations, including low incentives, the consumer, in North America and parts of the EU have shied away from EV adoption.  

The next few years should prove very interesting for the automakers and the regulators.

let me assure you consumer demand will not be focused on ICE vehicles in the future.  100% of everyone who has driven or ridden in my car will buy an electric car next.  And that is already more people than have ridden in all my last cars.  I give so many rides I feel like an Uber. Maybe 75 people in one month.  They are not just thinking about it. They would never go back. It amazes me except it feel the same way.  None of those people was thinking of the environment either. Rest assured. The automakers are not doing this for regulations. Lol. They have driven these cars and know their time is up. Their investments are stark proof. Their denial is just to stall for time. 

Wonderbar:

Drove a Taycan Turbo recently, some impressions:

1.  Takes some time to get used to the quiet.  You don't know it's on unless you check the lights on the dash.  

2.  Very fast, torque is instant.  About same 0-60 as my Panamera Turbo, but torque is more direct, instant.

3.  Very very stable in straight line and corners.  You feel extremely connected to the road, more so than my PT and a friend's new 992s.  Feels "planted" on the pavement, more so than any Porsche I have ever driven.  Impressive. You are in a performance car, no doubt (maybe a heavier but extremely powerful 992 feel?).

4.  Interior fit and finish is superb, more sleek and modern than the 992.  Similar to PT interior.  Outstanding design.  

5.  Front room is fine, rear is tight for longer trips.  My son is 6''2' and didn't complain, but PT is much more comfortable and roomy.

6.  Overall, Taycan struck me as a different, not necessarily better, Porsche product. Deal breaker for me is the rear seat  room.  I like the comfort and space of my PT, at this point in my life.  

Similar impressions from my test drive of a Taycan Turbo.

• The direct torque response when pulling through the corners is excellent
• My wife riding in the back seat felt some motion sickness during Porsche launch Control 
• Definitely more of a sports car/performance car feel. i think most new to Porsche buyers are expecting more of a traditional sedan like performance. The more direct and instant torque could lead to some interesting adventures for the first time Porsche buyers
• I was very impressed with the Taycan. I would consider a lease as this is a first generation EV from Porsche

2016 Porsche 991 Carrera GTS  Black with AeroKit Cup Package,  2017 Porsche Cayenne Platinum  Purpurite Metallic, New York

Leawood911:

CGX car nut:

Wonderbar:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/why-electric-cars-still-dont-live-up-to-the-hype/2019/12/30/242ce200-2b29-11ea-bcd4-2459...

Not much new here, but worth a post...

However, the author does fairly point out that the legacy auto makers are entering the EV market, not based on consumer demand, but instead to meet regulations on carbon emissions.  With a price delta in favor of ICEs and other limitations, including low incentives, the consumer, in North America and parts of the EU have shied away from EV adoption.  

The next few years should prove very interesting for the automakers and the regulators.

let me assure you consumer demand will not be focused on ICE vehicles in the future.  100% of everyone who has driven or ridden in my car will buy an electric car next.  And that is already more people than have ridden in all my last cars.  I give so many rides I feel like an Uber. Maybe 75 people in one month.  They are not just thinking about it. They would never go back. It amazes me except it feel the same way.  None of those people was thinking of the environment either. Rest assured. The automakers are not doing this for regulations. Lol. They have driven these cars and know their time is up. Their investments are stark proof. Their denial is just to stall for time. 

Classic example of selection bias but if it makes you feel better, okay. 

CGX car nut:

Leawood911:

CGX car nut:

Wonderbar:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/why-electric-cars-still-dont-live-up-to-the-hype/2019/12/30/242ce200-2b29-11ea-bcd4-2459...

Not much new here, but worth a post...

However, the author does fairly point out that the legacy auto makers are entering the EV market, not based on consumer demand, but instead to meet regulations on carbon emissions.  With a price delta in favor of ICEs and other limitations, including low incentives, the consumer, in North America and parts of the EU have shied away from EV adoption.  

The next few years should prove very interesting for the automakers and the regulators.

let me assure you consumer demand will not be focused on ICE vehicles in the future.  100% of everyone who has driven or ridden in my car will buy an electric car next.  And that is already more people than have ridden in all my last cars.  I give so many rides I feel like an Uber. Maybe 75 people in one month.  They are not just thinking about it. They would never go back. It amazes me except it feel the same way.  None of those people was thinking of the environment either. Rest assured. The automakers are not doing this for regulations. Lol. They have driven these cars and know their time is up. Their investments are stark proof. Their denial is just to stall for time. 

Classic example of selection bias but if it makes you feel better, okay. 

I’m talking about electric cars in general - once the infrastructure is in place like here in the Midwest. Taking into account our low cost of power at home. There is no comparison.  ICE cars around here will be like old tube TVs except for classics. It makes me feel better to let you know what is coming. It is just a matter of time. In Europe you will have lots more time but that should not make you feel better. 

Wonderbar:

Salesman also mentioned there would be a Taycan base model, below the 4S, coming in summer 2020.  Anyone here heard that?

I accidentally posted a picture of that...  

It is coming, indeed. Taycan S.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

Excellent PCA tech video of the Taycan Turbo details at Porsche’s US tech training facility.  https://youtu.be/c-veSH99ZD4

CGX car nut:

Excellent PCA tech video of the Taycan Turbo details at Porsche’s US tech training facility.  https://youtu.be/c-veSH99ZD4

I know that people will say "no big deal..." but I still admire Porsche for what they have achieved in such a short time.

In a decade from now on, VW Group will be the worldwide leader in EVs. The question is: Is it a good thing?

BMW already changed the strategy, they plan to produce a mix of cars (EVs, combustion engine, hybrids, etc.) instead of putting (almost) all their money solely on EVs (like VW Group actually did) and it seems Mercedes is also thinking about another strategy change, similar to BMWs one.

Time will tell...

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

I think we will see VW and Porsche in particular offer a more blended model mix. We have already seen Porsche hedge their bets with the next generation of the Macan.  The timeframe for the transition of the model mix to EVs is possibly going to take longer than what the auto industry originally forecasted. 

2016 Porsche 991 Carrera GTS  Black with AeroKit Cup Package,  2017 Porsche Cayenne Platinum  Purpurite Metallic, New York

bobr:

I think we will see VW and Porsche in particular offer a more blended model mix. We have already seen Porsche hedge their bets with the next generation of the Macan.  The timeframe for the transition of the model mix to EVs is possibly going to take longer than what the auto industry originally forecasted. 

I wonder what percent of car enthusiasts like me, who have driven cars like ... , are like me and will never buy another ICE car. To me my Turbo will be my last ICE and I doubt I will even drive it often. Bought a battery tender last week for it. My first purchase like that ever for one of my Porsche’s. They never used to sit for more than one day. 
So I think the change is here, now, for me.  And you know my anecdotal report of people I give rides to. They are fall into the same camp immediately. If you disagree and you have not been in an EV perhaps it is time you try. 
Pretty strong prediction about VW leading EV production. We will see. That $1000 stock price I predicted for a certain American car startup is looking better than the bankruptcy predictions. Lol. 

One of the reasons I got my Bmw 850 and then Aston Martin vantage was because they will probably be my last regular V8s. I will only be getting cheap EVs now for my regular cars. At some point EVs will replace my fun cars. But I will hold onto my GT3s and Mclarens for a while longer. The Aston and Mclaren definitely makes me think about not having any regular fun cars anymore - non GT 911s for example. 

Tesla Model S P100d. 2018 991.2 GT3. 2019 BMW M850i Convertible. 2020 Tesla Model 3 Performance. 2020 Aston Martin Vantage. 2020 Mclaren 720S coupe. 🥳

Right now, my tendency Is actually away from EV’s, and back toward internal combustion engines. I’ve driven Tesla model S and X and Taycan Turbo, and somehow they just don’t excite me. 

Wonderbar:

Right now, my tendency Is actually away from EV’s, and back toward internal combustion engines. I’ve driven Tesla model S and X and Taycan Turbo, and somehow they just don’t excite me. 

 People need to understand that at some point in our lives, EVs will be a reality, meaning there won't be much possibilities to "avoid" them. So why start this now and not wait until we will be "forced" anyway to drive EVs? I don't get it. This is as if the consumption of meat will be forbidden by the year 2050 and I start to become a vegetarian now.  

Oh, btw., I had an interesting talk with a Tesla Model 3 owner a couple of days ago, he is a customer of mine. The major reason he drives a Tesla is...money. He saves tons of money he told me. How? I wasn't aware that many Ikea and ALDI in Germany offer free charging. So he drives there often to charge his car. His father in law also has a solar voltaic installation on his farm and he gets free electricity there as well. Basically, he never paid for charging his car, with the exception of two vacation trips he had with the family. I get it, really do. I pay 500-600 EUR per month for fuel and I don't even drive that much. I also wasn't aware how interesting Tesla lease rates have become lately, I might even consider a Model 3 (performance version of course ) for my business, especially since I have a few financial advantages doing that. This is always about money, never about driving pleasure. Some people get excited about saving money, others get excited about driving a nice sounding car, I get that, I really do. Never was a fan of Scrooge though, so...  

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

RC:

Wonderbar:

Right now, my tendency Is actually away from EV’s, and back toward internal combustion engines. I’ve driven Tesla model S and X and Taycan Turbo, and somehow they just don’t excite me. 

 People need to understand that at some point in our lives, EVs will be a reality, meaning there won't be much possibilities to "avoid" them. So why start this now and not wait until we will be "forced" anyway to drive EVs? I don't get it. This is as if the consumption of meat will be forbidden by the year 2050 and I start to become a vegetarian now.  

Oh, btw., I had an interesting talk with a Tesla Model 3 owner a couple of days ago, he is a customer of mine. The major reason he drives a Tesla is...money. He saves tons of money he told me. How? I wasn't aware that many Ikea and ALDI in Germany offer free charging. So he drives there often to charge his car. His father in law also has a solar voltaic installation on his farm and he gets free electricity there as well. Basically, he never paid for charging his car, with the exception of two vacation trips he had with the family. I get it, really do. I pay 500-600 EUR per month for fuel and I don't even drive that much. I also wasn't aware how interesting Tesla lease rates have become lately, I might even consider a Model 3 (performance version of course ) for my business, especially since I have a few financial advantages doing that. This is always about money, never about driving pleasure. Some people get excited about saving money, others get excited about driving a nice sounding car, I get that, I really do. Never was a fan of Scrooge though, so...  

--

 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

 

You will be pleased at the fun it provides. Driving it at 10 of 10 might take me years to accomplish.  It is much quicker than my Turbo.  The savings over the turbo are astonishing. 

I drove all current Teslas, with the exception of the latest Raven models. None of these cars provided real driving fun after a short while but they provided "gadget" fun, I loved playing around with settings and looking at power consumption, remaining energy calculations and estimates, this stuff is fun. Driving is fun when you consider the instant acceleration but otherwise, these cars get boring fast, can't help it. I am seriously considering getting a Tesla 3 to save money as a daily driver, not to have fun with the car. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

just ordered a Bmw i3 for short trips in a 20km radius

intouch1:

just ordered a Bmw i3 for short trips in a 20km radius

i3 isn't really my cup of tea but for short trips, an EV makes really sense.

I assume that in your region, the electricity is basically for free (solar power)? 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

RC: ​​​This is as if the consumption of meat will be forbidden by the year 2050 and I start to become a vegetarian now.  

 

X2 Good analogy 

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

RC:

intouch1:

just ordered a Bmw i3 for short trips in a 20km radius

i3 isn't really my cup of tea but for short trips, an EV makes really sense.

I assume that in your region, the electricity is basically for free (solar power)? 

it isn't really my cup of tea either ....but its locally available with support and I do many trips that are really short so an EV makes sense

--
Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary... That's what gets you.

intouch1:

RC:

intouch1:

just ordered a Bmw i3 for short trips in a 20km radius

i3 isn't really my cup of tea but for short trips, an EV makes really sense.

I assume that in your region, the electricity is basically for free (solar power)? 

it isn't really my cup of tea either ....but its locally available with support and I do many trips that are really short so an EV makes sense

 

 This is very important with an EV, similar to a super sports car. An minor software issue here and there and the car stands still, local support is very important. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

RC:

intouch1:

RC:

intouch1:

just ordered a Bmw i3 for short trips in a 20km radius

i3 isn't really my cup of tea but for short trips, an EV makes really sense.

I assume that in your region, the electricity is basically for free (solar power)? 

it isn't really my cup of tea either ....but its locally available with support and I do many trips that are really short so an EV makes sense

 

 This is very important with an EV, similar to a super sports car. An minor software issue here and there and the car stands still, local support is very important. 

 

I would be curious how often service is required. Unlike ice cars these are not designed to need service and most problems which are software related are fixed over the air.  I get that electricity must be cheap and charging provided for but service my be actually a non issue. At least this is what I am seeing with the EV I have. 

The GT4 is supposed to be offered with PDK as well at some point, so I guess the GTS won't stay far behind? 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)

https://www.motor1.com/news/393603/tesla-model-3-porsche-911-drag/

Having everything is nice, but it's even nicer to make sure everything you've got is actually worth having.

nberry:

https://www.motor1.com/news/393603/tesla-model-3-porsche-911-drag/

will be more exciting to see who can corner harder though.

A Hellcat can do faster 1/4 mile time than a 911 too. But no one cares.