Crown

I have ordered a new 997 mk II, and have included P17 as an option, and so will have the Sport PASM. I have to admit to being just slightly nervous about this decision... I have now read two seperate reviews of the suspension both in reputible magazines, (Autocar and 911 and Porsche World). In fact these are the only two profesional reviews I have found of the SPASM option. Both reviews came to the same conclusion, and I'll quote 911 and Porsche world here: "This is Horrid".

I had a chance to drive a car equiped with this new suspension option last week, but only for about 5 miles, and maybe 10 minutes. Not exactly enough time to thoroughly evaluate it. That said< i really did not think it so aweful.

I hope it is better suited to my generally decent roads here in the north west, than it seems to be for the UK roads. These reviews do have me a bit nervous.

Michael

Michael Russell:

I have ordered a new 997 mk II, and have included P17 as an option, and so will have the Sport PASM. I have to admit to being just slightly nervous about this decision... I have now read two seperate reviews of the suspension both in reputible magazines, (Autocar and 911 and Porsche World). In fact these are the only two profesional reviews I have found of the SPASM option. Both reviews came to the same conclusion, and I'll quote 911 and Porsche world here: "This is Horrid".

I had a chance to drive a car equiped with this new suspension option last week, but only for about 5 miles, and maybe 10 minutes. Not exactly enough time to thoroughly evaluate it. That said< i really did not think it so aweful.

I hope it is better suited to my generally decent roads here in the north west, than it seems to be for the UK roads. These reviews do have me a bit nervous.

Michael

Hi Michael,

I'm speccing a new GTS and am also a little nervous about SPASM.

Could you let us know how things turned out for you.... many thanks.

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

@ Grant...

Hi Grant - you posted the following comment in 2008 on a different thread..

"I will be interested to see if the springs and/or swaybars on the 997.2 are different for cars that spec LSD (not the Sport PASM, but just LSD option)."

Just wondered if you ever got an answer to that?  Thanks....John.

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

John H:

@ Grant...

Hi Grant - you posted the following comment in 2008 on a different thread..

"I will be interested to see if the springs and/or swaybars on the 997.2 are different for cars that spec LSD (not the Sport PASM, but just LSD option)."

Just wondered if you ever got an answer to that?  Thanks....John.

 

 

Hi John - I have never seen any information that they made special suspension tuning for the LSD-equipped cars (other than Sport PASM).  I don't think so, but I don't know for sure.

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs).  Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550 Maranello

Many thanks for the reply Grant...

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

I'm sure I read somewhere (one of the UK road tests probably) that the 987 LSD equiped cars have subtle suspension mods to counter the increased understeer the LSD introduces.  I would have thought the 997 was similarly adjusted.

 Thanks for the info devo, and will also be looking fowadr to the impressions on the Sport-PASM by John and Michael, as I always get this option when I order a 911 (ex-996 and current 997) and I'm a bit worried about the sport suspensiont being PASM based, since I do not like the regular PASM, when thinking about the 991. So this thread is good news so far 

Carlos from Spain:

 Thanks for the info devo, and will also be looking fowadr to the impressions on the Sport-PASM by John and Michael, as I always get this option when I order a 911 (ex-996 and current 997) and I'm a bit worried about the sport suspensiont being PASM based, since I do not like the regular PASM, when thinking about the 991. So this thread is good news so far 

 The sport-PASM does not feel like the normal PASM. You do not have that 'unconnected' feeling. It is very similar to the old conventional one , you just loose a very slightly 'natural' feel... when you could actually feel the spring work even on the slightest uneven surface of the road ( but there again, maybe most people would not even notice that lost )

I did not like the normal PASM, I am happy with my Sport-PASM

Anyway, try the GT3 and you get get the idea of the S-PASM

--

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Autocar's review of the Sport Classic (wide body and -20mm SPASM) is complimentary on the ride and handling:

http://www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/FirstDrives/Porsche-911-3.8-Sport-Classic/245348/

Gnil:

Carlos from Spain:

 Thanks for the info devo, and will also be looking fowadr to the impressions on the Sport-PASM by John and Michael, as I always get this option when I order a 911 (ex-996 and current 997) and I'm a bit worried about the sport suspensiont being PASM based, since I do not like the regular PASM, when thinking about the 991. So this thread is good news so far 

 The sport-PASM does not feel like the normal PASM. You do not have that 'unconnected' feeling. It is very similar to the old conventional one , you just loose a very slightly 'natural' feel... when you could actually feel the spring work even on the slightest uneven surface of the road ( but there again, maybe most people would not even notice that lost )

I did not like the normal PASM, I am happy with my Sport-PASM

Anyway, try the GT3 and you get get the idea of the S-PASM

--

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Thanks you Gnil, that was what I was hoping to hear! 

As I understand it the -20mm suspension on a 997.1 is a single setting feature as opposed to PASM which has a choice of 'normal' and 'sport'. 

On a 997.2, SPASM also has a choice of settings.  So which setting on SPASM equates to -20mm and what does the other setting relate to?

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

John H:

On a 997.2, SPASM also has a choice of settings.  So which setting on SPASM equates to -20mm and what does the other setting relate to?

Good question - Gnil will know the answer - I assume there are 'normal' and 'sport' settings too. The key issue is how firm they are in relative terms to (a) the 'normal' and 'sport' settings in Normal PASM 997.2 cars and (b) the fixed setting of a 997.1 -20mm car

RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

I have a dif. opinion. I find the normal mode on PASM confortable enought and good for DD driving. When changing to sport mode it´s amazing the feel it gives thrue the steering, it´s really a big difference on feel and handling, I just love it and I´m more than happy with it, the SPASM would be to stiff for my taste I´m sure, maybe I´m getting old :(

J.Seven

Personally, I haven't tried SPASM but I didn't like -20mm with conventional dampers used up to 997.1

I find PASM on later models very good for both comfort and handling. On winding mountain roads with less than perfect surface and difficult bends the car can use high speeds with a feeling of safety because of its handling. I cannot see what more additional  benefit SPASM could have for fast road driving. Track driving is a different matter.

Also Sport mode of PASM is very usable on normal roads whereas on 997.1 it was only suited for the track and therefore redundant for most of the time.

The optical benefit of the -20mm is a plus for many people who opt for this suspension.

"Form follows function"

Like on many things, the bottom line is that its a matter of preference and use of the car. I have logged over 100,00km on mine with the -20mm, its not a weekend track toy, for me its setup is perfect for daily driving, and I can guarantee you I notice and more importantly appreciate the difference of the -20mm to the PASM everyday. Not only in its stiffness and body roll, but especially in its steering.

Fortunately Porsche always offers the two options for us to choose from so we can all be happy, since the Sport mode in PASM is not even close to being a substitute for the -20mm, in fact I found the Sport Mode of the PASM to be somewhat useless, it only made the ride innecesarily stiff without much proportionality in the return benefit in steering and handling, since it was as stiff or even stuiffer than the 997.1-20mm yet no were near its handling and steering.

For the benefit of everybody, I assume that Carlos is referring in his post to the PASM in the 997.1. 

Ziggy:

For the benefit of everybody, I assume that Carlos is referring in his post to the PASM in the 997.1. 

I am indeed, but I'm not including nor excluding the 997.2's PASM either, since I have not tested the 997.2 street or track enough to be able to have an opinion on its PASM vs the -20mm. I have only tested the 997.2 on a spirited mountain drive, its definately not a -20mm in terms of steering and handling, that was clear, but could not test it enough to judge the finer details I was talking about earlier on normal vs sport mode.

 I did not test 997.2 PASM enough to do a proper judgment.

SPASM on 997.2 in normal mode is perfect for the road to my taste. Firm, but never bumpy  . But you do feel how the wheels work on every bump. So if you do not like that , do not take  SPASM.

Personally I like it, as I want to know how the road surface is.

In sports mode it is not realy suited to the streets at legal speed , unless you drive VERY hard or on the highway. Then it gives all it's potential. If you drive normally on town , the car jumps in the holes or the very uneven surfaces. 

On  the N'Ring , at first I preferred to have the car in normal mode , now that I gained speed, I like it better in sports.

On a nice flat track, sports mode is still too soft .

Generally speaking I would say SPASM normal is very slightly softer then the old -20mm , as it hardly jumps on the bumps, unless they are really big. SPASM in sport is harder then the old -20mm.

Generaly I still do think that in sports it has too much roll on the track

--

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Gnil:

 

Generaly I still do think that in sports it has too much roll on the track

--

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

You might want to try GT3 adjustable swaybars.
 

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs).  Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550 Maranello

I retrofitted the M030 sports chassis on a Boxster S some years ago. At first i was very excited too with the sharper steering the fact that I could feel the rear of the car very accurately when cornering. After a while I got tired of feeling every bump on each and every routine journey and of the weightier steering. Therefore, after some 18 months I went back to the original suspension set and it was a joy and most of all the speeds were not any different.  The M030 on the road gave more the illusion of being faster.

What I am saying relates to road driving only.

My conclusion is that unless you use your car frequently on a track, go for the standard set up. Unless of course someone has an acquired taste for a harder, bumpier ride.

"Form follows function"

I don't agree at all that the -20mm is for track use, and the PASM-10mm is for the road IMO, the -20mm ts how a 911 should handle and behave to me. So its a matter of taste and preference on how you want your car to handle, there is no white & black answer of -10mm for road, and -20mm for track. To me a harder ride is "psychologically" more confortable than a softer less conected ride, because I like to feel what the car is doing at all time as much as posible and enjoy its reactions, on the other hand I don't mind the bumpier ride, and that is subjective too, I realise how for others the bumpier ride coulb be too much, it depends on the roads, the type of use, age, etc...maybe when  get older I won't be willing to trade in the more confortable ride for the handling and feeling.

For example, now that you mention the M030 sport suspension, I had the M030 on my ex-996 since day one, and though it was good, I found it not to be sporty enough for me, so you can imagine that I found the standard suspension for the 996 with all its body roll and softness to be substandard for a Porsche sportcar and more in line with a sporty sedan's. I was extremly dissapointed with the car I tested before I bought my 996, fortunately it was not "the 996 model" but rather the suspensions it had standard, and found that the M030 that came in my 996 improved that a lot.

Carlos from Spain:

I don't agree at all that the -20mm is for track use, and the PASM-10mm is for the road 

 
+1  Our preferences are entirely subjective so there can be no objective rule that applies to everyone.

RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

The -20mm gives a more tied-up feel to the suspension and a more feelsome, albeit heavier, steering. OTOH at slow speeds especially in city streets with their irregularities the ride is more bumpy and you tend to hear the odd rattle here and there from interior trim more, which for many is very irritating especially without the sound system on. And that on a car that the tyres spec doesn't help ride anyway.

Now if this is what an owner wants and depending where and how the car is used, fair enough and it's great that Porsche offer this choice.

However, it is not as if the standard -10mm PASM on a 997.2 is the suspension of a floating limousine and the -20mm is a necessity for sports driving on public roads. A Mercedes or a BMW probably need their version of a sports suspension whereas on a Porsche is a matter of choice and priorities.

So, "let the buyer beware".

"Form follows function"

Excuse me guys, I test drove some of these suspension combos and I kind of agree with what you experienced BUT I am questioning the reason why you experienced such differences.... I believe that on any given suspension IF you drop the car 20 mm you are going to "feel"  the road better because the car's center of gravity will be closer to the ground... I don't believe such a drop can be ignored on the 911...

There is no try. Just do.