Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: For comparison: 200-300kph in a 599GTB - Page1

Apr 10, 2008 7:37:18 PM

TB993tt: Rennteam Pro; Loc: manchester , United Kingdom; Posts: 2280, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 22, 2002; Reply to: AAHTT

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
AAHTT said:

are all european tests done with a passenger in the car ? I think most US tests are done with driver only.

No DIN weight is no occupants all fluids and 90% full tank...What I find ridiculous about the way Porsche do it now days is for eg the 997tt DIN weight is 1585kg but that is for a PCCB car with no sunroof or rear wiper as tested by Sport Auto. In the UK sunroof and rear wiper are not deletable so by definition the DIN weight is a load of horse sh!t for all RHD C16 UK cars

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Apr 10, 2008 8:22:52 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: Futch

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
Futch said:
Quote:
MKSGR said:
Quote:
Futch said:
Quote:
TB993tt said:
Quote:
Futch said:
The carrera GT weight of 1380 kgs is dry.

On the road weight for a version with aircon and Bose sound system is closer to 1500 kgs.

Actually the Carrera GT weight of 1380kg is supposed to be DIN ie wet 90% full fuel tank as you say all "normal" spec CGTs weighed in around 1475kg - there must be a zero optioned bare bones CGT somewhere knocking around in Germany

You are correct! My bad. 1380 kgs unladen weight DIN.
Having said that, all GT out there are weighted at close to 100 kgs more!
Seems Porsche, like most makers is very optimistic about its cars weight.

Similar to the "Macaronis", right

Yeah something like that. Sauerkrauts and Macaronis do have a few things in common...

Both taste very well, best with some French wine

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Apr 10, 2008 9:23:36 PM

cannga: Expert; Loc: Los Angeles's "twisties" :-) , United States; Posts: 1940, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 6, 2005; Reply to: MKSGR

Re: Performance Table

Wow, Alex, thanks! Very very useful table, especially since I can't seem to remember and quote acceleration numbers as effortlessly as the pro's here.

Mods: Maybe a good idea to make this thread a sticky? Clearly power is the essence of the Turbo (& GT2) and these threads are generating so many interesting discussions. It's nice to have a summary of people's efforts.

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Apr 11, 2008 11:25:15 AM

Lars997: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: South , Germany; Posts: 9448, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: cannga

Re: Performance Table

I made this thread sticky as it seems it is a high interest on it.

Lets see how it is developing!

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Apr 11, 2008 1:00:12 PM

TB993tt: Rennteam Pro; Loc: manchester , United Kingdom; Posts: 2280, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 22, 2002; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Performance Table

Fresh from Sport Auto mag 0-300-0 test.

Cargraphic with RS Tuning 624hp kit weighing DIN 1495kg did 0-300kph in 28.2s

I just compared some numbers - 100-250kph (to nulify starts) EClou's AWE took 13.6s and the CG624 12.7s

The CG624 had two occupants, I think Eclou's was solo so the CG car was at least 50kg lighter and that headwind - the AWE package is looking very strong

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Apr 11, 2008 1:12:31 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: TB993tt

Re: Performance Table

So Toby - does that mean the CG544 kit 0-300 time you mentioned is not correct? ie. it was actually the CG624 kit?

Also, do you have the full 0-100, 0-200 etc numbers also for this CG624 kit?

Thanks

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Apr 11, 2008 1:22:57 PM

TB993tt: Rennteam Pro; Loc: manchester , United Kingdom; Posts: 2280, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 22, 2002; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
Alex_997TurboRSC said:
So Toby - does that the CG544 kit 0-300 time you mentioned is not correct? ie. it was actually the CG624 kit?

Also, do you have the full 0-100, 0-200 etc numbers also for this CG624 kit?

Thanks

Seems there is a bit of BS coming from CG since they quote the SA numbers for the 624kit and say the car is 1630kg when the magazine tells how all the weight was lost down to 1495kg. I would cross off the CG544 0-300 numbers until we have magazine proof (although I still believe they are likely true).
The SA numbers for the lightweight CG624 are:
0-100kph 3.3s
0-150kph 6.0s
0-200kph 9.9s
0-250kph 16.0s
0-300kph 28.2s
300-0 6.9s

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Apr 11, 2008 1:58:44 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: TB993tt

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
TB993tt said:
Fresh from Sport Auto mag 0-300-0 test.

Cargraphic with RS Tuning 624hp kit weighing DIN 1495kg did 0-300kph in 28.2s

I just compared some numbers - 100-250kph (to nulify starts) EClou's AWE took 13.6s and the CG624 12.7s

The CG624 had two occupants, I think Eclou's was solo so the CG car was at least 50kg lighter and that headwind - the AWE package is looking very strong

Do you already have the test results? I look forward to reading the next issue of Sportauto. Apparently, they also included Rt12, GT2 etc. etc.

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Apr 11, 2008 2:02:15 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: TB993tt

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
TB993tt said:
Quote:
Alex_997TurboRSC said:
So Toby - does that the CG544 kit 0-300 time you mentioned is not correct? ie. it was actually the CG624 kit?

Also, do you have the full 0-100, 0-200 etc numbers also for this CG624 kit?

Thanks

Seems there is a bit of BS coming from CG since they quote the SA numbers for the 624kit and say the car is 1630kg when the magazine tells how all the weight was lost down to 1495kg. I would cross off the CG544 0-300 numbers until we have magazine proof (although I still believe they are likely true).
The SA numbers for the lightweight CG624 are:
0-100kph 3.3s
0-150kph 6.0s
0-200kph 9.9s
0-250kph 16.0s
0-300kph 28.2s
300-0 6.9s

Quite frankly, 28s for the 620hp version sounds reasonable. This would be somewhere between Rt12 (25s) and 544hpkit/GT2 (ca. 32-33s).

These new figures of Sportauto make me highly suspicious of the earlier test results of the "544hp version"...

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Apr 11, 2008 3:18:36 PM

TB993tt: Rennteam Pro; Loc: manchester , United Kingdom; Posts: 2280, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 22, 2002; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Performance Table

Copy of magazine article here:

http://www.cargraphic.de/index.php?/o,article,4135/&resolution=1024

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Apr 11, 2008 3:36:10 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: TB993tt

Re: Performance Table

Thanks

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Apr 11, 2008 3:45:09 PM

AAHTT: Senior; Loc: san diego , United States; Posts: 654, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 21, 2006; Reply to: TB993tt

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
TB993tt said:
Quote:
Alex_997TurboRSC said:
So Toby - does that the CG544 kit 0-300 time you mentioned is not correct? ie. it was actually the CG624 kit?

Also, do you have the full 0-100, 0-200 etc numbers also for this CG624 kit?

Thanks

Seems there is a bit of BS coming from CG since they quote the SA numbers for the 624kit and say the car is 1630kg when the magazine tells how all the weight was lost down to 1495kg. I would cross off the CG544 0-300 numbers until we have magazine proof (although I still believe they are likely true).
The SA numbers for the lightweight CG624 are:
0-100kph 3.3s
0-150kph 6.0s
0-200kph 9.9s
0-250kph 16.0s
0-300kph 28.2s
300-0 6.9s

thanks, that's much more like it. the CG 544 should be in the low 30s like everyone else with that power

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Apr 11, 2008 4:34:11 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: AAHTT

Re: Performance Table

UPDATED: added new columns and additional data from SportAuto.

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Apr 11, 2008 5:46:45 PM

cannga: Expert; Loc: Los Angeles's "twisties" :-) , United States; Posts: 1940, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 6, 2005; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Performance Table

Question for the experts here please.

Why is the CGT so (relatively) slow from 200-300? I mean its 0-200 is the fastest among the cars, and yet the 200-300 time drops off considerably. 24.3 seconds is the number I am asking about.

I understand at high speed, drag becomes a huge factor. Is the CGT's drag coeff. not good? Or is it just the engine running out of power?
Thanks.

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Apr 11, 2008 6:05:52 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: cannga

Re: Performance Table

CGT drag is bad with that big wing.
The CGT was not designed for high speed acceleration, it is a street legal track car.

FYI some other very high performance car wing retracts af very high speeds to allow for higher top speed.

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Apr 12, 2008 1:00:46 PM

andrea: Rennteam Master; Loc: Italy, Pordenone , Italy; Posts: 3569, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 24, 2003; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Performance Table

useful topic! why don't you add also 996 manthey 700cv sport auto test ?

so ruf rt12 is the Queen

0-100 3,9
0-160 7,0
0-200 10,0

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Apr 12, 2008 4:44:00 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: TB993tt

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
TB993tt said:
Copy of magazine article here:

http://www.cargraphic.de/index.php?/o,article,4135/&resolution=1024

So do you think that the times CG released for the 645 and 600 kits (23 secs and 26 secs to 300 km/h respectively) are fantasy?

Considering that one can get a GT2 for the price of a Turbo plus the 624 kit and only be marginally slower, I think Markus has made a very good decision in ordering the GT2.

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Apr 12, 2008 5:31:29 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: Crash

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
TB993tt said:
Copy of magazine article here:

http://www.cargraphic.de/index.php?/o,article,4135/&resolution=1024

Considering that one can get a GT2 for the price of a Turbo plus the 624 kit and only be marginally slower, I think Markus has made a very good decision in ordering the GT2.

Thanks

In a certain way the GT2 is a "wise" decision. It is a bit less powerful than the Rt12. But then: on the track it is fast as hell. In addition, you can use it 30.000km per year without a problem. Always covered by the factory warranty. After 2-3 years you just sell it for a reasonable price as there is always a demand for a used GT2. Not a bad deal.

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Apr 12, 2008 5:40:19 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: MKSGR

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
MKSGR said:
Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
TB993tt said:
Copy of magazine article here:

http://www.cargraphic.de/index.php?/o,article,4135/&resolution=1024

Considering that one can get a GT2 for the price of a Turbo plus the 624 kit and only be marginally slower, I think Markus has made a very good decision in ordering the GT2.

Thanks

In a certain way the GT2 is a "wise" decision. It is a bit less powerful than the Rt12. But then: on the track it is fast as hell. In addition, you can use it 30.000km per year without a problem. Always covered by the factory warranty. After 2-3 years you just sell it for a reasonable price as there is always a demand for a used GT2. Not a bad deal.

Not a bad deal at all. Plus, it looks killer and high-speed stability is supposed to be better than the Turbo. One other nice thing is also the fuel tank. Since you as you say do quite a lot of intercity stretches, that can only be a plus, compared to the 67 litres in the Turbo.

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Apr 12, 2008 5:52:58 PM

Turbo Al: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Rochester, New York , United States; Posts: 2531, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 3, 2005; Reply to: MKSGR

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
MKSGR said:
Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
TB993tt said:
Copy of magazine article here:

http://www.cargraphic.de/index.php?/o,article,4135/&resolution=1024

Considering that one can get a GT2 for the price of a Turbo plus the 624 kit and only be marginally slower, I think Markus has made a very good decision in ordering the GT2.

Thanks

In a certain way the GT2 is a "wise" decision. It is a bit less powerful than the Rt12. But then: on the track it is fast as hell. In addition, you can use it 30.000km per year without a problem. Always covered by the factory warranty. After 2-3 years you just sell it for a reasonable price as there is always a demand for a used GT2. Not a bad deal.

Agreed. The only drawback of the GT2 is lack of rear seats if you want to take your family for a ride-legally only one passenger allowed.

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Apr 12, 2008 6:40:50 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: Turbo Al

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
Turbo Al said:
Quote:
MKSGR said:
Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
TB993tt said:
Copy of magazine article here:

http://www.cargraphic.de/index.php?/o,article,4135/&resolution=1024

Considering that one can get a GT2 for the price of a Turbo plus the 624 kit and only be marginally slower, I think Markus has made a very good decision in ordering the GT2.

Thanks

In a certain way the GT2 is a "wise" decision. It is a bit less powerful than the Rt12. But then: on the track it is fast as hell. In addition, you can use it 30.000km per year without a problem. Always covered by the factory warranty. After 2-3 years you just sell it for a reasonable price as there is always a demand for a used GT2. Not a bad deal.

Agreed. The only drawback of the GT2 is lack of rear seats if you want to take your family for a ride-legally only one passenger allowed.

Ah, get an RS6 Avant for that. It's somewhat slower, but still just fine

.

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Apr 12, 2008 7:07:46 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: Crash

Re: Performance Table

No RS6 avant in the US...

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Apr 13, 2008 12:46:31 AM

AAHTT: Senior; Loc: san diego , United States; Posts: 654, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 21, 2006; Reply to: TB993tt

Re: Performance Table

Quote:
TB993tt said:
Fresh from Sport Auto mag 0-300-0 test.

Cargraphic with RS Tuning 624hp kit weighing DIN 1495kg did 0-300kph in 28.2s

I just compared some numbers - 100-250kph (to nulify starts) EClou's AWE took 13.6s and the CG624 12.7s

The CG624 had two occupants, I think Eclou's was solo so the CG car was at least 50kg lighter and that headwind - the AWE package is looking very strong

Toby, I got some Pbox numbers today while "comparing" my car to a modded 08 LP640 (665HP) and I am kind of pbox illiterate, so if you guys are interested tell me how to send the files to you to check if the "best results" on the screen were accurate.
I got 100-200kph in 6.5s with 2 shifts and 100-250kph ranging from 12.8 to 13 and change depending on slope I guess.
We did at least a half dozen runs with drivers only in each car and the lambo could only hang around up to top of 3 rd gear, after that it was easily walked time after time and up to 160mph the gap was still increasing

.
this happened obviously on a mexican autobahn...

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Apr 13, 2008 4:31:09 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: Alex_997TT

For comparison: 200-300kph in a 599GTB

BTW: I just did some 200-300 kph test on the AB in a 599GTB with just 2600km on the odometer. (Test based on real - not indicated - speed.)

The result was ca. 18.5s. Not bad

Italian horses seem to of similar size as German horses these days

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Apr 13, 2008 5:28:30 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: MKSGR

Re: For comparison: 200-300kph in a 599GTB

Quote:
MKSGR said:
BTW: I just did some 200-300 kph test on the AB in a 599GTB with just 2600km on the odometer. (Test based on real - not indicated - speed.)

The result was ca. 18.5s. Not bad Italian horses seem to of similar size as German horses these days

Whoa, that's fast!

What does the GT2 do? Around 22 or so?

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Apr 13, 2008 5:47:52 PM

svtrader1: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 821, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2003; Reply to: Crash

Re: For comparison: 200-300kph in a 599GTB

Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
MKSGR said:
BTW: I just did some 200-300 kph test on the AB in a 599GTB with just 2600km on the odometer. (Test based on real - not indicated - speed.)

The result was ca. 18.5s. Not bad Italian horses seem to of similar size as German horses these days

Whoa, that's fast! What does the GT2 do? Around 22 or so?

So Crash you believe the 599 will do 0-300 in under 30 sec now?

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Apr 13, 2008 5:48:06 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: Crash

Re: For comparison: 200-300kph in a 599GTB

Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
MKSGR said:
BTW: I just did some 200-300 kph test on the AB in a 599GTB with just 2600km on the odometer. (Test based on real - not indicated - speed.)

The result was ca. 18.5s. Not bad Italian horses seem to of similar size as German horses these days

Whoa, that's fast! What does the GT2 do? Around 22 or so?

Should be 22s based on GT2 factory specs.

P.S.: I have to note that I did not use GPS equipment (still thinking about the proper equipment / software as I use Apple computers...). However, the good old method of estimating speedometer inaccuracy first and then doing the timed runs does work quite well

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Apr 13, 2008 6:16:05 PM

AAHTT: Senior; Loc: san diego , United States; Posts: 654, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 21, 2006; Reply to: AAHTT

Re: Performance Table

on this 100-250 run there was a 9 meters denivelation over 580m so not sure if acceptable or not. click on attachment for better picture.

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Apr 13, 2008 7:54:15 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: svtrader1

Re: For comparison: 200-300kph in a 599GTB

Quote:
svtrader1 said:
Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
MKSGR said:
BTW: I just did some 200-300 kph test on the AB in a 599GTB with just 2600km on the odometer. (Test based on real - not indicated - speed.)

The result was ca. 18.5s. Not bad Italian horses seem to of similar size as German horses these days

Whoa, that's fast! What does the GT2 do? Around 22 or so?

So Crash you believe the 599 will do 0-300 in under 30 sec now?

Not really, at least not on average. Then again, there is no reason why you couldn't be right.

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Apr 13, 2008 8:58:57 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: Crash

Re: For comparison: 200-300kph in a 599GTB

Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
svtrader1 said:
Quote:
Crash said:
Quote:
MKSGR said:
BTW: I just did some 200-300 kph test on the AB in a 599GTB with just 2600km on the odometer. (Test based on real - not indicated - speed.)

The result was ca. 18.5s. Not bad Italian horses seem to of similar size as German horses these days

Whoa, that's fast! What does the GT2 do? Around 22 or so?

So Crash you believe the 599 will do 0-300 in under 30 sec now?

Not really, at least not on average. Then again, there is no reason why you couldn't be right.

At least the 599GTB should do it in approximately 30s. Even if you added a safety margin of 1s to my result 30s would still be the "approximate number"

Congrats to Maranello

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