Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR? - Page4

Apr 7, 2008 5:01:56 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: easy_rider911

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

The more deeply I reflect on my own Porsche experience (over the past 17 months ownership), the more firmly I believe that driving a Porsche is actually about the experience of driving a really well-handling car which feels so precise. It isn't the fastest car. It isn't the noisiest car. It doesn't say "Look at me". It just feels 'right' when you have an open road with plenty of bends to enjoy.

Your being disingenous. The GT-R is far superior in in the attributes you describe. So why don't you buy a GT-R. BECAUSE OF THE PORSCHE BADGE THAT IS WHY!

People just be honest with yourselves. To continue this canard that I don't care about the badge is just hogwash.

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Apr 7, 2008 5:16:56 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: nberry

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Good thing the GT-R doesn't look very good and that luxury brands still have the best designers...

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Apr 7, 2008 5:37:54 PM

reginos: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Nicosia , Cyprus; Posts: 12130, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 20, 2005; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
SciFrog said:
Well it would be nice if the 997TT was faster than the 996TTS to begin with...

No doubt the GT-R is somewhat of a loss-leader. But the 997TT should come close in performance at the very least.

You are right, I agree with you.
What I am saying is that if/when the facelifted Turbo achieves a Gt-R level of performance, people will say "so what", it should because it costa much more. The Turbo is a no win situation.

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Apr 7, 2008 5:57:58 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: reginos

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
reginos said:
Quote:
SciFrog said:
Well it would be nice if the 997TT was faster than the 996TTS to begin with...

No doubt the GT-R is somewhat of a loss-leader. But the 997TT should come close in performance at the very least.

You are right, I agree with you.
What I am saying is that if/when the facelifted Turbo achieves a Gt-R level of performance, people will say "so what", it should because it costa much more. The Turbo is a no win situation.

You are giving too much credit to the FL TT, I don't think it will perform much better...

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Apr 7, 2008 6:28:14 PM

skazzy: Veteran; Loc: ... , Canada; Posts: 931, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 31, 2005; Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
Porsche-Jeck said:
Quote:
AUM said:
Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

The answer is easy: they will respond, if they feel that they'll loose a significant number of customers to the competition (not only GT-R). The mere fact, that the one or other car is faster (straightline, NoS - whatever) and that the i-net is full of GT-R hype doesn't bother them.

That sums it up perfectly

/thread

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Apr 7, 2008 6:29:21 PM

JoeRockhead: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Topside , Monaco; Posts: 8033, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 17, 2007; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

I think too much credence is being given to the cost anyway. Price is an object, but so is reliability, fit and finish, aesthetics and pedigree. The intangibles are extremely important, not just the numbers. I've wanted a 911 my whole life and that's what I bought. Honestly, if the GT-R goes around the 'ring 2 seconds faster, I really couldn't care less. And, Porsche didn't have to lie about the amount of power their cars put out to get respect. I'm glad there is some competition out there but at the end of the day, I don't want a Nissan GT-R. The fact that every car magazine out there compares every new kid the on the block to a 911 speaks volumes as to the performance and desirability of the vehicle. That isn't up for debate.

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Apr 7, 2008 6:31:11 PM

JP66: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Seattle , United States; Posts: 2217, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 10, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
nberry said:Your being disingenous. The GT-R is far superior in in the attributes you describe. So why don't you buy a GT-R. BECAUSE OF THE PORSCHE BADGE THAT IS WHY!

People just be honest with yourselves. To continue this canard that I don't care about the badge is just hogwash.

Again, so why don't you get yourself a GTR??? It is superior in the same attributes...
You only care about the Ferrari badge

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Apr 7, 2008 6:34:24 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: JoeRockhead

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

You are correct, but once you have had a 911, what will you buy next? Porsche cannot live on first time buyers...

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Apr 7, 2008 6:42:57 PM

Nidge: Junior; Loc: UK; Posts: 57, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 12, 2006; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Chaps, this is a really interesting debate. As an owner of four porches on the bounce I will not be renewing my current 911s for another from the Porsche brand. The Audi R8 got me thinking. The GT-R made it a no brainer. There are probably as many who think the GT-R a looker as others who think the 911 the all time classic. Paying a dividend for a modest HP hike following each facelift has left me with some buyer's remorse. And comparing a TT with a GT-R is nonsense at double the price. If Porsche wish to produce an equivalent car for the same price then great, i'm in. However I am at the other end of badge snobbery. The one that goes "you paid too much for your badge" Whilst I would admit that the interior is not 911 standards, I could just not justify paying Pounds20K plus more on a FL 911s just to keep the brand. This from an individual who never envisaged deserting the Porsche brand. I think that arrogance has its place, but only when you know your product has no equal. The complacency is unreal. Even my dealer of long standing is worried about the new generation of superfast kids on the block. The GT-R is just the start. With R8, new Alfa after the same marketplace, I really think that the next generation 911 has to re-establish the high ground. If that be the case, I amongst other will be happy to return to the brand they so dearly cherish. For one I am happy with my GT-R order and for one I hope that I am lucky in obtaining a car that is already greatly oversubscribed.

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Apr 7, 2008 6:55:28 PM

JoeRockhead: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Topside , Monaco; Posts: 8033, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 17, 2007; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
SciFrog said:
You are correct, but once you have had a 911, what will you buy next? Porsche cannot live on first time buyers...

I've had a couple of Boxster's too. Next? Maybe a GT2 or GT3 RS.

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Apr 7, 2008 6:57:42 PM

JoeRockhead: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Topside , Monaco; Posts: 8033, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 17, 2007; Reply to: Nidge

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
cheshire porsche said:
Chaps, this is a really interesting debate. As an owner of four porches on the bounce I will not be renewing my current 911s for another from the Porsche brand. The Audi R8 got me thinking. The GT-R made it a no brainer. There are probably as many who think the GT-R a looker as others who think the 911 the all time classic. Paying a dividend for a modest HP hike following each facelift has left me with some buyer's remorse. And comparing a TT with a GT-R is nonsense at double the price. If Porsche wish to produce an equivalent car for the same price then great, i'm in. However I am at the other end of badge snobbery. The one that goes "you paid too much for your badge" Whilst I would admit that the interior is not 911 standards, I could just not justify paying Pounds20K plus more on a FL 911s just to keep the brand. This from an individual who never envisaged deserting the Porsche brand. I think that arrogance has its place, but only when you know your product has no equal. The complacency is unreal. Even my dealer of long standing is worried about the new generation of superfast kids on the block. The GT-R is just the start. With R8, new Alfa after the same marketplace, I really think that the next generation 911 has to re-establish the high ground. If that be the case, I amongst other will be happy to return to the brand they so dearly cherish. For one I am happy with my GT-R order and for one I hope that I am lucky in obtaining a car that is already greatly oversubscribed.

Porsche could build a car within 1.5 years to destroy everything out there. If there was a Boxster S with 425HP available, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

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Apr 7, 2008 7:04:35 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: JoeRockhead

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
JoeRockhead said:
Quote:
SciFrog said:
You are correct, but once you have had a 911, what will you buy next? Porsche cannot live on first time buyers...

I've had a couple of Boxster's too. Next? Maybe a GT2 or GT3 RS.

Neither of these cars are available from Porsche anymore

Great choice though, but not the TT which is the point of this thread...

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Apr 7, 2008 7:05:04 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: Nidge

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
cheshire porsche said:
Chaps, this is a really interesting debate. As an owner of four porches on the bounce I will not be renewing my current 911s for another from the Porsche brand. The Audi R8 got me thinking. The GT-R made it a no brainer. There are probably as many who think the GT-R a looker as others who think the 911 the all time classic. Paying a dividend for a modest HP hike following each facelift has left me with some buyer's remorse. And comparing a TT with a GT-R is nonsense at double the price. If Porsche wish to produce an equivalent car for the same price then great, i'm in. However I am at the other end of badge snobbery. The one that goes "you paid too much for your badge" Whilst I would admit that the interior is not 911 standards, I could just not justify paying Pounds20K plus more on a FL 911s just to keep the brand. This from an individual who never envisaged deserting the Porsche brand. I think that arrogance has its place, but only when you know your product has no equal. The complacency is unreal. Even my dealer of long standing is worried about the new generation of superfast kids on the block. The GT-R is just the start. With R8, new Alfa after the same marketplace, I really think that the next generation 911 has to re-establish the high ground. If that be the case, I amongst other will be happy to return to the brand they so dearly cherish. For one I am happy with my GT-R order and for one I hope that I am lucky in obtaining a car that is already greatly oversubscribed.

WOW! Great stuff. Right between eyes. No sense mincing words.

For years I have unabashedly spoken my preference for Ferrari despite preceived reliability issues, not the very best performance and high price. I buy the car because it is a FERRARI and all that goes with it. Can I buy a cheaper car with as good or better performance parameters? Without a doubt. But I cannot buy a car like a Ferrari which explodes the senses with it sharp reactive handling, technological advancements, sensuousness and sexiness that even woman envy.

It is the ultimate high in driving experience. I did not buy the car as a daily driver. It is my sanctuary and game room. I want something very much out of the ordinary for those moments when I need to step away from the mundane and pedestrian. Nothing like a Ferrari provides that experience.

I go out of my way to buy a Ferrari. The Badge and all it encompasses is my reason reason to buy it and I readily admit it.

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Apr 7, 2008 7:09:27 PM

AUM: Veteran; Loc: Germany; Posts: 1203, Gallery; Registered on: May 2, 2006; Reply to: reginos

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
reginos said:
I believe the GT-R must be costing Nissan much much more than they charge for it. It is halo model and a big loss leader which is cross subsidized in the overall costing/pricing structure of this big manufacturer . The reason they do it is very obvious and very valid if you ask me. So a Porsche can never be perceived to be as good as a GT-R because price will always be involved in the comparison. Even if the FL Turbo is slightly better than the Nissan, people will say that this is how it should be given the price differential, so no big achievement.

http://www.edmunds.com/nissan/gtr/2009/review.html

''Nissan's President and CEO, Carlos Ghosn, sent the degree of difficulty skyrocketing when he agreed to green-light the GT-R project on two conditions: first, the base price had to be about $70,000; and

second, the car had to be profitable,

i.e., not merely an image-boosting "halo car" that would be sold at a loss. Improbably, the GT-R has succeeded on all counts. Ghosn's conditions have been met, and we can confirm.....''

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Apr 7, 2008 7:15:22 PM

JoeRockhead: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Topside , Monaco; Posts: 8033, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 17, 2007; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
SciFrog said:
Quote:
JoeRockhead said:
Quote:
SciFrog said:
You are correct, but once you have had a 911, what will you buy next? Porsche cannot live on first time buyers...

I've had a couple of Boxster's too. Next? Maybe a GT2 or GT3 RS.

Neither of these cars are available from Porsche anymore
Great choice though, but not the TT which is the point of this thread...

My dealer confirmed on the weekend that they have one GT2 allocation still available. I will wait for someone else to take the depreciation hit on it though. And the thread isn't TT specific.

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Apr 7, 2008 7:15:24 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: nberry

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
nberry said:
For years I have unabashedly spoken my preference for Ferrari despite preceived reliability issues, not the very best performance and high price. I buy the car because it is a FERRARI and all that goes with it. Can I buy a cheaper car with as good or better performance parameters? Without a doubt. But I cannot buy a car like a Ferrari which explodes the senses with it sharp reactive handling, technological advancements, sensuousness and sexiness that even woman envy.

It is the ultimate high in driving experience. I did not buy the car as a daily driver. It is my sanctuary and game room. I want something very much out of the ordinary for those moments when I need to step away from the mundane and pedestrian. Nothing like a Ferrari provides that experience.

I go out of my way to buy a Ferrari. The Badge and all it encompasses is my reason reason to buy it and I readily admit it.

A little fast forgetting the economics in play there Nick, no?

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Apr 7, 2008 7:33:48 PM

SoCalHoosier: Veteran; Loc: California , United States; Posts: 896, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 13, 2003; Reply to: JoeRockhead

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
JoeRockhead said:
Quote:
cheshire porsche said:
Chaps, this is a really interesting debate. As an owner of four porches on the bounce I will not be renewing my current 911s for another from the Porsche brand. The Audi R8 got me thinking. The GT-R made it a no brainer. There are probably as many who think the GT-R a looker as others who think the 911 the all time classic. Paying a dividend for a modest HP hike following each facelift has left me with some buyer's remorse. And comparing a TT with a GT-R is nonsense at double the price. If Porsche wish to produce an equivalent car for the same price then great, i'm in. However I am at the other end of badge snobbery. The one that goes "you paid too much for your badge" Whilst I would admit that the interior is not 911 standards, I could just not justify paying Pounds20K plus more on a FL 911s just to keep the brand. This from an individual who never envisaged deserting the Porsche brand. I think that arrogance has its place, but only when you know your product has no equal. The complacency is unreal. Even my dealer of long standing is worried about the new generation of superfast kids on the block. The GT-R is just the start. With R8, new Alfa after the same marketplace, I really think that the next generation 911 has to re-establish the high ground. If that be the case, I amongst other will be happy to return to the brand they so dearly cherish. For one I am happy with my GT-R order and for one I hope that I am lucky in obtaining a car that is already greatly oversubscribed.

Porsche could build a car within 1.5 years to destroy everything out there. If there was a Boxster S with 425HP available, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

The key words are "COULD" and "IF". What we're trying to do is light a fire under Porsche to get that ball rolling sooner.
Remember that most of us here are actually long-time Porsche customers. (even Nick)
Not sure why some of you seem to take it so personally when discussing the current dynamics of Porsche.

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Apr 7, 2008 7:36:23 PM

fritz: Rennteam VIP; Loc: BaWü , Germany; Posts: 10248, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 23, 2003; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
SciFrog said:
Quote:
nberry said:
For years I have unabashedly spoken my preference for Ferrari despite preceived reliability issues, not the very best performance and high price. I buy the car because it is a FERRARI and all that goes with it. Can I buy a cheaper car with as good or better performance parameters? Without a doubt. But I cannot buy a car like a Ferrari which explodes the senses with it sharp reactive handling, technological advancements, sensuousness and sexiness that even woman envy.

It is the ultimate high in driving experience. I did not buy the car as a daily driver. It is my sanctuary and game room. I want something very much out of the ordinary for those moments when I need to step away from the mundane and pedestrian. Nothing like a Ferrari provides that experience.

I go out of my way to buy a Ferrari. The Badge and all it encompasses is my reason reason to buy it and I readily admit it.

A little fast forgetting the economics in play there Nick, no?

That tends to happen to Nick when he is confronted with so much senusuousness and sexiness that they explode his senses. Probably a result of years spent unabashedly paying high prices for not-the-very best performance and having to cope with percieved reliability issues which only a woman could envy.

Maybe Nick doesn't so much need a sanctuary as a sanatorium to play hís games in. It would have to have a Ferrari badge on the front gate though.

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Apr 7, 2008 7:37:16 PM

reginos: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Nicosia , Cyprus; Posts: 12130, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 20, 2005; Reply to: AUM

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
AUM said:
Quote:
reginos said:
I believe the GT-R must be costing Nissan much much more than they charge for it. It is halo model and a big loss leader which is cross subsidized in the overall costing/pricing structure of this big manufacturer . The reason they do it is very obvious and very valid if you ask me. So a Porsche can never be perceived to be as good as a GT-R because price will always be involved in the comparison. Even if the FL Turbo is slightly better than the Nissan, people will say that this is how it should be given the price differential, so no big achievement.

http://www.edmunds.com/nissan/gtr/2009/review.html

''Nissan's President and CEO, Carlos Ghosn, sent the degree of difficulty skyrocketing when he agreed to green-light the GT-R project on two conditions: first, the base price had to be about $70,000; and

second, the car had to be profitable,

i.e., not merely an image-boosting "halo car" that would be sold at a loss. Improbably, the GT-R has succeeded on all counts. Ghosn's conditions have been met, and we can confirm.....''

Don't believe everything you read on the internet

Many ways to disguise hidden costs in big multinationals.

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Apr 7, 2008 7:48:55 PM

throt: Rennteam VIP; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 6078, Gallery; Registered on: May 9, 2005; Reply to: SoCalHoosier

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
SoCalHoosier said:
Not sure why some of you seem to take it so personally whendiscussing the current dynamics of Porsche.

I agree , its all a bit silly . Its just that people get all protective over their buy but they still got to say fair play to Nissan because its damn obvious that they have done an awesome job..The price is where Nissan have come up trumps , though , they have kept it real and where it should sit , they will get rewarded imo...

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Apr 7, 2008 7:51:58 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: reginos

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
reginos said:
Don't believe everything you read on the internet
Many ways to disguise hidden costs in big multinationals.

Nissan is getting so much good press on this car, with almost zero marketing cost, well done...

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Apr 7, 2008 8:25:15 PM

reginos: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Nicosia , Cyprus; Posts: 12130, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 20, 2005; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
SciFrog said:
Quote:
reginos said:
Don't believe everything you read on the internet
Many ways to disguise hidden costs in big multinationals.

Nissan is getting so much good press on this car, with almost zero marketing cost, well done...

Exactly this the idea of a halo car and a loss leader I mentioned above, contrary to what Nissan officially say about the profitability of the car. Of course this doesn't deduct from the huge ability of this car but most of the GT-Rs positive impact in the press is related to its recognised ability at the given selling price. If they sold it for say the price of a GT2 or a F430 it would be seen in a totally different light. This car is heavily subsidised it is a kind of "dumping" by the clever Japs.

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Apr 7, 2008 9:01:21 PM

JoeRockhead: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Topside , Monaco; Posts: 8033, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 17, 2007; Reply to: SoCalHoosier

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:

The key words are "COULD" and "IF". What we're trying to do is light a fire under Porsche to get that ball rolling sooner.
Remember that most of us here are actually long-time Porsche customers. (even Nick)
Not sure why some of you seem to take it so personally when discussing the current dynamics of Porsche.

Who's taking it personally? The fact is, Porsche is easily capable of doing something about this... ie. add a couple of turbo's to the Boxster S and it's over. If you think 997TT owners are upset now, they would certainly go insane over that move! Which I suppose is why it will never happen.

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Apr 7, 2008 9:23:17 PM

eclou: Veteran; Loc: Texas , United States; Posts: 1182, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 4, 2006; Reply to: JoeRockhead

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Best potential platform in Porsche's stable is probably the Cayman. Porsche just chooses to keep it in the background. That leaves it to the owners to tweak their 997tt's to perfection. Porsche has provided us a very nice foundation to build upon in the 997 series cars. The aftermarket is what will respond to the GTR - Porsche won't have to spend a dime

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Apr 8, 2008 12:56:11 AM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: fritz

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Fritz I am crazy like a fox.

As to the Porschephiles response to the GT-R here is the list;

1. The car is ugly (forgetting that when the Uber frog was introduced 40 years ago that was the public reaction to it)

2. The performance figures are a fraud (where did I hear this before

oh yea the Z06)

3. If the performance figures are accurate, then they are lying about the hp.

4. If they are not lying about the hp then the performance number are as a result of a super version for press consumption.

5. If the car is for real, it nevertheless is a Nissan and we Porsche people do not buy lower mass produced cars.

6. It is a Nissan so the quality is lousy.

7. If the car is for real it is unfair to compare the price to a Porsche because Nissan is dumping the car at a loss just to sell it.

8. Finally regarding performance, at least to European audiences the car has yet to be tested by German drivers for German Magazines on German roads and therefore none of the prior test are worth a damn.

Have I missed anything?

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Apr 8, 2008 1:52:18 AM

MMD: Rennteam VIP; Loc: usa; Posts: 9652, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 16, 2004; Reply to: nberry

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Do you drive on the street?

You got the money?

Have a respect and admiration for Porsche?

Do you know what an abysmally UGLY car looks like?

No problem: Porsche wins and GTR loses.

Oh..., Porsche's response? They'll add a few more HP as needded to stay "ahead."

Sooooooo fugly:

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Apr 8, 2008 2:55:11 AM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: MMD

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

9. The actually performs quite well in german tests: well the gt2 is faster anyway (for 50% more than a TT).

Déjà vu all over...

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Apr 8, 2008 8:21:33 AM

AUM: Veteran; Loc: Germany; Posts: 1203, Gallery; Registered on: May 2, 2006; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

The GTR is the most important car of 2008. But it does have some problems for me; it is:

1. To heavy.
2. Too big.
3. Does not have the right sound.
4. I prefer European styling.

I hope BMW is preparing the new CSL to take on the GTR. Porsche is not going to make a credible response anytime soon, but BMW has the resources and technology to make the CSL similar in performance to the GTR while eliminating its four problems (above).

The Empire must strike back!

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Apr 8, 2008 9:19:13 AM

john999s: Senior; Loc: Hessen, Germany , Germany; Posts: 630, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2005; Reply to: AUM

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

My views as a C2S owner FWIW

The GTR is a great achievement that moves the current game on. It also happens to be able to make the maximum use of its excellent power because it is a clean sheet design which leverages state of the art thinking and technology.

That does not make other high performance cars like the 911 or turbo bad-it has just made the next step forwards.

If you read the test in last month's EVO where the GTR was pitched against the Z06, R8 and GT3 it becomes clear where the GTR is winning.
1.Great linear power and torque right accross the range.
2.Seamless power due to the gearbox
3.Abiility to get the power down on the road with 4wd
4.Weight distribution
5.World class brakes
6.Intelligent use of technology to bring it together.

It has the best price/all round performance ratio on the road today if you can get one.

Others can counter this including Porsche.

The current 911 to counter the GTR would have to lose weight in the first instance and either 1)needs to have a seamless gearbox to apply the power more consistently to the road (and probably a bit more power) 2) and needs some more handling Porsche magic to deal with weight transfer/changes of direction or 3) Lose some weight-preferably all 3!.

It seems from the tests which I have read that even a GT3 on a long long run would eventually leave a GTR because the weight of the GTR would eventually handicap it. A C2S would of course be left for dead.

Porsche makes fine cars and the they have a very nice brand which gives pride of ownership to many people. They can match or beat a GTR, of that I am sure. But in this age of efficiency they should do it in a Porsche way and not just by adding even more power and complex electronics to a 911.

If Porsche did the following I'm not sure the current GTR would see which way a Turbo went:

1.Lose at least another 150kg -it can be done (see GT2 and the racing department for details)
2.Sharpen the chassis and make the extremes more accessible
3.PCCB as standard at the current price point
4.A better gearbox which makes even better use of the power
In short they should maximise the benefits of the weight advantage and make better use of the power. I dont believe that weight distribution is a killer handicap-see race department.

A GT2 is not the answer for 'normal' drivers compared to a GTR. It is too focussed, extreme and difficult.

And whilst they are at it they should do the same to the standard 911's as well to close the gap a bit.

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Apr 8, 2008 9:42:00 AM

jesse: Co-Pilot; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 270, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 13, 2004; Reply to: AUM

Re: Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

Quote:
AUM said:
Will Porsche respond to the GTR?

From 6speedonline: http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125216
... and Porsche needs to bring them out ASAP.

Dont think so.

That's maybe the opinion of hard core P. fans which are depressed by some road tests (and a well spinned Nissan marketing campain).

BTW: Regarding the mags, the GT-R has a too harsh ride (EVO or was it R&T(?) mentioned it rides like a 997 GT3). Do I want that in a car for everyday use? Not really...

Currently 997 TT is going extremly well , esp. in Asia / EMEA market and is attracting the well earning customer level more than a Nissan GT-R.

PAG can really wait two or three years to implement new technolgies into the next model line at least.
There is no need to fall in panic

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