Crown

Sooner than later please!

......Maybe a 3.9-liter boxer-eight engine fitted with four turbos pumping out an estimated 650 horsepower.

Something new : “VarioCom” variable compression ratio system. According to the report, Porsche patented a variable-length connecting rod featuring an adjuster up top that is controlled by oil flow. The adjuster changes the position of a small end bearing at the piston’s wrist pin, which then adjusts stroke and compression ratio. That allows the engine to run a higher compression ratio for low-speed, efficiency-focused driving and lower compression when more power is needed.

Speculation that the 960 would ride on a mid-engine platform available with a rear- or all-wheel drive setup. It could run from 0-62 mph in 2.5 seconds with a price point more in line with the Ferrari 488 GTB, Lamborghini Huracan, and McLaren 650S.

So claims CAR magazine.   http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/industry-news/porsche/porsche-readies-960-name-for-new-mid-engined-supercar/

VIP Owners, get ready to put your deposit down.

Lets hope it's true.

Would be a dreamcar.

A turbo-charged unicorn 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | White | Full Bucket Seats | Sport Chrono
2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | Sport Chrono | SPASM

If this car becomes reallity, it has to produce more than 650 hp, otherwise it will have similar performace to the GT2 RS. 

Boyko23:

If this car becomes reallity, it has to produce more than 650 hp, otherwise it will have similar performace to the GT2 RS. 

Not necessarily but even if so, I don't think this would be a problem. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

The performance of any exotic Porsche will be monstrous because car companies can't move backwards in performance. The 911 Turbo is already crazy fast, and it can only get faster by the time an exotic Porsche arrives, so it's safe to assume a a 960 will be more or less packed with unusable performance.

noone1:

The performance of any exotic Porsche will be monstrous because car companies can't move backwards in performance. The 911 Turbo is already crazy fast, and it can only get faster by the time an exotic Porsche arrives, so it's safe to assume a a 960 will be more or less packed with unusable performance.

I wouldn't expect much more (performance) difference vs. the Huracan and R8 (the versions available at the time the 960 hits the market). 

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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

RC:

noone1:

The performance of any exotic Porsche will be monstrous because car companies can't move backwards in performance. The 911 Turbo is already crazy fast, and it can only get faster by the time an exotic Porsche arrives, so it's safe to assume a a 960 will be more or less packed with unusable performance.

I wouldn't expect much more (performance) difference vs. the Huracan and R8 (the versions available at the time the 960 hits the market). 

--

 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

 

Which by extension would suggest no major performance differences vs. the 992 Turbo presumably? How does that work?

You don't really expect a 992 Turbo to outrun a 960, do you? 

I'd say that the 992 Turbo S does 0-200 kph in around 9 seconds and the 960 slightly below it, maybe 8.5 seconds.

This is pure speculation though, I have no rumored performance figures yet...

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

RC:

You don't really expect a 992 Turbo to outrun a 960, do you? 

I'd say that the 992 Turbo S does 0-200 kph in around 9 seconds and the 960 slightly below it, maybe 8.5 seconds.

This is pure speculation though, I have no rumored performance figures yet...

No, I would not. But considering that that the Turbo's performance is already fairly similar to those cars, I would expect the 960 to be at least a notch or two above.

I any case, I am very excited by the prospect of this 960. I hope that, for once, all these rumors will materialise into something real.

A 960 Porsche would do 0-200 in the mid to high 7s range IMO. If a 3500 lb 488 can do 0-200 in 8.1s, you can assume a Porsche exotic with similar power will be the same or better 3 years from now.

It would be great if this was true, but the 960 project has a history of on-again, off-again...

Commenting performance figures two years before eventual presentation is useless because market and competition will be completely different by then, imv…

I expect, Porsche to set minimal targets as was with the 918 and adapt in the progress.  

In a AMS review, the 488 did 0-200 kph in 8.9 seconds and since their testing is standardized and very accurate, I trust AMS much more. 

With every Porsche (991 Turbo/S for example) generation, performance from 0-200 kph improves by one second or so.

I highly doubt that a 960 would do 0-200 kph in 7 seconds, this would be 918 territory. 

Yes, I think that Porsche needs to up their performance game, a 991.2 Turbo S should do 0-200 kph in 9 seconds...minimum but I guess Porsche has trouble to squeeze out lots of power from their current engine tech.

I would love to see a 992 Turbo S with 700 hp from the start but I guess we all know that this car will probably deliver 600 hp flat...or maybe 620 if we're lucky. I still have some hopes for the rumored hybrid tech and an additional boost but... 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

Hi Spyderidol, if it turns out where there is smoke there is fire, then I really don't understand why Porsche did not fast forward the 960 project (for the road and usage in motorsport) instead of completely revamping the 911 RSR (rear-mid engine, etc) for WEC GTE from 2017 onwards.

olli:

Hi Spyderidol, if it turns out where there is smoke there is fire, then I really don't understand why Porsche did not fast forward the 960 project (for the road and usage in motorsport) instead of completely revamping the 911 RSR (rear-mid engine, etc) for WEC GTE from 2017 onwards.

Hi Olli : I suspect that the mid-engine "911" may be an interim car (assuming that this is all true ). It will see season 2017 and  2018. After that, perhaps the 960 takes over. Who knows?

RC:

In a AMS review, the 488 did 0-200 kph in 8.9 seconds and since their testing is standardized and very accurate, I trust AMS much more. 

With every Porsche (991 Turbo/S for example) generation, performance from 0-200 kph improves by one second or so.

I highly doubt that a 960 would do 0-200 kph in 7 seconds, this would be 918 territory. 

Yes, I think that Porsche needs to up their performance game, a 991.2 Turbo S should do 0-200 kph in 9 seconds...minimum but I guess Porsche has trouble to squeeze out lots of power from their current engine tech.

I would love to see a 992 Turbo S with 700 hp from the start but I guess we all know that this car will probably deliver 600 hp flat...or maybe 620 if we're lucky. I still have some hopes for the rumored hybrid tech and an additional boost but... 

Not 7s flat, but between like 7.5-7.9.

650-700hp in a light car with lots of torque should be sufficient 3 years from now for that to happen. 675LT is very light, but it can crack 7.9. 

Spyderidol:

olli:

Hi Spyderidol, if it turns out where there is smoke there is fire, then I really don't understand why Porsche did not fast forward the 960 project (for the road and usage in motorsport) instead of completely revamping the 911 RSR (rear-mid engine, etc) for WEC GTE from 2017 onwards.

Hi Olli : I suspect that the mid-engine "911" may be an interim car (assuming that this is all true ). It will see season 2017 and  2018. After that, perhaps the 960 takes over. Who knows?

You guys try too hard to look for a Motorsport connection. Don't overthink this, sometimes it just a pure marketing decision...  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

Everyone assumes the 960 name being registered is to be used for the rumoured mid engine car from before. But I have been trying to gather news, and info last couple hrs. (Jetlagged induced research)

What if everyone is wrong? Right now, Porsche does not have the chassis, they won't use the Lambo/R8 one, nor do they have a suitable engine, I don't believe the current 9A1 has ever been built in a flat 8 configuration, the Cayenne/Panamera V8TT also doesn't seems to be the 'perfect' power plant, it's too big an heavy right now, so the project itself will be of great cost to Porsche just to develop, and the VAG group is not swimming in cash right now.

They also already have a mid engine platform in the Cayman/Boxster, it doesn't make sense for them to go ahead and do another mid-engine platform just because a minority of Porsche fans want one.

On the other hand, Porsche could, make a front engined Ferrari fighter relatively cheap, go up one class and fight with the F12/FF, using the Panamera platform.

Front engine rear wheel drive, front engine all wheel drive, it's all ready to go on the Panamera platform. Minimum capital outlay yet a new source of revenue. Playing in that segment also means the price will not be as sensitive, 350-400k car means a lot of freedom as to how they can equip the car, perhaps even go with what I suggested to them, add hybrid drivetrain to the V8TT to create another performance hybrid. 570HP from the gas engine and perhaps another 110HP from the electric motors, they are right around the ballpark with the Ferrari V12 but with much great fuel economy. The platform itself already can have hybrid power. Image-wise it will also be good to the company.

Last few 918 events, they had been asking us owners what other cars we have, the most common one among owners  is surprised, the FF. The follow up question is always why not the Panamera, and the answer are always we don't want a 4 door sedan. Some already have the Panamera yet they still bought the FF. We considered them 2 in different segment.

A two door "Panamera" Coupe makes a lot of sense, a GT, with (somehow) comfortable rear seats and enough luggage room for a weekend. Some sort of BMW 6 series or Mercedes S class Coupe from Porsche... 

Actually, this car would make a lot of sense for me and my family. We had a 6 series cab in Ibiza as a rental car and wife/kids loved it. Very comfy, fast and with the top down, real fun.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

RC, point taken, but I think it is reasonable to assume that the 960 timeline was pushed back (or the project cancelled completely) due to

(i) development priorities in light of development capacity bottlenecks, with roll-out of core products (Cayenne, Panamera, 992 etc.) winning first prize, and

(ii) scarce development funding in view of (i). 

Therefore, Walliser was more or less forced to make do with the 911 platform for his WEC GTE baby, at least for the time being. I suspect that is the connection between the real world and their motorsports program, if any.

RC:

Spyderidol:

olli:

Hi Spyderidol, if it turns out where there is smoke there is fire, then I really don't understand why Porsche did not fast forward the 960 project (for the road and usage in motorsport) instead of completely revamping the 911 RSR (rear-mid engine, etc) for WEC GTE from 2017 onwards.

Hi Olli : I suspect that the mid-engine "911" may be an interim car (assuming that this is all true ). It will see season 2017 and  2018. After that, perhaps the 960 takes over. Who knows?

You guys try too hard to look for a Motorsport connection. Don't overthink this, sometimes it just a pure marketing decision...  

The problem is that the waiver -mobile  (the mid-engine "911") can not go on for too long. If it starts winning then the opposition will start to complain about the waivers granted to Porsche.  If that happens, Porsche will find itself without a competitive product in the top GT series in the world. The first time in many, many decades.

..and Whoopsy's points could be right on the mark.

olli:

RC, point taken, but I think it is reasonable to assume that the 960 timeline was pushed back (or the project cancelled completely) due to

(i) development priorities in light of development capacity bottlenecks, with roll-out of core products (Cayenne, Panamera, 992 etc.) winning first prize, and

(ii) scarce development funding in view of (i). 

Therefore, Walliser was more or less forced to make do with the 911 platform for his WEC GTE baby, at least for the time being. I suspect that is the connection between the real world and their motorsports program, if any.

I think the (non) 960 decision was a VW Group decision, not a Porsche decision. For now.

A 960 makes sense (the R8 actually doesn't in my opinion...) but what Porsche lacks most is a GT Coupe. They badly need one and I think they know it.

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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

A mid engine 960 right now would only take away profit from R8 and Hurracan, so basically money going into the right pocket instead of the left pocket.  And Porsche/VAG needs new fresh money to go into both pockets.

Right now they are sort of in the same scenario like back in 2002,the 1st Cayenne era, they need new source of revenue. Catering to hardcore sports car addicts can wait.

From a business case point of view, it would only make sense to have a mid engine 960 when the R8/Hurracan is up for review/renewal. Then the group can position the next R8 at the low end of the market or even eliminate it, the Porsche in the middle then perhaps the next Hurracan at the top. Even then it would be a tight fit as the Aventador needs to move up to create room for the next Hurracan.

The VAG group is missing a touring GT, a sporty one. None of the brands have one, the Bentley Continentals are more of a show off item, they don't have the sporty characteristics needed. As it happens, Porsche have exactly what it takes to be in that segment right now. Doesn't cost much to produce such a car, minimum tooling cost on a existing platform.

At above 350k, they might move perhaps 2500.

At 300-350k segment, they might move just over 3000 cars a year.

At 250-300k, perhaps 4000-4500..

If they keep it around 200-250k, then perhaps 5000 if not more, at least for the first couple years.

A F12/FF is a 400k+ car, and I believe Ferrari sells around 2000 a year combined.

A GT Coupe with a base price (top model) of around 200k makes a lot of sense... 

The base engine version could be around 130k...

Yes, such a car would cannibalize from the 911 but I think the GT is long overdue.

Such a car could actually become the Swiss Armyknife of Porsche cars and I would surely be interested if it weights much less than a Cayenne... I am not interested in a GT with the weight of a Cayenne...then I get the Cayenne instead.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

Mission E - GT

olli:

Mission E - GT

4 doors = not interested. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

As usual I don't see things in the same way ( and in this case with Whoopsy). Bentley are racing their cars all over the GT series trying to promote its sportiness and end the stayed and stuffy image it previously had.

I don't see why Porsche can not compete directly with the Audi R8 or the Hurracan. I don't see Audi asking Porsche's permission to encroach on the Cayman territory with its TT RS.

Perhaps there are quite a few Porsche aficionados that would go for a sporty sedan, but I bet there are as many or more that would go for a mid-engine Fe-Fi type car.

Just my opinion.