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    Here we go again

    I lost track. AM, Maserati, AUDI, Nissan and now Jag

    http://www.autoblog.com/2008/01/29/rumormill-jaguar-planning-porsche-911-rival/

    Re: Here we go again

    Man, Porsche AG's ears must be ringing! every new sportcar that comes out always gets compared to the Porsche 911 by the press as the bar to which all are compared to or their target rival lets hope they don't get to full of themselves...

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    Man, Porsche AG's ears must be ringing! every new sportcar that comes out always gets compared to the Porsche 911 by the press as the bar to which all are compared to or their target rival lets hope they don't get to full of themselves...



    No question about that. But it used to be that the 911 had no rivals, and now it does. The hope is that PAG will learn from this, but from what I've seen in the last few years, my hope is less strong.

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    Man, Porsche AG's ears must be ringing! every new sportcar that comes out always gets compared to the Porsche 911 by the press as the bar to which all are compared to or their target rival lets hope they don't get to full of themselves...



    No one should be surprised by car makers entering the 911 market segment. At this time there are very few manfacturers competing in this market though recently we are beginning to see more doing so. It is very profitable and the leader in the segment has not changed in over 40 years. A fresh, new and attractive car in this segment would be welcomed by not only many car enthusiast but also many present Porsche owners.

    BTW, that is why the press invariably compares new cars in this market to Porsche. They have had it to themselves for years. Corvette, Z360, Honda 2000 and the rest of them are in a much lower price category.

    Re: Here we go again

    Going after the 911 makes sense, after all the profit % per unit the 911 makes is second to none.

    Re: Here we go again

    As with most PR, I will beleive it when the rubber actually hits the road.

    Re: Here we go again

    How quickly we all forget, the 911 has always had good rivals, even more so before than today when most of the pure sportcar makes and also the good olde motorsport derived street versions that makers used to make have dissapeared... but in the end only the 911 is still here and hence its the car to which everyone wants to compare itself to, nothing is new, nothing has changed in terms of comeptition: there has always been other options to choose. Before the GT-R was the supra, skyline, 3000GT or NSX, before the Aston V8 was the old V8, before the R8 was the Quattro Coupe, the Alpine, the Lotus, the Ferraris, the Lancias, the Lambos, the Jaguars, and so on... and today is not different, it has the italian competition (F430, Gallardo), the german (Audi R8), the japanese (GT-R), etc. all good rivals, but its funny that over all these years, now every new sportcar needs to be called the "new" 911 rival in order to be considered serious

    Re: Here we go again

    the 911 is and has always been a benchmark in the sportscarworld. everybody knows that!

    Re: Here we go again

    the 911 used to be further apart from their competitors in terms of performance.. other cars are coming closer, but that is to be expected!
    What do you guys think, zero to 60 in 1second... we can't go much faster anymore... so lets get rid of those stupid sat navs and radios, and air conditioning.... all pointless options

    Re: Here we go again

    Carlos, the GT-R was built to compete with the 997TT. It will pee on the rest of the 911's.

    The Corvette Z06 was built to compete with all 911's and pee's on all of them except for the GT2.

    The NSX is 15 years old. The Gt3000 was never intended to compete with the 911 nor was the lotus. For an example, the Elise is a very good track car but not intended to be a car driven daily.

    The AM in the past was targeted for a totally different market which did not include track duties and was priced far above the 911.

    THe ONLY reason Porsche is a standard in sport cars is it has the market completely to itself in producing a car that can be a daily driver and do track work. Now the GT-R and Corvette are moving in. Ferrari, which also does both, cannot be included because it is some much more expensive and not mass produced. That is one reason Nissan did not target the 430.

    Re: Here we go again

    Nick, your anti-Porsche agenda makes you too predictable and your arguments weak... last time I checked the 997TT was a 911 ... the Elise is not the Lotus I was talking about (keep guessing) ... the NSX and 3000GT/GTO are old but there was a 911 version at that time as well (thats my point) ... the 911 was a daily driver and track since the beginning not just now ... the GT2 (a 911) is more exclusive than the F430 and will PEE on it ...

    I'm telling you Nick, the lack of real protein in your diet is recking havock in your hippocampus, you should remember the history of the 911 better that I, I'm only 35. What you need is a good old fashion finguer licking good Bar-B-Q!

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    Nick, your anti-Porsche agenda makes you too predictable and your arguments weak... last time I checked the 997TT was a 911 ... the Elise is not the Lotus I was talking about (keep guessing) ... the NSX and 3000GT/GTO are old but there was a 911 version at that time as well (thats my point) ... the 911 was a daily driver and track since the beginning not just now ... the GT2 (a 911) is more exclusive than the F430 and will PEE on it ...

    I'm telling you Nick, the lack of real protein in your diet is recking havock in your hippocampus, you should remember the history of the 911 better that I, I'm only 35. What you need is a good old fashion finguer licking good Bar-B-Q!



    thanks for the supporting words Carlos, Nick I heard they now sell Bean-cakes at Starbucks. This should help your protein levels

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    They have had it to themselves for years. Honda 2000 and the rest of them are in a much lower price category.



    Trust me Nick, the Honda S2000 is a piece of junk compared with a Boxster. Unless you scream its head off it feels no different to a Civic. I had one when they first came out believing it would be a cheaper alternative to a Boxster and sold it a few months later afetr I become addicted to paracetomol.

    Now I've had two Boxsters and I've never regretted either. By and large you get what you pay for.

    Re: Here we go again

    Carlos I fully understand that English is not your first language and frequently you fail to read a post correctly. That is alright because I am a patient man.

    If you reread my post and comprehend it correctly then your post does not make any sense.

    Let me help you. My post never states that Porsche was anything but a daily and track car. It also states the cars you mentioned (some out of the very distant past) were never designed to be daily/tracks. They were one or the other. Today, more and more manufacturers are adopting the duel purpose and are succeeding beyond Porsche expectations. That is the point of my post.

    BTW, I fully agree that the GT2 performance will pee on my 430. Yet, put them side by side and the GT2 will disappear into the abyss of 24 other look alike 911 models.

    Finally, a closer reading of my post clearly indicates that the 997TT is a 911.

    Re: Here we go again

    Nick, don't worry its not the way you express yourself in written form, its the errors in argumentation that throw people off so won't matter if you use a different language

    "Today, more and more manufacturers are adopting the duel purpose and are succeeding beyond Porsche expectations."
    errrrrrr! (buzer sound) you specifically mentioned the Z06 and the GT-R that are moving in now... the C6&Z06 are not a 2+2, with worldwide service infrasctructure and as appropiate for all years round/climate use. And before the new GT-R there was.... long and behold... yes, the "old" GT-R Skyline which was essentially the same AWD four seater concept. I'm telling you, a big juicy steak will do wonders!

    As to the GT2 dissapearing into the abyss when placed next to a F430, guess you haven't seen the GT2 "live", but given that thats not how you compare cars, if you compare them strickly for attention seeking value then yes, I'll give you taht, just like if you place the GT-R or Z06 you mentioned next to a GT2. But fortunartely, most of those Z06 and GT-R driven won't care since they will be having a hoot driving the cars instead of posing with them.

    And the fact is that Porsche 911 sales keep getting more succesful year by year and Porsche has become the envy of the sportcar industry, something that wouldn't happen if they would be getting harder comeptition in real life, in fact its in the past were Porsche struggled more against the competition.


    One thing though the new R8 (and future versions, V10 and spyder) specifically is the closest true competitor to the 911 I have seen in a long time, and a solid alternative... will be interegsting to see its impact in sportcar market the next two years, but I see other manufacturers that are standing to loose more than Porsche is.

    Re: Here we go again

    Carlos, your point regarding the world wide service is a good one. Nevertheless, both the GT-R and Z06 are designed as high performance daily drivers though lacking a back seat(btw the backseats of the 911 are the joke of the industry). I don't believe the Skyline ever was.

    I also will concede that Porsche sales remain high. I continue to believe the life span of the 911 is numbered. For the life of me, I cannot understand how any sane person will continue to buy the next look alike model with small increase in power while knowingly taking a huge hit in depreciation by doing so.

    I guess I view and value the world differently.

    Finally, you may be 35 and good looking now but continue to have your steaks and your going to look like a 911 within 10 years.

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    nberry said: but continue to have your steaks and your going to look like a 911 within 10 years.



    Touché nick

    nah both my grandfathers made it to 96 eating real man food and I don't even drink or smoke , so I will probably be able to drive the current 911 in 2069

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    I lost track. AM, Maserati, AUDI, Nissan and now Jag




    As far as 911 competition, I far prefer the AM, Maserati and Audi options. Same will probably be true for the Jaguar when it emerges.

    The 911 wins over the Nissan option just because the GTR is so outrageously ugly.

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    nah both my grandfathers made it to 96 eating real man food and I don't even drink or smoke , so I will probably be able to drive the current 911 in 2069



    Yeah, but your grandfathers washed down all that man food with a couple jugs of tinto to keep their blood lipids lower than your tee-totaling scores.

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    Man, Porsche AG's ears must be ringing! every new sportcar that comes out always gets compared to the Porsche 911 by the press as the bar to which all are compared to or their target rival lets hope they don't get to full of themselves...



    No one should be surprised by car makers entering the 911 market segment. At this time there are very few manfacturers competing in this market though recently we are beginning to see more doing so. It is very profitable and the leader in the segment has not changed in over 40 years. A fresh, new and attractive car in this segment would be welcomed by not only many car enthusiast but also many present Porsche owners.

    BTW, that is why the press invariably compares new cars in this market to Porsche. They have had it to themselves for years. Corvette, Z360, Honda 2000 and the rest of them are in a much lower price category.



    Nick,
    you're regressing...I thought I cured you. Therefore I must point out this thread where you flat out lie that you were
    ever banned from rennteam for being a troll and then humiliated and proven to be a liar:

    http://www.rennteam.com/showflat.php?Cat...e=0&fpart=6

    I believe you are the only member to have ever been banned from rennteam. Not even I have had that distinction. Do you want to be banned again?

    David

    Re: Here we go again

    DavidSF - give it a rest...there's no point in re-opening old wounds.

    Anyway, this discussion is healthy enough..so far!!

    As for classing 'being banned' as a distinction - you'll get there if you really want to.

    Re: Here we go again

    David, listen to John's wise words, give it a rest with those type of posts or you will be the one banned.

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    W8MM said:
    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    nah both my grandfathers made it to 96 eating real man food and I don't even drink or smoke , so I will probably be able to drive the current 911 in 2069



    Yeah, but your grandfathers washed down all that man food with a couple jugs of tinto to keep their blood lipids lower than your tee-totaling scores.





    you do have a point there... OK, I have a lot of catching up to do!

    Re: Here we go again

    I agree with Nick, the GT-R is more of a 911 Turbo focused competitor rather than overall 911 line.

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    John H said:
    DavidSF - give it a rest...there's no point in re-opening old wounds.

    Anyway, this discussion is healthy enough..so far!!

    As for classing 'being banned' as a distinction - you'll get there if you really want to.



    I don't understand why I would be banned for posting factual information that's not a personal attack?
    I only posted to remind people, including Nick, of Nick's dark past of being banned for being a troll. If he didn't compare Porsche to Honda (S2000) I certainly would've kept quiet. I will continue to post this reminder whenever Nick acts like a troll. It's not a personal attack. It's truthful factual information about his past. If I'm banned for providing that service so be it, but I think it's highly unfair and hypocritical and "favortist" that rennteam would allow Nick to continue to post his troll posts and ban me for posting factual truthful information that's not a personal attack nor being a troll.

    David

    Re: Here we go again

    The real question is, who's the bigger troll...

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Yet, put them side by side and the GT2 will disappear into the abyss of 24 other look alike 911 models.





    As well as a 430 disappears if you put it side by side with any 430 or 360.

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    The real question is, who's the bigger troll...



    Bingo...!!

    Re: Here we go again

    Quote:
    John H said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    The real question is, who's the bigger troll...



    Bingo...!!



    Yes I agree-bingo!! Nick and I are BOTH trolls and I'm glad others agree! The difference is I know I'm a troll when it comes to some of Nick's posts, and so I can stop being a troll, as soon as Nick stops it with his boorish troll posts. The problem is Nick doesn't see himself as a troll, so I'm not holding my breath.

    BTW, to answer the question who is the bigger troll I think if you take a poll on any of the Porsche forums I think Nick would be it! And let's not forget Nick has been previously banned. I don't have that distinction (yet).


    David

    Re: Here we go again

    Gosh! It seems like Nick is making you lose some sleep.. Take it easy with whatever you are taking dude!

     
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