Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - P15/Senna - Page4

Mar 9, 2018 6:24:55 PM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: noone1

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

noone1:
How again did your friend take it up the ass by buying a 650S before the 675 was announced? Did he once again fail to use common sense and realize that there would be a track day special just like every other car on the planet?

?? Where is your argument logic again? Or are you just arguing for argument sake?

Do you even remotely remember the transition time from 12C-650-675?

They first did the 12C. then the P1, and swapped the 12C's front end to turn it into a 650 after 18months or so.

Now come the 650S Spyder. (He bought that)

They then announced the 675LT, which they announced there will only be 500 copies, which he put down a deposit right away.

Those are gone quick, and right away after they announced the 675LT Spyder. Another 500 cars. He thought he was screwed then as he wasn't informed there will be a Spyder version coming. But he swapped allocation to get a Spyder instead.

Now comes the 570S, he loved it so he ordered one too. Happy as a clam.

Then the 720S was announced, he also got one of the first cars, well after mine but I sold my allocation and didn't take a car. Also happy with his.

Now the comes the Senna. He had sneak peaks and infos beforehand, he liked and ordered right away. He was told in person BY McLaren Woking there won't be a GTR version like with the P1. He trusted them. This is McLaren Woking, not Mclaren Canada. He was plain lied to by HQ. Now this is what got him pissed. He was there with a P1 owner too, so 2 people got lied to with a straight face. The P1 owner didn't order the Senna though.

This is the issue on hand. McLaren HQ LIED to a customer with a straight face. A very good customer no less. Plus also a P1 owner too.

This will NEVER happen with Ferrari to their customers, nor Porsche with theirs. Nor Lamborghini. These guys will deflect the question and not answer, but will never ever lie to a customer like that. Plain and simple.

With my purchase history and as a 918 VIP, if I ask Porsche about future of a car or what's coming next, they will not lie to me, at worse I get is they would say they can't talk about it yet, but would comfort me by saying don't wait, or I will be pleasantly surprised by waiting.

--

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Mar 9, 2018 7:03:56 PM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21148, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Whoopsy:
noone1:
How again did your friend take it up the ass by buying a 650S before the 675 was announced? Did he once again fail to use common sense and realize that there would be a track day special just like every other car on the planet?

?? Where is your argument logic again? Or are you just arguing for argument sake?

You are new around here, right? Smiley

--

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

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Mar 9, 2018 7:05:09 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

He might have been lied to or not... It does not make sense for McLaren to lie this way...

But your friend has a problem, if he wants always the greatest latest it will cost him. There is ALWAYS a better car behind. This time he got caught... He is rich, he can sell the car and buy the one he wants again.

Ferrari is playing dirty too, because they can.

I do like a lot the fact that McLaren comes out with the new cars when they are ready. The 488GTB or Spider are way too long in the tooth for example. The current life cycles of cars are WAY too long. Lot of progress has already happened that is being held back just because of cycles. Porsche is the worst at that. Actually I suspect the 911 is an entire 7 year cycle behind where they could be today. McLaren is forcing the others to produce better cars more often, we all should applaud for the revolution they are bringing to the sport car world.

For example the Macan today is the same I have had in my garage for 4 years. Why? 4 years ago we had iPhone 5S. 4 years is an eternity these days.

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Mar 9, 2018 7:10:37 PM

Mcracing1: Newbie; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 29, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2018; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Whoopsy:
crayphile:
Whoops

HHe was at the launch party in London a little while ago, he had asked a certain person who shall remain nameless specifically if there will be a GTR version coming out like the P1 did. He was told a DEFINITE no on the spot. But he was told about the expose carbon weave option before it was introduced, which he took on the spot.

He didn't believe me when I tell him about the hotter version that WILL come, cause he quoted what he was told at the launch party. Now he believed be completely.

For Ferrari and Porsche, if asked specifically about something like that, they won't lie straight out, they would just deflect/avoid answering. I have had those answers from both before.

--

I was at the launch party in england of the senna and was been told to expect an non street legal version of the senna later. So i dont see the point of your friend. Maybe there were different launch party s but to me they were stright forward.

And how was it with the 991.1 Gt3RS were AP mentioned 2000 cars, at the end around 5000 produced....

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Mar 9, 2018 7:15:15 PM

Mcracing1: Newbie; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 29, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2018; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

SciFrog:
Ferrari is playing dirty too, because they can.

Indeed, and what about the upcoming versions rumored of the pista

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Mar 9, 2018 7:29:45 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: Mcracing1

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

And Porsche too. Buy this ridiculously overpriced Panamera diesel no one wants and you can get this exclusive GT3 RS. Oh wait, we will meet all the demand!

Today I’d much rather give my money to McLaren than Porsche or even Ferrari.

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Mar 9, 2018 8:21:34 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Mcracing1

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Mcracing1:
I was at the launch party in england of the senna and was been told to expect an non street legal version of the senna later. So i dont see the point of your friend. Maybe there were different launch party s but to me they were stright forward.

And how was it with the 991.1 Gt3RS were AP mentioned 2000 cars, at the end around 5000 produced....

LOL

Guess Whoopsy's friend was talking to the janitor.

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Mar 9, 2018 8:25:31 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Whoopsy:
noone1:
How again did your friend take it up the ass by buying a 650S before the 675 was announced? Did he once again fail to use common sense and realize that there would be a track day special just like every other car on the planet?

?? Where is your argument logic again? Or are you just arguing for argument sake?

So let me get this straight:

1. Your friend buys a 650S Spider because he likes it.
2. 675 is announced so he orders it.
3. Find out about the Spider and is able to swap his allocation and get the Spider.
4. Orders a 570S and likes it.
5. Orders a 720S and likes it.

Um, so he got the 4 cars he wanted and liked, and you're claiming he got screwed each time? Man, I wish I got fucked that bad more often...

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Mar 9, 2018 10:44:42 PM

crayphile: Rennteam Pro; Loc: England , United Kingdom; Posts: 2861, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 16, 2004; Reply to: Mcracing1

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Mcracing1:
I was at the launch party in england of the senna and was been told to expect an non street legal version of the senna later. So i dont see the point of your friend. Maybe there were different launch party s but to me they were stright forward.

And how was it with the 991.1 Gt3RS were AP mentioned 2000 cars, at the end around 5000 produced....

I suspect you mean the Winter Ball? I was there too, and it was well known that there would be a GTR even then as you say. Welcome to Rennteam BTW Smiley .

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Mar 10, 2018 6:55:41 PM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: crayphile

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

It was the Winter Ball.

I wasn't there but obviously there is a communication break down somewhere. Either between McLaren employees, or between McLaren employees to my friend, or between my friend and I. That last part I can ruled out as I know what I heard from him.

--

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Mar 10, 2018 7:04:57 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

So why did your friend want a GTR anyway?

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Apr 1, 2018 2:15:13 PM

rhino: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Island , Saint Lucia; Posts: 2866, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2006; Reply to: noone1

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

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Apr 3, 2018 2:45:14 AM

martini964: Veteran; Loc: Toronto , Canada; Posts: 853, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 1, 2014; Reply to: rhino

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

who remembered Laguna secs incident? funny was reading this when I see this post, are they using Senna in competition this year?

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Apr 21, 2018 4:20:55 AM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: martini964

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

While I still think the car is pretty ugly, this glass door idea could be the next step in adding excitement to cars. Hard to say what it will feel like driving, but the closer you are to the ground, the fast it feels like you're going. You shouldn't be staring out the door window by any means, by you should still be able to detect it out of your peripheral etc.

https://twitter.com/McLarenAuto/status/986576987497123840

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Apr 21, 2018 9:38:16 AM

Joost: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Dordrecht , Netherlands; Posts: 8054, Gallery; Registered on: May 3, 2004; Reply to: noone1

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Spotted on the road:

https://m.imgur.com/r/formula1/fHco99g

--

Porsche, separates Le Mans from Le Boys

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Apr 24, 2018 12:29:08 AM

Enmanuel: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Boston , United States; Posts: 8843, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 7, 2008; Reply to: Joost

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Joost:
Spotted on the road:

https://m.imgur.com/r/formula1/fHco99g

Is it just this picture or do the real life proportions also look strange?

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Apr 24, 2018 2:23:40 AM

Jean: Veteran; Loc: Seoul , South Korea; Posts: 1033, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 14, 2002; Reply to: Enmanuel

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

This is what happens when you impose aerodynamic parts on an existing chassis instead of designing a whole concept from the ground up.

Looks like a tuning car, which it eventually is.

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Apr 24, 2018 6:19:05 AM

Rossi: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Home , Germany; Posts: 12680, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: Jean

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Jean:
This is what happens when you impose aerodynamic parts on an existing chassis instead of designing a whole concept from the ground up.

Looks like a tuning car, which it eventually is.

Not before long Whoopsy will chime in and say that all current McLarens are tuning derivatives from the 12C. Smiley

--

We're at the point where you can be the fastest or just sound like you're the fastest.

The secret of life is to admire without desiring.

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Apr 24, 2018 6:40:51 AM

Porker: Rennteam VIP; Loc: SZ , Switzerland; Posts: 7062, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 17, 2005; Reply to: Rossi

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

It looks like someone attempted to make a Ferrari Enzo lookalike from a Toyota MR2. angry

--

1992 Mercedes-Benz W124 500E / 2008 Porsche 911 GT3 RS (sold) / 2011 Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG Performance / 2014 BMW-Alpina D3 biturbo Touring / 2018 Porsche 911 GT3 Clubsport

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Apr 24, 2018 7:34:28 AM

Itsme: Veteran; Loc: Munich , Germany; Posts: 994, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 22, 2003; Reply to: Porker

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Porker:
It looks like someone attempted to make a Ferrari Enzo lookalike from a Toyota MR2.

Smiley Smiley

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Apr 24, 2018 8:10:49 AM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21148, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: Porker

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Porker:
It looks like someone attempted to make a Ferrari Enzo lookalike from a Toyota MR2.

I couldn't quite put my finguer fi how to describe it but you just nailed it with that comparison. Proportions seem wrong, like a body that does not match the chasis.

--

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

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Apr 24, 2018 8:12:46 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59581, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Porker

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Porker:
It looks like someone attempted to make a Ferrari Enzo lookalike from a Toyota MR2.

Smiley Smiley

Speaking of MR2: I never understood why Toyota doesn't make a (relatively cheap and light) modern successor. Was a fun car.

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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Apr 24, 2018 10:42:40 AM

ISUK: Rennteam Master; Loc: UK , United Kingdom; Posts: 4206, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 16, 2004; Reply to: RC

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

RC:
Speaking of MR2: I never understood why Toyota doesn't make a (relatively cheap and light) modern successor. Was a fun car.

Sadly the business case for the level of investment required for such a model simply does not stack up these days. They might sell well for the first year or two but after that the sales dry up and the required return on investment to avoid a loss simply is not there. It's why Mazda required Fiat to commit to the 124 to make the MX5 viable and why the new Supra is platform sharing with the Z4.

MR2 buyers would be looking for all the modern tech and comforts in a new model and that adds weight, cost and blunts the performance aspect which kills the whole point of such a car. When manufacturers try and present a stripped down, back to basics model it simply gets panned for being too loud, riding too firmly, lacking electric everything, not having 25 gallon cupholders/CarPlay/30 way seats/enough luggage space for a two week vacation etc etc. It is therefore far easier to just produce a slightly sportier version of a cross over which is what the market wants these days, especially China which is driving the whole shift towards SUV's.

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Apr 24, 2018 11:44:39 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59581, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: ISUK

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

The new 124 is such an ugliness...Fiat screwed up badly. I wonder how this thing sells...

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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Apr 24, 2018 12:59:15 PM

crayphile: Rennteam Pro; Loc: England , United Kingdom; Posts: 2861, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 16, 2004; Reply to: Rossi

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Rossi:
Not before long Whoopsy will chime in and say that all current McLarens are tuning derivatives from the 12C.

Smiley .

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Apr 24, 2018 1:01:09 PM

ISUK: Rennteam Master; Loc: UK , United Kingdom; Posts: 4206, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 16, 2004; Reply to: RC

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

I agree on the 124. Fiat were trying to raid the heritage catalogue again following on from the success of the 500. Their target market for the 124 was the US where the previous model had been very popular but the proportions offered by the donor MX5 did not translate at all well to a retro inspired sports car. They should have been braver and gone for an updated version of the 1995 Barchetta which would have suited the cab rear/short trunk MX5 layout far better.

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Apr 24, 2018 1:04:57 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59581, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: ISUK

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

ISUK:
I agree on the 124. Fiat were trying to raid the heritage catalogue again following on from the success of the 500. Their target market for the 124 was the US where the previous model had been very popular but the proportions offered by the donor MX5 did not translate at all well to a retro inspired sports car. They should have been braver and gone for an updated version of the 1995 Barchetta which would have suited the cab rear/short trunk MX5 layout far better.

Smiley Smiley The Barchetta was so nice when it came out...

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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Apr 24, 2018 1:18:02 PM

ISUK: Rennteam Master; Loc: UK , United Kingdom; Posts: 4206, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 16, 2004; Reply to: RC

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

I had a Barchetta for 5 years as a weekend toy. I bought it from a German guy who worked for Hewlett Packard in Scotland. He bought in new in northern Italy and it was one of the first examples on the road in late 1995. It was a fun car and a decent drive being based upon the original Punto.

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Apr 24, 2018 2:54:03 PM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: ISUK

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

ISUK:
RC:
Speaking of MR2: I never understood why Toyota doesn't make a (relatively cheap and light) modern successor. Was a fun car.

Sadly the business case for the level of investment required for such a model simply does not stack up these days. They might sell well for the first year or two but after that the sales dry up and the required return on investment to avoid a loss simply is not there. It's why Mazda required Fiat to commit to the 124 to make the MX5 viable and why the new Supra is platform sharing with the Z4.

MR2 buyers would be looking for all the modern tech and comforts in a new model and that adds weight, cost and blunts the performance aspect which kills the whole point of such a car. When manufacturers try and present a stripped down, back to basics model it simply gets panned for being too loud, riding too firmly, lacking electric everything, not having 25 gallon cupholders/CarPlay/30 way seats/enough luggage space for a two week vacation etc etc. It is therefore far easier to just produce a slightly sportier version of a cross over which is what the market wants these days, especially China which is driving the whole shift towards SUV's.

Which is why the Alfa 4C is such a odd beast. It is everything you just said. And it's also a decent car no less.

--

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Apr 24, 2018 2:55:24 PM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: Rossi

Re: P15/Senna -- Yuck

Rossi:
Jean:
This is what happens when you impose aerodynamic parts on an existing chassis instead of designing a whole concept from the ground up.

Looks like a tuning car, which it eventually is.

Not before long Whoopsy will chime in and say that all current McLarens are tuning derivatives from the 12C.

Nah, haven't you noticed? Lately I have changed my tune to the Alfa 4C is a cheaper and better alternative to McLarens Smiley

I am in love with my 4C right now

--

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