Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: 997S or 996 Turbo? - Page1

Sep 8, 2007 3:14:14 PM

cibergypsy: Pilot; Loc: FL, USA , United States; Posts: 366, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 21, 2006

997S or 996 Turbo?

What would you choose? An 11,800 miles 2006 Carrera S with X51 and factory Aerokit with other options that pushed the MSRP to $121500 or a late (2004-2005) 996 Turbo or Turbo S with similar mileage? There will be a substantial depreciation hit on the 997 S if I go this route but this question is about which is the better car, without regard to monetary issues. So, what would this poll reveal?

Next
Threads

Sep 8, 2007 3:40:26 PM

Statman: Junior; Loc: Boulder, Santa Monica , United States; Posts: 100, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 6, 2005; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Have you driven either car? Once you drive the turbo, there is no looking back.

Next
Threads

Sep 8, 2007 3:40:39 PM

Powerstar: Junior; Loc: Germany; Posts: 91, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 22, 2006; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

no question .. the turbo S .. if you have driven a turbo S you never will look for a 911 without a turbo

Next
Threads

Sep 8, 2007 6:20:29 PM

silvershadow: Senior; Loc: Zuerich, Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 757, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 6, 2003; Reply to: Powerstar

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

I have the same opinion: Turbo can be really addictive

Next
Threads

Sep 9, 2007 2:04:15 AM

Turbo Al: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Rochester, New York , United States; Posts: 2531, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 3, 2005; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

As everyone has said, the Turbo makes the decision easy. And remember, you can make a 996 Turbo or TurboS sick fast with smart tuning.

Next
Threads

Sep 9, 2007 10:07:39 AM

Powerstar: Junior; Loc: Germany; Posts: 91, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 22, 2006; Reply to: Turbo Al

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

put 10000 Euro (550-580hp) in the engine and you can keep up with the new lp640 lambo because there is so much torque

Next
Threads

Sep 9, 2007 3:41:21 PM

cibergypsy: Pilot; Loc: FL, USA , United States; Posts: 366, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 21, 2006; Reply to: Powerstar

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

I've driven the 2001 996 Turbo that my brother had prior to buying his F430 and I loved the car. At that time, I had a 2004 996 C4S and I kept it when I should have traded cars with my brother. That would have saved me a lot of money because I ended up selling the C4S and buying the Carrera S that I mentioned in this post. I am trying to make up my mind as to wether or not I'd be better off, as far as depreciation is concerned, by selling my Carrera S now and cutting my losses and moving on to a very nice 996 Turbo S that is Certified Pre-Owned until 2010 with 16,000 miles. For comparison reasons, my Carrera S is a 2006 with X51 and Aerokit as well as adaptive sports seata, Carrera Classic wheels, full leather interior, Bose Surround Sound and a myriad other options that made me pay $121430 for it when all was said and done. I optioned the car like that because I intended it to be a "keeper." Now, with all that goes around regarding the M96/M97 family of engines and their wet sumps, RMSs, their completely removed origins from the GT1 engine the Turbo carries, I have something like a "chip on the shoulder" when I encounter GT3, GT2 and Turbo owners, something like a feeling that my car is missing the essence of continuity that all other 911 have had since 1.963 - sort of an inferiority complex.
By the way, I do love the way the 997 drives when changing directions, turning and how it feels nimbler than the 2001 Turbo as well as the sound of the atmospheric engine at full rpms with the PSE, but I don't think it is objective since it's been a while since I drove the Turbo and it wasn't a last year model with all the improvements those models should have. I also love the 997s interior more than the 996 series but it's not like the 996 series is bad at all! Like I said, if I had kept my brother's Turbo and sold the Carrera 4S, I wouldn't be in this position as I'd be very happy with that car as a keeper and would have saved me over $50,000 plus any depreciation I would incurr if I do sell my 997 S.

Next
Threads

Sep 10, 2007 2:54:48 PM

tinbomber: Newbie; Loc: Chicago, USA; Posts: 11, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 8, 2006; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

honestly...I think you already answered your own question!

next time measure twice and cut once!

If moeny's no object...get the 996TT. i have no Idea how porsche comes up w/ the 381HP number for X51, but IMO there is NO comparison btw a stock 415HP TT and a 997SX51. The 997 is s-l-o-w!!

The 996TT is $5k away from 500HP, $15k from 580HP...

spend $20k do a nice suspension, 580HP and wheels!

wave at Z06s and Vipers in your rear view!

Next
Threads

Sep 10, 2007 6:47:29 PM

Moogle: Rennteam Master; Loc: Bay Area , United States; Posts: 5019, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 9, 2003; Reply to: tinbomber

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

The turbo's capability for endless modding and the superior engine format makes it the top choice in this scenario

Next
Threads

Sep 12, 2007 10:08:09 AM

Jeannot: Expert; Loc: Currently in Hong-Kong , Switzerland; Posts: 1745, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 13, 2005; Reply to: Moogle

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Also the depreciation on the Turbo shall be less from now on, the reliability is better...and it will always be a turbo :-)

Next
Threads

Sep 12, 2007 5:59:48 PM

Gnil: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: VD, Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 14173, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 11, 2005; Reply to: Jeannot

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

People are biased...
On this board you are clearly advised to choose the 996 Turbo.
Your same question on the 997 board has a wast majority telling you to get the 997.

So...should we take the advice on Rennteam as objective ?

Next
Threads

Sep 12, 2007 9:37:45 PM

cibergypsy: Pilot; Loc: FL, USA , United States; Posts: 366, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 21, 2006; Reply to: Gnil

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

You seem to be very right about this! I guess that, as a decision tool, I'm going to rely on my own judgement as difficult as it is when it comes to Porsches.

Next
Threads

Sep 13, 2007 6:37:23 AM

silvershadow: Senior; Loc: Zuerich, Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 757, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 6, 2003; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Drive both and then decide.
Listen to your own "butt" and to your own sensations

Next
Threads

Sep 14, 2007 3:33:01 PM

Statman: Junior; Loc: Boulder, Santa Monica , United States; Posts: 100, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 6, 2005; Reply to: Gnil

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Quote:
Gnil said:
People are biased...

I actually think people like to think they made the correct decision and there is a degree of belief that if others agree...then they did...There really is no comparison between the turbo and an NA...this is not a good or bad thing just a reality.

Next
Threads

Sep 16, 2007 12:40:29 AM

cibergypsy: Pilot; Loc: FL, USA , United States; Posts: 366, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 21, 2006; Reply to: Statman

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Today I drove a 2005 996 Turbo S with only 14.5K miles on its odomoter. The car is much - and I mean - much faster than my 2006 X51 Carrera S, without any exaggeration on my part. It is definitely a lot faster off the line due to the huge torque this motor produces, and also faster on the top rpm range - this car has a substantial amount of more hp than the 381 my Carrera S can produce. I could feel a bit more turbo lag, as compared to a standard 996 Turbo, but nothing significant at all: its response is very quick and only a bit than a standard 996 Turbo. As far as cornering/handling abilities, I can say nothing good or bad as my test drive (in Florida) didn't include any roads with turns.

I like the looks of my 997 far more than the 996 series but it's not like the 996 is a bad looking car, far from it! It's just that to me, the 997 looks more like a traditional 911 than the 996. One aspect I am definitely in favor of the 997 is the interior quality. IMO, the 997 is a giant leap ahead of the 996 in design and quality albeit not in ergonomics. Again, this is just my opinion.

So, as it stands, my search for a 996 Turbo or Turbo S is based only on the grounds of engine durability, credentials and pedigree. So, to any of you guys, where is the money better spent? Not taking into consideration money or looks, which is the better buy as far as getting a "proper" 911? The GT1 derived 996 Turbo or the "integrated dry sump" M97 Carrera? I have a lot of fun on my Carrera, don't get me wrong. I love the car but, every time I open its user's manual and read Porsche's disclaimer about fitting racing tires on the car and the possibility of damage to the engine due to oil starvation, it just makes me a bit conscious of not having a "real" 911. Am I exaggerating or not? Advise from other enthusiasts is the best way to gauge the extent of this issue. I mean, do owners of GT3s, GT2s and Turbos look down on us for having an M96 or M97 motor? Are we providing more of a margin of profit to Porsche for buying a car that, specified in a way as to make it right, costs close to a GT3 but its engine is 1/3 the cost? Are buyers of other marques right in calling an M96 or M97 motor a "wet sump POS"?

It's not my intention to stir trouble here but only to exchange objective ideas into these issues that may be of importance to some of us, as I am one of those who own a Porsche with an M97 motor and would love it 100% were it not for this issue.

Next
Threads

Sep 16, 2007 1:07:27 AM

Turbo Al: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Rochester, New York , United States; Posts: 2531, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 3, 2005; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

If you want to buy a true "proper" 911, Carrera or Turbo, then you need to look for an air-cooled model-993, 964, or further back.

That's what I did when I picked up a 993TT this spring.

As for your choice between a 997S and 996TT, you have already "compromised" the "purity" of your purchasing decision, so repent.

But if you don't mind the Pinky Lai-designed 996 headlight assembly on the 996TT, then your choice is easy, since turbocharged 911 trumps normally aspirated without a doubt.

Next
Threads

Sep 16, 2007 3:34:56 AM

cibergypsy: Pilot; Loc: FL, USA , United States; Posts: 366, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 21, 2006; Reply to: Turbo Al

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Quote:
Turbo Al said:
If you want to buy a true "proper" 911, Carrera or Turbo, then you need to look for an air-cooled model-993, 964, or further back. That's what I did when I picked up a 993TT this spring.
As for your choice between a 997S and 996TT, you have already "compromised" the "purity" of your purchasing decision, so repent. But if you don't mind the Pinky Lai-designed 996 headlight assembly on the 996TT, then your choice is easy, since turbocharged 911 trumps normally aspirated without a doubt.

I understand what you mean and, just to illustrate a point, I've also owned a 1987 Carrera 3.2L for many years now and have always had an air-cooled 911 since I was 19. I am, therefore, not new to air-cooled 911s.

Now, that doesn't mean that I am opposed to a water cooled 911 either! The issue is that I bought a 2006 997S not being aware of the differences in engine designs between the regular Carreras and the GT3, Turbo and GT2 and not being told about the fact that the M96 or M97 engines are low cost, wet sumped, mass produced, not-good-for-racing POS. That is what I hear now from different forums and I am just concerned about the long term outlook if I keep my 997S. That's why I said that, even though I prefer the looks of a 997 over a 996, the 996 is not so bad as to not consider selling my POS (if indeed it is a POS) and buying a 2004-2005 996 Turbo so that I don't further enrich Porsche more than I did when I wasted my $122,000 on a 997 Carrera S.

I wouldn't have cared about the depreciation on the Carrera S if it were worthy of being a keeper. I don't need a GT3 and would have been happy as long as my Carrera S would have shared the engine, albeit with a different state of tune, with the GTs or the Turbo just like a 3.2L Carrera has the same engine as a 3.2L Club Sport or a 964 has the same engine as a 964 RS and as a 993 has the same engine as a 993RS. All those cars shared the same engine with their more track-oriented versions, in different states of tune, without resorting to putting a "pretend" 911 engine in any of the road oriented versions.

Next
Threads

Sep 16, 2007 12:49:36 PM

Shark01: Newbie; Loc: Houston, Tx; Posts: 15, Gallery; Registered on: May 8, 2005; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Quote:
cibergypsy said:
I have something like a "chip on the shoulder" when I encounter GT3, GT2 and Turbo owners, something like a feeling that my car is missing the essence of continuity that all other 911 have had since 1.963 - sort of an inferiority complex.

Here is your defining statement......despite the interior you prefer and the round headlights (since both are wide body cars thats the only exterior difference)you pine for the legend that is the Turbo, the greatest all-around sportscar in the world.

You will always feel that longing since you have driven the legend, so you better put some money aside for it before it consumes you.

If I can make a suggestion, the 997 Turbo seems like the perfect fit for you. It may take longer to save up for, but would be more of a keeper in your terms.

Next
Threads

Sep 16, 2007 2:02:55 PM

cibergypsy: Pilot; Loc: FL, USA , United States; Posts: 366, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 21, 2006; Reply to: Shark01

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

That's what I thought after I drove the 996 Turbo S - to wait until there are some good pre-owned 997 Turbos at a good price and then get one and not take a huge depreciation hit again.

Next
Threads

Sep 17, 2007 6:23:19 PM

Jeannot: Expert; Loc: Currently in Hong-Kong , Switzerland; Posts: 1745, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 13, 2005; Reply to: cibergypsy

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

I had a 997S. I MUCH prefer the 997 look. But now, I think I would go 996TTS for two reasons 1) reliability 2) lower depreciation....Performance and upgradability would only come later. Might be my next car...Black please :-)

Top
Threads

Board	Subject	Last post	Views	Replies
Porsche	SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II)	4/17/24 7:16 AM Gnil	775783	1798
Porsche	Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos)	4/7/24 11:48 AM Boxster Coupe GTS	440937	565
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Cayman GT4 RS (2021)	5/12/23 12:11 PM W8MM	262354	288
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022	3/12/24 8:28 AM DJM48	260536	323
Porsche	The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche	1/30/24 9:18 AM RC	84952	45
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift	3/15/24 1:23 PM CGX car nut	5450	50
Porsche	The moment I've been waiting for...	2/1/24 7:01 PM Pilot	879971	1364
Porsche	992 GT3	7/23/23 7:01 PM Grant	814919	3868
Porsche	Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!	2/10/24 4:43 PM nberry	390327	1526
Porsche	GT4RS	4/21/24 11:50 AM mcdelaug	389470	1454
Others	Tesla 2 the new thread	12/13/23 2:48 PM CGX car nut	371681	2401
Porsche	Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design	7/3/23 12:30 PM Porker	368510	797
Porsche	Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour	4/11/24 12:32 PM Ferdie	288789	668
Porsche	Collected my 997 GTS today	10/19/23 7:06 PM CGX car nut	261085	812
Lambo	Huracán EVO STO	7/30/23 6:59 PM mcdelaug	239809	346
Lotus	Lotus Emira	6/25/23 2:53 PM Enmanuel	229977	101
Others	Corvette C8	10/16/23 3:24 PM Enmanuel	220939	488
Others	Gordon Murray - T.50	11/22/23 10:27 AM mcdelaug	168984	387
Porsche	Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS	6/11/23 5:13 PM CGX car nut	140842	144
BMW M	2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now	12/29/23 9:04 AM RC	117308	303
Motor Sp.	2023 Formula One	12/19/23 5:38 AM Whoopsy	108455	685
Others	Valkyrie final design?	4/28/23 2:45 AM Rossi	99595	219
Porsche	2022 992 Safari Model	3/7/24 4:22 PM Whoopsy	84051	239
AMG	Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758	2/23/24 10:03 PM blueflame	75017	297
Porsche	992 GT3 RS	3/3/24 7:22 PM Whoopsy	53489	314
Motor Sp.	Porsche 963	3/16/24 9:27 PM Whoopsy	24938	237
Ferrari	Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6)	1/21/24 4:29 PM GT-Boy	21155	103
BMW M	2022 BMW M5 CS	4/8/24 1:43 PM Ferdie	19459	140
AMG	G63 sold out	9/15/23 7:38 PM Nico997	16575	120
AMG	[2022] Mercedes-AMG SL	4/23/24 1:24 PM RC	13626	225

Crown

Forum - Thread

997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Re: 997S or 996 Turbo?

Forum

Boards