Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche? - Page1

Sep 28, 2017 10:56:51 AM

Spyderidol: Rennteam Master; Loc: Mozambique; Posts: 5807, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 25, 2007; Reply to: RC

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

RC:
EnglishManInNY:
I also like the wheels. I believe Porsche need to be bold with the design and stick with what they did with the prototype. If they dilute the design I think that’s a v big mistake.

I know but since they need to make this car appealing to a broader customer base, it will be clearly diluted (less playful).

It will keep it's flowing lines but with a bit more pragmatism.

I'm not sure that "making the car appealing to a broader customer base" is not just an excuse for producing another ugly car. This car has been seen by millions and has been generally well received. Why the need to change in order to appeal to a broad customer base? The base is there. They like the car!

I understand that the production models need to be different to the prototypes, but that is usually due to production requirements, costs, logistics, etc.

I still recall the prototype for the Boxter. It was very well received. Then Porsche watered it down (appealing to that broader customer base) and it took several face-lifts to correct all that "appealing".

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Sep 28, 2017 11:02:09 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59581, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Spyderidol

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

The problem is that you need to sell the car to a certain customer base, which, for example, seems to like the Tesla S.

I agree, original designs are often the nicest ones but they also need to manufacture the car and they need to adapt the design to certain crash/pedestrian crash regulations/laws, real life production conditions, etc..

It is going to be interesting to see the final design and maybe we are lucky (and Porsche is courageous).

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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Sep 28, 2017 11:53:22 AM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21148, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: RC

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

They may also make some compromises in the final design to cabin space and practicality inside that the prototype does not need to take but the final product does, and that may make the final design less attractive. Function follows form in the prototype design but it's the other way around in the final production design.

--

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

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Sep 28, 2017 12:16:46 PM

Lars997: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: South , Germany; Posts: 9448, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

This car is the big chance of Porsche to catch up with the design again. It has enough heritage and a lot of future in it. Love it - lets hope we will see this car soon on the market!

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Sep 28, 2017 12:36:21 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Lars997

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

I think they'll neuter the prototype and make it a far cry from what people were hoping.

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Oct 4, 2017 3:27:18 PM

neunelf: Senior; Loc: Switzerland; Posts: 610, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 4, 2003; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

https://www.motor1.com/news/182383/porsche-mission-e-spy-photos/

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Oct 4, 2017 3:29:25 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: neunelf

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Too much camo to tell what it will finally look like.

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Oct 4, 2017 3:33:38 PM

AP911: Senior; Loc: UAE , United Arab Emirates; Posts: 566, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 28, 2017; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

It looks really nice, the exterior has design cues that remind me of the Carrera GT.

Tesla should be proud and worried at the same time. Proud because Porsche is testing the Mission E against Teslas.

Worried because someone who pays $100K for a Tesla will have no problem paying $130K for a Porsche. Porsche will steal a lot of Tesla's current customers so maybe Tesla should focus on the Model 3 and compete with Chevy.

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Oct 4, 2017 3:40:50 PM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: AP911

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

AP911:
It looks really nice, the exterior has design cues that remind me of the Carrera GT.

Tesla should be proud and worried at the same time. Proud because Porsche is testing the Mission E against Teslas.

Worried because someone who pays $100K for a Tesla will have no problem paying $130K for a Porsche. Porsche will steal a lot of Tesla's current customers so maybe Tesla should focus on the Model 3 and compete with Chevy.

This.

Tesla needs to move down market to survive. They have the giant battery factory to crank out batteries for a reasonable cost and they will have the cost advantage to the value cars like i3 and Chevy Bolt.

If they want to stay at the top segment they will need to up their fit and finish and interior quality by a couple folds while holding the price the same.

My VW Golf R basically has the same if not better quality interior than a Tesla.

--

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Oct 4, 2017 3:45:49 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

It's very cheap to improve interior quality. Car interiors are really not that expensive.

If they can save a few thousands dollars in battery cost and economies of scale, they could make the interior comparable to a Porsche.

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Oct 4, 2017 3:59:35 PM

lukestern: Expert; Loc: Somewhere , United Kingdom; Posts: 1377, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 15, 2005; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

I really like the looks and proportions of that Mission-E. Even though the car is disguised in camo it for sure highlights a lot more than the prototype model with these more ordinary wheels, etc.

If the charging infra is in place in 2020 and the specs are pleasing I'll definitely get one asap!

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Oct 4, 2017 4:29:07 PM

Wonderbar: Rennteam Pro; Loc: usa , France; Posts: 2719, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 31, 2005; Reply to: lukestern

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Interesting that one photo above shows the camo prototype with two Teslas behind it.

Prototype sure looks like a Panamera. I know the camo is heavy, but I hope the final Mission E retains its unique design.

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Oct 4, 2017 4:35:40 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: Wonderbar

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

If Range Rover can make a nice interior on a $75k RRS I have no doubt Tesla can too. Again, right now they don’t need to and the money goes to the battery and the power train. Eventually it will go to the interior.

I completely disagree that someone who will pay $100k for a Tesla will pay $130k for a Porsche. I am the living proof and so are several here. I bought a RRS for $100k and passed on the too expensive Porsche. I would have paid $100k for a Tesla X 100D (it did not exist at the time) but would not have paid $140k for a X P100D. And besides the price not everyone cares to have a better handling car. Surely people here realize we are the minority...

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Oct 4, 2017 4:43:03 PM

AP911: Senior; Loc: UAE , United Arab Emirates; Posts: 566, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 28, 2017; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Still, more people care that its a Porsche than many realize.

And it is not that easy to make a good interior or a more reliable car or else everyone would make that. Range Rovers has alway had nice interiors and bad reliability, it hasn't changed much. Toyota/Lexus have always had excellent reliability. It is not a switch on/off.

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Oct 4, 2017 4:44:19 PM

SciFrog: Rennteam VIP; Loc: USA , United States; Posts: 9870, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 15, 2005; Reply to: AP911

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

My RRS has been far more reliable than my previous two Cayennes and Macan...

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Oct 4, 2017 4:51:55 PM

AP911: Senior; Loc: UAE , United Arab Emirates; Posts: 566, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 28, 2017; Reply to: SciFrog

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Well, figures don't lie.

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Oct 4, 2017 4:54:55 PM

AP911: Senior; Loc: UAE , United Arab Emirates; Posts: 566, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 28, 2017; Reply to: AP911

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Tesla also suffers from bad reliability and when more options are available owners will jump ship.

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Oct 4, 2017 5:30:22 PM

turbolite: Veteran; Loc: Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 1012, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 26, 2004; Reply to: AP911

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

So happy the Mission E prototypes are finally on the road!

Even the biggest Tesla fan can now start to imagine that the competition will be coming at them fast and strong.

The Musk nimbus re cars will be gone pretty soon. Maybe people should buy the stock in future for its fotovoltaic rooftiles..;-)

--

turbolite

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Oct 6, 2017 1:12:16 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59581, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Whoopsy:
AP911:
It looks really nice, the exterior has design cues that remind me of the Carrera GT.

Tesla should be proud and worried at the same time. Proud because Porsche is testing the Mission E against Teslas.

Worried because someone who pays $100K for a Tesla will have no problem paying $130K for a Porsche. Porsche will steal a lot of Tesla's current customers so maybe Tesla should focus on the Model 3 and compete with Chevy.

This.

Tesla needs to move down market to survive. They have the giant battery factory to crank out batteries for a reasonable cost and they will have the cost advantage to the value cars like i3 and Chevy Bolt.

Yes, this is actually the only chance to survive...mass production of lower priced cars.

If they want to stay at the top segment they will need to up their fit and finish and interior quality by a couple folds while holding the price the same.

True but even now, they barely make profit, so how could they up the quality at same price? Impossible.

My VW Golf R basically has the same if not better quality interior than a Tesla.

Very true indeed. "Typical American" car I'd say and you guys know that I love the US but in this case, this is true. American car makers just seem to have issues with interiors, for whatever reason. They should do like the Chinese do (in other segments): Copy. Smiley Smiley

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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Oct 6, 2017 1:43:38 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: RC

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

RC:
Whoopsy:
AP911:
It looks really nice, the exterior has design cues that remind me of the Carrera GT.

Tesla should be proud and worried at the same time. Proud because Porsche is testing the Mission E against Teslas.

Worried because someone who pays $100K for a Tesla will have no problem paying $130K for a Porsche. Porsche will steal a lot of Tesla's current customers so maybe Tesla should focus on the Model 3 and compete with Chevy.

This.

Tesla needs to move down market to survive. They have the giant battery factory to crank out batteries for a reasonable cost and they will have the cost advantage to the value cars like i3 and Chevy Bolt.

Yes, this is actually the only chance to survive...mass production of lower priced cars.

If they want to stay at the top segment they will need to up their fit and finish and interior quality by a couple folds while holding the price the same.

True but even now, they barely make profit, so how could they up the quality at same price? Impossible.

My VW Golf R basically has the same if not better quality interior than a Tesla.

Very true indeed. "Typical American" car I'd say and you guys know that I love the US but in this case, this is true. American car makers just seem to have issues with interiors, for whatever reason. They should do like the Chinese do (in other segments): Copy.

It would cost probably a couple thousand dollars to give a Tesla the same interior quality as Porsche.

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Oct 6, 2017 7:06:31 PM

Targa Tim: Expert; Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada , Canada; Posts: 1475, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 3, 2005; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

noone1:

It would cost probably a couple thousand dollars to give a Tesla the same interior quality as Porsche.

not that easy I'm afraid.

American cars just do not have the "attention to details" compared to European or Japanese cars.

You need to retrain the whole crews.

--

Tim

2010 997.2 GT3RS; 2008 Cayenne Turbo; 2006 911 Club Coupe; 2016 911 GTS Club Coupe; 2015 Macan S

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Oct 6, 2017 7:45:32 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Targa Tim

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Cadillac interiors are just as good as Porsche IMO, so I don't see the problem.

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Oct 6, 2017 8:59:13 PM

Targa Tim: Expert; Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada , Canada; Posts: 1475, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 3, 2005; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

noone1:
Cadillac interiors are just as good as Porsche IMO, so I don't see the problem.

never owned or driven one, will need to check it out...

--

Tim

2010 997.2 GT3RS; 2008 Cayenne Turbo; 2006 911 Club Coupe; 2016 911 GTS Club Coupe; 2015 Macan S

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Oct 6, 2017 10:39:48 PM

bobr: Veteran; Loc: New York , United States; Posts: 945, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 3, 2003; Reply to: Targa Tim

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Targa Tim:
noone1:

It would cost probably a couple thousand dollars to give a Tesla the same interior quality as Porsche.

not that easy I'm afraid.

American cars just do not have the "attention to details" compared to European or Japanese cars.

You need to retrain the whole crews.

Tesla hired one of Porsche's designers of the Mission E interior. It will be interesting to see what he does for the Tesla's interiors.

--

2014 Porsche 991 C4S Black with Sports Design Package, 2017 Porsche Cayenne Platinum Purpurite Metallic, New York

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Oct 7, 2017 5:34:19 AM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

noone1:
Cadillac interiors are just as good as Porsche IMO, so I don't see the problem.

Oh my Smiley

Cadillac interior are on par with Hyundai at best.

See all those cheap plastic and fake wood and real leather that looks like fake? 10 year old Civic got them beat already.

--

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Oct 7, 2017 1:53:50 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

I think Porsche interiors are mediocre at $50K+. Not sure what you expect from $50K cars though. It's not like Cadillac is selling $100-200k cars. The Cadillac is on par with the Macan I drove. Nothing to right home about. Just a mid-range luxury interior.

The new Lincolns have good interiors as well.

Whether you like the design is another question. I personally think Porsche has shit interior designers, but that's just my opinion.

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Oct 8, 2017 4:20:03 AM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

You are a downer on EVERYTHING except Tesla, your favourite interior is from a Cadillac and favourite car is a RAV4.

No need to say anything more in fact. We understand you now.

--

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Oct 8, 2017 5:57:50 AM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Whoopsy, what's it like getting hurt feelings over cars? I don't recall you having such a hard-on for Porsche until you bought a 918 and felt like a VIP.

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Oct 8, 2017 6:37:15 AM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: noone1

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

noone1:
Whoopsy, what's it like getting hurt feelings over cars? I don't recall you having such a hard-on for Porsche until you bought a 918 and felt like a VIP.

Simply stating the truth dude, guess that really step on your toes hard! Sorry bud!

I see the last gen Cayenne interior every day, and it is night and day better than the cheap interior of the Range Rover SVR, which is on par with say a Merceds GLE. The only SUV interior that seems more expensive looking is the Bentley Bentayga.

The latest generation Panamera interior is miles ahead of a BMW 7 and a Mercedes S, and the only luxury sedan with a better interior is a Rolls Royce or a Bentley.

911 series? Every car before the 996 has a junk interior, and for 996s, unless someone add all the leather bits, it is also junk. 997 series is the first 911 that have a decently nice interior, surprise surprise that's when I firs have my hard on for Porsche even though I had 2 996s before that. Gee I wonder why. Oh, right, I love nice interiors.

But really, why am I explaining myself to you? Everyone else here understands except you, who just love McLaren and Tesla and is negative about everything else. Seriously, you have lost all credibility when you said you love Cadillac interior and Tesla's interior can be improved by spending a couple thousands. Model S/Model X's interior are at least 10-15k away from match the level of Mercedes BMW Audi.

Oh, you forgot I also have the hard on for Ferrari? And Lamborghini? And Aston Martin? Notice something? They all have NICE interiors. Hell my Golf R has a nicer interior than a Model S/X.

--

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Oct 8, 2017 9:10:25 AM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21148, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

Whoopsy:
You are a downer on EVERYTHING except Tesla,

Don't forget McLaren and straight line acceleration videos Smiley Smiley but yeah, everything else is like Smiley

--

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

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