Crown

For a long time I was looking to get this, but at the end no lock. ignore the detailing part, the rest is awesome:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QU1Le-56GKA

MKSGR:

Herbaliser:

MKSGR:

Herbaliser:

"getting a GT2 RS allocation is like a jackpot in the lottery".

That's the reality. You should check again your Porsche sources and also chat with the big unofficial supercar dealers who provide for the very rich spoiled clients...

The GT2 RS is already a collectible and is practically sold-out. It might take a while for some people to realize it.

What a nonsense - sorry... Even if you had a 997 GT2RS with very low mileage the car would be no "jackpot in the lottery". You might still sell it for slightly above list price (the prices came down quite a bit) - but taking into account the opportunity cost of capital, the necessary maintenance cost to date etc. even the 997 GT2RS can hardly be called "a good investment".

And the GT2RS was produced in much smaller numbers (500 units), last edition of Mezger engine, last edition of manual etc....

Truth is: the 991 GT2RS is a great car if one loves the concept and how the GT2 models feel and drive. However, the McLaren 720s might be faster even on the track - we need tests to verify this. The GT2RS has the benefit of the doubt for the time being as I am convinced it will be super quick on the track and McLaren needs to proof that their suspension/ESP works better now.

The 991 GT2RS is surely no "jackpot in the lottery", reflecting on the above thoughts - although interested parties have an interest in making people believe otherwise  If you buy it you should buy it as you like the drive feel of the GT2 models.

It seems that you haven't check the price of 997 GT2 RS lately. I suggest you do so before making such statements. The cheapest car on mobile.de is quoted at €300K, the average price for a 15k km car is €360K, low mileage cars are €500K.

The GT2 RS with it's limited availability is not for people that have to chose between it and some other car simply because they don't have to. 

Regarding your second point: it seems you might not have a good insight in how rich people think and act... Maybe things are different in parts of the world where money came quickly and also people are afraid that it might go away quickly as well. People who have been rich for longer times always make choices. Not because they have to but because they learned so during their upbringing and from their exposure to business life.

That sounds patronizing and aristocratic. Coming from old money and being born in Germany doesn't automatically give you a superior point of view on the matters of the rich society. Since you don't have the slightest idea of my background or environment you are risking to really embarrass yourself with your speculations about "not knowing how rich people think", ..."parts of the world where money came quickly", etc. 

Just imagine that while you can afford to think, research, debate, calculate for weeks or months whether to get a GT2 RS or 720s or whatever, for some people it is not worth the decision fatigue. They have to make far more important business decisions every day. So it is easier for them to just get all the cars they want, because they are passionate about cars...and because it wouldn't make the slightest difference to their finances.

As for the 997 GT2 RS you can twist it however you want but you can't buy a decent one for less than €350K.

martini964:

For a long time I was looking to get this, but at the end no lock. ignore the detailing part, the rest is awesome:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QU1Le-56GKA

One of the only AWD cars that really excites me

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

Dubay:

Where is that from?  Pretty nice garage...GT4, Macan and a white GT2RS...More pics of the RS available?

Herbaliser:

 

Just imagine that while you can afford to think, research, debate, calculate for weeks or months whether to get a GT2 RS or 720s or whatever, for some people it is not worth the decision fatigue. They have to make far more important business decisions every day. So it is easier for them to just get all the cars they want, because they are passionate about cars...and because it wouldn't make the slightest difference to their finances.

 

 

One surely would not have the time to write nonsense on the Internet then either. You know, because of those very important business decisions... Very funny indeed  But I understand, you are not part of this group - you fancy how this group might behave in a film or what?

Herbaliser:

 

As for the 997 GT2 RS you can twist it however you want but you can't buy a decent one for less than €350K.

 

If you feel that you need to pay at least 350k for a 997 GT2RS when the Internet is full of offers at this rate or lower, with cars priced in this range sitting there for 12-18 months, no transactions taking place you also proof that you are the person to believe in marketing messages like the one you quoted above ("like winning the lottery") etc. If you have the means to pay for the car you are the ideal victim 

Whoopsy:

RC:

Whoopsy:

The hype for driving pleasure in the 911R 

I beg to differ. The 991 is just way too big. Every 911 up to 993 will have more driving pleasure than a 911R. 

I spent the weekend driving to and back from my track, 600 miles, in my Turbo 3.6. That was fun through the mountains.  Speed wasn't too high, heck it was a lot slower than I would have done in any of my cars, Cayenne Turbo S included.

Then I jumped into my 911R. First thought, holy shit this car is huge! The car is much wider and I actually had to look and check when parking. It simply doesn't have the charm of a air cooled 911 period. 

Yes the power is nice, but it is so powerful and fast that I can't stay on the gas for long. 

Yes the shifter is SUPER nice, I enjoyed using it very much, wish the same shifter is in the Turbo 3.6

That's about it. 

Mind you, I don't mind going out in the 911R, but I just wish the hype would die down and make the car less valuable so I can drive it more. 

Stupid question: If you had to live with one sports car only, ignoring the 918, which car would that be? I am curious.

 

My Huracan Spyder! surprised isn't it 

I knew it...  

Still...your 918 is just...how to put it...legend.  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

MKSGR:

Herbaliser:

 

As for the 997 GT2 RS you can twist it however you want but you can't buy a decent one for less than €350K.

 

If you feel that you need to pay at least 350k for a 997 GT2RS when the Internet is full of offers at this rate or lower, with cars priced in this range sitting there for 12-18 months, no transactions taking place you also proof that you are the person to believe in marketing messages like the one you quoted above ("like winning the lottery") etc. If you have the means to pay for the car you are the ideal victim 

Some people don't seem to realize that the prices asked are not always (actually never) the prices paid. Especially in the car business. I am no speculator and I do not sell/buy cars in a professional way but I do know the numbers (a benefit of my part time job here... ).

Guys, no need to fight over this though. While I am saying that I am not that much interested in the GT2 RS, make no mistake: If I could afford having more cars, the GT2 RS would definitely be on my priority list. Wonderful product, maybe a little bit overpriced compared to the competition (is there any with this look?) but still desirable. If someone wants to get this car to enjoy driving it, I will not have any objections. I know Porsche and although I do not agree with some of their product decisions and prices, the GT2 RS will definitely be worth owning (and driving) it. I have no doubts.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

RC:

MKSGR:

Herbaliser:

 

As for the 997 GT2 RS you can twist it however you want but you can't buy a decent one for less than €350K.

 

If you feel that you need to pay at least 350k for a 997 GT2RS when the Internet is full of offers at this rate or lower, with cars priced in this range sitting there for 12-18 months, no transactions taking place you also proof that you are the person to believe in marketing messages like the one you quoted above ("like winning the lottery") etc. If you have the means to pay for the car you are the ideal victim 

Some people don't seem to realize that the prices asked are not always (actually never) the prices paid. Especially in the car business. I am no speculator and I do not sell/buy cars in a professional way but I do know the numbers (a benefit of my part time job here... ).

Guys, no need to fight over this though. While I am saying that I am not that much interested in the GT2 RS, make no mistake: If I could afford having more cars, the GT2 RS would definitely be on my priority list. Wonderful product, maybe a little bit overpriced compared to the competition (is there any with this look?) but still desirable. If someone wants to get this car to enjoy driving it, I will not have any objections. I know Porsche and although I do not agree with some of their product decisions and prices, the GT2 RS will definitely be worth owning (and driving) it. I have no doubts.

my issue is: will it be more enjoyable to drive than the .1GT3RS? i guess no. will it be more enjoyable to drive&own than the 488GTO? check no. so why am i getting one???

pmarkow:

RC:

MKSGR:

Herbaliser:

 

As for the 997 GT2 RS you can twist it however you want but you can't buy a decent one for less than €350K.

 

If you feel that you need to pay at least 350k for a 997 GT2RS when the Internet is full of offers at this rate or lower, with cars priced in this range sitting there for 12-18 months, no transactions taking place you also proof that you are the person to believe in marketing messages like the one you quoted above ("like winning the lottery") etc. If you have the means to pay for the car you are the ideal victim 

Some people don't seem to realize that the prices asked are not always (actually never) the prices paid. Especially in the car business. I am no speculator and I do not sell/buy cars in a professional way but I do know the numbers (a benefit of my part time job here... ).

Guys, no need to fight over this though. While I am saying that I am not that much interested in the GT2 RS, make no mistake: If I could afford having more cars, the GT2 RS would definitely be on my priority list. Wonderful product, maybe a little bit overpriced compared to the competition (is there any with this look?) but still desirable. If someone wants to get this car to enjoy driving it, I will not have any objections. I know Porsche and although I do not agree with some of their product decisions and prices, the GT2 RS will definitely be worth owning (and driving) it. I have no doubts.

my issue is: will it be more enjoyable to drive than the .1GT3RS? i guess no. will it be more enjoyable to drive&own than the 488GTO? check no. so why am i getting one???

To make some money?  

No turbo charged car will ever be more enjoyable than a sports car with a n/a engine. Maybe in the future if manufacturers really succeed in getting rid of that turbo lag. The 488 is pretty close to that I have to admit though. Much closer than Porsche (991.2 Turbo S) for example. Also, I assume that the 488 GTO will be at least as fast as the GT2 RS with a more exotic design (GT2 RS is definitely the Schwarzenegger of the 600+ hp car club).

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

make money on the gt2rs? very doubtful as you will agree

pmarkow:

make money on the gt2rs? very doubtful as you will agree

I honestly don't know. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

I am pretty much assured that I will get the GT2RS. Of course not directly through an authorized dealer in the region but through a different channel which will cost me nothing over sticker price. Today dealers network in the GCC are in the hands of the 2nd generation of the original establishers. They are themselves car collectors and most limited production cars go to them or their very close friends & relatives. I have experienced this practice with them first hand on several occasions. It all started with the 997GT2RS and continued with the 991GT3RS, 911R and now the 991GT2RS. Luckily  it was the decision by Porsche to increase the production of the GT3RS that helped me secure an order at that time. 

Unfortunately as customers here our main competition are the dealers owners!

Markus, can you elaborate on why the 997 GT2 RS can be underwhelming? I can barely  imagine that, but I've never driven one.

1992 Mercedes-Benz W124 500E / 2003 BMW M3 CSL (sold) / 2008 Porsche 911 GT3 RS / 2014 BMW-Alpina D3 biturbo Touring / 2014 BMW-Alpina B3 biturbo Touring Allrad

ha:

I Luckily  it was the decision by Porsche to increase the production of the GT3RS that helped me secure an order at that time. 

 

Here in the UK the buyers squabble over who's getting a GT Porsche and for me it gets very hideous and thats me saying that when i do not play it . Of course I would like a GT2RS but I will not bust my bollocks trying to get one or cozy up to salesman for one, its all a BS game.

At the end of the day, its just a bit of metal on 4 rubber rings .. 

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

throt:

Here in the UK the buyers squabble over who's getting a GT Porsche and for me it gets very hideous and thats me saying that when i do not play it . Of course I would like a GT2RS but I will not bust my bollocks trying to get one or cozy up to salesman for one, its all a BS game.

At the end of the day, its just a bit of metal on 4 rubber rings .. 

I have the same attitude as you although I am pretty irked that when times were tough in 2008 they were very pleased to offer me a slot for a GT2 yet that gives no currency in today's "lottery win GT" market, I think the UK market may be worst of them all.... like you I will keep calm and carry on.

TBH it feels pretty grubby reading RC's machinations of a potential foray into car dealing with a car which I have been lusting after for 3 years or more 

--

997 GT2 2014 3.9 Mezger, 800PS @ 1.2 bar

993 Turbo, 2006 built 3.8, 577PS/797NM, 1440kg DIN

ha:

I am pretty much assured that I will get the GT2RS. Of course not directly through an authorized dealer in the region but through a different channel which will cost me nothing over sticker price. Today dealers network in the GCC are in the hands of the 2nd generation of the original establishers. They are themselves car collectors and most limited production cars go to them or their very close friends & relatives. I have experienced this practice with them first hand on several occasions. It all started with the 997GT2RS and continued with the 991GT3RS, 911R and now the 991GT2RS. Luckily  it was the decision by Porsche to increase the production of the GT3RS that helped me secure an order at that time. 

Unfortunately as customers here our main competition are the dealers owners!

This was a similar situation in Germany and other countries. Many dealers (owners) secured a car for themselves. I understand the reason behind it but Porsche should have made clear that limited edition cars are for customers only. Even Porsche employees couldn't get one, there was an internal "lottery" for 20 cars. Thats it.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

pmarkow:

 

 

 

my issue is: will it be more enjoyable to drive than the .1GT3RS? i guess no. will it be more enjoyable to drive&own than the 488GTO? check no. so why am i getting one???

Until you drive it  you don't know the answer, anything else is just speculation.

RC:

MKSGR:

Herbaliser:

 

As for the 997 GT2 RS you can twist it however you want but you can't buy a decent one for less than €350K.

 

If you feel that you need to pay at least 350k for a 997 GT2RS when the Internet is full of offers at this rate or lower, with cars priced in this range sitting there for 12-18 months, no transactions taking place you also proof that you are the person to believe in marketing messages like the one you quoted above ("like winning the lottery") etc. If you have the means to pay for the car you are the ideal victim 

Some people don't seem to realize that the prices asked are not always (actually never) the prices paid. Especially in the car business. I am no speculator and I do not sell/buy cars in a professional way but I do know the numbers (a benefit of my part time job here... ).

Guys, no need to fight over this though. While I am saying that I am not that much interested in the GT2 RS, make no mistake: If I could afford having more cars, the GT2 RS would definitely be on my priority list. Wonderful product, maybe a little bit overpriced compared to the competition (is there any with this look?) but still desirable. If someone wants to get this car to enjoy driving it, I will not have any objections. I know Porsche and although I do not agree with some of their product decisions and prices, the GT2 RS will definitely be worth owning (and driving) it. I have no doubts.

Reading my posts again I was a bit harsh yesterday. Did not want to offend Herbaliser. But I was a bit angry about this kind of arbitrary do this-do that talk combined with an attempt to justify this with a no time to research-but time, money, space available in abundance approach. That is just not how the real world works. 

In essence, the "Piling up any car that is claimed to be rare makes sense strategy" made me a bit angry as it is contradictory in itself: If you have the means to buy nice cars you should also have the brains to limit yourself to a certain extent... At least from time to time.

Anyhow: apologies to Herbaliser 

Porker:

Markus, can you elaborate on why the 997 GT2 RS can be underwhelming? I can barely  imagine that, but I've never driven one.

Don't get me wrong: the 997 GT2RS is a wonderful car. Extremely precise and efficient. The engine is extremely powerful. However, when you drive it in the real world you use it at around 50-80% of its capabilities (as it is too quick to use more of the potential). And at that level it feels a bit like a perfect VW Golf. Super easy to use, not too loud, comfortable enough etc. You just don't get the sensation that many people might expect from these cars. I still love them as they are the most perfect and efficient sports cars produced to date  Also, I love driving them. 

On the track they are super quick and also comparatively easy to handle. Just even there they are mostly quick - not spectacular. For me the GT2RS has its own market. The Italiens or also the McLarens feel very different 

TB993tt:

throt:

Here in the UK the buyers squabble over who's getting a GT Porsche and for me it gets very hideous and thats me saying that when i do not play it . Of course I would like a GT2RS but I will not bust my bollocks trying to get one or cozy up to salesman for one, its all a BS game.

At the end of the day, its just a bit of metal on 4 rubber rings .. L

Like you I will keep calm and carry on.

997 GT2 2014 3.9 Mezger, 800PS @ 1.2 bar

993 Turbo, 2006 built 3.8, 577PS/797NM, 1440kg DIN

All the best then with securing one .

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

MKSGR:

Porker:

Markus, can you elaborate on why the 997 GT2 RS can be underwhelming? I can barely  imagine that, but I've never driven one.

Don't get me wrong: the 997 GT2RS is a wonderful car. Extremely precise and efficient. The engine is extremely powerful. However, when you drive it in the real world you use it at around 50-80% of its capabilities (as it is too quick to use more of the potential). And at that level it feels a bit like a perfect VW Golf. Super easy to use, not too loud, comfortable enough etc. You just don't get the sensation that many people might expect from these cars. I still love them as they are the most perfect and efficient sports cars produced to date 

I agree and thats pretty much the same with the 991GT3 due to its tame torque. .

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

throt:

MKSGR:

Porker:

Markus, can you elaborate on why the 997 GT2 RS can be underwhelming? I can barely  imagine that, but I've never driven one.

Don't get me wrong: the 997 GT2RS is a wonderful car. Extremely precise and efficient. The engine is extremely powerful. However, when you drive it in the real world you use it at around 50-80% of its capabilities (as it is too quick to use more of the potential). And at that level it feels a bit like a perfect VW Golf. Super easy to use, not too loud, comfortable enough etc. You just don't get the sensation that many people might expect from these cars. I still love them as they are the most perfect and efficient sports cars produced to date 

I agree and thats pretty much the same with the 991GT3 due to its tame torque. .

You could say - in a very abstract way - that the GT2RS will be liked by people who also love the regular turbo / turbo s. These cars share the same genes and they feel very similar 

MKSGR:

 

You could say - in a very abstract way - that the GT2RS will be liked by people who also love the regular turbo / turbo s. These cars share the same genes and they feel very similar 

Let's wait and see how will the 2wd version tail reacts from 2,500 ~ 4,500 rpm ,it will be interesting in the hands of newcomers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWyvruWYRrI

RC:

This was a similar situation in Germany and other countries. Many dealers (owners) secured a car for themselves. I understand the reason behind it but Porsche should have made clear that limited edition cars are for customers only. Even Porsche employees couldn't get one, there was an internal "lottery" for 20 cars. Thats it.

Unfortunately Even with this type of arrangement, dealers here can find a way around it 

I'm hoping that Porsche will take into consideration the high demand and increases the production accordingly, specially with the absence of a regular GT2 production. That should turn the tables on Porsche dealers network. Instead of the customer trying to kiss their asses they will be the ass kissers!

Well sadly in Spain is like the opposite way. OPC owners get one because nobody want to get one

BiTurbo:

MKSGR:

 

You could say - in a very abstract way - that the GT2RS will be liked by people who also love the regular turbo / turbo s. These cars share the same genes and they feel very similar 

Let's wait and see how will the 2wd version tail reacts from 2,500 ~ 4,500 rpm ,it will be interesting in the hands of newcomers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWyvruWYRrI

OMFG, after watching that I am inclined to be a bit more lenient to Nick's view -  there really are people that incompetent driving these sorts of cars, the "accident" in that video is beyond words 

997 GT2 2014 3.9 Mezger, 800PS @ 1.2 bar

993 Turbo, 2006 built 3.8, 577PS/797NM, 1440kg DIN

absent:

pmarkow:

 

 

 

my issue is: will it be more enjoyable to drive than the .1GT3RS? i guess no. will it be more enjoyable to drive&own than the 488GTO? check no. so why am i getting one???

Until you drive it  you don't know the answer, anything else is just speculation.

Extrapolation from history i'd say

TB993tt:

BiTurbo:

MKSGR:

 

You could say - in a very abstract way - that the GT2RS will be liked by people who also love the regular turbo / turbo s. These cars share the same genes and they feel very similar 

Let's wait and see how will the 2wd version tail reacts from 2,500 ~ 4,500 rpm ,it will be interesting in the hands of newcomers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWyvruWYRrI

OMFG, after watching that I am inclined to be a bit more lenient to Nick's view -  there really are people that incompetent driving these sorts of cars, the "accident" in that video is beyond words 

unbelievable, even with ESC off