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Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Porschephiles are unbelieveable. They pick and choose certain perf. criteria which display the Porsche faster. We are told the Ring times only count and 0-62 acceleration test are for dragsters and not pure sport cars.
This GERMAN test has the 997TT with a better time than the Z06. After 62mph the Z06 trounces the 997 until what 275km? Then the 997 catches up but at is unable to exceed 300kmph while the Z06 continues to 315. The Z06 has a faster Ring time. Every majopr magazine which tested the two cars in all types of venues has had the Z06 not only beating but shellacking the 997TT.
How can anyone extrapolate these numbers and conclude the 997TT is faster than the Z06.
Factor in all other test including track time and it is no contest in favor of the Z06. 
I find also interesting that we now have doubter's regarding the 599 times. The numbers were transposed?
Or that Ferrari had a team accompany the 599 for the test. Is there no end to your hubris in favor the inverted bathtub with the funky looks? 
This GERMAN test has the 997TT with a better time than the Z06. After 62mph the Z06 trounces the 997 until what 275km? Then the 997 catches up but at is unable to exceed 300kmph while the Z06 continues to 315. The Z06 has a faster Ring time. Every majopr magazine which tested the two cars in all types of venues has had the Z06 not only beating but shellacking the 997TT.
How can anyone extrapolate these numbers and conclude the 997TT is faster than the Z06.
Factor in all other test including track time and it is no contest in favor of the Z06. I find also interesting that we now have doubter's regarding the 599 times. The numbers were transposed?
Or that Ferrari had a team accompany the 599 for the test. Is there no end to your hubris in favor the inverted bathtub with the funky looks?
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
nberry said:
Porschephiles are unbelieveable. They pick and choose certain perf. criteria which display the Porsche faster. We are told the Ring times only count and 0-62 acceleration test are for dragsters and not pure sport cars.
This GERMAN test has the 997TT with a better time than the Z06. After 62mph the Z06 trounces the 997 until what 275km? Then the 997 catches up but at is unable to exceed 300kmph while the Z06 continues to 315. The Z06 has a faster Ring time. Every majopr magazine which tested the two cars in all types of venues has had the Z06 not only beating but shellacking the 997TT.
How can anyone extrapolate these numbers and conclude the 997TT is faster than the Z06.
I find also interesting that we now have doubter's regarding the 599 times. The numbers were transposed?
Nick you're a master of rhetoric but a fool in terms of content.
We have heard you reiterate that the z06 is faster than the 997 Turbo and nobody seems to disagree with that. It's only hinderance in a test such as this is its gearing ratios and higher Cd (to reduce lift). The z06 is the superior performer to the soft 997TT as well as your flashy f430. Thanks for the update.
This is tantamount to people who see 0-300kmph tests for the CGT and immediately throw temper tantrums about its "poor performance." If you want a straightline rocket, get the Veyron or a Saleen S7 TT. These cars are not formulated for these sheer metrics. I don't think 0-300kmph is a great indicator of a racecar's performance, it's an indicator of GT performance.
Guess what: the 599 GTb does quite well.
---
newflash: formula for success for 0-300kmph:
Low Cd, low front nose SA, high HP
Result=quick 200-300
so what
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
I suspect that somewhere between 250-300kph hour the driver shifted the Z06 into 6th gear. This would be the reason for a slow 0-300k time. Also, the Z06 hits its top speed in 5th gear, so maybe this is why the top speed is low.. This is just a hunch, but I would bet money on it..
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
MKSGR said:Quote:
VKSF said:
Would argue today's new car prices are awfully cheap, esp given the lack of car price inflation over past 10-15 yrs
You are the car maker's dream of a customer
Just view car ownership costs/price inflation today/vs past 10-15 yrs as incredibly cheap vs absolute costs/inflation in costs of primary/secondary/tertiary houses in desirable locales; private jet flts; divorces; Pateks, Petrus, etc etc.....
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
nberry said:
Porschephiles are unbelieveable. They pick and choose certain perf. criteria which display the Porsche faster. We are told the Ring times only count and 0-62 acceleration test are for dragsters and not pure sport cars.
This GERMAN test has the 997TT with a better time than the Z06. After 62mph the Z06 trounces the 997 until what 275km? Then the 997 catches up but at is unable to exceed 300kmph while the Z06 continues to 315. The Z06 has a faster Ring time. Every majopr magazine which tested the two cars in all types of venues has had the Z06 not only beating but shellacking the 997TT.
How can anyone extrapolate these numbers and conclude the 997TT is faster than the Z06.
I find also interesting that we now have doubter's regarding the 599 times. The numbers were transposed?
Nick. I dont mean to put words in your mouth - but I think you meant to say : More cylinders/more displacement/more hp/more revs/more torque/usually equals a quicker car if the
weights are reasonably close.
Now as to why some people cant understand that I dont know.
However, when Porsche finally does put the Cayenne TT engine into the lighter Boxster maybe they will get it.
Until then its business as usual here.
That bit aside. The 599GTB is a fast car. However it is from the Schumacher era - wich taints any Ferrari ownership experience imho-because of his unsportsman like conduct in his career at Ferrari.
Oct 26, 2006 6:23:17 AM
- Pagani Fanatic
- Junior
-
- Loc: Canada
- Posts: 64, Gallery
- Registered on: Feb 19, 2006
- Reply to: JimFlat6
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
I thought this addition to this thread would be apperciated.
Auto Motor Und Sport's 2005 numbers combined with these ones:
I've found the numbers for last years top speed test from AMS:
Here's how they compare: Vehicles from 2005 comparsion bolded
Top Speed:
402 km/h - Bugatti Veyron
355 km/h - Ferrari Enzo
340 km/h - Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
335 km/h - Ferrari 599 GTB
334 km/h - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
334 km/h - Porsche Carrera GT
330 km/h - Ford GT
330 km/h - Lamborghini Murcielago 6.2
324 km/h - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
323 km/h - Bentley Continental GT
317 km/h - Aston Martin Vanquish
315 km/h -Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
310 km/h - Porsche 997 Turbo
309 km/h - Aston Martin DB9
298 km/h - Dodge Viper SRT-10
0-200 km/h:
7.4 - Bugatti Veyron
10.3 - Ferrari 599 GTB
10.3 - Ferrari Enzo
10.7 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
10.7 - Porsche Carrera GT
11.2 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
11.2 - Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
11.9 - Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
12.0 - Ford GT
12.3 - Porsche 997 Turbo
12.5 - Lamborghini Murcielago 6.2
13.8 - Dodge Viper SRT-10
16.5 - Aston Martin Vanquish S
16.7 - Aston Martin DB9
17.2 - Bentley Continental GT
0-300 km/h:
18.2 - Bugatti Veyron
26.1 - Ferrari Enzo
29.9 - Ferrari 599 GTB
30.6 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
31.8 - Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
33.6 - Ford GT
34.2 - Porsche Carrera GT
36.9 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
37.6 - Lamborghini Murcielago 6.2
40.7 - Porsche 997 Turbo
41.8 - Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
57.1 - Aston Martin Vanquish S
67.2 - Bentley Continental GT
74.6 - Aston Martin DB9
Auto Motor Und Sport's 2005 numbers combined with these ones:
I've found the numbers for last years top speed test from AMS:
Here's how they compare: Vehicles from 2005 comparsion bolded
Top Speed:
402 km/h - Bugatti Veyron
355 km/h - Ferrari Enzo
340 km/h - Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
335 km/h - Ferrari 599 GTB
334 km/h - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
334 km/h - Porsche Carrera GT
330 km/h - Ford GT
330 km/h - Lamborghini Murcielago 6.2
324 km/h - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
323 km/h - Bentley Continental GT
317 km/h - Aston Martin Vanquish
315 km/h -Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
310 km/h - Porsche 997 Turbo
309 km/h - Aston Martin DB9
298 km/h - Dodge Viper SRT-10
0-200 km/h:
7.4 - Bugatti Veyron
10.3 - Ferrari 599 GTB
10.3 - Ferrari Enzo
10.7 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
10.7 - Porsche Carrera GT
11.2 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
11.2 - Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
11.9 - Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
12.0 - Ford GT
12.3 - Porsche 997 Turbo
12.5 - Lamborghini Murcielago 6.2
13.8 - Dodge Viper SRT-10
16.5 - Aston Martin Vanquish S
16.7 - Aston Martin DB9
17.2 - Bentley Continental GT
0-300 km/h:
18.2 - Bugatti Veyron
26.1 - Ferrari Enzo
29.9 - Ferrari 599 GTB
30.6 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
31.8 - Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
33.6 - Ford GT
34.2 - Porsche Carrera GT
36.9 - Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
37.6 - Lamborghini Murcielago 6.2
40.7 - Porsche 997 Turbo
41.8 - Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
57.1 - Aston Martin Vanquish S
67.2 - Bentley Continental GT
74.6 - Aston Martin DB9
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
RC said:Quote:
svtrader1 said:
Wow! The 599 is fast.It seems to get faster with each test. Too bad they didn't do a top speed test.
1. I've been told tonight by one of our sources that there has been a typo and that the SLR numbers have been mixed up with the 599 numbers, with the exception of the top speed.
Since this hasn't been confirmed yet by AMS, we should wait until we know for sure.
AMS will never confirm that theory as it is 100% wrong...
I can verify the test results based on my own test drive experience with the 599GTB: The SLR numbers in the AMS test are substantially below what I achieved with a brand new (100km) 599 test car...
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
ocnatv said:
I suspect that somewhere between 250-300kph hour the driver shifted the Z06 into 6th gear. This would be the reason for a slow 0-300k time. Also, the Z06 hits its top speed in 5th gear, so maybe this is why the top speed is low.. This is just a hunch, but I would bet money on it..
Don't bet money. There a Z06 videos on the net that confirm the rather slow acceleration of this car beyond 250kph (in 5th gear). The outcome of the test has nothing to do with the selction of improper gears.
P.S.: The videos I am talking about have been posted and discussed in a different thread on rennteam.com
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
nberry said:
Porschephiles are unbelieveable. They pick and choose certain perf. criteria which display the Porsche faster. We are told the Ring times only count and 0-62 acceleration test are for dragsters and not pure sport cars.
This GERMAN test has the 997TT with a better time than the Z06. After 62mph the Z06 trounces the 997 until what 275km? Then the 997 catches up but at is unable to exceed 300kmph while the Z06 continues to 315. The Z06 has a faster Ring time. Every majopr magazine which tested the two cars in all types of venues has had the Z06 not only beating but shellacking the 997TT.
How can anyone extrapolate these numbers and conclude the 997TT is faster than the Z06.
I find also interesting that we now have doubter's regarding the 599 times. The numbers were transposed?
Come on! You're smarter than that! The Z06 ring time has yet to be confirmed. And, if you want to do a comparison in this fashion, let me present the 7:40 time for the Turbo, achieved by Motor Trend. Do I think it's BS? Yes. But the same goes for the 7:43 time of the Vette. Let's wait for AMS.
Regarding other criteria, Nick, The Turbo and Corvette are still pretty much neck and neck from 100 to 200 km/h, while the Corvette's gearing allows it to accelerate faster up to 250 km/h. However, after that, the Turbo pulls hard on it. It will reach its 310 km/h top speed much (relatively speaking) faster than the Z06. Sure, you may have never driven over 150 mph, but for Europeans, this is important. Give me a Turbo or a Z06 and I'll go out right now and find a good spot to do 200 mph in a couple of minutes. Staying above 250 km/h isn't such a big deal in Germany, remember that. Also, any little gust of wind will reduce your speed and what counts is how fast a car gets to its top speed, especially with a miniscule difference of 5 km/h (that's a slow walk).
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
ocnatv said:
I suspect that somewhere between 250-300kph hour the driver shifted the Z06 into 6th gear. This would be the reason for a slow 0-300k time. Also, the Z06 hits its top speed in 5th gear, so maybe this is why the top speed is low.. This is just a hunch, but I would bet money on it..
The Germans literally invented performance driving. Do you really think the drivers of the best car magazine in the world with decades of experience are dumb enough to do something like that?
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
ocnatv said:
I suspect that somewhere between 250-300kph hour the driver shifted the Z06 into 6th gear. This would be the reason for a slow 0-300k time. Also, the Z06 hits its top speed in 5th gear, so maybe this is why the top speed is low.. This is just a hunch, but I would bet money on it..
The Germans literally invented performance driving. Do you really think the drivers of the best car magazine in the world with decades of experience are dumb enough to do something like that?
Crash - sorry to enlighten you
But, I dont think the Germans invented it.
What German car in 1906 could do 127 mph? What German car in 1907 could do almost 150mph? None.
Steamed about that?
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
ocnatv said:
I suspect that somewhere between 250-300kph hour the driver shifted the Z06 into 6th gear. This would be the reason for a slow 0-300k time. Also, the Z06 hits its top speed in 5th gear, so maybe this is why the top speed is low.. This is just a hunch, but I would bet money on it..
The Germans literally invented performance driving. Do you really think the drivers of the best car magazine in the world with decades of experience are dumb enough to do something like that?
Crash - sorry to enlighten you
What German car in 1906 could do 127 mph? What German car in 1907 could do almost 150mph? Porsche production models weren't hitting those speeds until ...1970.
Steamed about that?
Not really, Jim. I'm not a die-hard proponent of any brand and I welcome your somewhat educational facts
. The only thing steaming here right now is broccoli .
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
ocnatv said:
I suspect that somewhere between 250-300kph hour the driver shifted the Z06 into 6th gear. This would be the reason for a slow 0-300k time. Also, the Z06 hits its top speed in 5th gear, so maybe this is why the top speed is low.. This is just a hunch, but I would bet money on it..
The Germans literally invented performance driving. Do you really think the drivers of the best car magazine in the world with decades of experience are dumb enough to do something like that?
Crash - sorry to enlighten you
What German car in 1906 could do 127 mph? What German car in 1907 could do almost 150mph? None.
Steamed about that?
I don't know about which country you're talking about but I'm pretty sure it were the French who invented motorsports.
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
The 599GTB is a fast car. However it is from the Schumacher era - wich taints any Ferrari ownership experience imho-because of his unsportsman like conduct in his career at Ferrari.
That may be the funniest post I've ever read. Surely you aren't serious? I don't see a smiley...
Gary
Oct 26, 2006 2:40:15 PM
- 01Box06Z06
- Pilot
-
- Loc: Pennsylvania, USA
- Posts: 300, Gallery
- Registered on: Mar 9, 2006
- Reply to: Gary(SF)
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Bottom line for me is that my car was even included in this test! I paid $70,000 for my car and it's being included in this test. That shows that it is a supercar and is running with cars costing MUCH more.
All these cars are phenominal! The 599 is incredible! I can't believe how fast that car is. The new trans must make a huge difference. The Veyron is sick fast. The Blue Devil should be able to run with the 599 would be my guess.
Most of the debate, of course on this forum, is about the 997TT. Again, the Z and TT are VERY close. In a straight line they swap the lead the entire way. It's great to see two cars so closely matched in straight line speed. Around the track, the lighter weight of the Z shows. With the GT2 coming, that'll be MUCH quicker than the TT around the track is my guess. I still don't think that these two cars are being cross-shopped. They're much different in the way they drive. I think you'll either want one or the other. Some people do have both as I have seen. They enjoy both personalities for what they are.
GREAT TEST
All these cars are phenominal! The 599 is incredible! I can't believe how fast that car is. The new trans must make a huge difference. The Veyron is sick fast. The Blue Devil should be able to run with the 599 would be my guess.
Most of the debate, of course on this forum, is about the 997TT. Again, the Z and TT are VERY close. In a straight line they swap the lead the entire way. It's great to see two cars so closely matched in straight line speed. Around the track, the lighter weight of the Z shows. With the GT2 coming, that'll be MUCH quicker than the TT around the track is my guess. I still don't think that these two cars are being cross-shopped. They're much different in the way they drive. I think you'll either want one or the other. Some people do have both as I have seen. They enjoy both personalities for what they are.
GREAT TEST
Oct 26, 2006 2:45:56 PM
- Martin J.S.
- Co-Pilot
-
- Loc: Germany
- Posts: 256, Gallery
- Registered on: Jan 20, 2004
- Reply to: 01Box06Z06
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Instead of the AM DB9 they should have taken the Vanquish S V12. The DB9 is a different league than the other competitors (more like SL 55 or SL 65, which are also both way faster and more powerfull than the DB9)... also the Continental GT doesn't really fit the league. It's pretty much like comparing a Gallardo and a 911 to a SLK. Tests like these would be much more enjoyable if all candidates were in the same league. 
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
I'm just amazed at how fast all these cars are compared to the Viper. I used to think the Viper was a mcuh closer to the top with the V10 8.25 liter engine. I agree with 01Box05Z06, the Vette is a real bargain even at above MRSP. I still wouldn't trade my 997TT (plenty fast for me and it's my daily drive...never figured out why folks get a nice car and then park it in the garage waiting for the weekend???). I'm sure the upcoming GT2 will be really fast. Would be nice if they had some of Ruf's work involved....or maybe some 'ring times with all these great cars under the same conditions & driver.
Mike
Mike
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
Gary(SF) said:Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
The 599GTB is a fast car. However it is from the Schumacher era - wich taints any Ferrari ownership experience imho-because of his unsportsman like conduct in his career at Ferrari.
That may be the funniest post I've ever read. Surely you aren't serious? I don't see a smiley...
Gary
You will never know
I await my Scumacher edition FiatUltra Cheater Punto Cabriolet. Its very RED and steals parking spaces easily!
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
MKSGR said:Quote:
Turbo said:
P.S.: Looks like Congaman can wrap my present (look at the 0-300 time of the Z06)
Yap, if these times are correct then you will get the promised Xmas card.....but still I don't know how the test was performed and I'm still in doubt....the real life race is still up....I'm just wating for a respons from the other guy who accepted my challange....after the AMS test he would have nothing to fear....
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
Congaman said:Quote:
MKSGR said:Quote:
Turbo said:
P.S.: Looks like Congaman can wrap my present (look at the 0-300 time of the Z06)
I will PN you my postal address (for the Xmas card)
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
355Spider said:
I did some testing in my Z06 today for the standing mile. This will show how far off these monkeys are on the Z06. Refer to my standing mile thread for details.
Don't be so disrespectful. I would wager that there was a flaw in your testing procedures. If a car does 200-250 km/h in 7 seconds (19 seconds total), there is NO WAY it is going to do the remaining 50 km/h in 8 seconds. Check your test data.
Re: SUPERCAR TEST Auto Motor Sport
Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
355Spider said:
I did some testing in my Z06 today for the standing mile. This will show how far off these monkeys are on the Z06. Refer to my standing mile thread for details.
Don't be so disrespectful. I would wager that there was a flaw in your testing procedures. If a car does 200-250 km/h in 7 seconds (19 seconds total), there is NO WAY it is going to do the remaining 50 km/h in 8 seconds. Check your test data.
He probably did his tests on a drag strip.It usually has more grip than a "normal" surface.
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