Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST! - Page1

Mar 17, 2006 8:43:51 AM

KresoF1: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Croatia , Croatia; Posts: 7856, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 3, 2005; Reply to: turbolite

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Let's face it-Vette Z06 is a very good car, specially for the money!
Sport Auto test is excellent, car is very,very fast indeed... But, as turbolite said it is not the perfect car for all people. Porsche fans(me included) will not buy Z06! Why? There is a problem with Vette image here in Europe(and this is a big problem!)...
Maybe this thing will change after both AMS and Sport Auto test were excellent? We will see.
Ideal situation is to have both 997 Turbo and Z06, all potential buyers of 997 Turbo can afford extra car for sure...
My guess for Z06 Super Test ring time: 7.50-7-48min! Yes, judging by Hockenheim time it will be that good.
BTW, I tried normal Vette C6(manual) and I was not very impressed, specially with steering feel...

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Mar 17, 2006 8:54:10 AM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: KresoF1

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
Branimir said:
Let's face it-Vette Z06 is a very good car, specially for the money!
Sport Auto test is excellent, car is very,very fast indeed... But, as turbolite said it is not the perfect car for all people. Porsche fans(me included) will not buy Z06! Why? There is a problem with Vette image here in Europe(and this is a big problem!)...
Maybe this thing will change after both AMS and Sport Auto test were excellent? We will see.
Ideal situation is to have both 997 Turbo and Z06, all potential buyers of 997 Turbo can afford extra car for sure...
My guess for Z06 Super Test ring time: 7.50-7-48min! Yes, judging by Hockenheim time it will be that good.
BTW, I tried normal Vette C6(manual) and I was not very impressed, specially with steering feel...

You highlight an important fact: HHR performance and NBR performance are two different things. HHR is a traditional track. NBR is (essentially) a replication of real-life road conditions. Cars that are fast on the HHR are not (always) fast on the NBR.

Therefore, I agree with your expectation regarding the NBR time of the Z06 (also having in mind the rather poor supertest results of the C5). The Z06 will probably do around 7:50 on the NBR, i.e. will most likely be slower than the 997TT (not to speak of the 997TTS).

On the other hand the Z06 performance figures (straight line and HHR) are really excellent. They highlight that the new 997TT is too slow. Apparently, Porsche has failed to re-establish the standard in the sports car world

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Mar 17, 2006 9:21:30 AM

dhayek: Rennteam Master; Loc: Beirut , Lebanon; Posts: 3839, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 7, 2004; Reply to: MKSGR

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

i am impressed with the time of the gallardo! as for the vette impressive times but not my car for sure,apart from the speed ,there is the design,the sound ,the interior,the exclusivity,the history etc...

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Mar 17, 2006 9:24:27 AM

Jackrw: Newbie; Loc: USA; Posts: 12, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 9, 2006; Reply to: BjoernB

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
BjoernB said:
As much as I respect the time/performance-comparisons between brand x and y I personally could not care less if somebody beats me by 0.2 secs or 2-3 secs per lap unless I am running in a whatever championship. I cannot understand all the fuzz about HP (480 or 500 ?) 3.7 or 4.0 sec's etc since most of us driving performance cars are not even close to be able to repeat any of the - from pro's - reached times. I want to see how many rennteamers can lap the ring in around 8 min - probably only on the playstation with a 800 hp car...certainly not with their fully optionned 997 or TT. My point is : if you like X - buy it ; if Y overtakes you so what ? Does it effect my ego ? Only those who don't have one at the first place. I drive 911's because I love them for what they are and only the sound is good enough to lift my mood - and onto today's roads whereas 99% of us are driving our toys -incl tracking- we are not driving because we want to be the fastest at any point of time - we drive whatever-car because the overall package suits our taste the most.

I think you might have a different perspective if you were living in the US or even in Germany. Really, being in Sigapore, I doubt you can do any real driving but just having to look good. There the 911 definitely has the leg up.

However, try this senario: you are going 150mph on the autobanh and here comes right up against your @ss a Z06 and you have to yield to him even though your ride costs 2 or 3 times more. Or this one: 3AM in the morning, you and your girlfriend going home after a fun night at hot spot in LA. You are in your brand-spanking new F430, with your girl drapped all over you.

On the 5 lane Interstate I-10; you see this Vitory Red Z06. Your woman wants you to race him. He wants to race you and his blonde female companion is giving you the eye,

You just realized at that moment that you wouldn't stand a chance if you tried to race him. That is when you start to care. This type of senario is taking place on streets of the US constantly.

This has nothing to do with Ego, it has to do with not having as much fun as the next guy over in the Z06. People tend to forget that for 90% of the drivers the only race engaged ever is on a deserted highway. There, driving skill is secondary; fit & finish is out of the door; handling rarely comes into play, the only thing matters is the trap speed and topend. The Z06 will have almost 10mph over the 997TT. That is just not right! 10 years ago, we wouldn't even think of having this discussion.

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Mar 17, 2006 9:34:05 AM

Jackrw: Newbie; Loc: USA; Posts: 12, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 9, 2006; Reply to: Jackrw

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Here is one man's view of the new Z. Coast to Coast in a Z06. http://www.popularmechanics.com/blog/automotive/2410566.html

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Mar 17, 2006 3:25:38 PM

sdy284: Expert; Loc: Wisconsin, USA; Posts: 1348, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 7, 2005; Reply to: Jackrw

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
Jackrw said:
However, try this senario: you are going 150mph on the autobanh and here comes right up against your @ss a Z06 and you have to yield to him even though your ride costs 2 or 3 times more. Or this one: 3AM in the morning, you and your girlfriend going home after a fun night at hot spot in LA. You are in your brand-spanking new F430, with your girl drapped all over you. On the 5 lane Interstate I-10; you see this Vitory Red Z06. Your woman wants you to race him. He wants to race you and his blonde female companion is giving you the eye, You just realized at that moment that you wouldn't stand a chance if you tried to race him. That is when you start to care. This type of senario is taking place on streets of the US constantly.

and then the race is over & the "loser" in the ferrari (or porsche) has to further humiliate himself by taking his woman to his 7000+ sq ft house, with, possibly, a few other ferrari's and or porsches in the driveway. Meanwhile, the "winner" in the Z takes his woman back to his 4000sq ft house with a Surburban (maybe an escalade) in the driveway.

Man... I sure hope i'm never that big of a "loser"

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Mar 17, 2006 3:26:17 PM

01Box06Z06: Pilot; Loc: Pennsylvania, USA; Posts: 300, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 9, 2006; Reply to: Jackrw

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

I own a Boxster and a Z06. They are COMPLETELY different drives. Both are very fun, but in very different ways. The Boxster is more engaging at slower speeds. You get more feedback going slower than in the Z06. When pushed, the Z06 really comes alive and is fantastic.
Personally, I think the Z06 is VERY good for the entire industry. It'll push everyone a little further. I'm sure many manufacturers are scratching their heads trying to figure out how they got that much technology and performance into a car that costs so little.
As for the debate over Porsche or Corvette: Again, this is a personal choice. There are people who'll just look at the raw numbers and paper and say the Z06 is the "better" car. There are others who just won't give the Z06 the time of day because of the interior and because it's a Chevy (no cache or bad image). It comes down to what you as an individual want out of a car. I don't think you can go wrong with any of the cars the Z06 is compared to. The 997tt is going to be a phenominal car for sure and the people who buy it will be very happy with it and not care about the numbers game. An F430, well, let's face it, it's an F430 and that's all that needs to be said about that (I would buy one in a minute if I could afford it).
Bottom line, it's a personal choice. 997S is still a great car and the better choice for some, while the Z06 is a great car and a better choice for others.

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Mar 17, 2006 3:50:25 PM

AJVIP: Expert; Loc:; Posts: 1862, Gallery; Registered on: May 30, 2005; Reply to: 95jersey

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
95jersey said:

I agree that it will take a long time, if the acceptance will ever happen. I think our success at LeMans has opened the door. You can say all you want that a road car and race car are different, but there are lots of people in Europe who follow LeMans and now have a different view on Corvette since its recent years of success. GM is not completely stupid..."build it and they will come".

"Our" ?

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Mar 17, 2006 3:59:24 PM

sdy284: Expert; Loc: Wisconsin, USA; Posts: 1348, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 7, 2005; Reply to: AJVIP

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
ajcastaneda said:
Quote:
95jersey said:

I agree that it will take a long time, if the acceptance will ever happen. I think our success at LeMans has opened the door. You can say all you want that a road car and race car are different, but there are lots of people in Europe who follow LeMans and now have a different view on Corvette since its recent years of success. GM is not completely stupid..."build it and they will come".

"Our" ?

the C5R & C6R's

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Mar 17, 2006 4:08:16 PM

AJVIP: Expert; Loc:; Posts: 1862, Gallery; Registered on: May 30, 2005; Reply to: sdy284

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

That's fine .. just didn't know if Jersey was a GM engineer or something

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Mar 17, 2006 4:09:31 PM

WBH: Expert; Loc: CA; Posts: 1963, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 2, 2004; Reply to: sdy284

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
sdy284 said:
Quote:
Jackrw said:
However, try this senario: you are going 150mph on the autobanh and here comes right up against your @ss a Z06 and you have to yield to him even though your ride costs 2 or 3 times more. Or this one: 3AM in the morning, you and your girlfriend going home after a fun night at hot spot in LA. You are in your brand-spanking new F430, with your girl drapped all over you. On the 5 lane Interstate I-10; you see this Vitory Red Z06. Your woman wants you to race him. He wants to race you and his blonde female companion is giving you the eye, You just realized at that moment that you wouldn't stand a chance if you tried to race him. That is when you start to care. This type of senario is taking place on streets of the US constantly.

and then the race is over & the "loser" in the ferrari (or porsche) has to further humiliate himself by taking his woman to his 7000+ sq ft house, with, possibly, a few other ferrari's and or porsches in the driveway. Meanwhile, the "winner" in the Z takes his woman back to his 4000sq ft house with a Surburban (maybe an escalade) in the driveway.

Man... I sure hope i'm never that big of a "loser"

More importantly, guys out driving post-dinner/club prob have some alcohol in bloodstream.....add that to the poss vehicular manslaughter charges and massive civil litigation if anything goes wrong while street-racing at reckless speeds....anyone who would choose to street race simply shows poor risk/reward judgement.....may Darwinian selection prevail.....

Besides, don't most affluent, responsible guys going out on town in LA/LV/NYC tend to just get an S-Class and driver to not have to worry re: DUI charges....

Don't know if German autobahn cx is much different, but have occasionally run alongside cars like 430/612/575/65/GT2, etc while briskly commuting in my humble 996TTS during SF-SilicVy runs on 280 fwy...and have never been challenged to race (nor do guys I know who also commute in $150K+ cars relate stories of being challenged

).....I suspect those who routinely drive these cars know there will always be microscopic accel/top speed diffces in various theoretic/real-world scenarios; prob own a few difft P/F/MB, etc anyway; prob have decent risk/reward judgement; and don't tie up their self-confidence in a mere car/plane/house/chick anyway.....

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Mar 17, 2006 6:52:05 PM

964C2: Expert; Loc: Dallas, TX , United States; Posts: 1825, Gallery; Registered on: May 11, 2004; Reply to: 01Box06Z06

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
01Box06Z06 said:
I own a Boxster and a Z06. They are COMPLETELY different drives. Both are very fun, but in very different ways. The Boxster is more engaging at slower speeds. You get more feedback going slower than in the Z06. When pushed, the Z06 really comes alive and is fantastic.
Personally, I think the Z06 is VERY good for the entire industry. It'll push everyone a little further. I'm sure many manufacturers are scratching their heads trying to figure out how they got that much technology and performance into a car that costs so little.
As for the debate over Porsche or Corvette: Again, this is a personal choice. There are people who'll just look at the raw numbers and paper and say the Z06 is the "better" car. There are others who just won't give the Z06 the time of day because of the interior and because it's a Chevy (no cache or bad image). It comes down to what you as an individual want out of a car. I don't think you can go wrong with any of the cars the Z06 is compared to. The 997tt is going to be a phenominal car for sure and the people who buy it will be very happy with it and not care about the numbers game. An F430, well, let's face it, it's an F430 and that's all that needs to be said about that (I would buy one in a minute if I could afford it).
Bottom line, it's a personal choice. 997S is still a great car and the better choice for some, while the Z06 is a great car and a better choice for others.

Well said

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Mar 18, 2006 4:08:05 PM

MKW: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Palo Alto and North Lake Tahoe , United States; Posts: 2491, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 22, 2002; Reply to: 01Box06Z06

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
01Box06Z06 said:
I own a Boxster and a Z06. They are COMPLETELY different drives. Both are very fun, but in very different ways. The Boxster is more engaging at slower speeds. You get more feedback going slower than in the Z06. When pushed, the Z06 really comes alive and is fantastic.

My Turbo always feels like a truck in around town driving the day I get it back after driving a " sprightly " but still heavy Boxster S service loaner for a day or two ! That's why I'm constantly tempted to get something LIGHT like a Lotus Exige also , but I worry I won't enjoy the Turbo anymore , as straightline acceleration for cars in the 500-600 hp class is so massive ( and dangerous on roadways ) that I find I use WOT far less on it than all the other cars I own. These cars are becoming a new class : you've had " Garage Queens " forever , now we have " Road Queens " cars that can only be wrung out fully at " Do Not Pass GO - Go Directly To Jail " speeds well over 120 + mph on public roads AND with speed potential that could NEVER be reached on a typical amateur event racetrack with it's curves /turns ! Heck, manufacturers have to rent places and spend days preparing at places like the 20 mile long maufacturers' test ovals like VW's or the one in Ohio just to find out what the top speed they can advertise on their cars in their sales brochures !

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Mar 18, 2006 6:26:39 PM

95jersey: Senior; Loc: US; Posts: 578, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 20, 2006; Reply to: MKW

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
MKW said:
Quote:
01Box06Z06 said:
I own a Boxster and a Z06. They are COMPLETELY different drives. Both are very fun, but in very different ways. The Boxster is more engaging at slower speeds. You get more feedback going slower than in the Z06. When pushed, the Z06 really comes alive and is fantastic.

My Turbo always feels like a truck in around town driving the day I get it back after driving a " sprightly " but still heavy Boxster S service loaner for a day or two ! That's why I'm constantly tempted to get something LIGHT like a Lotus Exige also , but I worry I won't enjoy the Turbo anymore , as straightline acceleration for cars in the 500-600 hp class is so massive ( and dangerous on roadways ) that I find I use WOT far less on it than all the other cars I own. These cars are becoming a new class : you've had " Garage Queens " forever , now we have " Road Queens " cars that can only be wrung out fully at " Do Not Pass GO - Go Directly To Jail " speeds well over 120 + mph on public roads AND with speed potential that could NEVER be reached on a typical amateur event racetrack with it's curves /turns ! Heck, manufacturers have to rent places and spend days preparing at places like the 20 mile long maufacturers' test ovals like VW's or the one in Ohio just to find out what the top speed they can advertise on their cars in their sales brochures !

YOu need to try out a track day. I do a dozen a year and get my car up to 165mph in a safe controlled environment. It's is better than sex. I agree that doing this on the road is stupid. That is why I drive a cheap lease everyday and could care less what kind of car it is as long as it gets good gas mileage. But when track day comes....

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Mar 18, 2006 8:42:46 PM

SoCalHoosier: Veteran; Loc: California , United States; Posts: 896, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 13, 2003; Reply to: 95jersey

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
95jersey said: It's better than sex.

Next time, try using a female.

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Mar 18, 2006 8:58:06 PM

strawman: Newbie; Loc: Canada; Posts: 44, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 12, 2004; Reply to: turbolite

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
turbolite said:
So sport auto finally tested the z06, although not on the Nürburgring yet.

Performance data are very similar to the AMS test data, it's the same car:

0-100 4,0
0-160 8,0
0-200 12.0

Hockenheim lap: 1.11,5 an excellent time!
In comparison:
Corvette c6: 1.14.8
F430 F1: 1.12,7
Gallardo: 1.11,8
Murcielago: 1.12,0
P. Zonda S: 1.11,8
996 tt: 1.14,6
911 gt3: 1.13,2
911 gt2: 1.12,6
911gt3rs 1.11,8 (racetires)
PCGT: 1.08,6
Ford gt 1.14,1

comments are extremely favourable re engine and brakes. not an easy car to be handled at the limit though.

in summary: a hard nut to crack even for the 997tt..

Nice numbers..that track time is very impressive

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Mar 18, 2006 9:51:08 PM

MKW: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Palo Alto and North Lake Tahoe , United States; Posts: 2491, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 22, 2002; Reply to: 95jersey

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Quote:
95jersey said:

YOu need to try out a track day. I do a dozen a year and get my car up to 165mph in a safe controlled environment.

That is still 30-40 mph below the top speed of most of these 500-600 hp cars . That's why it's funny to see people argue about Brand X having a top of 200 and Brand Y " only " doing 195 mph . Of course the guy with the 200 mph car has already installed ghetto wheels and a a body kit , knocking off 20 mph from the top speed.

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Mar 19, 2006 4:45:47 PM

bondmid003: Pilot; Loc: La Jolla, CA , United States; Posts: 378, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 10, 2006; Reply to: MKW

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Is there a place online where you can read the Sport Auto article?

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Mar 20, 2006 2:03:19 PM

95jersey: Senior; Loc: US; Posts: 578, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 20, 2006; Reply to: MKW

Re: ZO6 Sport Auto TEST!

Most REAL race cars on REAL road coursed will NEVER see much faster than those speeds. It's not about the car, more than the fact that most tracks don't have 1 mile long straits required to hit those speeds. My car has 423RWHP, which at the crank is around 500HP. It weights about 3100lbs, and the only track I can get to 165mph, is using part of a long Nascar oval at Pocono Raceway at the old SCCA road course. I regularly pass 911tt and Viper's due to my higher HP to weight ratio.

Anyone who gets caught up on 190 vs. 200 has probably never driven that fast or has never driven on a road course.
Some may not understand this, but top speed and acceleration is not what is exciting about road racing, it's carrying overall MOMENTUM through corners for a faster lap time. I often use the straits for a "breather" while I get ready to threshold brake or apex the next corner. Everyone should try a track day, it will absolutely open your eyes (and is a lot of fun.)

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