Crown

RC:

Guys, there is a huge difference with the "box" from Carnewal. 

It keeps the valves open all the time, which the original setup, even with the sport button pressed, does not. Even with the sport button pressed, the valves operate according to the DME programming but since they open up more (and longer), you get the sportier sound vs. not pressing the sport button. With the little box from Carnewal, this process is eliminated, the valves stay open all the time, thus you have a louder sound than with the original setup, even if the sport button is pressed. 

You actually need to install the box, try it, then go back to the original setup and you'll realize very fast how big the difference is. Especially on the Cab, the difference is huge.

So to actually hear the difference, I would recommend lowering both windows completely and of course opening the sunroof (Coupe). 

As to the negative effects to the engine: I doubt that the slight changes in back pressure have any serious negative effect on the GTS engine. It would probably be different on a turbo engine. Of course torque is changed to some point (and you can actually feel it a little bit) but performance is still the same, I tried several 0-100 kph and 0-200 kph runs (GPS) and the time was 4.4 sec and 14.5 sec, so within original "specs" (both with Sport Plus active and without launch control).

Thanks for the clarification RC. This goes against all information I read on other forums, tuner web sites, etc. but I am not going to argue the case since I have no experience from Gert's device  It goes against the logical explanation for the new center muffler too.

However, this would essentially mean that if one locates the vacuum hose for the 997.2 PSE and disconnects it, then the PSE would always be "very" loud? Like the good old 997.1 PSE mod. Has anyone found the vacuum hose? This would be a simple and cheap mod...

997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.

If I recall, RC looked for it and wasn't able to locate it ...

997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red

reginos:

RC:

Guys, there is a huge difference with the "box" from Carnewal. 

It keeps the valves open all the time, which the original setup, even with the sport button pressed, does not. Even with the sport button pressed, the valves operate according to the DME programming but since they open up more (and longer), you get the sportier sound vs. not pressing the sport button. With the little box from Carnewal, this process is eliminated, the valves stay open all the time, thus you have a louder sound than with the original setup, even if the sport button is pressed. 

When you press the PSE button with car idling and go to the back of the car you realize that all 4 pipes let gas out (at OFF only the 2 inside ones) but still the pressure from the outer pipes is very low compared to the inside pipes. This proves that although the valves open they do not open fully at first , but only gradually depending on Porsche programing (revs, speed et al.)

Apparently what RC's trick box does is to fully open the valves from zero and keep them open all the time. Hence more sound all the time.

Reginos you´re spot on. Just went to my car and use the remote control. When PSE off the outer pipes are fully closed at idling and inside pipes let gas out. Switch on the PSE via remote and the outer pipes start to let gas out at the pressure has the inside pipes, so there´s seems to be a difference compared to PSE with factory settings which according to you, at idling with PSE on the outer pipes have low pressure than inside pipes.

J.Seven

bluelines:

RC:

Guys, there is a huge difference with the "box" from Carnewal. 

It keeps the valves open all the time, which the original setup, even with the sport button pressed, does not. Even with the sport button pressed, the valves operate according to the DME programming but since they open up more (and longer), you get the sportier sound vs. not pressing the sport button. With the little box from Carnewal, this process is eliminated, the valves stay open all the time, thus you have a louder sound than with the original setup, even if the sport button is pressed. 

You actually need to install the box, try it, then go back to the original setup and you'll realize very fast how big the difference is. Especially on the Cab, the difference is huge.

So to actually hear the difference, I would recommend lowering both windows completely and of course opening the sunroof (Coupe). 

As to the negative effects to the engine: I doubt that the slight changes in back pressure have any serious negative effect on the GTS engine. It would probably be different on a turbo engine. Of course torque is changed to some point (and you can actually feel it a little bit) but performance is still the same, I tried several 0-100 kph and 0-200 kph runs (GPS) and the time was 4.4 sec and 14.5 sec, so within original "specs" (both with Sport Plus active and without launch control).

Thanks for the clarification RC. This goes against all information I read on other forums, tuner web sites, etc. but I am not going to argue the case since I have no experience from Gert's device  It goes against the logical explanation for the new center muffler too.

However, this would essentially mean that if one locates the vacuum hose for the 997.2 PSE and disconnects it, then the PSE would always be "very" loud? Like the good old 997.1 PSE mod. Has anyone found the vacuum hose? This would be a simple and cheap mod...

Taken from another board - looking for the vacuum hose on a GTS....

"I found the plug.

It is on the right side of the engine at the side of the intake and is a black plug that goes into a grey piece.

There is a metal ring that hold the plug into place.  BE CAREFUL with the metal ring as mine went flying off and now I can't find it anywhere.  You will need this metal ring to lock the plug back into place if you decide to plug PSE flappers back in.

"No pics yet, but I can take one tomorrow to show the plug....it's the only plug on the right side on the intake manifold."

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No need for pics - just reach in and to the right.  The plug runs back-to-front and has a metal "C" clip that locks it on.  Squeeze the clip (it only moves one way, so you'll know when you have it right) and pull it towards you. Let it dangle or zip tie it to something else if you're anal.

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Anyone fancy trying this....and taking some photos?   RC - are you up for giving it a go...?

--

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

Great!  Thanks John.

I had a look at my Carrera S and I found the black rubber hose and the grey plastic connector.

If this works as on the 997.1 PSE there should be two methods for disabling the flaps:

1. Unplug the black electrical wire on the rear (lower) side of the grey plastic
2. Unplug the black vacuum hose on the front (upper) side of the grey plastic.

The description from the member on the other forum seem to refer to method 1.

I will give it a try later today 

997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.

 I will also give it a try.

So is it this part that you unplug ? 

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

On the 991 the PSE is activated by the Sport button like on 997.1.

I don't think that's a good idea. They should have kept the separate button as on 997.2 for more versatility.

"Form follows function"

Gnil:

So is it this part that you unplug ? 

That lower part it the electrical connector, you can unplug that one. Or you can unplug the vacuum hose on the other end of the gray plastic.

997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.

So, ladies and gentlemen, the proof is in the pudding 

I disconnected the rubber vacuum hose, a light hiss could be heard as air filled the tube and I then started the engine. The exhaust was loud from the start and remained loud. The exhaust button on the center panel did no longer have any effect (the light went on and off, but no difference in sound). Hence we can conclude that disconnecting the rubber hose does keep the flaps in the default open position.

I did a few runs both in town and on the highway, trying to take extra notice of the sound between 50 - 80 km/h. Did it sound better than a GT3? No. Did it sound as loud as the 997.1 PSE? No. Did it sound louder than normal? Maybe, but probably no (in other words no noticeable difference to me). I then reconnected the hose, this made the exhaust button functional again and I did a re-run. I could not hear that the exhaust was quieter than with the rubber hose disconnected.

I also tried a few accelerations in 2nd gear between 60 - 80km/h with the rubber hose connected and switching the PSE on and off. Reason being, if there is a cut-off in this speed range then I should not hear any difference, since the flaps should remain closed. That was however not the case. Switching the PSE on made the exhaust a lot louder.

My humble conclusions based on the above:

1. Disabling the flaps does not make the exhaust noticeable louder than with PSE on.
2. There is no speed-related cut-off on the 997.2 PSE.
3. Gert's device enables PSE on when starting the car, but that is it 
4. To get a louder sound from the 997.2 PSE one needs to do the center muffler bypass.

I could be all wrong of course 

997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.

 Thanks  for this precious information.

I located the plug, it was very hard to pull, so I pulled the hose ( very easy ) . Had the same sound as you. Then I only tried it at standstill.......... no difference with PSE activated through the button.

RC seemed to say that the flaps are sometimes half open for back pressure reasons, but your test must be pretty accurate . 

BTW : if on the 991 the PSE is activated trough the sports button, that is just plain wrong !!!! why  does P take a step back ?????  

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Very useful bluelines ... thanks for testing it out  

997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red

Gnil:

BTW : if on the 991 the PSE is activated trough the sports button, that is just plain wrong !!!! why  does P take a step back ?????  

That's how I understand it from page 49 of the catalog, under "Die SPORT Taste".

They will bring the PSE button back with 991.2

--

"Form follows function"

reginos:

They will bring the PSE button back with 991.2

 

997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.

reginos:

Gnil:

BTW : if on the 991 the PSE is activated trough the sports button, that is just plain wrong !!!! why  does P take a step back ?????  

That's how I understand it from page 49 of the catalog, under "Die SPORT Taste".

They will bring the PSE button back with 991.2

--

"Form follows function"

 of course.... and add 35 HP, correct the front design, update the PCM,  and make the car just as it was supposed to be in the first place   

--

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

easy_rider911:

Very useful bluelines ... thanks for testing it out  

+1....Many thanks for giving it a try - just sorry it didn't work out so well.

I've replied to the poster, on the other board, who suggested it and received a reply from him and another user who both swear it works just fine!  I've also posted your pics (hope you don't mind) just to ensure we're talking about the same tube....

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

Seems Bluelines' may have experimented using the wrong tube..

The correct tube to unplug is shown below...

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

John H:

Seems Bluelines' may have experimented using the wrong tube..

The correct tube to unplug is shown below...

 

I will try again.

997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.

Just wondered if you've given it another try yet?

I'm not sufficiently mechanically proficient to be the first, but will take it on if someone here, who is confident about what they're doing, gets a positive result...

If that sounds like a cop-out... it probably is...

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

 I tried quickly  to pull the plug off, but there is the metal ring that I could not get off with my fingers. The car was also hot, so it wasn't great conditions to try. Will try again this week end.

But I do not believe it will make a difference.  I also pulled the ' wrong plug' and it does open the flaps ( bout no better sound then with PSE on ) ...  So I do not see what that other plug can do different ?

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

 So, I pulled the plug this afternoon . And.........

First I thought  it made more noise, that it added an ' empty can sound '  . 

I tested it then many times, with plug on, off, PSE on / off and must say that I was not convinced anymore . Many times it sounded the same to me , but once and a  while the ' mod' sounded louder. And where it sounded louder was not between 50 km/h and 80 km/h, but rather around 100 - 120 km/h .  

But again... I might have gotten confused after a while and could not hear clearly anymore ,  

Now, at least I can do the mod in one second . I just pull the plug or put it back. Very easy , once you have taken the metal ring off ( BTW I took a tool to take the ring off )

So, please try it , and tell me what you guys think / hear .

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

 I tried it again this morning.  DId not find it louder driving in 3rd at around 60- 70 km/h.

The only place I thought it could be a little bit louder was at starting and up to 20 km/h .. But then again, my ears might not be very accurate 

As I said before, now that  I took the metal ring off, I can do or undo the ' mod' in one second.

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Gnil - many thanks for 'taking the plunge'...

Would be very interested to hear what Bluelines makes of it..

BTW - what tool did you use to get the metal ring off?

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

 this

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Is that a special pair of over-sized pliers??  It's okay - just returning the sarcasm..

--

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."

--

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

John H:

Would be very interested to hear what Bluelines makes of it..

Bluelines did not have time to try since he spent the weekend blasting over the Splügen pass to Lugano and back again in the Boxster with the newly installed IPD plenum and GT3 throttle body  Mama mia does the little Boxster move now... and what a sound! Bellissimo! 

Regarding these vacuum hoses on the 997. For sure both of them does not control the PSE. My guess is one of the controls the flap (or multiple flaps on the GTS) in the air intake chamber. Hence the difference in sound when removing either. I guess we just need to figure out which one actually controls the PSE. Messing around with the flaps in the intake cannot be good 

997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.

I'm assured that this is the hose to unclip and disconnect...

"Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."