Crown
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Feb 8, 2009 10:54:35 PM
- Atzporsche
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Reply to:
Gauss
Feb 9, 2009 7:24:43 AM
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Lars997
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I'm guessing a little under a thousand Feb 9, 2009 6:03:25 PM
- easy_rider911
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Feb 10, 2009 12:55:31 PM
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RC
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Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
Judging by the look and position of the car, I doubt that the driver got away unhurt. Sad. 
The Carrera GT is one of my favorite sportscars but you really need to be a good and experienced driver to be able to drive this car very fast. Many owners underestimate its potential AND danger.
One of our most beloved and appreciated users, Ben Keaton. died in a Carrera GT and he was a pretty good driver.
Unfortunately there has been a lawsuit after this accident in which Ben's passenger, Mr. Rudl, was killed too.
His widow filed a lawsuit and won but as much as I feel for her and her pain regarding the death of a beloved person, I can't agree at all with her statement after she won the lawsuit:
"My loving husband was an innocent passenger in an expensive sports car that inexplicably failed to incorporate a modern, life-saving safety feature. He was a passenger on a racetrack that was dangerously designed. While driving on racetracks always involves risks, the result of this case and the redesign of the track will help eliminate unnecessary risks and make the sport of high speed driving safer."
1. her husband was indeed an innocent passenger but as a fellow sportscar driver, he was aware of the risk involved when he entered Ben's CGT
2. not sure how a racetrack can be dangerously designed. If there is a danger, you need to drive more careful and more slowly. She may call this dangerous, I call it a challenge. This is why we have racetracks. I would judge differently if it would be a public street
3. ESP(PSM), the "modern life saving feature" is something I highly appreciate, even on a sportscar. However: if you drive a sportscar without ESP/PSM, you know the risk involved. I even think that I remember Ben argueing why he actually preferred driving a car without ESP/PSM and I can fully understand it. Whoever drives a Carrera GT should be aware of the danger(s) involved.
To make it short: such accidents are horrible, especially if someone dies. People driving such cars should be aware of the risk involved, sometimes I get however the feeling that they take the expression "toy" too seriously, forgetting about the possible consequences of their driving.
Btw: here's a picture of a "typical" Rennteam staff meeting. Gladly, no destroyed car(s) and everybody happy and alive. 
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor 997 Turbo, Cayenne Turbo S, BMW M3 Cab DKG, Mini Cooper S JCW
Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
good point rc......
i am sure, that would her husband have survived the crash in a bad condition such as paralyzed or else he would not have sued the family of the deceased...................
many times it's the grief over the lost lives that pushes people to sue......sometimes also simply financial motivation.
i have never had my cars beyond the speed of 260-270. i simply 'know' that the gt2 will go 329 regardless of who's driving. it's the twisties where i look to have fun.....
i always drive my cars as if i have no traction and stability control. i do not tend to rely on the car fixing it for me.....there are boundaries and speeds that go beyond what electronics and aids can 'fix'.
i will not put my life at the hands of airbags and stability control....much rather have fun in a 'safe' manner.
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Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary... That's what gets you.
Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
RC:FWIW, I suspect that this point referred to the fact that large concrete blocks had been arranged as boundaries for a children's playground in the infield, and Ben's CGT crashed into one or several of these blocks.
2. not sure how a racetrack can be dangerously designed. If there is a danger, you need to drive more careful and more slowly. She may call this dangerous, I call it a challenge. This is why we have racetracks. I would judge differently if it would be a public street
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fritz
Feb 10, 2009 11:04:13 PM
- Atzporsche
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Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
fritz:I remember the horrible real pictures of that exact scene.. I can't possibly think of why they would blame the car when they put deadly concrete blocks perpendicular to the road
RC:FWIW, I suspect that this point referred to the fact that large concrete blocks had been arranged as boundaries for a children's playground in the infield, and Ben's CGT crashed into one or several of these blocks.
2. not sure how a racetrack can be dangerously designed. If there is a danger, you need to drive more careful and more slowly. She may call this dangerous, I call it a challenge. This is why we have racetracks. I would judge differently if it would be a public street
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fritz
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2005 Ford Focus S, 5spd
1986 Porsche 944, 5spd
Feb 11, 2009 6:55:40 AM
- Italo
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Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
Lars997:On the other hand, maybe it was just because the CGT has wide, thick doors.
Italo:
parked his car a liitle bit further away from yourspossibly avoiding a potential dent
My guess is, that the CGT is so difficult to drive that it is not easy to put it more need on the parking
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fritz
Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
Italo:
to ligthen up the mood, RC I noticed that the owner of the CGT in the pic parked his car a liitle bit further away from yours
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There's only one car, there's only one Porsche
Funny you mention it: CR actually parked his CGT first, then I parked my 997 Turbo.
I usually always leave such a huge space between my car and others, learned my lesson(s). Unfortunately some people actually hate me doing this, I had a housewife mock me (you can't park...) because I once blocked almost two parking lots with my car. The reason was pretty simple: next to one parking lot was a Mini Van and I knew the owner and her kids. Little hint: bang..bang...they couldn't care less. So better to be safe than sorry, even if a bored housewife needs to give me parking lessons with a high pitched voice. 
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor 997 Turbo, Cayenne Turbo S, BMW M3 Cab DKG, Mini Cooper S JCW
Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
Haaa - I know this to good RC. This desperate housewifes shaking heads when seeing me parking in front of the the supermarket.
But lets face it - we all made the experience that some people dont care about others values. So I better keep distance before I need to get the pitched voice after seeing the dent 
Re: Heavy Carrera GT Crash
Lars997:The driver of the turbo is known for his recklessness and for damaging other cars when it comes to parking, so the CGT-driver simply had to react (and park his car) this way.
Haaa - I know this to good RC. This desperate housewifes shaking heads when seeing me parking in front of the the supermarket.
But lets face it - we all made the experience that some people dont care about others values. So I better keep distance before I need to get the pitched voice after seeing the dent
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Back again! 
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