996TT weighs LESS than the 997TT
http://www.supercars.net/garages/MMO/17v2.html
http://www.theautobahn.com/forum/showcar.php?do=overview&car_model_id=40
whats going on???
"CF" claimes 997TT is 1585 KG manual
the 996TT is 1540 KG
im confused,,,,,
Feb 25, 2006 2:42:03 AM
Quote:
BD 997 said:
I thought the 997TT weighed less?? I made that comment on the other forum and they shot me down with this....
http://www.supercars.net/garages/MMO/17v2.html
http://www.theautobahn.com/forum/showcar.php?do=overview&car_model_id=40
whats going on???
"CF" claimes 997TT is 1585 KG manual
the 996TT is 1540 KG
im confused,,,,,
Quote:
BD 997 said:
I thought the 997TT weighed less?? I made that comment on the other forum and they shot me down with this....
http://www.supercars.net/garages/MMO/17v2.html
http://www.theautobahn.com/forum/showcar.php?do=overview&car_model_id=40
whats going on???
"CF" claimes 997TT is 1585 KG manual
the 996TT is 1540 KG
im confused,,,,,
Quote:
brunner said:
Aren't you tired of complaining?
Wait for the **** car first... So much fuss over a couple of pictures is starting to look a little silly.
Quote:
MKSGR said:
Why should disappointed Porsche buyers not complain for months. The test results will (most likely) not change much. The facts known to date speek for themselves
Quote:
RC said:Quote:
MKSGR said:
Why should disappointed Porsche buyers not complain for months. The test results will (most likely) not change much. The facts known to date speek for themselves
I understand that some people are disappointed, especially with the non-availability of PDK but also with the "low" power figure on the paper.
But, this is a fact: the 997 Turbo is an incredibly fast car and because you like to compare it to the 996 Turbo S, I can tell you that I've talked about this "comparison" to certain people and all of them were actually laughing in my face, claiming that the 997 Turbo and the 996 Turbo S are as much of a difference in performance like day and night. And in favor of the 997 Turbo. I trust these people because up to now, their claims have been accurate.
Of course they can be wrong, I can be wrong and maybe the 997 Turbo is crap. But shouldn't we wait until we see a real life review, at least ONE?
I have more of a feeling that you're trying to "justify" to yourself NOT to go for the new 997 Turbo and to be happy with your current 996 Turbo S. No problem with me. But if you want to know facts, you should wait for a few reviews to make sure you're not making a mistake in your judgement.
Regarding the weight of the new Turbo:
I hold here the OFFICIAL Porsche 911 (996) Turbo Technik Kompendium in my hands and the weight statements are:
Leergewicht DIN: 1540 kg (Tiptronic: 1585 kg) - 997 TT:1585 kg (1620 kg).
Leergewicht DIN + Fahrer 75 kg: 1615 kg (Tiptronic: 1660 kg) - 997 TT: 1660 kg (Tiptronic: 1695 kg).
Weight to power ratio:
3,66 kg/HP (Tiptronic: 3,76 kg/HP).
So yes, you're right: the new 997 Turbo is actually 35-45 kg heavier than the old 996 Turbo and I'm a little bit surprised to see how Porsche seems to mix up the numbers, by purpose or not. I suppose they took the latest factory weight claims for the 996 Turbo and compared them to the new 997 Turbo. But I agree with you that this is a little bit of a marketing "trick". Because although the 996 Turbo did gain in weight over the years of production, it also gained in performance surprisingly.
But the 996 Turbo vs. 997 Turbo power/weight ratio is a different story. 3.3 kg/HP is better than 3.66 kg (by ~ 10%).
And the 996 Turbo S is a few kg heavier than the 996 Turbo due to the increased weight (this is valid for the 996 Turbo too) during the model production cycle.
Sounds confusing? Well, a little bit.
This is why I recommend: wait and see. If you don't like it, you don't have to buy it. And if you like it, well...too late for an early car.
Quote:
MKSGR said:
I am actually in the situation that I need to replace my 996 sooner or later. It already has 60k km on the clock...
Feb 25, 2006 4:23:34 PM
Feb 25, 2006 4:41:34 PM
Feb 25, 2006 5:46:51 PM
Quote:
RC said:
The new Murcielago should be an incredible car. For 250000 Euro, this is right now the best buy for your money I'd say...if you're into sportscars.
0-100 kph in 3.4 seconds (definetely faster than 997 TT), 0-200 kph in under 11 seconds (I don't have the precise figure at hand) and a top speed of 340 kph. This car absolutely rocks. This would definetely be THE car in my garage if I would have the money. No doubt about it.
My wife doesn't like the Murcielago either. Reason? It is a chick magnet. She didn't tell me directly but the tone in her voice was very clear. And my wife doesn't have to feel threatened by other women since she has nothing to complaint about, especially after two kids.
But you know how women are...they are cool, strong, whatever...but when it comes to other women and looks...
As much as I'm a Porsche addict, the new Lamborghini Murcielago is just a dream come true. In my opinion the perfect package, a mix of style, sportiness, aggressive and masculine looks, combined with feminine beauty (as weird as this may sound). A driving machine par excellence.
Quote:
pierre said:Quote:
MKSGR said:
I am actually in the situation that I need to replace my 996 sooner or later. It already has 60k km on the clock...
I call this a brand new car!
But I'm with you. Mine will need a replacement sometimes too, but I won't jump into the early 997TT train. Too much money for too little improvement, at least right now. We'll see what will follow, but I'm currently more on the GT3 side... (even if I'm bit bit afraid I could miss the torque)
Another fun thing (in a very different league) is the T1. (sorry for sliding a bit OT)
--p
Quote:
CF said:
Question for MKSGR.
In your opinion, which specifications should the 997 Turbo have?
Feb 25, 2006 6:38:00 PM
Quote:
bostonmini said:Quote:
RC said:
The new Murcielago should be an incredible car. For 250000 Euro, this is right now the best buy for your money I'd say...if you're into sportscars.
0-100 kph in 3.4 seconds (definetely faster than 997 TT), 0-200 kph in under 11 seconds (I don't have the precise figure at hand) and a top speed of 340 kph. This car absolutely rocks. This would definetely be THE car in my garage if I would have the money. No doubt about it.
My wife doesn't like the Murcielago either. Reason? It is a chick magnet. She didn't tell me directly but the tone in her voice was very clear. And my wife doesn't have to feel threatened by other women since she has nothing to complaint about, especially after two kids.
But you know how women are...they are cool, strong, whatever...but when it comes to other women and looks...
As much as I'm a Porsche addict, the new Lamborghini Murcielago is just a dream come true. In my opinion the perfect package, a mix of style, sportiness, aggressive and masculine looks, combined with feminine beauty (as weird as this may sound). A driving machine par excellence.
I agree, the new bull is awesome, no two ways about it, and although the 997TT is awesome, the gallardo SE isnt so bad either!!! RC, are u becoming a lambo convert:)?
Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
bostonmini said:Quote:
RC said:
The new Murcielago should be an incredible car. For 250000 Euro, this is right now the best buy for your money I'd say...if you're into sportscars.
0-100 kph in 3.4 seconds (definetely faster than 997 TT), 0-200 kph in under 11 seconds (I don't have the precise figure at hand) and a top speed of 340 kph. This car absolutely rocks. This would definetely be THE car in my garage if I would have the money. No doubt about it.
My wife doesn't like the Murcielago either. Reason? It is a chick magnet. She didn't tell me directly but the tone in her voice was very clear. And my wife doesn't have to feel threatened by other women since she has nothing to complaint about, especially after two kids.
But you know how women are...they are cool, strong, whatever...but when it comes to other women and looks...
As much as I'm a Porsche addict, the new Lamborghini Murcielago is just a dream come true. In my opinion the perfect package, a mix of style, sportiness, aggressive and masculine looks, combined with feminine beauty (as weird as this may sound). A driving machine par excellence.
I agree, the new bull is awesome, no two ways about it, and although the 997TT is awesome, the gallardo SE isnt so bad either!!! RC, are u becoming a lambo convert:)?
If you search through some of RC's older posts, you will find, that he has actually been quite a Lambo fan for a while now. He wanted the old Murci, so I can only imagine what it must feel like to see the new one (heck, I'd order it in a heartbeat if I could afford to blow the extra Euro 100.000 ).
Quote:
MKSGR said:Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
bostonmini said:Quote:
RC said:
The new Murcielago should be an incredible car. For 250000 Euro, this is right now the best buy for your money I'd say...if you're into sportscars.
0-100 kph in 3.4 seconds (definetely faster than 997 TT), 0-200 kph in under 11 seconds (I don't have the precise figure at hand) and a top speed of 340 kph. This car absolutely rocks. This would definetely be THE car in my garage if I would have the money. No doubt about it.
My wife doesn't like the Murcielago either. Reason? It is a chick magnet. She didn't tell me directly but the tone in her voice was very clear. And my wife doesn't have to feel threatened by other women since she has nothing to complaint about, especially after two kids.
But you know how women are...they are cool, strong, whatever...but when it comes to other women and looks...
As much as I'm a Porsche addict, the new Lamborghini Murcielago is just a dream come true. In my opinion the perfect package, a mix of style, sportiness, aggressive and masculine looks, combined with feminine beauty (as weird as this may sound). A driving machine par excellence.
I agree, the new bull is awesome, no two ways about it, and although the 997TT is awesome, the gallardo SE isnt so bad either!!! RC, are u becoming a lambo convert:)?
If you search through some of RC's older posts, you will find, that he has actually been quite a Lambo fan for a while now. He wanted the old Murci, so I can only imagine what it must feel like to see the new one (heck, I'd order it in a heartbeat if I could afford to blow the extra Euro 100.000 ).
The Murcielago is really a great car. The only drawback is its extreme design. Driving a Murcielago will always be a strong statement... A statement totally different from being seen in a 997TT. If they could only fix the performance of this car
Quote:
RC said:
The new Murcielago should be an incredible car. For 250000 Euro, this is right now the best buy for your money I'd say...if you're into sportscars.
0-100 kph in 3.4 seconds (definetely faster than 997 TT), 0-200 kph in under 11 seconds (I don't have the precise figure at hand) and a top speed of 340 kph. This car absolutely rocks. This would definetely be THE car in my garage if I would have the money. No doubt about it.
My wife doesn't like the Murcielago either. Reason? It is a chick magnet. She didn't tell me directly but the tone in her voice was very clear. And my wife doesn't have to feel threatened by other women since she has nothing to complaint about, especially after two kids.
But you know how women are...they are cool, strong, whatever...but when it comes to other women and looks...
As much as I'm a Porsche addict, the new Lamborghini Murcielago is just a dream come true. In my opinion the perfect package, a mix of style, sportiness, aggressive and masculine looks, combined with feminine beauty (as weird as this may sound). A driving machine par excellence.
Feb 25, 2006 9:33:25 PM
Quote:
RC said:Quote:
MKSGR said:
Why should disappointed Porsche buyers not complain for months. The test results will (most likely) not change much. The facts known to date speek for themselves
I understand that some people are disappointed, especially with the non-availability of PDK but also with the "low" power figure on the paper.
But, this is a fact: the 997 Turbo is an incredibly fast car and because you like to compare it to the 996 Turbo S, I can tell you that I've talked about this "comparison" to certain people and all of them were actually laughing in my face, claiming that the 997 Turbo and the 996 Turbo S are as much of a difference in performance like day and night. And in favor of the 997 Turbo. I trust these people because up to now, their claims have been accurate.
Of course they can be wrong, I can be wrong and maybe the 997 Turbo is crap. But shouldn't we wait until we see a real life review, at least ONE?
I have more of a feeling that you're trying to "justify" to yourself NOT to go for the new 997 Turbo and to be happy with your current 996 Turbo S. No problem with me. But if you want to know facts, you should wait for a few reviews to make sure you're not making a mistake in your judgement.
Regarding the weight of the new Turbo:
I hold here the OFFICIAL Porsche 911 (996) Turbo Technik Kompendium in my hands and the weight statements are:
Leergewicht DIN: 1540 kg (Tiptronic: 1585 kg) - 997 TT:1585 kg (1620 kg).
Leergewicht DIN + Fahrer 75 kg: 1615 kg (Tiptronic: 1660 kg) - 997 TT: 1660 kg (Tiptronic: 1695 kg).
Weight to power ratio:
3,66 kg/HP (Tiptronic: 3,76 kg/HP).
So yes, you're right: the new 997 Turbo is actually 35-45 kg heavier than the old 996 Turbo and I'm a little bit surprised to see how Porsche seems to mix up the numbers, by purpose or not. I suppose they took the latest factory weight claims for the 996 Turbo and compared them to the new 997 Turbo. But I agree with you that this is a little bit of a marketing "trick". Because although the 996 Turbo did gain in weight over the years of production, it also gained in performance surprisingly.
But the 996 Turbo vs. 997 Turbo power/weight ratio is a different story. 3.3 kg/HP is better than 3.66 kg (by ~ 10%).
And the 996 Turbo S is a few kg heavier than the 996 Turbo due to the increased weight (this is valid for the 996 Turbo too) during the model production cycle.
Sounds confusing? Well, a little bit.
This is why I recommend: wait and see. If you don't like it, you don't have to buy it. And if you like it, well...too late for an early car.
Quote:
MKSGR said:Quote:
RC said:Quote:
MKSGR said:
Why should disappointed Porsche buyers not complain for months. The test results will (most likely) not change much. The facts known to date speek for themselves
I understand that some people are disappointed, especially with the non-availability of PDK but also with the "low" power figure on the paper.
But, this is a fact: the 997 Turbo is an incredibly fast car and because you like to compare it to the 996 Turbo S, I can tell you that I've talked about this "comparison" to certain people and all of them were actually laughing in my face, claiming that the 997 Turbo and the 996 Turbo S are as much of a difference in performance like day and night. And in favor of the 997 Turbo. I trust these people because up to now, their claims have been accurate.
Of course they can be wrong, I can be wrong and maybe the 997 Turbo is crap. But shouldn't we wait until we see a real life review, at least ONE?
I have more of a feeling that you're trying to "justify" to yourself NOT to go for the new 997 Turbo and to be happy with your current 996 Turbo S. No problem with me. But if you want to know facts, you should wait for a few reviews to make sure you're not making a mistake in your judgement.
Regarding the weight of the new Turbo:
I hold here the OFFICIAL Porsche 911 (996) Turbo Technik Kompendium in my hands and the weight statements are:
Leergewicht DIN: 1540 kg (Tiptronic: 1585 kg) - 997 TT:1585 kg (1620 kg).
Leergewicht DIN + Fahrer 75 kg: 1615 kg (Tiptronic: 1660 kg) - 997 TT: 1660 kg (Tiptronic: 1695 kg).
Weight to power ratio:
3,66 kg/HP (Tiptronic: 3,76 kg/HP).
So yes, you're right: the new 997 Turbo is actually 35-45 kg heavier than the old 996 Turbo and I'm a little bit surprised to see how Porsche seems to mix up the numbers, by purpose or not. I suppose they took the latest factory weight claims for the 996 Turbo and compared them to the new 997 Turbo. But I agree with you that this is a little bit of a marketing "trick". Because although the 996 Turbo did gain in weight over the years of production, it also gained in performance surprisingly.
But the 996 Turbo vs. 997 Turbo power/weight ratio is a different story. 3.3 kg/HP is better than 3.66 kg (by ~ 10%).
And the 996 Turbo S is a few kg heavier than the 996 Turbo due to the increased weight (this is valid for the 996 Turbo too) during the model production cycle.
Sounds confusing? Well, a little bit.
This is why I recommend: wait and see. If you don't like it, you don't have to buy it. And if you like it, well...too late for an early car.
I really hope that you are right about the performance of the 997TT. But why are the performance figures on paper so disappointing then? But I agree, let's wait and see. The unfortunate thing is that I do not have much time to wait.
I am actually in the situation that I need to replace my 996 sooner or later. It already has 60k km on the clock... That partly explains my disappointment with the new 997TT - as I will not order the car as introduced in Geneva.
If they don't offer a reasonable package within the next 12 months I might try to get a 599GTB. Also, the new Audi R8 with the larger engine might be interesting. The Murcielago is too extreme (in terms of looks - my wife hates it...)