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Re: AMS Story
The Google translated text from AMS:
Porsche 911 turbo: Pressure art
The Top model of the 911-Baureihe von Porsche was always crowned by a turbocharger. The sixth generation of the top model celebrates on that Geneva cars salon world premiere and starting from 24 June with the German dealers will stand. The 911 turbo of the type now 480 HP carry out 997 with 6.000/min. and thus 60 HP more than its predecessor. The maximum torque of the 3,6-Liter-Boxers climbed around 60 Nm to 620 Nm and is owing to loaders with variable shovel geometry within the range between 1.950 and 5.000/min. for the order.
These improvements can be read off also from the road performances: For the standard print of zero on 100 km/h the new turbo with six-gearbox needs 3.9 seconds. In 12.8 seconds the Coupé reaches the mark of 200 km/h. The average consumption is to be with 12,8 litres per 100 kilometer.
It still more quickly precedes with the optional automatic transmission Tiptronic S. Here only 3.7 seconds for the Sprint of zero on one hundred and speed 200 offense after 12.2 seconds are already reached. Here the average consumption is with 13,6 litres. The maximum speed for both variants is against it in-pregnant about 310 km/h.
Comeback of the Dampfrads still laest themselves the driving dynamics of the turbo with the special equipment "sport Chrono package turbo" continue to increase: By push of a button the load pressure in the middle speed range can be raised here around 0,2 bar and be swollen the torque to 680 Nm for up to ten seconds.
So that this does not smoke at the rear wheels, the turbo has a again developed all-wheel drive with electronically steered multiple disk clutch in series. For adequate negative acceleration Monobloc Festsattelbremsen with six pistons at the front axle and four pistons at the rear axle with 350 millimeters of large disks provide. Optionally can be ordered also one ceramic(s) brake assembly with 380 and 350 millimeters of large disks.
Optically the turbo sets a again modelled front apron off, air intakes before the rear wheels by 22 a millimeter from its series brothers by Bi-xenon-headlights, into the width back grown and a new tail spoiler.
The price for the 911 turbo amounts to 133,603 euro.
Porsche 911 turbo: Pressure art
The Top model of the 911-Baureihe von Porsche was always crowned by a turbocharger. The sixth generation of the top model celebrates on that Geneva cars salon world premiere and starting from 24 June with the German dealers will stand. The 911 turbo of the type now 480 HP carry out 997 with 6.000/min. and thus 60 HP more than its predecessor. The maximum torque of the 3,6-Liter-Boxers climbed around 60 Nm to 620 Nm and is owing to loaders with variable shovel geometry within the range between 1.950 and 5.000/min. for the order.
These improvements can be read off also from the road performances: For the standard print of zero on 100 km/h the new turbo with six-gearbox needs 3.9 seconds. In 12.8 seconds the Coupé reaches the mark of 200 km/h. The average consumption is to be with 12,8 litres per 100 kilometer.
It still more quickly precedes with the optional automatic transmission Tiptronic S. Here only 3.7 seconds for the Sprint of zero on one hundred and speed 200 offense after 12.2 seconds are already reached. Here the average consumption is with 13,6 litres. The maximum speed for both variants is against it in-pregnant about 310 km/h.
Comeback of the Dampfrads still laest themselves the driving dynamics of the turbo with the special equipment "sport Chrono package turbo" continue to increase: By push of a button the load pressure in the middle speed range can be raised here around 0,2 bar and be swollen the torque to 680 Nm for up to ten seconds.
So that this does not smoke at the rear wheels, the turbo has a again developed all-wheel drive with electronically steered multiple disk clutch in series. For adequate negative acceleration Monobloc Festsattelbremsen with six pistons at the front axle and four pistons at the rear axle with 350 millimeters of large disks provide. Optionally can be ordered also one ceramic(s) brake assembly with 380 and 350 millimeters of large disks.
Optically the turbo sets a again modelled front apron off, air intakes before the rear wheels by 22 a millimeter from its series brothers by Bi-xenon-headlights, into the width back grown and a new tail spoiler.
The price for the 911 turbo amounts to 133,603 euro.
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
temm said:
Thanks neunelf
0-200 km/h manual: 12.8 seconds
0-200 km/h Tiptronic: 12.2 seconds
WOW
BMW M6 Coupé E63 SMG - 2005 (Serie)
Test in ams Jahrbuch 2006
Gewicht 1760 kg
0 - 80 km/h 3,3 s
0 - 100 km/h 4,2 s
0 - 120 km/h - s
0 - 130 km/h - s
0 - 140 km/h - s
0 - 160 km/h - s
0 - 180 km/h 10,7 s
0 - 200 km/h 13,0 s
Supertest in sport auto 12/2005
Gewicht 1761 kg
0 - 80 km/h 3,3 s
0 - 100 km/h 4,2 s
0 - 120 km/h 5,6 s
0 - 130 km/h - s
0 - 140 km/h 7,0 s
0 - 160 km/h 8,7 s
0 - 180 km/h 10,9 s
0 - 200 km/h 12,8 s
Test in sport auto 07/2005
Gewicht 1761 kg
0 - 80 km/h 3,3 s
0 - 100 km/h 4,2 s
0 - 120 km/h 5,6 s
0 - 130 km/h - s
0 - 140 km/h 7,0 s
0 - 160 km/h 8,7 s
0 - 180 km/h 10,9 s
0 - 200 km/h 12,8 s
Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
Crash said:Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Why be worried?
The AMS time-to-speed numbers are undoubtedly from Porsche AG. The magazine numbers to which you are comparing them came from actual testing. Porsche is quite conservative in making perfomance claims.
Wait until a real test before getting worried
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
Crash said:Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Why be worried?
The AMS time-to-speed numbers are undoubtedly from Porsche AG. The magazine numbers to which you are comparing them came from actual testing. Porsche is quite conservative in making perfomance claims.
Wait until a real test before getting worried
That's why I said "a bit". I actually hoped the 997TT would be a fair bit faster than the M6 (my friend just bought one
).
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
Crash said:Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Why be worried?
The AMS time-to-speed numbers are undoubtedly from Porsche AG. The magazine numbers to which you are comparing them came from actual testing. Porsche is quite conservative in making perfomance claims.
Wait until a real test before getting worried
That's why I said "a bit". I actually hoped the 997TT would be a fair bit faster than the M6 (my friend just bought one
I 100% agree with you (not the first time, I guess
):The published performance figures are disappointing. I hope that the powerkit version will be as quick as I expect it to be.
The 997TT is slower and heavier than expected. And PDK is also not available
Porsche is heading towards a wrong direction.
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
MKSGR said:Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
Crash said:Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Why be worried?
The AMS time-to-speed numbers are undoubtedly from Porsche AG. The magazine numbers to which you are comparing them came from actual testing. Porsche is quite conservative in making perfomance claims.
Wait until a real test before getting worried
That's why I said "a bit". I actually hoped the 997TT would be a fair bit faster than the M6 (my friend just bought one
I 100% agree with you (not the first time, I guess
The published performance figures are disappointing. I hope that the powerkit version will be as quick as I expect it to be.
The 997TT is slower and heavier than expected. And PDK is also not available
Porsche is heading towards a wrong direction.
Yep, we agree once again
I do hope that the numbers Porsche put out are extremely conservative (12 seconds flat should be acceptable) and that the powerkit is about 2 seconds faster than the standard factory numbers for the TT (same as with the 996TT). That would put it at the same performance level at the 996 Ruf Rturbo.
I'm definitely waiting for the powerkit.
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
Crash said:Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Why be worried?
The AMS time-to-speed numbers are undoubtedly from Porsche AG. The magazine numbers to which you are comparing them came from actual testing. Porsche is quite conservative in making perfomance claims.
Wait until a real test before getting worried
Yes, but the question is: Are they only being conservative with the manual? Because the tip is rediculously fast.
If the answer is yes, then, they must be trying to sucker the buyers in getting the optional$$$ tip.
In any case, the tip will have to perform as advertised or there is going to be hell to pay.
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
svtrader1 said:Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
Crash said:Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Why be worried?
The AMS time-to-speed numbers are undoubtedly from Porsche AG. The magazine numbers to which you are comparing them came from actual testing. Porsche is quite conservative in making perfomance claims.
Wait until a real test before getting worried
Yes, but the question is: Are they only being conservative with the manual? Because the tip is rediculously fast.
If the answer is yes, then, they must be trying to sucker the buyers in getting the optional$$$ tip.
In any case, the tip will have to perform as advertised or there is going to be hell to pay.
You know, I actually agree with you. I have no doubt that the Tip performs as well as Porsche claims, but I don't believe that the manual is slower than 12 seconds to 200 km/h.
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
Crash said:Quote:
svtrader1 said:Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
Crash said:Okay, now I'm a bit worried
Why be worried?
The AMS time-to-speed numbers are undoubtedly from Porsche AG. The magazine numbers to which you are comparing them came from actual testing. Porsche is quite conservative in making perfomance claims.
Wait until a real test before getting worried
Yes, but the question is: Are they only being conservative with the manual? Because the tip is rediculously fast.
If the answer is yes, then, they must be trying to sucker the buyers in getting the optional$$$ tip.
In any case, the tip will have to perform as advertised or there is going to be hell to pay.
You know, I actually agree with you. I have no doubt that the Tip performs as well as Porsche claims, but I don't believe that the manual is slower than 12 seconds to 200 km/h.
Well, I do have my doubts about tip. I wouldn't be surprised if they issued a statement regarding tip...as in - it was a typo.
As for the manual, Porsche have been conservative in the past, but, usually no more than a few tenths of a sec. If you think their off by a full second, I'm afraid you're sadly mistaken. We'll see...
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
CF said:
Well said Mike.
I am extremely happy with this outcome since the new Tiptronic seems to be a major improvement over the old one.
I'm not even thinking about the PDK anymore.
Well done Porsche
If the "new" Tip improves performance over the "old" by minimizing power loss and gear shift latency (in addition to the other electronic controls alluded to previously), can anyone describe their experience with/understanding of the "old" Tip's downshfiting capability and manual control abilities via the steering wheel-mounted toggle switches? After all, this seems to be a key point for those on the fence about Tip versus manual-concern that the former may not handle downshifting or gear-selection during certain maneuvers-such as in hard cornering compared to the latter.
I also wonder how the powerkit might interface with the two trannies and whether Tip versus manual (versus PDK if it ever makes it onto the 997TT) would be benefitted differentially. Of course, this is likely a question with no ready answer....
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
Turbo Al said:Quote:
CF said:
Well said Mike.
I am extremely happy with this outcome since the new Tiptronic seems to be a major improvement over the old one.
I'm not even thinking about the PDK anymore.
Well done Porsche
If the "new" Tip improves performance over the "old" by minimizing power loss and gear shift latency (in addition to the other electronic controls alluded to previously), can anyone describe their experience with/understanding of the "old" Tip's downshfiting capability and manual control abilities via the steering wheel-mounted toggle switches? After all, this seems to be a key point for those on the fence about Tip versus manual-concern that the former may not handle downshifting or gear-selection during certain maneuvers-such as in hard cornering compared to the latter.
I also wonder how the powerkit might interface with the two trannies and whether Tip versus manual (versus PDK if it ever makes it onto the 997TT) would be benefitted differentially. Of course, this is likely a question with no ready answer....
Al, I never use my Tip buttons for shifting, even in twisties...I find computer does an excellent job (am very familiar w/SL55/65 which also have great auto trannies; and I know 430's F1 tranny well)...also, Tip buttons are fairly hard to use from an ergonomic standpoint vs paddleshifters; so, though I enjoy flipping up and down gears for aural fun on a 430 F1, I just let Tip do its thing and focus on steering/brakes/accel....
I vaguely recall someone claiming Heywood was faster around a track in 996TT Tip vs man; have also seen posting of hp/tq diag for 996TTS on rennteam that implies Tip works better vs 996TTS motor than manual
.....have never seen N-ring times for 996TTS Tip vs manual, but I suspect in 99% of real-world conds and controlled-world tracks, 99% of rennteamers would be faster in 996TTS/997TT Tips than manuals (despite the amazing number of pro-caliber racecar drivers who seem to be on rennteam and every other chatboard)..... Not sure why the microscopic timing diffces matter, except for bragging rights at the bar w/a bunch of drunk, middle-aged guys talking smack re: how they could earn a living racing cars (and get a sponsor to provide them their Viagra for free) if their day jobs don't work out
.....just get the car/tranny which offers driving "feel" you most enjoy...to each his own.....
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
svtrader1 said:
Well, I do have my doubts about tip. I wouldn't be surprised if they issued a statement regarding tip...as in - it was a typo.
What a cynic you are
You act as if Porsche is incapable of an engineering breakthrough.
Is your nick-name Eeyore?
I never question German engineering.
But, Porsche Marketing is another story.
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
CF said:
Well said Mike.
I am extremely happy with this outcome since the new Tiptronic seems to be a major improvement over the old one.
I'm not even thinking about the PDK anymore.
Well done Porsche
An auto tranny is inferrior technology compared to DSG. Can you imagin a quick downshift with an auto tranny? I am not prepared to buy old technology for maximum prices. Porsche is on a very dangerous route.
Re: AMS Story
The acceleration times were achieved by using sticky tires -as far as I know, customers cannot order such tires from the factory (might have changed though).
No way, that big thing can achieve such times with 500hp and RWD only. Standard tires would lose about 0.4 sec to 100 km/h
OAB
No way, that big thing can achieve such times with 500hp and RWD only. Standard tires would lose about 0.4 sec to 100 km/h
OAB
Re: AMS Story
I agree that it is quite an achievement to produce such performance figures from a torque converter auto.
Nevertheless I am hoping to get PDK in my future car. For a sporty car, I believe it is the more rewarding drive. I use it everyday in my "city car" (A3 3.2) and although the car is not really sporty, I prefer it to a standard auto.
I also heard somewhere that the PDK mules produce an absolutely unbelievable sound when downshifting.
Still best compromise between auto box and manual in my opinion.
OAB
Nevertheless I am hoping to get PDK in my future car. For a sporty car, I believe it is the more rewarding drive. I use it everyday in my "city car" (A3 3.2) and although the car is not really sporty, I prefer it to a standard auto.
I also heard somewhere that the PDK mules produce an absolutely unbelievable sound when downshifting.
Still best compromise between auto box and manual in my opinion.
OAB
Feb 14, 2006 1:26:12 PM
-
Carlos from Spain
- Rennteam Moderator
-
- Loc: Spain. , Spain
- Posts: 21152, Gallery
- Registered on: Feb 9, 2003
- Reply to: OAB
Re: AMS Story
I still can't belive a heavy hydrolic torque converter auto with 5 gears is faster than a 6-speed manual version. I can't think of that being the case even in any sportcar ever. The torque converter adds significant weight, it robs torque in the gear shifts and has one less gear so the ratios are longer and more widely spaced...
Is there a posibility that Porsche is naming the PDK as Tiptronic as well? or have they specifically said that the Tip on the Turbo is still a torque converter?
If its a torque converter then Porsche has added a additional feature to the Tip equipped cars to make it faster than the manual version and they are holding back that feature on the manual versions in order to push the Tip sales until the PDK is out. Thats the only explanation I can think off.
Is there a posibility that Porsche is naming the PDK as Tiptronic as well? or have they specifically said that the Tip on the Turbo is still a torque converter?
If its a torque converter then Porsche has added a additional feature to the Tip equipped cars to make it faster than the manual version and they are holding back that feature on the manual versions in order to push the Tip sales until the PDK is out. Thats the only explanation I can think off.
Re: AMS Story
Quote:
OAB said:
The acceleration times were achieved by using sticky tires -as far as I know, customers cannot order such tires from the factory (might have changed though).No way, that big thing can achieve such times with 500hp and RWD only. Standard tires would lose about 0.4 sec to 100 km/h
Where did you get that info on the sticky tires?
I have never heard of that, if anything i have always heard Porsche is very conservative with there numbers 
OAB
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