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    Feb 2, 2006 6:27:33 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    SoCalHoosier
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    997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Based on the hi-res pic that Ron posted (thank you Ron)... I did a quick P-shop of what the car should've looked like without the cheap Ford Mustang inserts. To some of you it may not make much of a difference but to me it's small details like this that I think make a top end sports car like the TT shine.
    (vent has been lengthened and the insert lines removed)

    I seriously wonder how much more this would've cost to do. I'm sure the design department already thought of it... I'm just trying to figure out why they killed it.

    Feb 2, 2006 7:12:21 PM

    turbolite
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    it's all about margin mate....

    but your change looks good!

    Feb 2, 2006 7:28:02 PM

    Revvv
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    Reply to: turbolite

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    The inserts allow them to build a C4 and C4-S, and a Turbo variant. It's all about profitability. But you are 110%
    correct; the car looks like a much higher level of quality
    with-out the , production friendly , stamped inserts.
    Ahh; the price of independence....
    Revvv

    Feb 2, 2006 8:43:08 PM

    zack
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    Reply to: Revvv

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Good work with the p-shop socalhoosier , i had to do a double take just to catch the difference.
    But now i notice them, it does bug me. hope they're not on th production.

    Feb 2, 2006 10:16:14 PM

    fritz
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    vent has been lengthened and the insert lines



    I'd be interested to know how you would propose to press that side panel and incorporate the duct without using a separate insert?

    Feb 2, 2006 10:49:47 PM

    svtrader1
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    Reply to: fritz

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    vent has been lengthened and the insert lines



    I'd be interested to know how you would propose to press that side panel and incorporate the duct without using a separate insert?



    The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.

    Rossi's car:

    Feb 2, 2006 11:44:23 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: svtrader1

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    vent has been lengthened and the insert lines



    I'd be interested to know how you would propose to press that side panel and incorporate the duct without using a separate insert?



    The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.

    Rossi's car:



    Exactly! This vent thing bothers me so much that I'd be willing to pay Porsche an additional 5K-10K over their MSRP to have it corrected! I know all of you are saying "go aftermarket" but I don't like adding pieces to a Porsche (or Ferrari). The Ruf RT12 is a good example of how Porsche should've made the vents without the inserts.

    Feb 3, 2006 12:05:28 AM

    FSU-997TT
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Nice work, can you show us what the turbo looks like in white?

    Feb 3, 2006 12:18:20 AM

    brunner
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    Reply to: svtrader1

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari

    Feb 3, 2006 12:43:51 AM

    Turbo Al Offline
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    Reply to: brunner

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari



    I thought the same thing, except they didn't do it on the 996TT (unless they learned something new), and it's identical to the Techart 996TT side intake piece-and I doubt those dudes put it in for aerodynamic purposes.

    Perhaps with the VTG's, the intercooler setup is different, benefiting from this-Fritz, any comments?

    Feb 3, 2006 1:04:51 AM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: FSU-997TT

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    FSU-997S said:
    Nice work, can you show us what the turbo looks like in white?



    ...here you go... (mind you these are real quickies!)

    Feb 3, 2006 2:25:15 AM

    0two9
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    Reply to: Turbo Al

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    *crying*... I love it without the horrid, cheap inserts. However--- they need to have them to keep the costs down. They can't pull a ferrari and screw the world .... if a side of a ferrari breaks... that's going to run into the 10's of thousands... if you dent the side of the porsche.. .it may cost you up to 6 k.
    But God, that thing does look more amazing with no cheap insert and just the air vents. Good job!

    Feb 3, 2006 3:27:03 AM

    FSU-997TT
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    Reply to: 0two9

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Thanks Mr. Hoosier....looks great!!!!

    Feb 3, 2006 5:18:40 AM

    Super DariusM
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    FSU-997S said:
    Nice work, can you show us what the turbo looks like in white?



    ...here you go... (mind you these are real quickies!)



    Uauuu,can you paint me one in seal gray?

    thanks!!

    Feb 3, 2006 9:18:20 AM

    RCA
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    The problem is that the "modified" side vents don't go with the rest of the car, they look too "clean" now. I'm not a designer but I think people understand what I want to say.

    Feb 3, 2006 10:16:13 AM

    Joost
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    Reply to: RCA

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Anybody already ordered the 997 tt in atlas grey? That must be a blast to see. And RC, I understand what you mean. The trubo has a pretty "busy" design, with lots of thingies and protrusions on it. Then it does not make sense (designwise) to make the side intake very smooth, it would not match the rest of the car's design.
    -Joost-

    Feb 3, 2006 12:29:28 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: RCA

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    RC said:
    The problem is that the "modified" side vents don't go with the rest of the car, they look too "clean" now. I'm not a designer but I think people understand what I want to say.



    RC... understand where you're coming from but I am a designer and one of the worst things you can do is add clutter to clutter. In other words... some areas may be cluttered but that doesn't mean you can't have relative clean areas. The reality is... the area is technically not that clean due to the addition of the vent holes, which also exist along the lower rear flanks. The car's profile without the insert lines makes it flow much better.

    Haven't you noticed that all the dark colors look better? It's because it hides much of those extraneous lines that are totally unnecessary.

    Feb 3, 2006 12:42:06 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: Super DariusM

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    Super Darius said:
    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    FSU-997S said:
    Nice work, can you show us what the turbo looks like in white?



    ...here you go... (mind you these are real quickies!)



    Uauuu,can you paint me one in seal gray?

    thanks!!



    This is close to what seal grey should look like for this particular shot...

    Feb 3, 2006 12:51:49 PM

    RCA
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    Reply to: Joost

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    Joost said:
    Anybody already ordered the 997 tt in atlas grey? That must be a blast to see. And RC, I understand what you mean. The trubo has a pretty "busy" design, with lots of thingies and protrusions on it. Then it does not make sense (designwise) to make the side intake very smooth, it would not match the rest of the car's design.
    -Joost-



    You READ my mind. Exactly what I meant.

    Feb 3, 2006 12:59:04 PM

    RCA
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    RC
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    Haven't you noticed that all the dark colors look better? It's because it hides much of those extraneous lines that are totally unnecessary.



    Actually: NO. The only reason I'm going for black is my neighborhood and my customers (if I decide to drive to work in this car). Black makes the 997 Turbo look more "civilized", even a bit boring since all that design "goodies" can't be really seen clearly. But I have no choice.

    Feb 3, 2006 1:10:07 PM

    Super DariusM
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Thanks a lot..

    now we must work on the rims..all black are too heavy..

    but..i have an idea of the looks..

    thanks again
    Ciao

    Feb 3, 2006 2:28:34 PM

    Nick_Athens Offline
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    Reply to: RCA

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    Haven't you noticed that all the dark colors look better? It's because it hides much of those extraneous lines that are totally unnecessary.



    Actually: NO. The only reason I'm going for black is my neighborhood and my customers (if I decide to drive to work in this car). Black makes the 997 Turbo look more "civilized", even a bit boring since all that design "goodies" can't be really seen clearly. But I have no choice.



    So if you would be able to choose an other color without taking in consideration your job and your neighborhood, which color would that be?

    Feb 3, 2006 2:29:48 PM

    Joost
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    Reply to: Super DariusM

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Oh man, that mentality you talk about RC! I hate that. In holland it is just the same. If for instance a dentist drives a porsche, people say he earns too much money, that he is too expensive as a dentist... I hate that... but to tell the truth, I know I sometimes think the same... but only if he drives a ferrari
    -Joost-

    Feb 3, 2006 2:30:34 PM

    Steve R
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    Reply to: Super DariusM

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    How about one in green with no side vent thing

    Feb 3, 2006 2:44:28 PM

    arakis
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    Reply to: brunner

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari



    And where exacly on the 430 form doesent folow function

    Feb 3, 2006 3:35:35 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: arakis

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    arakis said:
    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari



    And where exacly on the 430 form doesent folow function



    Ignore his comments... he just comes around to spout some brainless jargon to see if he can get a rise out of people.

    Feb 3, 2006 3:39:05 PM

    Turbo Al Offline
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    arakis said:
    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari



    And where exacly on the 430 form doesent folow function



    Ignore his comments... he just comes around to spout some brainless jargon to see if he can get a rise out of people.



    How about the glass covering over the engine bay, too bling and lower class for me.

    Feb 3, 2006 3:50:28 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: Turbo Al

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    Turbo Al said:
    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    arakis said:
    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari



    And where exacly on the 430 form doesent folow function



    Ignore his comments... he just comes around to spout some brainless jargon to see if he can get a rise out of people.



    How about the glass covering over the engine bay, too bling and lower class for me.



    The design of the clear cover may not be to your liking however it would still need to be covered and vented whether translucent or not. In other words this is still a very functional piece. (this is more a matter of personal taste)

    Something that would be completely extraneous would be like the clock/wart of the sport chrono package which really does not exhance or function for overall car performance but instead is considered a "bling" item.

    Feb 3, 2006 4:20:53 PM

    brunner
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    arakis said:
    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari



    And where exacly on the 430 form doesent folow function



    Ignore his comments... he just comes around to spout some brainless jargon to see if he can get a rise out of people.


    Funny to get that from you, of all people...

    Anyway, I was talking about a different engineering philosophy at Ferrari. The beauty of shape was always but before engineering demands. The bodies were beautiful at the expense of aerodynamic efficiency...
    Quick quiz: Who said "Aerodynamics is for people who don't know how to build engines", and what does he have to do with Ferrari?

    Feb 3, 2006 4:35:38 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: brunner

    Re: 997 Turbo without the cheap side vents...

    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    SoCalHoosier said:
    Quote:
    arakis said:
    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:The same way Maranello did it with the F430. But, the middle piece would have to go. Which would be even better IMO.


    I'm venturing to guess that that the middle piece smooths the airflow to the intercooler and it's not just a useless design weirdness. Usually form follows function at Porsche, as opposed to Ferrari



    And where exacly on the 430 form doesent folow function



    Ignore his comments... he just comes around to spout some brainless jargon to see if he can get a rise out of people.


    Funny to get that from you, of all people...

    Anyway, I was talking about a different engineering philosophy at Ferrari. The beauty of shape was always but before engineering demands. The bodies were beautiful at the expense of aerodynamic efficiency...
    Quick quiz: Who said "Aerodynamics is for people who don't know how to build engines", and what does he have to do with Ferrari?



    Enzo... and he's dead. Your point?
    I like the fact that their vent design isn't compromised by profitability. So what? If I'm paying over 130K for a car, I want it to look like it costs at least 50K to build. Doesn't mean I love Ferrari nor does it mean I hate Porsche... I just know that in a market for exclusive sports cars, you better build them to look and feel like it.

    Now you never answered my question from days back...
    What (non-Porsche) cars equalled or surpassed the 993TT in performance during its timeline?
     
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