Crown

Board: AMG Mercedes Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread

    Dec 21, 2003 12:48:27 PM

    Bilal
    Expert
    Bilal
    Loc: Manchester, UK
    Posts: 1533, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 20, 2003
    Reply to: CynCarvin32

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    If the C55 gets a V8 that puts out more than 367HP, when will the CLK get an upgrade? 4 years time when its facelift is due?

    The C32 is already a second quicker than the CLK55 from a standing km, so a 430HP C55 is gonna be sold for about the same price as a the C32 if not slightly more, while others have to make do with a measly 367hp CLK for the same price as the E55? (In UK, a CLK55 costs 57K, and the E55 62K)

    Rarely has Mercedes released a model that is cheaper and faster than its top of the line models, with the exception of thr E55, that thing is QUICK.

    Dec 21, 2003 9:57:21 PM

    CynCarvin32
    Newbie
    CynCarvin32
    Loc:
    Posts: 15, Gallery
    Registered on: Aug 12, 2003
    Reply to: Bilal

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    I think you need to understand this a little bit more Bilal. Maybe I did not explain my self properly (i have a tendency to do this )

    The 3-valve motor will be replaced very soon. The first versions will be in the SLK cars. When the SLK55 debuts at the Geneva (if i remember correctly) auto show it will have the quad cam motor. If the 3.5L motor has 272 hp, the 5.5L motor should make around 400bhp. 430hp is a high estimate but it still is something worth thinking about. I do not see the 5.5L quad cam being that powerful but it should will yield more power than the current 3-valve version.

    At this point, the old 5.5L motor (non blower) will most likely end production (or be scaled back greatly) for it will have no use other than for the G55. The Kompressor cars are to be short lived as well for the non-blower E55 is already being tested on high-speed tracks in Germany. But this is not what I am trying to discuss.

    The CLK55 will surely get a "freshening" sooner than 4 years from now. Did the W203 go 4+ years with no freshening? No, it well be freshened for mid year 2004. So in a year or so the CLK will get a freshening and I would expect it to get a power increase as well. All MB models get a mid production cycle freshening that that is a great time to update the driveline. MB needs to get these new DI quad cam motors to market for various reasons but among the reasons: they run far cleaner than the current motors and they use noticeably less fuel.


    As for pricing, the CLK55 is a total joke. It is by no means worth the 57k (uk) 70k (usd). I am in the market for a new car and I looked at the CLK55 and a E55. The interior of the CLK55 is lower rent than the C32 and the E55 is by far the car of choice.
    But if AMG has the SLK55 with a quad cam motor I see little to no reason to put an older 3-valve motor into the newly freshened C55. Being that the 3 valve motors made about 20hp less than the new DI gas motors I say the 5.5L motor should make around 20 hp more than the current 5.5L motor. This puts the car at the doorstep of 400bhp.

    Dec 21, 2003 9:57:21 PM

    CynCarvin32
    Newbie
    CynCarvin32
    Loc:
    Posts: 15, Gallery
    Registered on: Aug 12, 2003
    Reply to: Bilal

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    I think you need to understand this a little bit more Bilal. Maybe I did not explain my self properly (i have a tendency to do this )

    The 3-valve motor will be replaced very soon. The first versions will be in the SLK cars. When the SLK55 debuts at the Geneva (if i remember correctly) auto show it will have the quad cam motor. If the 3.5L motor has 272 hp, the 5.5L motor should make around 400bhp. 430hp is a high estimate but it still is something worth thinking about. I do not see the 5.5L quad cam being that powerful but it should will yield more power than the current 3-valve version.

    At this point, the old 5.5L motor (non blower) will most likely end production (or be scaled back greatly) for it will have no use other than for the G55. The Kompressor cars are to be short lived as well for the non-blower E55 is already being tested on high-speed tracks in Germany. But this is not what I am trying to discuss.

    The CLK55 will surely get a "freshening" sooner than 4 years from now. Did the W203 go 4+ years with no freshening? No, it well be freshened for mid year 2004. So in a year or so the CLK will get a freshening and I would expect it to get a power increase as well. All MB models get a mid production cycle freshening that that is a great time to update the driveline. MB needs to get these new DI quad cam motors to market for various reasons but among the reasons: they run far cleaner than the current motors and they use noticeably less fuel.


    As for pricing, the CLK55 is a total joke. It is by no means worth the 57k (uk) 70k (usd). I am in the market for a new car and I looked at the CLK55 and a E55. The interior of the CLK55 is lower rent than the C32 and the E55 is by far the car of choice.
    But if AMG has the SLK55 with a quad cam motor I see little to no reason to put an older 3-valve motor into the newly freshened C55. Being that the 3 valve motors made about 20hp less than the new DI gas motors I say the 5.5L motor should make around 20 hp more than the current 5.5L motor. This puts the car at the doorstep of 400bhp.

    Dec 21, 2003 11:11:07 PM

    Bilal
    Expert
    Bilal
    Loc: Manchester, UK
    Posts: 1533, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 20, 2003
    Reply to: CynCarvin32

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    I agree completely.


    Just one question...what about all those people who up until now and will continue to do so, (since not everyone follows MB like us) who bought CLK55's, with 367Hp do?

    What about the resale value?



    PS, 400hp for an AMG NA 5.5L motor? If Mercedes can squeeze out 272hp from a 3.5, forget ratio calculations (which would put out 430Hp for teh 5.5, lets say an all new 5.5V8 was amde from teh ground up carrying all this latest technology, wouldn't 450-500hp be more appropriate, or is a that a little too optimistic...

    Dec 21, 2003 11:11:07 PM

    Bilal
    Expert
    Bilal
    Loc: Manchester, UK
    Posts: 1533, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 20, 2003
    Reply to: CynCarvin32

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    I agree completely.


    Just one question...what about all those people who up until now and will continue to do so, (since not everyone follows MB like us) who bought CLK55's, with 367Hp do?

    What about the resale value?



    PS, 400hp for an AMG NA 5.5L motor? If Mercedes can squeeze out 272hp from a 3.5, forget ratio calculations (which would put out 430Hp for teh 5.5, lets say an all new 5.5V8 was amde from teh ground up carrying all this latest technology, wouldn't 450-500hp be more appropriate, or is a that a little too optimistic...

    Dec 22, 2003 11:43:23 PM

    CynCarvin32
    Newbie
    CynCarvin32
    Loc:
    Posts: 15, Gallery
    Registered on: Aug 12, 2003
    Reply to: Bilal

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    Well, 450-500 hp is possible but that seems like a very agressive motor for the W203. On a per liter basis I am sure AMG could get 450 hp from that motor and maybe even more but this would make the other AMG vehicles look relativly slower being that the bottom of the line AMG would be nearly as fast as the larger more expensive vehicles. With 440 hp the C55 would beat an E55 being that it weighs 200-300 lbs less. But when you realize that the C32 and SLK32 had the fastest 0-60 times for any AMG car for 1 year before the V8K motor came to market one wonders if th C55/SLK55 might be equal to the E55k and SL55k in performance. In 2002, the C32 and SLK32 were faster than the E55, S55, AND CL55 so maybe the C55/SLK55 well be faster than we think! We can always hope right? It is not matter of IF amg can make the NA V8 that powerful but instead a matter of WILL they. Two months from now and we shall know!

    Dec 22, 2003 11:43:23 PM

    CynCarvin32
    Newbie
    CynCarvin32
    Loc:
    Posts: 15, Gallery
    Registered on: Aug 12, 2003
    Reply to: Bilal

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    Well, 450-500 hp is possible but that seems like a very agressive motor for the W203. On a per liter basis I am sure AMG could get 450 hp from that motor and maybe even more but this would make the other AMG vehicles look relativly slower being that the bottom of the line AMG would be nearly as fast as the larger more expensive vehicles. With 440 hp the C55 would beat an E55 being that it weighs 200-300 lbs less. But when you realize that the C32 and SLK32 had the fastest 0-60 times for any AMG car for 1 year before the V8K motor came to market one wonders if th C55/SLK55 might be equal to the E55k and SL55k in performance. In 2002, the C32 and SLK32 were faster than the E55, S55, AND CL55 so maybe the C55/SLK55 well be faster than we think! We can always hope right? It is not matter of IF amg can make the NA V8 that powerful but instead a matter of WILL they. Two months from now and we shall know!

    Dec 23, 2003 11:19:02 AM

    Bilal
    Expert
    Bilal
    Loc: Manchester, UK
    Posts: 1533, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 20, 2003
    Reply to: CynCarvin32

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    Yeah, with the SL65 being strangled by the SLR, I doubt if more than 430hp will find its way into a C-class. Of course, if they do do this, then that will mean, the V8K models of teh future will get 550-600+hp?

    Who's to know, I think i'll let AMG surprise me!

    Dec 23, 2003 11:19:02 AM

    Bilal
    Expert
    Bilal
    Loc: Manchester, UK
    Posts: 1533, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 20, 2003
    Reply to: CynCarvin32

    Re: C55 AMG Estate

    Yeah, with the SL65 being strangled by the SLR, I doubt if more than 430hp will find its way into a C-class. Of course, if they do do this, then that will mean, the V8K models of teh future will get 550-600+hp?

    Who's to know, I think i'll let AMG surprise me!
     
    Edit

    Forum

    1. All 

    Boards

     
    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II) 4/17/24 7:16 AM
    GnilM     		762325 1798
    Porsche Sticky Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos) 4/7/24 11:48 AM
    Boxster Coupe GTS     		435291 565
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Cayman GT4 RS (2021) 5/12/23 12:11 PM
    W8MM     		260482 288
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022 3/12/24 8:28 AM
    DJM48     		257530 323
    Porsche Sticky The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche 1/30/24 9:18 AM
    RCA     		80938 45
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift 3/15/24 1:23 PM
    CGX car nut     		5321 50
    Porsche The moment I've been waiting for... 2/1/24 7:01 PM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    		 872196 1364
    Porsche 992 GT3 7/23/23 7:01 PM
    Grant     		807581 3868
    Porsche Welcome to the new Taycan Forum! 2/10/24 4:43 PM
    nberry     		387138 1526
    Porsche GT4RS 4/17/24 8:53 PM
    GaussM     		385287 1452
    Others Tesla 2 the new thread 12/13/23 2:48 PM
    CGX car nut     		368267 2401
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 7/3/23 12:30 PM
    Porker     		366260 797
    Ferrari Ferrari 812 Superfast 4/21/23 8:09 AM
    the-missile     		289130 550
    Porsche Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour 4/11/24 12:32 PM
    Ferdie     		286136 668
    Porsche Collected my 997 GTS today 10/19/23 7:06 PM
    CGX car nut
     
     
     
     
     
    		 259107 812
    Lambo Huracán EVO STO 7/30/23 6:59 PM
    mcdelaug     		237266 346
    Lotus Lotus Emira 6/25/23 2:53 PM
    Enmanuel     		225321 101
    Others Corvette C8 10/16/23 3:24 PM
    Enmanuel     		219893 488
    Others Gordon Murray - T.50 11/22/23 10:27 AM
    mcdelaug     		166992 387
    Porsche Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS 6/11/23 5:13 PM
    CGX car nut     		138940 144
    BMW M 2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now 12/29/23 9:04 AM
    RCA     		115686 303
    Motor Sp. 2023 Formula One 12/19/23 5:38 AM
    WhoopsyM     		107470 685
    Others Valkyrie final design? 4/28/23 2:45 AM
    Rossi     		99322 219
    Porsche 2022 992 Safari Model 3/7/24 4:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		83625 239
    AMG Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758 2/23/24 10:03 PM
    blueflame     		74897 297
    Porsche 992 GT3 RS 3/3/24 7:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		53183 314
    Motor Sp. Porsche 963 3/16/24 9:27 PM
    WhoopsyM     		24703 237
    Ferrari Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6) 1/21/24 4:29 PM
    GT-Boy     		20957 103
    BMW M 2022 BMW M5 CS 4/8/24 1:43 PM
    Ferdie     		19224 140
    AMG G63 sold out 9/15/23 7:38 PM
    Nico997     		16469 120
    129 items found, displaying 1 to 30.