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    Oct 27, 2005 11:43:58 AM

    Flying_Dutchman
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    Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Next saturday I'll be driving my TT at the Spa Francorchamps race-track. It's a multi-brand track-day oragnized by Marc Duez. I already did a few such events previously with my 996 Carrera. I'm really anxious to experience my new Turbo on the track. I'll be driving it in normal street-configuration, with no particular mods. Tires are Pirelli P Zeros which I think I'll deflate by +/- 0.3 bar. Brake pads and fluid are stock.

    I stress that the purpose is not to go and get the last 1/100th of a second. It's purely a "just for fun" track-day. The 420 horses will be liberated though .

    Does anyone have previously lived experiences with track-driving the 996 Turbo? Any particular issues to be taken into account? Thanks in advance .

    Oct 27, 2005 7:46:37 PM

    turbolite
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    Dr_Biturbo said:
    Next saturday I'll be driving my TT at the Spa Francorchamps race-track. It's a multi-brand track-day oragnized by Marc Duez. I already did a few such events previously with my 996 Carrera. I'm really anxious to experience my new Turbo on the track. I'll be driving it in normal street-configuration, with no particular mods. Tires are Pirelli P Zeros which I think I'll deflate by +/- 0.3 bar. Brake pads and fluid are stock.

    I stress that the purpose is not to go and get the last 1/100th of a second. It's purely a "just for fun" track-day. The 420 horses will be liberated though .

    Does anyone have previously lived experiences with track-driving the 996 Turbo? Any particular issues to be taken into account? Thanks in advance .



    Two pieces of advice for you
    1. tire pressure should be 1.9 in front and 1.8 on rear. this is the advice of the pirelli tire experts at monza and it worked with my car (a 996tt like yours). dont forget to reinflate them after the trackday.
    2. absolutely be careful with the gearshifts, particularly the downshifts. do heel and toe and if you cant shift down very gently and with no hectic. if you shift down from high speed eg 220 kmh to 70 (5th to 2nd) shift down every gear and release the clutch between each gearshift.
    I happened to be too hard on a downshift and ruined the rings of third gear. this is a renowned problem particularly of the turbo. in fact the gt3 has aluminum rings from third gear upwards, but the turbo has the weaker copper rings. cost me 5000 euro. so be very careful not to get hectic and do gentle gearshifts.
    the car is very easy to drive otherwise, great traction and acceleration and a bit of understeer, just dont be too early on the gas and you will be fine. have fun!!


    cheers

    Oct 27, 2005 8:08:20 PM

    Datenede
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    @Dr_Biturbo
    I was often in Spa. Last two times with the 996ttx50.
    It is a wounderful track, the "little Nürburgring" but it costs you 1 set of tires per day if you really do fast.

    If you want your tires survive: 5-7 fast laps only and then cool down before driving another 5-7 laps.
    Enjoy it.

    Oct 27, 2005 9:34:17 PM

    Flying_Dutchman
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    Reply to: turbolite

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    turbolite said:
    1. tire pressure should be 1.9 in front and 1.8 on rear. this is the advice of the pirelli tire experts at monza and it worked with my car (a 996tt like yours). dont forget to reinflate them after the trackday.




    1,9 and 1,8 bar seems VERY low (2,5 front and 3,0 rear is what Porsche recommends for road use). I take it that you mean tire pressure should be at that level in "cold" condition before starting to turn the laps, so that pressure returns close to factory prescribed levels after the heating???!

    Oct 28, 2005 7:39:37 AM

    turbolite
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    Dr_Biturbo said:
    Quote:
    turbolite said:
    1. tire pressure should be 1.9 in front and 1.8 on rear. this is the advice of the pirelli tire experts at monza and it worked with my car (a 996tt like yours). dont forget to reinflate them after the trackday.




    1,9 and 1,8 bar seems VERY low (2,5 front and 3,0 rear is what Porsche recommends for road use). I take it that you mean tire pressure should be at that level in "cold" condition before starting to turn the laps, so that pressure returns close to factory prescribed levels after the heating???!



    Yes, this refers to cold tires, but I dont think ít would get back up to road level from there. neither it needs to.
    and careful with gearshifts! ot it's gonna be

    Oct 29, 2005 3:51:01 PM

    03-turbo911
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    Reply to: turbolite

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    It's importent to do a check on the car before you take it on the track. Things like oil and brakes should be inspected. Tires should not be run with Porsche's recommended road use, pressures should be reduced because they will heat up quite fast.

    Take it easy the first time out and do an exploratory lap to warm your car first. While the brakes are very strong, don't over work them and take it easy. They will overheat if you're still running the stock brake fluid and pads.

    The turbo is a pussy cat on the track. very easy and relaxing to drive. The PSM would save you from making big mistakes but the main thing is SMOOTHNESS. Establish a rythem, pace yourself, don't attempt any heroics the track day will be one to remember. Also remember to do a warm down lap before you park it.

    Now go out and enjoy yourself.

    Oct 29, 2005 8:24:06 PM

    Thomas
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Hi,

    Watch your tire pressure. You should maintain it between 2,2 and 2,5 bar warm. If your 996tt got the stock suspension installed you can avoid understeer by trail braking and applying a little lower tire pressure at the front tires compared to the rear tires. Brake fluid should be not an issue. I'd recommend some cool down laps to relax the tires every 3 to 6 laps (depending on your driving style). You can extend the life of your rotors a lot by avoiding ABS. Brake pads should not be an issue as Spa is not really hard on the brakes.

    Cheers & have fun
    Thomas

    Oct 29, 2005 9:08:46 PM

    fritz
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    Reply to: turbolite

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    turbolite said:
    I happened to be too hard on a downshift and ruined the rings of third gear. this is a renowned problem particularly of the turbo. in fact the gt3 has aluminum rings from third gear upwards, but the turbo has the weaker copper rings. cost me 5000 euro. so be very careful not to get hectic and do gentle gearshifts.




    FWIW, if you check the brochures I think you'll find the GT3 synchronizer rings for gears 3 to 5 are in fact steel, not aluminium, whilst "softer" bronze rings are used in other models like the Turbo. Steel brings take more abuse, but the downside is that they do not synchronize as quickly when a transmission is cold.

    Oct 29, 2005 9:39:30 PM

    RCA
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    1. if you can afford it, buy a second set of wheels (rims/tires) for the track only. Keep the tire pressure at 2.5 bar front and 3.0 bar rear until you're actually on the track. Do a few warm-up rounds (on the Nordschleife one is sufficient due to the length) and lower your tire pressure to 2.5 front and 3.0 rear (it will be about 0.2-0.4 higher than before starting the warm-up round). You could also ask those who know the track which tire pressure worked best for them but usually it also depends on the tire you're using.

    2. if you have one set of wheels only, don't forget to raise your tire pressure back to normal after track racing. Let the tires cool off for a while before you do that, also don't forget a slow cool-off round after hard track racing in your Turbo, it does wonders to the engine and especially to the chargers)

    3. using racing brake fluid can help a lot too to improve braking feel/performance but if you do so, exchange it BEFORE and AFTER each race. It works better than the original fluid but attracts much faster moist from the air and degrades much faster through the heat.

    4. the untersteer can be taken care of, just let your dealer re-adjust your suspension alignment, using a coilover kit would improve things too. Highly recommend is the original Porsche suspension kit for the Turbo (X73 or X74, I don't have it in my head right now...I'm tires).

    5. the 996 TT engine is a pretty reliable engine...IF you don't force it when being cold. So the best advice is: let your engine warm up sufficiently, be careful that it may take at least 10 km or so. If the water temp. is OK, this doesn't mean that the oil temp. is OK, you may want to wait a few minutes longer. During a warm-up round, don't exceed 4000-4500 rpm and avoid high boost figures.

    Have fun!

    Oct 29, 2005 10:06:54 PM

    03-turbo911
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    Reply to: RCA

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    One trick that I've used to check if the oil tempreture is sufficent is, while the car is moving, toggle the check oil level gauge and if it says words to the effect of "need to stop car for oil level", I know that it's warmed up enough. I wait a few minutes just to make sure and enjoy the boost. Turbos shouldn't be run hard while they're not up to temperture.

    Oct 29, 2005 10:44:48 PM

    fritz
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    Reply to: 03-turbo911

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    03-turbo911 said:
    Turbos shouldn't be run hard while they're not up to temperture.



    FWIW, no car should be run hard until it is up to operating temperature.

    Oct 31, 2005 9:51:45 AM

    Flying_Dutchman
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    Reply to: fritz

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Well everything went just marvellous. The car just ran brilliant. No comparison whatsoever to my previous Carrera. The stability of the car is perfect and the power just what you need in Spa. I've had the tires at 2.0 bar front and 2.2 bar rear, which worked out to be perfect for that day (indian summer day with 21*C), the driver (me, not Schumi) and the type of trackday (6 runs of 20' each).

    Here are some pictures of the event:


    [image]http://www.marc-duez.be/report051029/images/GX6J6194.htm[/image]

    This M3 Cab will a few laps later crash badly, with no physical injuries however.

    This is one of the pace cars. Curious thing about this GT3 RS is that the owner, a disabled driver has had it prepared to function without throttle, brake or clutch pedals. Throttle and brakes are at his steering wheel and clutch is engaged automatically with some sort of switch at the gearlever.

    Oct 31, 2005 12:24:01 PM

    turbolite
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    Reply to: fritz

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    turbolite said:
    I happened to be too hard on a downshift and ruined the rings of third gear. this is a renowned problem particularly of the turbo. in fact the gt3 has aluminum rings from third gear upwards, but the turbo has the weaker copper rings. cost me 5000 euro. so be very careful not to get hectic and do gentle gearshifts.




    FWIW, if you check the brochures I think you'll find the GT3 synchronizer rings for gears 3 to 5 are in fact steel, not aluminium, whilst "softer" bronze rings are used in other models like the Turbo. Steel brings take more abuse, but the downside is that they do not synchronize as quickly when a transmission is cold.



    you are right. sorry, I mixed up steel and aluminum - what rhe heck...

    Oct 31, 2005 1:41:00 PM

    03-turbo911
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    Reply to: turbolite

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Glad you enjoyed the experience. It's quite addicting.

    Oct 31, 2005 2:52:53 PM

    Avantgarde
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    "Curious thing about this GT3 RS is that the owner, a disabled driver has had it prepared to function without throttle, brake or clutch pedals. Throttle and brakes are at his steering wheel and clutch is engaged automatically with some sort of switch at the gearlever."

    Wow, sounds like a Playstation console

    Oct 31, 2005 4:35:30 PM

    Flying_Dutchman
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Same track-day but different photographer: here're some further pictures.










    Oct 31, 2005 4:42:09 PM

    Flying_Dutchman
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    Reply to: Avantgarde

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    Avantgarde said:[
    Wow, sounds like a Playstation console



    On the track the driver displayed a very competent driving style

    Oct 31, 2005 8:37:51 PM

    Rufie
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    Reply to: Flying_Dutchman

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    There was an article about that GT3 RS and its driver in Flat6 Magazine last month.

    Oct 31, 2005 11:30:09 PM

    Grant
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    Reply to: Rufie

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Thanks for the report, Phil. Looks like LOTS of fun!

    Nov 2, 2005 8:27:20 PM

    TT Surgeon
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    Reply to: Grant

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Man, you really need an X73 setup. Night and day.

    Nov 3, 2005 1:14:15 PM

    Flying_Dutchman
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    Reply to: TT Surgeon

    Re: Track-driving a 996 TT - Advises / experiences?

    Quote:
    C4S Surgeon said:
    Man, you really need an X73 setup. Night and day.



    X73 is certainly perfect for the track but a nightmare for open roads (Belgian roads tend to be poorly maintained). Moreover, I only do 5 or 6 track-days a year, just for fun.

    It's clear that there's no compromise. Except PSS9 maybe.
     
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