Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift - Page1

Jul 22, 2003 12:34:20 PM

Futch: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: EU , United Kingdom; Posts: 4759, Gallery; Registered on: May 14, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Relax!!!

Ciao Gianmaria,
Como estas jefe?
Yes I do read a lot of press but I'm also fortunate enough to have driven many cars. To start with, my owns C4C and previously Boxster S, my family's, SL500, S600, 750IL, 540i, etc etc etc, friends and family's friends, 996GT2, SL55, Cayenne S, 456GT and of course the 360. I never owned a 360 but I did spend the whole day with it. What a wonderful car it is!!! The noise, the beauty, the badge, but performance were on par or maybe marginally better than my Carrera, sterring was way too light for my taste (only slightly heavier than the SL) and I somehow didnt' feel as connected to the car compared to a Porsche, but that could be because I didn't drive over a long period of time, mind you, I still did over 600 kms which can give you a good idea of a car.
So there you go, I read mags, but I know the baby, would I get one?
Humm, against the Carrera, yes I think so definitly, against a Turbo, that's a tricky one, but I think the Turbo is the Better car.
Gallardo, humm don't know the car.
Stradale, well, believe it or not but I am good friend with a young guy who works at the paris dealership, and also to Nicolas Todt who received the first one in France. I haven't driven it but these guys are Ferraristi and their verdict is that is it a sensasionnal car but You have to go and find the extra performance, up to 5000rpm, the car is identical to a 360. Now tha'ts what they say, I admit, but these guys are not my neighbours or friends of my girlfriend, one of them is in charge of clientele service for Ferrari France and the other one is the son of the manager of the scuderia. That's enough for me to believe them

Take it easy and get a 996 turbo

Fanch.

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Jul 22, 2003 1:36:45 PM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Futch

Re: Relax!!!

fanch,

i suppose you took some de-escalation lessons recently

BTW, i did not know that jean todt has a son. i always had the impression that he is the prototype of a single ultra-workaholic with just the scuderia and his montblanc collection in mind. i am deligthed somehow

he's cool!

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Jul 22, 2003 1:55:52 PM

admin: Rennteam Administrator; Loc:; Posts: 44, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 25, 2002; Reply to: Rossi

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:
@gianmaria:
I'm so glad that we have finally found the all-knowing, one-and-only grandmaster of high perfomance cars, who can give to us his unbelievable wisdom and let us take part at his unique knowledge

Just kidding man, don't take things too serious!

regards
sr

Please guys, calm down.

No need for getting personal.

To Gianmaria: please do not feel offended.
It seems that the discussion is as passionate as a Ferrari.

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Jul 22, 2003 2:09:54 PM

Futch: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: EU , United Kingdom; Posts: 4759, Gallery; Registered on: May 14, 2002; Reply to: zzboba

Re: Relax!!!

De-escalation??? You mean with regards with the mega Texan trucks? I liked them mostly because it was new to me!
But I'll always be a sport car lover.
When I see the Turbo cab pics, my heart starts pumping!!!
I remember when I was debating which car would be next, RC straight from the start suggested me that one!

I am not very good friend with Nicolas, but I know him. I'm better friend with Tim, the guy who works for Pozzi France.
BTW, just in case you're interested, the Todt Father and son currently drive a really ugly 575MM black mat (it looks like the car has not been painted, ugly...) a Stradale and the only Enzo in the world with a fully integrated bose sound system

(true!)
Fanch.

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Jul 22, 2003 3:05:50 PM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Futch

Re: Relax!!!

dear fanch,

"de-escalation" was in reference to your "relax, man" posting. very non-agressive

i really like this!!

some years ago a guy in my town used to drive around in a 456 GT and then a 355 spider in matt olive green paint finish! like an army vehicle... really weird and far from beautiful, but attracting a lot of attention. i wonder what the resale value was, though

cheers
zz

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Jul 22, 2003 3:24:59 PM

Gianmaria Traversone: Newbie; Loc: Costa Rica; Posts: 29, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 12, 2003; Reply to: Rossi

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

guys, do not get me wrong , recreational cars is not a matter to take sirious. It just surprises me the attitude and the siriousness and confidence most of you comment on car that you just have seen in a magazine or parking lot. I ownd some sports cars and I can comment on those sports car not others, or like just like the MATTM3 that gives a nice and personal comments on the ferrari and Lamborghini presents, from his point of view which by the way I agree with. But from the rest of you I just get a bit of arrogance and distructive criticism on your comments that it is not at all interesting, ( probabbly the typical German attitude problem, ups

) I just immagine a guy posting that (in a Ferrari forum, like this one is)by the way) That he just bought a 355 and he would like to share whith you guys the experiance of owning a Ferrari and see if he can get from some other 355 owners recommendations on the car ect... ect... You guys probabbly will tell him to sell it immidiatly and buy a Porshe (GERMAN is better..) because the 355 has not the power of bla bla bla , and the tendancy is to bla bla bla... and again without even having put your ass on a 355.

Anyway I can see I am in the wrong forum , so sorry for the intrusion and you all take are.

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Jul 22, 2003 3:50:13 PM

Futch: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: EU , United Kingdom; Posts: 4759, Gallery; Registered on: May 14, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Suerte!!!

Gianmaria,
It's your decision to go but it's a shame. We have tried some of those cars. Remember that one of RC's best friend is CR and he owns a 355 Spider (and a 996 Turbo too BTW) so I'm pretty confident the RC knows this car well, as for myself, well, as you can read above, I have tried out the 360 for a while and I was certainly IMPRESSED, but it's just not a perfect car just like the 996 is not a perfect car.
But it looks like you have made up your mind, y pienso que es une lastima pero es asi.
Entonces suerte amigo electronico y hasta luego puede ser in Costa Rica o Paris!!!

Fanch.

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Jul 22, 2003 4:11:26 PM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

"if you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen" (harry s. truman)

so long!
zzboba

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Jul 22, 2003 5:17:32 PM

Rossi: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Home , Germany; Posts: 12682, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:
guys, do not get me wrong , recreational cars is not a matter to take sirious. It just surprises me the attitude and the siriousness and confidence most of you comment on car that you just have seen in a magazine or parking lot. I ownd some sports cars and I can comment on those sports car not others, or like just like the MATTM3 that gives a nice and personal comments on the ferrari and Lamborghini presents, from his point of view which by the way I agree with. But from the rest of you I just get a bit of arrogance and distructive criticism on your comments that it is not at all interesting, ( probabbly the typical German attitude problem, ups ) I just immagine a guy posting that (in a Ferrari forum, like this one is)by the way) That he just bought a 355 and he would like to share whith you guys the experiance of owning a Ferrari and see if he can get from some other 355 owners recommendations on the car ect... ect... You guys probabbly will tell him to sell it immidiatly and buy a Porshe (GERMAN is better..) because the 355 has not the power of bla bla bla , and the tendancy is to bla bla bla... and again without even having put your ass on a 355.

Anyway I can see I am in the wrong forum , so sorry for the intrusion and you all take are.

So now, who should calm down in the end???

If somebody "is not at all interested" in opinions given by members of this forum, he has three opportunities:

1) don't read it
2) read it but don't comment it
3) read it and say why you have a different opinion

I read this forum quite often and never ever found a statement with a "wrong attitude and seriousness and confidence" or "a bit of arrogance and destructive criticism" that is quite common in other car forums. This is why I like rennteam.com that much.
And Gianmaria, do you really believe you are the only one here who owns sportscars and that all the others only talk about what they "have seen in a magazine or parking lot" and "without even having put their ass on it"? Well, I would not bet on it.

And if I read statements like "probably the typical German attitude problem", sorry but then I have to ask, who has the bigger attitude problem, hmm?

Even more I think it is important to talk about one's opinions and feelings of how a great car could become even greater, as there might be the possibility - as RC correctly said - that the the big car companies might read it and get a feeling what the customer really wants.

So let's all get back to business and be friendly to eachother.

regards
sr

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Jul 22, 2003 5:41:48 PM

MattM3: Newbie; Loc: USA; Posts: 41, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 19, 2003; Reply to: Rossi

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

I like the fact that my thoughts are valuable, yet I've only seen ferraris and lambos in parking lots!

But i love my 95 M3 baby!

-Matto

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Jul 22, 2003 6:34:12 PM

floren: Junior; Loc:; Posts: 137, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 6, 2003; Reply to: zzboba

Re: Relax!!!

to zzzoba,

where do you live?

i met this guy once at the nürburgring, or a guy who pretented to be him.

i do live in berlin and last summer a 456 gt of that colour burned out because he was parked outside and some prezlauerberg punkers threw a molotow in it.

does this guy live in hamburg?

and wasn't his 355 spider photographed for the ferrari magazin last year?

best, floren

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Jul 22, 2003 7:47:37 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59605, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:

Anyway I can see I am in the wrong forum , so sorry for the intrusion and you all take are.

Sorry to hear that, Gianmaria.

But walking out of the "conflict" doesn't help much.
How about posting a detailled driving report as soon as you get your Stradale to convince some of us that we (and some other Stradale owners) are wrong?

Would be very mature.

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Jul 22, 2003 11:03:03 PM

Gianmaria Traversone: Newbie; Loc: Costa Rica; Posts: 29, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 12, 2003; Reply to: RC

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

rc , I see no conflict in here, it is just a different point of view. I would like to find a forum where people shares their experience on a car they tried or ask reccomendation to some other owners , technical problems, ectt.. While this is a general discussion on sport cars some owners some not but with very little idea on Ferrari. From what I remember from your profile NONE OF THE PEOPLE DISCUSSING THIS PARTICULAR TREAT OWNS OR HAS OWNED A FERRARI

so how can this be a ferrari forum!!! and most ironically, I can a learn from your comments????????????

I believe this is a nice forum to discuss and talk bullshit about sport car put again, stick to the "I believe" kind of comments rather than make the determinand and prepotent kind of comments, on a car or a brand. You guys should name this Forum " What Ferrari must do for Gerrman costumers"
ah! and to zzabx whatever, I did not get the kitchen and heat joke.. maybe you can explaine it later.
Again , no hard feeling, just me in the wrong place, I not good in espuculating.... which is what is mainly going on in here.

Just to end this I woul always trade 150 Hp for a little horse in the steering wheel anytime, the smell, the sound.., the history.. I am sure many of you would feel the same if you had a chance.

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Jul 23, 2003 7:05:58 AM

Rossi: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Home , Germany; Posts: 12682, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:
From what I remember from your profile NONE OF THE PEOPLE DISCUSSING THIS PARTICULAR TREAT OWNS OR HAS OWNED A FERRARI so how can this be a ferrari forum!!! and most ironically, I can a learn from your comments????????????

Do you really believe there are no Ferrari owners in this forum, only because there is no entry in the profile?

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Jul 23, 2003 8:48:26 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59605, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Gianmaria

The profile of our Users doesn't say anything.
Our second Editor-In-Chief CR Germany owns a Ferrari F355 Spider and a 996 Turbo.
There are other Users here who own Ferraris, you just have to check older posts.

Some Users own several sports cars, so they don't necessarily point out that they drive a Ferrari.
There are also sons of fathers who own a Ferrari because the father doesn't use internet forums.

My job here is to start a discussion and deliver information.
The job of the Users is to pick up such a discussion and continue it.
It is not my fault if non-Ferrari owners make comments to a certain topic too.
We'd be able to limit the access of certain Users to specific topics/forums but our goal is to attract as many people as possible to participate in a discussion.
Sometimes it is a very valuable experience to get the opinion of owners of other cars because Ferrari/Porsche owners usually tend to glorify the car they bought.
As long as the posts are justified by arguments/experiences, as long as they seem mature and not childish and as long as the posts don't bash a certain car, I find it OK.

But I understand you: when I posted as a Porsche owner on a german Mercedes SLK forum (I just made an iquiry for my wife who owns a SLK) and outed myself as a 996 Turbo owner, I got flamed so much...they almost ripped my head off.

I had to say that I'm really proud of our Users because such things don't happen here. We have Ferrari owners posting to the Porsche forum, we have Porsche owners posting to the Ferrari forum and all kind of car brand owners posting to all forums and I have to say that it is astonishing that all posts seem to be mature and without flaming.

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Jul 23, 2003 10:02:38 AM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

i really do not get why you are so concerned?

nobody said anything really negative about the modena. i would say that most rennteam users admire the modena. the only thing that was said here is that the successor will get a significant power increase. whats wrong about it? go to your ferrari dealer and ask him!

i think your reproaches are quite insulting. well, i am from germany, but does this make any difference? you probably haven't read any of my other posting -- to say that at rennteam porsche is glorified by germans is really BS. please do me a favor and read some threads in the other areas about porsche coroporate policy, models, the cayenne etc.

but that the 996TT is a better overall car than the modena is a fact. you can use it every day, do relaxed intercontinental journeys and thrash most competitors on the track -- which other car does this? but for the same money i would rather get a modena, though. because of emotion, because of its beauty...

and just to let you know, i have a running order for the modena successor, i have driven various sports cars and ferraris extensively (F355 GTS, 355 spider F1, 360 spider F1) and i love ferraris. they are great.

be lucky about your car, no need to be that belligerent!

regards
zz

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Jul 23, 2003 10:39:50 AM

art.italy: Co-Pilot; Loc: Italy , Italy; Posts: 295, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 7, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: Gianmaria

RC is right, I have been owner of a 360 Modena (bought sept.02, sold two weeks ago) having at the same time a 02 911 turbo.

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Jul 23, 2003 11:06:36 AM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: floren

Re: Relax!!!

yes i am from hamburg!

i do not know the owner, but the military ferraris have been quite (in)famous around car nuts in hamburg of course. i heard that the ferraris are history and that he currently drives a smart and a VW eurovan with an aftermarket porsche engine

regards,
zz

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Jul 23, 2003 11:13:41 AM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: zzboba

Modena vs. 996tt

@quote from zzboa's post: "... that the 996TT is a better overall car than the modena is a fact. you can use it every day, do relaxed intercontinental journeys and thrash most competitors on the track"

zzboa, all qualities you claim for the 996tt are correct (usable every day, well suited for for intercontinental journeys, quick on the track - and on other roads) - except one. After having owned both cars for quite a while I still cannot say which car is the "better" car. Both have their qualities, both are desirable, both are different (sound, design, efficiency, day-to-day usability, maintenance costs etc.) and both are probably two of the best sport cars money can buy...

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Jul 23, 2003 11:29:17 AM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: MKSGR

Re: Modena vs. 996tt

Quote:
Both have their qualities, both are desirable, both are different (sound, design, efficiency, day-to-day usability, maintenance costs etc.) and both are probably two of the best sport cars money can buy...

agreed!

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Aug 8, 2003 10:21:54 PM

eric_brigham: Newbie; Loc: NYC; Posts: 9, Gallery; Registered on: May 9, 2003; Reply to: RC

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Is this V10 rumor legit? This information is contrary to what I have heard on numerous occasions about the new Modena powerplant being a tuned version of the Maserati engine. With the Gallardo's introduction, Ferrari going with a 500+ HP V10 does make some sense, but I haven't seen this speculation anywhere else. Any thoughts???

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Aug 8, 2003 10:34:25 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59605, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: eric_brigham

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:
Is this V10 rumor legit? This information is contrary to what I have heard on numerous occasions about the new Modena powerplant being a tuned version of the Maserati engine. With the Gallardo's introduction, Ferrari going with a 500+ HP V10 does make some sense, but I haven't seen this speculation anywhere else. Any thoughts???

Well, I can't tell you the source but let me put it this way:
if that person doesn't know, nobody knows.

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Aug 9, 2003 6:48:52 AM

Rossi: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Home , Germany; Posts: 12682, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:
Quote:
Is this V10 rumor legit? This information is contrary to what I have heard on numerous occasions about the new Modena powerplant being a tuned version of the Maserati engine. With the Gallardo's introduction, Ferrari going with a 500+ HP V10 does make some sense, but I haven't seen this speculation anywhere else. Any thoughts???

Well, I can't tell you the source but let me put it this way:
if that person doesn't know, nobody knows.

RC, you are making me curious!

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Aug 9, 2003 9:09:45 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59605, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Rossi

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:

RC, you are making me curious!

Curiousity killed the cat...

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Aug 11, 2003 7:54:23 AM

Rossi: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Home , Germany; Posts: 12682, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Quote:
Quote:

RC, you are making me curious!

Curiousity killed the cat...

I thought you will write that RC !!!

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Aug 25, 2003 3:09:11 PM

LG1: Pilot; Loc: Italy; Posts: 433, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 3, 2002; Reply to: Gianmaria Traversone

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Gianmaria: you are way out of line here!
First of all you know that there are Ferrari owners in this forum, and I would say pretty knowledgeable ones also (have you forgotten it's thanks to someone in this forum that you were able to know about the Challenge Stradale earlier than most other customers, and therefore secure your order in advance...).
This forum is made of REAL CAR ENTHUSIASTS, not by one dimensional so called fans or "tifosi" or whatever you want to call them,and I think it is one of its main advantages.
This is the only forum I follow closely and regularly(even though I haven't been able to actively partecipate lately), and as I think you know I own a Modena, have owned a 996GT2, have driven most of the interesting sport cars on sale(including the Gallardo), so please stop talking this nonsense about all the members here being magazine readers and speaking about cars they don't know, because as things are right now, even you are talking about your beloved Challenge Stradale without having put your a** on it, and having driven one myself I can tell that the comments RC reported from the owners he met are spot on.
So I suggest you deflate your ego a bit, and try to read carefully some of the posts written in this forum, you might learn something and maybe, eventually, broaden your views like some valuable friends here on the board.

Remember, this is written by a fellow Ferrari enthusiast...

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Aug 25, 2003 7:10:34 PM

Scuderia: Co-Pilot; Loc: CA, United States; Posts: 159, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 22, 2003; Reply to: LG1

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Well, I definently think that the Stradale will be better than the standard 360, but the question is how much better. What I want to see arent simple figures like 0-60 or 70-0, but to put a Modena on a track (perhaps at Indy for publicity) and then put the Stradale out to see how they compare. I know that the Stradale will perform much better, but how much better, and wheather that performance increase is worth the drastic price increase, is what I want to know. (If this has allready been done, please tell me)

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Aug 25, 2003 7:43:12 PM

Jean: Veteran; Loc: Seoul , South Korea; Posts: 1033, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 14, 2002; Reply to: Scuderia

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Something similar has already been done by Japanese video-magazine called "Best Motoring" on Japan's traditional Tsukuba circuit and the differece between Modena and 360 Challenge (not Challenge Stradale) was not much. Less than 1 second difference with the Challenge car at 1:03, both on P-zero Corsas.

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Aug 25, 2003 7:58:43 PM

floren: Junior; Loc:; Posts: 137, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 6, 2003; Reply to: Jean

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Hi,

as Ferrari tested in Fiorano was that the Stradale is 3 sec faster as the Modena, and more than one as the Challenge.

Best, Floren

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Aug 26, 2003 7:17:25 AM

floren: Junior; Loc:; Posts: 137, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 6, 2003; Reply to: LG1

Re: Update on 360 Modena Facelift

Luigi!

Good to have you back.

Ae you going to be in Frankfurt between September 8th and 10th?

Best, Floren

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Suerte!!!

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